No Bookmarks Exist.
On but just before we started to I wanted to make a quick. 00:00:00
Note that these are directional and so just make sure that when you're talking to go directly into them. I was getting some lower 00:00:03
levels on that last one, and I just want to make sure that I'm getting everybody's statements on the record. So thank you so much, 00:00:08
Tony. Okay. 00:00:13
Let's see. 00:00:20
Let me get the time. 00:00:23
All right, today is June 26th. 00:00:26
2024, the time is 7/23 and we're going to start our regular City Council meeting. We're going to start with a presentation for the 00:00:30
GFOA Distinguished Budget Presentation Award by Chrissy Bayless, our Finance Director. 00:00:37
Hi, thank you for being here in New York. I'm excited to share this with you, David Mortensen, our former Finance Director and his 00:00:48
and his team. Thanks Anthony for the OR Tony for the reminder. 00:00:53
It was David Mortensen that put this in and received this award. I want to draw your attention up to the shelf up there. The award 00:01:00
on the far left is the Distinguished Budget Award from GFO A and I have added our 2023 medallion to that. I just wanted to read a 00:01:07
little bit about what the the award is for and entails. 00:01:14
So GFOA is the Government Finance Officers Association. The Distinguished Budget Award is a prestigious recognition given to 00:01:21
government entities that demonstrate excellence in budgeting practices. It is a national award that acknowledges organizations for 00:01:28
their commitment to meeting the highest standards of governmental budgeting. 00:01:34
Government entities that meet specific criteria and demonstrate excellence in budgeting practices. 00:01:41
Are recognized with the GFOA Distinguished Budget Award. This award signifies the organizations commitment to transparency, 00:01:47
accountability, and effective financial management. Receiving the GFO a Distinguished Budget Award not only reflects positively on 00:01:55
the government entity but also enhances its reputation among stakeholders, including citizens, investors, and rating agencies. It 00:02:02
demonstrates the organization's dedication to sound financial practices. 00:02:10
And provides assurance to the public that their tax dollars are being managed responsibly. Just as a side note, this is the sixth 00:02:17
year in a row that Vineyard has received this Distinguished Budget award. 00:02:23
Thank you so much and we're so grateful for all the work that you put into that as you were part of his team, so we really 00:02:29
appreciate it. That brings you to your second item, 2.2, which is the fraud risk assessment presentation. 00:02:36
The fraud risk assessment is something that is required by law that is conducted annually and brought before the council. 00:02:46
I recently completed this. There is a possible of 395 points. The high points shows that you have low risk and we did get the 395 00:02:53
out of the 395 indicating that we are our fraud risk is very low. It it really is about asking a lot of questions and questions 00:03:02
regarding accounting checks and balances, making sure that one person in the department doesn't have too much control. And so I 00:03:10
was, I was very excited and confident to fill that out and know that Vineyard is doing its best to be. 00:03:19
Fiscally responsible. 00:03:29
Thank you so much. Great work on that. We really appreciate learning more about that and that we got a 395. You must feel like an 00:03:31
A+ student right now. It's exciting. OK, we'll have our public comments and what this time is for anything you want to talk to the 00:03:37
council about that is not on the agenda. So if this is something separate from the other items, please come up, state your name 00:03:44
and where you're from, and we will take those comments for you. 00:03:50
Real quick, did you have a time limit or anything that you wanted? Let's do 2 minutes, OK? 00:04:03
Tim Blackburn from Sleepy Ridge and I know that the mayor and the city engineer have talked with one of the residents about this 00:04:09
concern just a few minutes ago, but I just wanted to bring it up for public information because of the fact that the area under 00:04:16
development right now with Goodborough and. 00:04:22
Cadence, thank you. And Cadence is under development. Is it isn't agriculturally being treated anymore. Prior to this time, it was 00:04:31
always under agricultural like hay was being grown, corn, things like that. What's happened now is that we just have a lot of 00:04:39
weeds growing in the area because it's not being plowed and we have a humongous infestation of what commonly is called Clover 00:04:47
mites. There are other names for that. 00:04:54
And they are breeding and nesting in all the weeds that are there. And because of the high temperatures, which we kind of have a 00:05:03
perfect storm occurring right now. We have the weeds growing, we have high temperatures and they are infesting now the homes that 00:05:10
are on the southern end of that development and starting to move toward the northern end of the development. It needs immediate 00:05:18
attention from the developers and city. And I know that there's been a commitment made to do that. And I just want to under score. 00:05:25
The fact that several of the residents asked me to speak for them tonight. Barbara couldn't stay and we haven't personally been 00:05:33
infested yet, but we're just across the street. So we're anxiously awaiting the cities attention to that problem. Thank you. Thank 00:05:40
you just for the council so that you're aware of it. Marty actually was in an area that also got the false chinch bugs and they 00:05:46
because of the temperature they're coming up in different weed weeded areas. So Naseem's all over it and he's making he's working 00:05:53
with. 00:05:59
The abatement team and the weed mitigation group. So we'll be working on that. So any other comments from the public? 00:06:06
Daria Evans, Vineyard resident, thank you for this opportunity to speak. I'd like to thank the Vineyard Days fireworks show. That 00:06:27
was great. Also, the community garden fencing looks wonderful and pickleball, senior pickleball is fun. 00:06:35
I would like to state that I'm disappointed that I did not know about the June 14th special session of City Council. I'm 00:06:44
disappointed that it was not posted on the Vineyard City Facebook because that's what I look at, and that it was held on a Friday 00:06:50
morning when I'm used to Wednesday evening City Council meetings. So I'd like to know why the special session was not live 00:06:56
streamed and available to watch in a transcript available to read. 00:07:02
And in that June 14th special session, excuse me, item 4.1, the settlement agreement, the minutes only say that Jamie Blakesley 00:07:09
presented a settlement agreement to the public. Well, I would like to know who are the plaintiffs? Who are the defendants? What is 00:07:17
the complaint in the lawsuit about? What was the when was the complaint lawsuit filed? What is the resolution settlement amount? 00:07:24
What course correction? 00:07:31
Will Vineyard City make to ensure that these types of issues no longer happen? 00:07:39
And also continuing on that. 00:07:49
Public Treasures Investment Fund. 00:07:54
The management authorization. I believe that this acronym needs to be identified and spelled out the first time it is used. 00:07:57
On the June 12 agenda, there was also a proposed zoning text amendment for mixed-use in the industrial area. There was not an 00:08:07
attachment describing what was proposed. When will this come up again to City Council, since it was not? 00:08:15
On the June 14th special session or tonight's June 26 City Council agenda. 00:08:24
And then lastly, I feel that participation in City Council meetings is no longer encouraged For these reasons. The last one that 00:08:31
you just mentioned, can you say that again? 00:08:35
The city, the City Council it was not. The proposed zoning text amendment for mixed-use industrial area was not listed in the June 00:08:42
14th special session or tonight's June 26th City Council agenda. It was on the original June 12th meeting that was cancelled. 00:08:51
Thank you. So I'd like to know when that will come about again and then? 00:09:01
The reason the reasons why I feel that participation City Council is no longer encouraged are it's because the changing of the 00:09:06
format. 00:09:10
Of the Wednesday night meeting to the Redevelopment Agency, RDA first and then City Council not having adequate time to review the 00:09:15
agenda, only 24 hours, is disheartening. Tonight's agenda was is 209, excuse me, 109 pages. 00:09:23
Not having complete minutes limits our ability as citizens to know what is happening in our city. Referencing that Jamie 00:09:32
Blakeslee's And sometimes we get answers to our questions and other times we don't. Thank you. 00:09:40
John. 00:09:50
Karen Cornelius, Vineyard resident I just want to talk about the two-minute time limit. 00:10:03
I personally don't feel that it's fair. We give of our time and our service to be here. We have elected people that we want to 00:10:08
hear and we want to know what they what they are doing for the people of Vineyard. And I also feel I have a real problem with you 00:10:17
closing the public comment. And then you may or may not discuss what it was that we asked. We may wait months for an answer to our 00:10:25
question. I would like you to answer our questions as our questions are asked rather than to close the public comment. 00:10:34
And then choose whether or not you're going to address it. I also would ask, once again, that acronyms do not appear on the 00:10:43
agenda. We need to spell that because we don't have access to your Cheat Sheets. We need to know what it is that we're going to be 00:10:49
talking about. 00:10:55
We also appreciate the time when the Council does have discussions back and forth, because. 00:11:02
That is a lot of what we come for. We have elected people. We want to know what they're doing to continue to gain our trust. 00:11:10
That's true of all of you. So those discussions are important. I have felt a little bit tonight like. 00:11:17
We were trying to sell people on our opinions and I'm not talking about me, I'm talking about people up there. 00:11:26
And I feel like sometimes words are put in people's mouths and. 00:11:32
I feel like we need to take what one another says as where they really are and accept it and not try to bring them to our side of 00:11:38
the table, but let them vote as their heart says and not try to sway their vote in a meeting like this. Thank you. 00:11:46
Hi, I'm Janae Riley. I'm a Vineyard resident and I just have a simple request and it's based on a problem down at the Lakeside 00:12:04
Park. For the last three, two or three Saturdays there's been multiple events happening at the same time. The school part, the 00:12:11
park parking lot is full, the school parking lots full, and sometimes the church parking lots full. So the next thing is to start 00:12:18
parking on the grass of our front yards. 00:12:26
And the strip in front of our house is not painted red from the corner of where Holdaway Rd. turns down to the park either on the 00:12:34
it's painted to. 00:12:40
Partway down the foot past the 1st house. 00:12:47
But not after that. So we've had people parking in front of our yard and blocking. And sometimes we have right now we have a dirt 00:12:51
berm and we had a couple people park up on the dirt berm on our property. So and it's only because there is no other property or 00:12:58
place. And I feel bad about that. I've asked them, I've even told them just come park on my driveway, but don't leave any garbage 00:13:05
this time just because. So I guess my concern is twofold. 00:13:12
Number one, can we have a little communication with Orem about the amount of of events that are happening down at the park? And 00:13:21
then #2 if we could paint the front, the finished painting, the extension from the park up to the corner around in red with red 00:13:28
paint so that it will be a visible recognition of no parking there. So because it is a traveling lane, so people traveling have to 00:13:36
travel in the turning lane, middle lane, so either. 00:13:43
Change the striping, put the red. I don't know what would be the safest way of doing that. Thanks. Thank you, Thank you, thank 00:13:50
you, thank you for that. 00:13:54
All right, any other comments? 00:13:59
If there are none, I'm going to go ahead and close the public comments. 00:14:02
And we are going to move our reports closer to the end and move into consent items. 00:14:06
I'll make a motion to approve the consent items as presented. OK, We have our first by Marty. Can I get a second, second, second 00:14:18
by Amber? 00:14:22
Any discussion? Otherwise I just need. Can I ask why we can't just answer their questions while they're here so they can leave? 00:14:27
OK, we're on this item and then I'll answer you. 00:14:32
All in favor, aye? 00:14:39
Any opposed? 00:14:41
Yeah, I would say that it's different every time. Some of the questions are really complex and I was saving the ability for us to 00:14:44
discuss while we are in our reports. 00:14:49
Some of the some of the questions are things that we might have the answers to right now. It's there's really important to stay on 00:14:55
our business items and to make sure that if we are giving answers or promising anything that we notify the public, we're required 00:15:01
by the Open Public Meetings Act to do so. So sometimes we have the ability to do it and sometimes we don't have the ability, but 00:15:07
we do take notes and we do bring it to our experts to get that information and bring it back. And if you leave your e-mail and 00:15:13
your phone number and you. 00:15:20
Pretty usual because sometimes I'll open it up and we'll talk back and forth for like 40 minutes sometimes. But I'm watching the 00:16:27
agenda and I'm making sure that we can get through it. And tonight we've got some really important things on, so we're going to 00:16:33
move forward. But we do, we did listen and we are paying attention. Mayor, would you like me to give a short answer to the 00:16:39
question about the settlement agreement? Oh yeah, that would be nice. But I do have a question about that in general is. 00:16:45
Maybe you can address that if it wasn't in our minutes for the statement that you did make publicly, we would want to, you could 00:16:53
add that supplement the minutes and you could even hold the minutes and approve them at a later meeting if you want with that 00:16:59
supplement. So the special meeting was driven by the timing of. 00:17:05
Threatened litigation against the city and I had for a few weeks before that and the council had held a closed session to discuss 00:17:12
this litigation. 00:17:17
Leading up to it, settlement conversations are by definition confidential because if you speak about them openly then you scuttle 00:17:22
your ability to come to any kind of resolution. 00:17:27
And so the fact scenario is essentially this. There are. 00:17:33
Some communities in the city that when they were created in the plat, the platen included a note that prohibited. 00:17:38
Telecommunications from being put within the public utility easement in those communities. 00:17:46
It wasn't uniform across the city. It was in certain plats and not in others. It was put in there, we believe by the developer. 00:17:54
Those kinds of restrictions are unlawful. There's a federal law that prohibits that. The reason they prohibited is so that. 00:18:02
People aren't limited in their ability to get communication. It goes back to the old days when you had radio and broadcast TV and 00:18:10
if you only had. 00:18:14
One person doing the news, then your news would be filtered to their viewpoint and they want. 00:18:19
People to be able to get communication from a number of different sources. Now we're concerned less about broadcast TV and radio 00:18:25
and those things and more about can we get Internet for more than one provider. 00:18:30
And in those communities with that restriction, they could only get Internet from one provider. And so that provider literally had 00:18:36
residents of the city over a barrel. It was the only choice, and it wasn't always the best choice. They wanted options. 00:18:44
Comcast came in and requested a permit to enter that public utility easement. 00:18:53
We had. 00:18:58
To sort out legally whether we had the right to give them that. 00:19:01
Access where there was that restriction in the in the plat notes. 00:19:05
And what we ended up doing was negotiating with Comcast that we would grant them that permission. We agree with Comcast on the 00:19:09
reading of the federal law that prohibits that kind of plat restriction. 00:19:16
And the state law that talks about public utility easements and what they have to be. 00:19:24
And we believe they have to be open to telecommunications and that they have to be open to any telecommunications provider that 00:19:29
has an agreement, a franchise agreement with the city. 00:19:35
Franchise agreements are uniform, so if there's a franchise agreement for Comcast, the franchise agreement for other Internet 00:19:41
providers is on the same terms. 00:19:46
And they are given access to provide that service to everybody within the city. 00:19:51
Comcast, in exchange for us granting them that permit, agreed to indemnify and defend the City if another telecommunications 00:19:56
provider or a private developer sues the City. 00:20:03
For in their view unlawfully granting access to Comcast contrary to what's in that plat amendment and that platinum, we expect 00:20:10
that kind of lawsuit might come. And so we wanted to be sure we were backstopped. So the the bottom line of it all is. 00:20:19
The city engineers working with Comcast right now to give them those permits, they're working through that application process. 00:20:29
There's some discussion in that process just because we want to figure out things like. 00:20:35
Where do the communications boxes go? And. 00:20:42
How did they enter and are they going to leave it in the same condition when they leave? But once all those details are worked 00:20:45
out, we expect they will be given a permit to go into those Public Utilities. 00:20:50
And then after they're able to lay their infrastructure, residents within the city will have will begin having choices on Internet 00:20:56
service. So that was the settlement agreement that was presented. The agreement again was confidential up until the point that we 00:21:03
signed it, but we got Comcast to sign it before we brought it to the city. So the moment it was approved, it could be binding on 00:21:09
Comcast and we could be backstopped and and kept safe. 00:21:16
In that litigation and it's now a public document now that it's been approved, of course. 00:21:23
And in the meeting, I did give an explanation and as the mayor noted, we'll make sure the minutes are supplemented. You'll also 00:21:29
have this recording that. 00:21:33
Provides a little bit of an overview over for you of what that litigation was and what we did. 00:21:37
Are we, are we now allowed to say who the developer was? 00:21:42
What's that? Are we in that loud now by law to be able to say who the developer was? Oh, I don't think you ever were prohibited. I 00:21:47
mean, every plat within the city has the name of the person who okay, who was it proposed the plat? 00:21:53
Well, there are, there are. This was not exclusive to a single plat, so it's done several plats throughout the city. But the plot 00:22:00
in question? 00:22:04
Do you know the No. 00:22:09
I don't have all the plats in front of me, so they're they're. 00:22:12
Comcast provided us a list of. 00:22:16
About a half dozen or so, but they were not the only ones within the city, so I don't. 00:22:20
I don't know offhand the full universe of that, and I don't want to. I don't know whether it was one developer or multiple 00:22:24
developers, but they did exist. 00:22:29
In the city and those notes are on some plots. Excellent. Thank you so much for that recap. We'll go. I would like to make a 00:22:34
comment on that. 00:22:38
I was not invited to that meeting. You guys asked me if I could go Friday and I said yes, I can go anytime afternoon. And that was 00:22:42
the only thing about it. And you guys held a settlement meeting. You didn't contact me. You held a City Council meeting. You 00:22:49
agreed upon it and made a public notice. And I read about it on Facebook. 00:22:56
And I want to know who's responsible to find out if I did or did deny a meeting and that there's a record because I'm on the City 00:23:04
Council. 00:23:08
So all of the meetings that go out are done the same way. They're noticed the same way, they're sent to you the same way. The 00:23:13
Recorders office emailed everybody the same way. I asked everybody when they could make it and found a quorum. And then the 00:23:19
Recorders office put the meeting together and notified everybody the same way that they do each meeting. So it wasn't about 00:23:25
excluding anybody that could or couldn't make it. It was just about getting a tentative schedule, knowing that we had enough if we 00:23:31
needed to move forward with that. 00:23:37
We had to hold it according to the timeline and everybody was noticed this same exact way. 00:23:44
OK. We're going to go ahead and move on to our business items 9.1. 00:23:51
Permit parking program and our Senior Planner, Cash Hansi will present. 00:23:56
Mayor, while we're waiting for cash, I want to put one other thing in the record because it does matter as it relates to this 00:24:01
litigation. We, I can't discuss an open session, the contents of what we talked about during a closed session, but we did hold 2 00:24:05
closed sessions. 00:24:10
About this litigation and Council member Holdaway was present during those closed sessions and the settlement agreement is 00:24:15
consistent with what was discussed in those closed sessions. There's not anything in the agreement that should be a surprise. 00:24:22
Thank you and if you have? 00:24:28
Questions for how you want to be noticed in the future, you can talk to Eric and our recorder's office as well. OK, go ahead, 00:24:36
cash. OK, great. I'm here to present Resolution 20/24/17, which is regarding street parking permit. 00:24:44
300 W and Vineyard Loop Rd. near the lakefront at Town Center Development. 00:24:52
And doing this permit, some of the council, myself, staff, other members staff met with the HOA there to kind of discuss their 00:24:58
ongoing concerns with parking in their development and came up with an agreement. And that's what is in this resolution to provide 00:25:04
extra parking to that development, to hopefully provide just extra parking to the residents that live there. Do you want me to go 00:25:09
through each line of the resolution? I don't think so. I think the overall is that we're opening up this parking to the all of the 00:25:15
areas that have done. 00:25:21
We did an update to the resolution that was submitted to the packet. We did add line 11 here that does say the Lakefront 00:25:59
Homeowners Association must continue to enforce their parking permits and enforcement programs. I was going to ask you on that. On 00:26:06
number 11, is there something that you need to say like the city has the reserves the right to withhold something if if that? 00:26:14
Isn't upheld or are there enough teeth in the overall resolution? 00:26:22
We do have in other areas of this resolution, I believe it's line. 00:26:28
Sorry, I should be looking at my laptop, it's a little easier to read. 00:26:33
And that way if they removed the permit program stopped enforcing their whatever it is, but we had agreed upon that this. 00:27:16
City could make a change at some point and yeah, regardless, if they did stop doing that, there would be a lot of issues within 00:27:23
their development because we are also only willing to sell 82 parking stalls or parking permits and I believe there's 109 parking 00:27:30
stalls along those two streets, so they are limited in that fact as well. I would probably add that wording just in case. OK. 00:27:38
Other than that, I did want to just real quick mention we did make a few other small changes, Line 6. 00:27:45
Where we're asking them that if they need additional parking beyond what is being allowed on 300 W and Vineyard Loop Rd. that the 00:27:53
HOA is responsible for providing at least 25 stalls at a minimum of at least 25. And then the other wording we just got rid of by 00:27:59
restriping, where the city can come in and improve the number of parking stalls just because there's other methods to increase the 00:28:05
number of parking stalls and we didn't want to limit us to just restriping. 00:28:11
Sarah, does this reflect what you wanted it to be? I know that you've been working a lot with the HOA board. 00:28:20
I just want to go over it with the HOA and make sure that everyone's, everyone's good and I'd be happy to join you with them as 00:28:56
well. OK, great. Thank you. 00:29:00
Are we allowed to have an open meeting and invite them here so that we can have a council? 00:29:04
Do you? We'll just continue it on. We don't need to make a motion for that. We'll just continue it. So OK. 00:30:12
Thanks, Kash. Yeah, thank you. 9.2 is a public hearing adoption of the Vineyard City FY24 Budget Final Amendment Resolution 2024, 00:30:20
Dash 18. 00:30:25
We'll have a motion to go into a public hearing. 00:30:32
So moved. Thank you, Marty. Second, second by Amber. All in favor, Aye. All right. We are now in a public hearing and our finance 00:30:35
Director, Chrissy Bayless will. 00:30:40
Give us a presentation. 00:30:47
I just wanted to remind you all of what the process is that we're going through tonight. At the end of a fiscal year, it's 00:30:51
required that any minor adjustments are brought before the council. This is very common practice. So this would be budget 00:30:58
amendment #5 for fiscal year 24, the council was given the packet with any minor changes that were in there. So I believe we're 00:31:06
we're OK to just go ahead unless there's questions. OK. Are there any questions from the public on this item? 00:31:13
Usually, Christie, you go or we go through what the changes were when we do an amendment or would you like to do that right now? 00:31:22
That list available, I could get it together for you. 00:31:34
I mean. 00:31:41
I mean, I've looked through it and I feel comfortable, I just thought I would like to know the differences too. 00:31:42
Can you just speak to the microphone and just say that it's in the packet and that we have it? 00:31:51
Just just reminding that this is this is what was provided in the package so that everybody could take a look at that and review 00:31:57
that. No, I think it's great. I was able to read through it and I feel comfortable with the changes. She wanted a preview for the 00:32:03
public. Usually what happens and we can plan for it next time is when we do an amendment, usually we're walked through what what 00:32:10
changes were made just like a like a slide show type thing that helps the public understand it better. 00:32:17
OK. I'll be happy to get that for next time. That would be great. Just for next time. 00:32:24
What's the name of it? Is this resolution amendment 2023-2024? Because I'm not seeing a breakdown of the changes either. 241829, 00:32:31
page 29. 00:32:37
OK, Karen, come on up and state your name and where you're from and what your comment is. 00:32:49
We did. 00:32:56
You were the first resident with 109 pages in the packet last night. For residents, that's a lot to go through and a lot to 00:32:58
formulate, so to have it on the slide. 00:33:05
Is what we need, not what we're asking for, but what we need. So I would hope that the next time we could expect to have that up 00:33:12
there when these packets are so big. Yeah, that's fine. If we want to just pull open this page and just talk about it a little bit 00:33:18
and give kind of a preview for how this amendment works and give some background so that as we discuss the new budget, those 00:33:25
answers will come out a little bit more, I think that'd be helpful. 00:33:31
And Christy, I know you've been so busy and you've been doing a fantastic job. So there's no way reflects it was just. 00:33:39
It was out of habit and I thought it would be there so. 00:33:46
Thank you for all you're doing. I appreciate your honesty and like I said, we will have that available for next time. My thought 00:33:49
was that in giving the council the information that you guys would go through it and then obviously you represent the constituents 00:33:55
and if there are concerns that you bring forth or that they bring to you, then we would be able to discuss those. But I'm happy to 00:34:01
pull up the final budget for fiscal year 24 with any questions that you have. 00:34:07
Do you guys have any questions that you wanted to present to the public so that the public can make a comment on it? 00:34:14
I don't have to. 00:34:24
Yep, it's a public hearing. Come up to the microphone, state your name and where you're from and what your comment is. 00:34:27
I'm Darlene Price, I'm in the villas and. 00:34:33
If my understanding is correct. 00:34:36
We were short on the budget for last year, correct? We overspent last year. 00:34:41
What do you mean by overspent? Well, I have a budget of $150.00 for XY and Z, right? And I spent $200.00. So I overspent. That's 00:34:48
what I'm asking is that according to what I was looking at on, on the two sections that you had up there, that was for last year, 00:34:57
correct? So my question for you is, are you saying we overspent meaning we didn't have a balanced budget or what? What exactly are 00:35:05
you asking in? In my household, I have to balance my budget every month. 00:35:14
And make sure that I don't overspend if I do have a credit card that I put my excess on and then that next month that has to be 00:35:23
paid off. So if we are having a City Council that has been given an award for transparency and for balancing the budget, my 00:35:30
understanding was that we didn't balance the budget last year that we overspent. And so this year we have to make up for what we 00:35:38
overspent. Is that correct? 00:35:45
Yeah. 00:35:53
No, that's not correct, sorry. 00:35:55
I think what you're confusing balancing the budget with having using fund balance. 00:35:58
To balance the budget, we cannot spend 1 penny more in any of the funds than what this Council gives us the approval to do so. 00:36:03
I get a feeling that we're having a shell game. 00:36:44
And I'm supposed to guess where the correct budget is? I hate to say that I am more angry than I am disappointed. I've gone from 00:36:47
disappointed to angry. I don't feel that we even need to be here, because you're going to just plain do what you want to do and 00:36:54
input from us does not count. 00:37:00
I have seen that on more than one thing that you have voted on where the House has been packed with people who have said please 00:37:07
don't do this and you just went ahead and did it anyway. So I guess I'm just frustrated and and I'm getting to the point of being 00:37:14
angry that you are not representing us for some reason. 00:37:20
My father would say follow the money. Why are you not doing what you say you're supposed to do? 00:37:28
Hold on, before we go back and forth, I'm going to close the public hearing on it. 00:37:35
Umm, are there any other comments from the public? 00:37:39
I'll come right back to you, Jake. 00:37:46
OK. Daria Evans, Vineyard resident, Slide 30, Page 35. 00:37:53
At the bottom. 00:37:59
Fiscal year FY Fiscal year 23 actual. 00:38:01
At the bottom, surplus and deficit in parentheses. It's in parentheses a deficit of $2,487,980. 00:38:07
That's probably to her question. Thank you. 00:38:18
All right. Any other comments from the public? 00:38:23
OK. Can I go out of a public hearing? 00:38:27
So moved first by Amber, can I get a second? 00:38:29
Second. Second by Marty. All in favor, Aye. All right, Jake. 00:38:33
Yeah, I, I think it's really important and I, Christy, I completely agree with the government conversation of where we can approve 00:38:38
to go into debt or to use our, our, our rainy day fund or our savings or our set aside funds for other things, right. I think when 00:38:44
a citizen approaches us and says, hey, I mean, and I, we, we can approve to go into debt like that, the 2 million or whatever. I 00:38:51
think we just need to be very clear and bring it down to. 00:38:58
Yeah, we spent more than what we had and we went into a rainy day fund last year dramatically. 00:39:07
Is what she? 00:39:18
Want to make sure that Christie's not doing anything wrong or anyone like. 00:39:20
Can you clarify that? 00:39:24
Yeah. I would just clarify that, that each year. 00:39:26
There is carryover dollars in the budget from within the general fund. There's a minimum and a maximum on that. So the minimum is 00:39:29
what, 7%? 00:39:34
Christy. 00:39:40
Five, 5% maximum is 35%. As a city, we like to try to stay between 17% and 35% because it has a, it's a recommended amount to stay 00:39:42
within because it improves bond ratings and things like that. They won't let you go above 35%. They want you to be below that. 00:39:52
35% and so we try to stay in between that. So each year as we set forth our budget, a portion of our budget. 00:40:04
Is utilization of that carryover general fund? 00:40:12
So that it stays within that range. The use of fund balance is perfectly common. Every year you you bet you budget for it so that 00:40:17
by the end of the year. 00:40:23
When you know inevitably a portion of your accounts are going to go unspent. 00:40:29
It automatically brings that account up to about the top of it again. And so you want to kind of. 00:40:34
Forecast right about in the middle of it. 00:40:41
So that you're not too low and you're not too high come the end of the year. But as Christy pointed out. 00:40:44
A budget is a forecast where budget we're forecasting our revenues, both property tax and sales tax and and our other revenue 00:40:51
sources and and it's the best guess and you try to be as conservative in that in that estimate as you can be. And Christy does a 00:40:57
phenomenal job and is usually. 00:41:03
As history goes, our our finance directors have been very good at getting close to that. 00:41:09
The approval of our end of year is simply the corrections that were a little bit plus here and a little bit minus here within the 00:41:15
budgeted allowances. 00:41:20
And within that fund? 00:41:26
OK. So it's not that there is overspending or there wasn't a portion of that fund balance? 00:41:28
So Daria mentioned the word deficit, and I think maybe you could explain that a little bit. 00:41:39
I think the average person, though, would understand that we're going into our savings and that's how most people speak, right? 00:41:45
It would be irresponsible. And so you want to pay your light bills and you want to make sure that you are saving and only spending 00:42:26
between those two percentages. And that's what we're that that's what is happening inside of this budget. And and one more 00:42:32
addition is that that the purpose behind that isn't so much so that you have a savings account on an ongoing basis. A big purpose 00:42:38
of that is so that when the year begins and you have yet to collect, you know, your first tranche of, of sales tax or property 00:42:44
tax. 00:42:50
You have a buffer so that the city continues to operate seamlessly between fiscal years. 00:42:57
And so that is why there's a recommended amount to stay within so that you don't have, you know, critical cash flow problems 00:43:03
during that transition from one finance fiscal year to the next. OK. I'm actually, I'm really happy to hear you explain it that 00:43:11
way because some of the concerns that were brought up to me were that if if we're looking at, you know, last year, we're one. 00:43:18
The budgets have changed a little bit, 1.1 million. 00:43:26
Use of the prior fund balance up from 26,000 from the year before. 00:43:32
So some of the comments that I heard was that will take us above the safe mark to be able to get good bond financing. So I'm happy 00:43:38
to hear you say that you guys maintain that 17% that I. 00:43:45
That's not something that I understood before, so I'm again learning. So can you help me understand how we went from? 00:43:53
And the use of the prior year fund balance? 00:44:01
Umm, what's what's in there now? And how did we go from 26,000 needing to use 26,000 to needing to use 1.1 million? And then this 00:44:05
year it changed from needing 465, which I felt OK about, to going back up. The new one is like 900. The one that came back last 00:44:15
night at like 10:00. I went all through this with Kim Olson yesterday. So it's like I have three different. 00:44:25
Three different budgets and the numbers are so different. 00:44:36
Right. And I'm going off one and I ask all my questions and then we get another one and it's lower and me and Kim are like, yay, 00:44:39
this is awesome. And then I get the one at 10:00 last night and all the numbers are back up again. And so yeah, it's scary for me 00:44:45
to approve it when when it changes to this degree. 00:44:52
Sorry, I asked questions and they're doing, Sarah, I totally understand. I appreciate your questions because I want to make sure 00:44:59
we all understand what's going on and we are going to be discussing quite, quite in depth during the conversation about the fiscal 00:45:04
year 25 budget. 00:45:09
And talking about this very thing. 00:45:14
We are not headed in a good direction in the amount of fund balance that we are using in order to keep. 00:45:18
Vineyard growing and having our services at the same level that we currently have them. 00:45:24
And so our goal tonight later is we'll be talking about what we're looking at in the fiscal year 25 budget. It is to help course 00:45:29
correct this action that has not been previously addressed. We are going to be trying to do small increments to at least get us on 00:45:37
the right trajectory to be where we need to be. And Christy, I would I would like clarity in that for the minutes you're not 00:45:44
talking about course correcting how fiscally aware the council has been. 00:45:52
Rather, what we're bringing into the city with tax revenue. 00:45:59
Is that right? 00:46:06
Yes, and and inflated costs, I mean, everything is going up, right And and yet Vineyard isn't, hasn't had a tax increase in 22 00:46:08
years. So we, I think we kept, I mean, we all hope things get better, right. And I think the projections that the council had that 00:46:14
were that things were going to head a different direction, different than what it has. 00:46:20
But in no way have they been fiscally irresponsible. We are just getting to where we're going to have a structural deficit if we 00:46:27
don't do something to course correct. So, but however, that conversation is not inside of this one, right? It's different. And the 00:46:33
conversation that Sarah brought up that said she got two different budgets for the 25, that's different, which she wanted clarity 00:46:38
on. 00:46:44
There were three. Actually, there were three that she's stating. 00:46:50
Are you talking in 24 or 24? 00:46:55
Listening Christie's computer glitched and she lost all of her budget, so she had to redo it so. 00:47:00
So yeah, anyway. 00:47:08
But umm. 00:47:10
But as I was going over it with Kim, we just went through and and Marty mentioned she doesn't want a nickel and dime staff because 00:47:12
you guys are awesome. You do such a great job. And I don't ever want you to think that that we don't think you're doing a great 00:47:19
job because we we do. In fact, I there was a petition going around to get to get crosswalk for. 00:47:26
For Hamptons over to Parkside and before that petition even finished, Nassim was already on it. So you guys are doing an awesome 00:47:35
job and I so, so appreciate it. The thing, the thing that Marty said is she doesn't want a nickel and dime everybody. And I 00:47:42
totally get that and I'm totally on board with that. The thing is, is that when you're talking about a $12 million budget, a dime 00:47:48
is like 10 grand, right? So you, you. 00:47:55
You pull back your budget 10 times, that's 100 grand. 00:48:03
And if everybody did that across the board, pretty soon it's $1,000,000. Do you see what I'm saying? It's like paying attention to 00:48:06
those little things add up, right? And so my challenge to staff, even Eric and the mayor, is to pay attention to those those Dimes 00:48:12
that you're spending and see where you can pull back for the sake of of getting this on the right trajectory. And just so you 00:48:19
know, I like. 00:48:25
Julie likes to say we need to put skin in the game. Like I'm even willing you can take off one of my months of income. 00:48:32
To help, I'm totally willing to do that, actually for the next three years. It's mine's more like a penny. 00:48:40
Compared to yours, but, but I'm willing. Jake would probably do it. 00:48:46
So, so there's that, but I think if if we all just really looked at it, we would live in a really nice community. And I feel like 00:48:51
if we just, if we just. 00:48:55
Coasted for the next year and didn't do a lot of excess training, didn't do a lot of excess travel. It wouldn't be too hard to get 00:49:01
us back where we need to be so. 00:49:06
OK. So just to make sure I understand everything that you're saying, I felt like inside of that conversation we talked about. 00:49:12
Taxes. 00:49:21
The 25 budget. 00:49:22
And did you have your questions on the 24 budget amendment? 00:49:24
Answered. 00:49:31
On just the closing out the year portion. 00:49:34
OK. 00:49:37
All right. That's where we're at right now. It's closed. No, that's OK. Let's wrap that portion up. And I believe I went out of a 00:49:38
public hearing, didn't I? Yes. So I need a motion on. So real quick I want to go through it. So it looks like the biggest one is 00:49:46
retirement and taxes. It was 36 and now it's 63. What was the increase for that online 54 transportation? 00:49:54
A staff member I'm guessing? Yes. Maintenance on transportation, it went up 16,000. 00:50:04
On transportation, what was that? 00:50:10
Do we know? 00:50:14
I don't have the detail right off hand but I'm OK. And what the 16,000 increase for transportation was in 24. 00:50:18
For the maintenance transportation line from 35,000 to 51. 00:50:29
Oh, for the mini the. 00:50:35
Right. And we moved it. 00:50:41
Right. To cover the electronic message boards, Yes. 00:50:43
And that would be under the transportation fund. OK. And then the good, yes. 00:50:47
Electronic message boards. 00:50:52
So, you know, they'll talk the mobile, their mobile electric must support. So when the city has to put up messages to the to the 00:50:55
public specifically for Rd. closures and so forth that we're able to put them up and then the went from 22 to 65. 00:51:03
40 an extra 40. 00:51:15
In transportation. 00:51:20
Hold on. I'm getting, I'm pulling up the detail in our finance system. 00:51:24
By the way, when you guys were talking about that, I pulled up our training and conferences and stuff for this year and we're 00:51:41
talking across all the departments like $60,000. So when we have like a 1.2 million deficit, $60,000 can go towards that. But 00:51:47
that's not what is making our budget not. 00:51:53
Fiscally responsible. 00:52:00
Right. But it helps. Every little bit helps. But I'm saying that's an awful well. And I think we need to be clear when you're 00:52:03
talking about paying your bills and going and keeping A level of service, when you say something like we can pull back, that's the 00:52:09
duty of the entire council is decide where you want to spend and how you don't want to spend. And one of the things you have to 00:52:15
assess is do we want to get these services? Do we want the road crossing? Do we want that petition for the crossing across the 00:52:20
street? 00:52:26
And if there are things that we can say, hey, we went inside of here and we looked and we said we're not seeing a return of 00:53:01
investment on here, let's go ahead and pull that. And that's this, that's this group. So, but let's go ahead and pull up the 00:53:06
numbers, OK, maybe we're just talking about the 22 to 65. 00:53:11
Oh, I'm sorry. I thought we were talking the equipment fund. He was saying there was a $16,000 difference. Yeah. 00:53:18
In the equipment fund, I don't, I think many of you are aware we received a grant, I guess it's kind of a grant from Domino's 00:53:23
Pizza for plowing for the snow plows. And so that revenue was put into this expense account and that is why you're seeing a 00:53:31
negative amount on that. I'm seeing like transportation and water, like retirement and taxes, it seems like they're consistent 00:53:38
from 36 to 60 is that now transportation and water would not be under the same fund. 00:53:46
You have water, storm water, wastewater, sorry, transportation. You know, I know it's a different fund, but what I'm saying is 00:53:55
from transportation and retirement taxes, it went from 36 to 63. What page are you on? 00:54:01
29. 00:54:09
But I'm seeing also on others it's a consistency that. 00:54:14
Retirement and taxes. It was 41 and 68. So like what? Why is all the department's retirements higher than what we budgeted? 00:54:19
Not all of them are. There are some departments that I neglected to get coded correctly. When I took over as the finance director, 00:54:28
there was a little misunderstanding about who was doing what and so people that were maybe being should have been charged in the 00:54:35
internal service fund were not. And so instead of going in and making all of those adjustments, I left it and made adjustments in 00:54:41
this final budget and have a list of which ones I need to change as of July 1st for this this upcoming year. 00:54:48
There you go. 00:54:56
Contract services and wastewater went from 970 to 1.3 million. 00:55:00
Contract services in wastewater would be the increase that we saw for sewer for the 40% increase. 00:55:08
Is this typical at the end of the year where we'll just have this clean up and all the numbers change and everything? And it is 00:55:16
absolutely typical and they are very minor adjustments. We make adjustments throughout the year. And like I said, this was budget 00:55:22
amendment #5 to finish up the year. But it is very common that minor adjustments are made within each fund at the end of each 00:55:28
fiscal year. 00:55:34
All right. 00:55:44
Can we get a motion? 00:55:46
I move to adopt Resolution 20/24/18, the amendment to the fiscal year 2023-2024 budget as presented. All right, we have a first by 00:55:52
Amber. Can I get a second? 00:55:57
Second Second by Sarah, Jake, Amber I I Marty. Sarah. 00:56:03
Aye, OK. 00:56:11
We'll go ahead and move to 9.3 public hearing proposed salary increases for elective and statutory officials. This requires a 00:56:14
motion to open and close the public hearing, so we'll go ahead and have that now. 00:56:19
I move to open into a public hearing. Thank you. Marty, can I get a second? 00:56:26
I need a second. 00:56:32
2nd thank you, Sarah. All in favor, Aye, We're now in a public hearing and we will. 00:56:33
Be hearing from, I'm not going to introduce the numbers, that would be dangerous, but I will introduce the law and what the 00:56:41
requirement is on this. So this is coming to the public a little bit differently than what it has in years past. The state 00:56:48
legislature this last session made a change to the law and compensation for public officials has always been a public record. 00:56:55
There's a state database where you can search for it and look at it and it's all there. 00:57:02
It now is required to come forward to councils at the time that you approve your budget. By ordinance, you have to approve 00:57:10
compensation for certain positions within the city government. 00:57:15
And so you have in the packet and ordinance that has those positions and those approvals listed, you also are required to hold a 00:57:21
public hearing. And so that's why this public hearing is occurring to comply with that legal requirement. OK. And Corey, are you 00:57:27
presenting this item as well? I just needed to add, I needed to highlight that I made a mistake in the first submittal when I did 00:57:33
the 1st. 00:57:39
Submission of the spreadsheet. And so I made a correction right before the City Council meeting. So I just wanted to highlight 00:57:46
your attention to that correction. 00:57:50
OK. 00:57:54
Did you want you want me to explain the correction or OK in the budget we had budgeted for a 5% salary increase. 00:57:55
In addition to that, there's a 0.7% recommended increase for Tier 2 retirement staff and that was included in the budget, but I 00:58:04
missed including that on the spreadsheet for the director salary increases. So that's what I added to that. And the 5% is the cost 00:58:11
of living adjustment. 00:58:17
It's 3.5% cost of living and 1.5% merit. Merit. 00:58:24
OK. Are there any questions from the public? 00:58:31
OK, seeing as there's none, I will go out of a public hearing. 00:58:37
I need a motion I move to go out of a public hearing. Thank you. Marty. Can I get a second, second, second by Sarah? So wait, 00:58:41
we're not going to talk about it. No, we're talking about. 00:58:45
Hi. Hi. 00:58:51
All right, and now the Council can discuss. 00:58:53
Jake, did you have something? Yeah. So is this just a code, Jamie, that the state requires us to put in place so that it's in part 00:58:58
of our policy? Are we actually giving everyone a salary increase? And no, this is required. You have to annually adopt the 00:59:04
salaries for those positions and state what they are so. 00:59:10
If you. 00:59:17
Make for most cities, for example, will will budget with a cost of living increase for staff and then they'll they may also pair 00:59:19
it with a merit increase and if you were to do those routine increases for. 00:59:25
Staff in certain positions, you have to include that in this ordinance that you adopt now annually. So right now, that's a new 00:59:33
process, the bottom line and the figures have always been public, but you have to approve them in a different way now than cities 00:59:38
have done it in the past. 00:59:43
So right now we're not approving 5 and 5.7. We're just putting this in a policy that. 00:59:49
As a policy, we will be doing like our city manager could be doing this. Let me look at your. 00:59:56
I'm not following what you mean. I think he's saying are we approving the funding for it or are we approving the policy? Well, so 01:00:02
you just, you just held the hearing on it and you are required to do that by law you have now. 01:00:10
Two different resolutions in front of you. One will be your resolution approving the budget and the budget will include an overall 01:00:18
figure right for compensation and these would be within it. You have a separate ordinance that's item 9.5. That is the ordinance 01:00:25
for the salary increases for those positions that's listed. So you'll as a council have to consider and then vote on both of those 01:00:32
items separately. 01:00:39
And so then they would, so we're, they go hand in glove. We're approving the policy and then they would get the increase. We would 01:00:46
and they would tonight. 01:00:50
The increase. I don't know the answer to the question on when the increase takes effect. 01:00:56
According to you, vote on the increase when you vote on the annual budget. 01:01:01
That's the state law requirement. And so you do them both together, I think. I think what you're saying, what you're suggesting is 01:01:06
that we're doing a policy. This isn't a policy, We're not implementing a policy for these salary increases. This is part of the 01:01:12
budget and this is the recommended increase. 01:01:18
Yes. 01:01:27
Who started this initiative? Just curious. 01:01:28
I don't, I don't remember who the sponsor was. I can pull that up and tell you in a few minutes if you want. No, no, not from the 01:01:32
state. I'm saying within the city, like who asked that we do an increase for us. 01:01:37
This is the first time hearing it like I thought when the packet came out, the increase you're referring to paying me more? Yeah, 01:01:44
that is also part of the statute is that. 01:01:49
Elected officials are listed among that group of. 01:01:56
Select director level staff within the city. 01:02:02
And the policy says that if the. 01:02:06
If a cola is given. 01:02:09
Elected officials will receive that same cola. 01:02:12
With the staff and COLA is the cost of living allowance. 01:02:16
And you can't separate it to cut us out. 01:02:23
The statute says. 01:02:28
The elected officials will receive the same cola that. 01:02:30
That the city staff get if the if a COLA is provided. 01:02:34
That's my understanding, I'm not quoting it, but that was what we learned. 01:02:38
Our budget. 01:02:44
It just it feels a little wrong. 01:02:50
When we're when we're not on the right path. 01:02:53
Right. I feel like everybody's paid really fairly and I love the idea, you guys all obviously. 01:02:58
Definitely deserve more for what you do, but maybe this isn't the best year to do this. Maybe we wait a year and see. I feel a lot 01:03:05
better of it about it if we were back to the the $26,000 prior year fund balance then. 01:03:13
Then closer to a million. I mean, I don't want any. I definitely don't want to vote to give myself a raise. 01:03:22
So that's how I feel. Yeah, me too. 01:03:31
All right, I. 01:03:36
Discussion, right? You already closed that, Marty. Amber, yes, this is not open for discussion right now. Marty and Amber, do you 01:03:39
have any comments? 01:03:43
You know, it's always an awkward conversation. I'm. 01:03:49
I'm looking at this. 01:03:53
Yeah, I don't care if I get another $400.00 a year or not. That to me we're, I mean, we're talking such a small percentage in my 01:03:55
family's budget and the city's budget. 01:03:59
What I'm more interested in, like to me that's it doesn't matter if we need to cut that out or whatever we need to do, but 01:04:06
rejecting the salary increases for the staff, I've been thinking a lot about it. 01:04:11
And. 01:04:19
You know, it's Mr. Price came in and talked about how everyone's struggling and how we don't, how we need to be respectful with 01:04:20
funds and everyone is trying to make ends meet. And I think, and our staff is part of that, our staff is trying to make ends meet 01:04:26
as well and they're dealing with inflation and they're dealing with gas prices. 01:04:32
And so it's kind of like this catch 22, it's do we cater to that and help show our staff that we acknowledge the work they're 01:04:38
doing? Do we try to help with retention of employees? Is 5.7% going to make a difference whether or not they're going to stay or 01:04:45
go? And is 5.7%? 01:04:52
Or the 56,000? Is that going to make or break our budget? 01:05:00
I'd love to hear Julian Amber's opinions. 01:05:04
I feel like we're, I feel like there's some other things that we could look into arguing to get rid of before we look at getting 01:05:08
rid of cola. I believe my husband's company is in a struggling field and they're still working on cola for them as well. I don't 01:05:14
know. Yeah. I mean, how long was it? 01:05:19
When we so we did an adjustment before, but it had been years since an adjustment had been made for the City Council and the mayor 01:05:27
and I think it's excellent that we have this opportunity to. 01:05:33
Address it like this. It's uncomfortable to talk about giving yourself a raise, however menial it is, but it's necessary. This is 01:05:40
a hard job. There's a lot of work that goes into it, and I think that following the state law, understanding the purpose of it, it 01:05:47
makes a lot of sense. Can I jump in just for a second? The the state law doesn't require that the council receive a COLA with the 01:05:55
staff last year. 01:06:02
And I can't remember the details exactly because Ezra, the city manager at the time did this last year when you looked at the City 01:06:09
Council and the mayor's salaries and we did an increase then I believe they could have done an ordinance and and what they did at 01:06:17
that time was tie in any City Council mayor increases to a COLA that we would then give to city staff. So the state statute or the 01:06:25
the SB 91 that we're referring to doesn't indicate that we have to give. 01:06:32
City Council, the COLA. So we'd have to go back and look at whether whether that city ordinance required that you get one or 01:06:40
whether you could choose not to. I don't think it requires it. I think what it did was it instituted a policy. So what Amber was 01:06:48
pointing out was that before this, the City Council was working X amount of time for $8000 and the mayor had been working. 01:06:56
Full time for $15,000 and so they increased it and they said it's really uncomfortable to do. 01:07:05
These significant increases for just getting a cost of living when you're dedicating this time. And so they said why don't you do 01:07:12
incremental things that annually comes up and if it's in the budget or if we can do it during that time, allowing the COLA because 01:07:21
it's a small amount that doesn't create a very big burden on the residents versus the small incremental moments. So that's the 01:07:29
question before you. We're definitely going to give you the COLA. In my opinion, where I stand, I'm voting for that you guys. 01:07:37
We heard it from our residents and we heard it from our council. I think that's important for me either way, however the council 01:07:47
feels about a COLA for you guys. The idea is just taking small steps versus huge increases over time. And so whatever you guys 01:07:53
want to do, I feel comfortable with. 01:08:00
OK, but I need a motion. 01:08:07
Yeah, umm. 01:08:09
Are you making a motion? No, I'm gonna comment on this. 01:08:12
I think our staff are some of the best staff. 01:08:18
That are in other cities and I've loved working with them. 01:08:20
I just don't. 01:08:24
When down economies come, they hit and they affect all of us, and I don't like that government staff. 01:08:25
We just vote and then we put the pressure on the other side because the other side is hurting. 01:08:32
Just as the other. 01:08:37
You know, it's like, hey, so it's a down economy, so one gets out and one doesn't. I'm not sure what you're saying. 01:08:39
Well, when there's a bad economy and inflation and what are we combined the private sector and the public sector at the same time. 01:08:45
And so us as a council just voting that, hey, the inflation and everything in the down economy isn't going to affect it is what 01:08:51
I'm saying. So I. 01:08:56
But at the same rate. 01:09:03
You know, at the beginning of this January, February, when we did meet that one time. 01:09:06
It was bringing us a budget that doesn't go into debt or have us raise rates on our taxes and we haven't been great. We have 01:09:11
spent. 01:09:16
We don't need to name Qual Church World Trade Center. There's a lot of things that we have just gone out and spent. And I would 01:09:23
feel a lot more comfortable if we were not doing all of these things to say, hey, we're in a bad spot. But we need to be, we're 01:09:29
A-Team and everyone needs to do it together. And we're going to be talking about a massive rate increase tonight. And I just don't 01:09:34
think it's the so we're going to throw this and the massive rate increase to our citizens as well during inflation. So I would be 01:09:40
voting no. 01:09:46
For which part? For the color for the staff? 01:09:52
For both. 01:09:55
Any further closing comments? It looks like there was a closing comment and so let's go ahead and wrap that up and then we can 01:09:58
make a motion or I just need a motion. 01:10:02
Motion until the budget. 01:10:18
There's no motion until after the budget, so let's move on. Think about it. 01:10:20
OK. We will go ahead and move on to our. 01:10:24
Discussion and action of the adoption of the final fiscal year 2025 budget. 01:10:31
And we are going to be hearing from our finance director and we are also going to be hearing from. 01:10:36
In addition to serving Vineyard for approximately 20 years, she personally serves as a financial advisor to West Valley, West 01:11:22
Jordan, Orem, Ogden, South Jordan, Leighton, Lehigh, Eagle Mountain and several others. And so with that, I'm going to turn the 01:11:29
time over to Miss Lewis for a presentation. 01:11:36
Interrupted with halal music. Please feel free to check up your phone to see if it distracts me because. 01:11:45
You did a really good job and weren't distracted. 01:11:51
Hi, it's nice being with you tonight. I have been with the city of Vineyard. I've been have the privilege to work as your 01:11:55
financial advisor since your population was 268. And I remember distinctly that the mayor that ran at the time had 68 votes in 01:12:02
favor of him winning. And I've seen all this, you know phenomenal growth. I worked with Norm Holdaway. I'm assuming he is related 01:12:10
to you so I've got. 01:12:17
Deep breaths here, deep roots here So. 01:12:25
In addition to working with a lot of cities as their financial advisor when they issue debt, we do a lot of consulting and 01:12:29
feasibility studies. We do analysis like comprehensive financial sustainability plans. You're not the only cities that grapple 01:12:37
with, you know, the whole concept of, you know, my revenues and my expenses and how do we, you know, plan for that for the future. 01:12:44
So I have given a presentation similar to this to. 01:12:52
Both cities, large and small, I think the first time that I could find record of it was maybe back in like 2010 ish, which would 01:13:00
seem about right because that's when you know, a lot of the economies wheels were falling off and cities were in a lot of 01:13:10
financial stress at that time after the 2008 and 9 recession. And we actually presented to the League of Cities and Towns. 01:13:19
Related to this, because a lot of people do not understand how the tax rates are set for cities, they think they understand and 01:13:29
their view is, you know, generally quite. 01:13:35
Rational. It's not an irrational way that they perceive it, but it's just not the way it works in Utah, it's way it works in some 01:13:43
states. 01:13:46
So with that, they've been kind enough and when I sent the slides, I didn't realize that they come up like in fancy little pieces 01:13:50
because when I was making. So just populate the page. There you go, okay. 01:13:57
So just yesterday and I was working on this presentation over the past little while. 01:14:04
I'm a sort of voracious news reader, and I saw this headline out of Money Wise just yesterday, and it certainly minutes, you know, 01:14:10
sort of all over the Internet. 01:14:16
Remember, I'm talking about Montana. I should have put that in whatever, but it is how people think, and they think it applies to 01:14:24
taxes and how they're set in every state. 01:14:28
We just can't take this anymore. A Montana man, 68, begs for a moratorium on property taxes. 01:14:32
After his bill reaches 8000A year just to live in our own house. 01:14:38
If my taxes were $8000 a year, I'd be begging for you to post a moratorium. 01:14:43
But then, as you read on this article, it says soaring property values. There are many reasons. Again, this is Montana. There are 01:14:50
many reasons why property taxes may increase over time. First and foremost, property taxes typically based upon a percentage of 01:14:56
your home's assessed value. That part is true. The last part is not for Utah residents. So if your value goes up, it's likely that 01:15:03
your tax bill will too. 01:15:10
That is not the way property tax rates work in Utah. All right, next page. 01:15:18
So one of the first things to understand, and probably everyone in the room knows this, if you get a tax bill, you see it, 01:15:25
probably have asked what it is or figured out. And but it's like, Oh yeah, they're giving me a reduction. I'm happy for that. 01:15:30
So one of the things under Utah State tax law is that for a primary owned resident. 01:15:37
You do not pay taxes on the full market value of your home. So market value is like if you're going to plunk a for sale sign in 01:15:46
your yard. Market value is what you're expecting to be paid when you sell your home or what your homes value is if it were going 01:15:54
to be appraised. So if it is a second home, if you're fortunate enough to have a second home in Saint George or whatever. 01:16:02
That is not your primary residence and you will not get that same discount. 01:16:11
It is only for primary residential properties. 01:16:16
So they take the market value, they reduce that by 45%, and your taxable value in this example would go from a market value of 01:16:19
$744,900 to the taxable value of $409,695. 01:16:26
If that full market value were a business. 01:16:34
Whoever's nail salon or whatever it is right that residential exemption does not apply. They would pay the taxes on the full, full 01:16:40
value of that. All right, next slide. 01:16:44
Oh my goodness, that is microscopic. So here, Believe it or not, you'll have to believe me. I've got it in a little bit bigger 01:16:51
thing on the next page. This is an actual. 01:16:55
Tax bill that one of my colleagues actually went to the county assessors website and plucked up a tax bill. And if with your 01:17:02
microscopic reading eyes just you can see 123 the 4th column over the 2023 tax rate. 01:17:11
That top one for the school district basic levy is 001408. How did I do? 01:17:21
106 OK, not bad from here not. 01:17:30
Oh, the second one down or the first one? The second one 4040? 01:17:36
So is is 4048, so .004048. So we use the numbers in that column from that tax bill to develop some data on some other pages. So 01:17:45
next. 01:17:53
That's a little bit larger, so I can read it from here at least. So the second line, Alpine School District, 0.004048. So the 01:18:02
numbers in that column, the second column next or the column next to item, the 2023 rate, those are off of a 2023 tax bill for a 01:18:10
residential property in the city of Vineyard. 01:18:18
We show what the taxes are and the percent of that total for your tax bill. So you as a City Council and this is true statewide 01:18:27
for cities and it's and it's just something that we as an individual, if you were to ask me, bar Lewis, what is your total 01:18:35
property tax? And Murray, I can give you a pretty good estimate of what that check is for. What is your total property tax in for 01:18:43
your condo in Saint George? I can tell you what that tax bill is. 01:18:51
Even being in this industry. 01:19:00
I cannot tell you. I mean, I could look this up and find it out. I cannot tell you how much of that money goes to the city. It's 01:19:02
not. It's not what's planted in my head. What's planted in my head is my total tax bill. So when any jurisdiction goes to, you 01:19:09
know, raise property taxes and the state law requires that you have to, you know, show and have a hearing and show what the 01:19:16
percentage increase is people naturally. 01:19:23
Do the math in their head of oh, and I'm just making up a number now, right? They naturally do the math and say, oh, a 5% tax 01:19:32
increase. If my tax bill, my total tax bill, because that's how they think of it. My total tax bill is $1000 and a 5% increase. I 01:19:38
can do that math, right? I know that's going to be $50. 01:19:44
So when each jurisdiction raises taxes, it's important that you understand and that you educate your constituents that what you 01:19:52
get to control is the taxes for that 30% line, OK? So we'll talk in a minute about, well, OK. 01:20:03
But my tax bill as a whole is still going up. You're very likely so because everyone of those entities, school district, the state 01:20:16
school levy, the city, Utah County and Central Utah Water District, all can act separate apart from you to raise those property 01:20:24
taxes, right? And that's going to affect the total tax bill. 01:20:32
The pie chart at the bottom just shows what's at top in a cute little pie chart and you can see that the you know, the big orange 01:20:42
piece that is Alpine school districts chunk of money Vineyard is the light blue pie to the left and the county is the light blue 01:20:49
and the darker blue pie to the right of that. All right, next. 01:20:55
I'm sorry about this. I didn't realize I was doing this until I got here. And I'm like, oh crap, OK, there we go. 01:21:06
The certified tax rate calculation pursuant to state law. 01:21:16
Aims to maintain revenue neutrality for the jurisdiction. 01:21:21
Revenue neutrality means whatever dollar amount. So, you know, put yourself in a place which is a little bit hard, probably 01:21:28
mentally where Vineyard doesn't have any new homes built, but just pretend that we have a year right, where no new homes, no new 01:21:35
businesses are built, right? And from 2022 to 2024. 01:21:42
You all know right? Property values are doing what we're going up, right? 01:21:51
But if there's no new growth, the tax statute is structured so that you will receive the exact same dollar amount. 01:21:56
Dollar amount, not rate dollar amount. 01:22:07
In 23 that you received in 22. 01:22:11
So if you take no action. 01:22:15
Right. You'll get probably some more money in the real world because you do have some new growth. 01:22:18
But what comes with new growth? 01:22:24
Cost, cost. 01:22:27
Exactly, Jacob, absolutely. So it's important to understand that. 01:22:28
I talked about new growth, OK, but that is not an increase in existing home value. It does not capture anything related to the 01:22:35
home valuation. As a matter of fact, it's an the rating agencies love our tax law. Why do they love it? So let's go back mentally 01:22:43
to 2010, what was happening in 2008 and nine with like properties in Nevada? 01:22:51
Right. Property values are going up and they don't have this law. So tax revenues were just skyrocketing, right? But then here 01:23:01
comes 2008, 2009, right? 01:23:07
Crashing values also crashing revenues, right? Yeah, exactly so. 01:23:14
That makes it really hard for local governments to budget because you're like, right in Utah. Guess what? Property values went 01:23:22
down some. 01:23:26
Now that you know this brilliant thing, what do you think happened to the tax rate? 01:23:31
Up a little, up a little and you didn't have to take any action for that to increase. 01:23:38
Because they are seeking to maintain revenue neutrality, OK. 01:23:43
Moving on. 01:23:48
And there's one page that things come up like the last one comes first and it's it's a little bit of a hot mess. So sorry about 01:23:50
that. 01:23:53
OK, this is an example. This is not Vineyard. 01:23:59
That's an example I actually got off of. 01:24:04
Legislative report from 2022, I think later on I've got a reference to where you can go look it up if you want. But they're trying 01:24:08
to educate the legislators about the same kind of thing. And they said, oh, OK, so how is the general fund budget number set? 01:24:15
Well, they look at what the whatever city they pulled, I don't know, they didn't reference it. 01:24:22
So if your general fund budget last year from property taxes generated $7,400,000, they went, oh, what is the current taxable 01:24:30
value of the city? It's two billion, 155 in this example. And it is relatively simple math in this example. 01:24:38
So it's just really we need to get to 7 million four. We, what are we going to multiply the two billion 1:55 to get to 7 million 01:24:49
four? Oh, it's .003434 in this example. 01:24:55
Now when I say simple math, the actual way they they the mathematical formula that they utilize to deal with new growth and 01:25:02
changes in centrally assessed property. 01:25:08
What big giant thing is in Vineyard that essentially assessed? 01:25:15
PowerPoint exactly 100% spot on. 01:25:21
You have no say in what the centrally assessed every five years, right, Whatever they do with it, right, He said. Power plant, 01:25:26
Yeah, sorry, power plant. And it's essentially 5 every five years. I think it is every five years. So it's centrally assessed. 01:25:34
Right. And depending upon what the state sets that rate for, for all you know, centrally assessed kind of railroads, power gas, 01:25:42
those type of facilities are what gets centrally assessed. 01:25:49
If they go in and, you know, argue that their taxes need to be lower and the state says, OK, sure, we agree with that, which they 01:25:57
do sometimes. 01:26:02
It impacts this math calculation. But again, you get to say nothing about it. I mean, you can go to the hearing, right? But the 01:26:07
city, they didn't have to approach the city to do that. So the actual calculation is more complicated than this example that the 01:26:14
state presented the legislature because I do take into account new growth. 01:26:20
They do take into account changes in centrally assessed taxes, but this is intended to give you an idea of how the sort of the 01:26:27
basic part of that is set. And then again, if you don't act on this in the future and that taxable value goes up. 01:26:35
And they're trying to get you that same 7.4 million. You're going to see that 003434. 01:26:43
Go down, which is what we will. I'll show you in a minute relative to Vineyard, OK, next. 01:26:50
In the presentation that I referenced a minute ago that I pulled that example from, the state specifically says. 01:27:00
There is no windfall or loss of revenues that they're Speaking of, lack of the revenues to the local government from market 01:27:08
fluctuation. So again, property values go up. 01:27:13
Tax rate goes down, property values go down, tax rate goes up. Because they're seeking for revenue neutrality. They state it is 01:27:19
designed to be revenue neutral to the taxing entity view as a taxing entity. With that additional property tax revenues then can 01:27:26
only come from new construction. 01:27:32
And adjustment to the certified tax rate, that's it. And as Jacob indicated, right, if it wasn't you, I'm trying to keep track. 01:27:39
And but if you have, I think you did say that if there's, if there's new construction, you've got new costs, right? You've got 01:27:45
more people, you've got a police, you've got more people you've got fire for, you've got more people want parks and roads and 01:27:51
water and it goes on and on. So those new revenues for construction, I believe I wasn't there when they authored the, the state 01:27:57
tax code. 01:28:03
I believe that why they agreed to an adjustment for new construction is because they realize that any new construction is going to 01:28:10
require new services, right? Okay, all right, next. 01:28:15
So here we are. 01:28:25
With vineyards tax rates, so I have one cell highlighted in green from 2017 to 2023. You're with the exception of the green cell, 01:28:28
your property tax rate to operate tax rates have fallen and fallen and fallen and fallen and fallen. 01:28:37
I did not have time to research it. 01:28:47
My best educated guess relative to why that property tax rate went up in 2021 as you did not you you the council seated at the 01:28:51
time did not act to increase taxes because as as Kristen stated, you haven't raised taxes for in that capacity to adjust your 01:28:58
certified tax rate for I don't a long, long time. 01:29:06
What I believe happened here is I think it was the IT was post Kovid, right? I think property values maybe went down and that was 01:29:15
a slight adjustment up. I don't know that. So put a pin in that one. But you can see the trend line right from 2017 to 2033 is 01:29:21
down, down, down, down, down. All right, next slide, I might be a next, it might be a bullet. There we go. It just says what I 01:29:27
just said, OK. 01:29:33
So now let's look at some of the other main taxing entities. 01:29:40
That your, you and your citizens will see on their their tax bill. 01:29:45
So we've got Vineyard there. That's the same data that was on that previous slide. We have Alpine School District, Central Utah 01:29:50
Water Conservancy District and Utah County. 01:29:55
As you can see Alpine school districts tax rate has gone up in that same period of time three Times Now. If my assumption on 20/21 01:30:00
is accurate, theirs may have gone up in 2021 for the same reason. I didn't again go research every meeting they had and see which 01:30:08
years they actually acted to increase their rates. Also if they have a general obligation bond that either comes on. If the if the 01:30:16
citizens approve a general obligation bond that's going to raise the tax rate. 01:30:23
If they pay off general obligation bonds, that tax rate is going to naturally fall because they no longer have the the need to 01:30:31
collect that tax because it's voted on specifically to pay that debt. 01:30:38
I meant to highlight all of central Utah Water Conservancy districts in green because what do you notice is like the trick test 01:30:46
question. What do you notice about Central Utah Water Conservancy districts rate? 01:30:52
Remains constant and why do you think that is the amount of water people use, right? 01:30:58
It means they act each and every year to hold their tax rate the same. 01:31:06
Each and every year they are required to be in a public hearing, you know, process like you're doing tonight and say we're just 01:31:12
going to preserve that same tax rate. 01:31:18
That's all we want to do, preserve that same tax rate. Could you notice everyone else is right, Utah County, there's goes down, 01:31:23
down, down, up. Now we got to bump it up, down, down, down. At some point they're going to have to bump it up. Central Utah. I do 01:31:29
have a couple of clients that do this. Clearfield is one. I know West Valley looks at it every year to, you know, see if they 01:31:35
should hold their rate constant. So Ogden looks at it every year to see if they hold their rate constant. And Ogden several years 01:31:41
ago was in a situation like you. 01:31:47
And, you know, but with a little bit bigger numbers or a bigger city and they had the need to, you know, raise revenues to pay 01:31:54
public safety. And I don't remember the, you know, the number of years, but they hadn't raised tax the same thing for years and 01:32:01
years and years when we went and did their look at their analysis and I didn't think to do this for you, but we looked at, oh, 01:32:07
what would their revenues be today? How how many more dollars would they have in their general fund if they had held that tax rate 01:32:13
constant? 01:32:19
From the last time they raised taxes for them, the number was $8 million. They if they had just done what Central Utah did and 01:32:28
held that rate constant every year, just like clockwork, they would have had $8 million more a year in their budget. So you can 01:32:35
see the compounding impact of just letting that rate slide, right? I mean, it's, it's going the wrong direction when inflation is 01:32:43
going to the direction, which I'll show you in a minute. So as you can see, yours is dropping, dropping, dropping. 01:32:50
Alpine Mike, again a guess is the reason that big drop in that one year is my guess is they had a Geo bond payoff they have, they 01:32:58
keep all their debt really, really short. 01:33:02
But you've got central Utah just steady as she goes. You talk county is, you know, pretty flat overall. So that I just want you to 01:33:08
keep that in your head as we talk about what happens when inflation comes along. All right. 01:33:15
This is the one that they come up all wonky. I don't. 01:33:25
Well, there's one more. One more at the top. 01:33:29
So additional property tax revenues generated from new construction growth, as we've talked about, come with new demands on 01:33:34
services. 01:33:38
They're designed so that you can provide the same level of services to those new citizens that you do today. It relying on that 01:33:43
like, Oh yeah, we're going to have lots of growth, so we'll have more revenues. 01:33:48
Relying on that alone falls short overtime because it's not designed to keep pace with inflation. So without action taken at your 01:33:54
level, right? 01:34:00
You just can't practically keep up with the inflating costs of providing city services. As someone who came to the podium noted 01:34:07
earlier, I've got a slide that, you know, has some shocking numbers relative to inflationary increases over the past same period 01:34:13
that seven years. 01:34:18
But you know, well, yes, you and I are all feeling the squeeze as individuals. 01:34:24
It's not like fairies work for you. You have individuals that work for you, right? They have the same need to have, you know, more 01:34:32
money to put the gas, same amount of gas in their gas tank. So that stress comes to a city as well. So not again, if you just let 01:34:39
that rate fall, fall, fall, fall, fall, eventually you've got you got a budgetary problem. All right, next. 01:34:46
Oh, here it is. The inflation game, I called it. 01:34:55
So with references to where I found these numbers, I couldn't always find the same reference for the same number. 01:34:59
I looked at the price of ground beef in 2017 and the price today or last year and it's gone up 31%. Price of a movie tickets gone 01:35:08
up 25% a car. That one I was like wow so I have to buy a car for my 16 year old this year so I get to quit driving her around. 01:35:16
The average house in Utah County, that was also pretty shocker for me, 74%. The median income in Utah County has gone up 42%. 01:35:26
So it's not all, I mean, median income appears to be keeping up with everything but housing, right? It's like, OK, it seems to be 01:35:37
keeping up with car increases, seems to be keeping up movie tickets. And we all know there's a real housing squeeze. And then I 01:35:43
just tossed on here for the sake of it, the mean annual firefighter wage in Utah. Because again, that's something that hits you as 01:35:49
a city directly, right? Some of that may be supply and demand, some of that may be, but it's real. It's what you have to deal 01:35:55
with. And that's gone up 51%. 01:36:01
And I got that from Forbes and Zip recruiter. So I don't know the Fire Chief from or may may think I'm way off, but all right. 01:36:09
Next. 01:36:19
OK, now here's the shocker. 01:36:21
So I'm comparing the inflation rate. So not, you know, I was just giving you some cute little samples on the previous page. The 01:36:23
actual annual CPI inflation rate is what's listed there in the second column to the right. So you've got the year, you've got the 01:36:29
inflation rate. 01:36:35
And you can see that that increases sometimes a little, sometimes 2022 a lot. Thankfully, it's coming back down. I think this year 01:36:42
will be in the 3:00-ish percent range, which will be nice. And then you can see the cumulative nature of that inflation. So if 01:36:49
it's 2.41 year, then we add to that 1.8, then it's a total of 4.2, then we add to that 1.2, then we add to that 4.7. So when you 01:36:57
look at it from a cumulative perspective. 01:37:04
It adds up to a 22% increase in that inflation index over that period from 2017 to 2023. Now let's look at the percentage rate 01:37:12
change in Vineyard Cities tax rate. 01:37:20
Oh, look, there are lots of negatives. Went down 1.4%, it went down 14.8%, it went down 3.5. So you can, you can see it right 01:37:29
there. And so you're going the wrong direction. That's what that graph at the bottom is trying to show you. Inflation is going 01:37:35
this way. 01:37:40
Your tax rates going this way and again new growth is in the tax increase you get from new growth is intended to cover the new 01:37:47
same level of cost of services. Okay, next. 01:37:55
I just sell these great things and then these words come up all right, here are some pie charts relative to where your. 01:38:05
The pie charts went away. 01:38:16
That's OK. 01:38:20
So this is where your tax revenues, this isn't just your property tax revenues, this is the revenues that come into your general 01:38:22
fund. So for those in the audience, the general fund takes in things like property tax, sales taxes, business license fees, 01:38:29
license and permits, that kind of thing. The general fund does not deal with water and sewer. That's in a separate enterprise fund 01:38:36
that is intended hopefully to be self-sustaining. 01:38:43
So this just gives you an idea of you know where the. 01:38:52
Money comes from that makes up your general fund, and then the next pie chart on the right is expenditures, general government, 01:38:55
public safety, highway and public Works, and Parks and rec. 01:39:02
So I have several clients that, you know, aim. I actually was texting one earlier tonight before my phone started playing really 01:39:10
loud music. I was texting to say, will you remind me it was for Ogden because I know she works late. Will you remind me how many 01:39:15
what you were? 01:39:21
What amount of your public safety cost is covered by your property taxes? And she said she'd need to look and get back to me. But 01:39:30
several cities that I work for really aim to, you know, try to have their property taxes cover. Oh, thank you. I bet I have like 01:39:35
50. 01:39:40
15 bottles of water scattered. 01:39:46
Getting over a sinus infection. 01:39:52
Drink all night. 01:39:57
So several of my clients and my colleagues clients aim to have property taxes pay for public safety. 01:40:00
They like the feel of that right, Which I'm not using air quotes, but just because it's the word feel. But it's like, OK, what is 01:40:10
the most essential thing? 01:40:15
That you provide. 01:40:20
The safety of my citizens. OK, so is it nice to look at them and say, oh, where do your property tax dollars go? Oh, they go right 01:40:22
to pay police and fire. 01:40:26
OK. So if you look at where your revenues are coming from and where your expenditures are going, big sea of blue is public safety. 01:40:31
I didn't think about blue being like, you know in blue line kind of thing. So big sea of blue public safety. 01:40:40
So in an ideal world, it would be lovely if the property taxes on the revenue source covered that big sea of blue. 01:40:49
But you can see it's not right. So by my calculation it might be on this page. As you keep clicking it might be on the next one. 01:41:02
All right. 01:41:12
There we go. That's what I've already talked about. The first bullet point for Vineyard your public safety costs in your fiscal 01:41:14
year 2025 budget are estimated to be about $5.6 million. 01:41:21
It is not uncommon. I I mean I haven't canvassed every city that we work for it at Lewisham, but it is not uncommon that public 01:41:28
safety is a number one expense. That is not uncommon. 01:41:35
So even with the proposed change in tax rate that the city you know is going to be discussing, it's estimated that you would 01:41:43
collect 3.9 million. 01:41:48
To go to that, I mean, again, if you use this philosophy, I'm not saying you have to, but just understand that when your citizens 01:41:55
say, what does my property taxes go to pay for, it's only covering about 70% of public safety costs. 01:42:01
Right. So you're looking to sales taxes and other things to augment that. So I just want you to be aware of that. All right, next. 01:42:08
So another way of looking at, you know, sort of like are we keeping up with inflation? It's just another view of it is looking at 01:42:19
your total population and your revenue. So we looked at that in 2017 and 2023. And here's a cute little graph. The next page has 01:42:25
more specific data that I like. 01:42:30
So taking that same per capita, so per person, what you know what was your general fund or your property taxes generating in 2017 01:42:39
per person? 01:42:45
Versus what is it capturing now? 01:42:52
Well, if we don't adjust for inflation, it looks like oh you got you can party all day, right? Because in in 2017 you were 01:42:55
collecting 32,000 approximately per person. 01:43:01
And now you're collecting 37, so you're like, Oh yeah, that's $5000 more until I go back and add in those inflationary figures, 01:43:08
right? So I'm inflating that so that you're comparing apples to apples in today's dollars. If I take the $32,057 from 2017 and I 01:43:16
use the inflationary numbers that I showed on that other page, like one percent, 1.21.8, whatever they were, we add that, compound 01:43:23
that over time and bring it up to today. 01:43:31
In today's dollars, you would have $39,808 per capita to work with, but you really only have 37,490. So you've lost again, another 01:43:39
way of looking at the fact that you've lost buying power of roughly $2300 per person. All right, next. 01:43:49
I don't know whether Howard Stevenson knows that I use this quote. Probably not. But maybe he'll watch this and he'll know. 01:44:05
So Howard Stevenson was the executive director of the Utah Taxpayers Association for many years. They bill themselves as we are, 01:44:11
the taxpayer watchdog. And this was written, I think he was a senator until 2018. 01:44:19
This was an article that he was written by him and I've got the the date site. I can't remember I meant to include the. I could 01:44:29
find it if you need it where what the article is written in. 01:44:34
And this is a direct quote. 01:44:42
If local governments want to exceed the certified tax rate, they must go through truth and taxation notification and hearing 01:44:45
process. 01:44:49
This is a good opportunity for local government officials to explain the proposed budget to their constituents. And then I should 01:44:54
have put this in bold with like bright yellow around it. For the record, the Utah Taxpayers Association does not oppose local 01:45:00
governments, does not oppose every proposed increase over the certified tax rate. In many cases, local governments are recouping 01:45:07
inflationary losses. 01:45:14
So probably one of the most conservative taxpayer guys I know, right, is saying, I mean, he's acknowledging that your certified 01:45:22
tax rate drops and drops and drops and doesn't cover inflationary increases. 01:45:28
All right, next. 01:45:36
So have you all pulled out your tax bills for the past blah, blah, blah years that I was 20 from 2017. Going forward, you might 01:45:41
look at it and say, well, my, what I'm paying, my taxes have gone up. And you would be right, right? Because there are several 01:45:47
reasons that those taxes might be going up. What do we show on those charts? Oh, every Alpine school district had three tax 01:45:53
increases. 01:45:59
Central Utah holds their steady. Utah County had one tax increase right. 01:46:07
So your total tax bill? 01:46:12
Could be going up one because of those other entities that are raising taxes. That's an easy one. The harder one to kind of 01:46:15
grapple with is related to how your property tax value is increasing compared to quote UN quote your neighbors. 01:46:24
Locally assessed property has to be valued every five years. 01:46:34
Now, do I think they'd run around and appraise all of our homes? No, I do not know by what method they they do. All I know is that 01:46:40
some years it's like, oh, your property is now worth this and you can go in and, you know, fight against that if you think it's 01:46:45
overvalued. 01:46:50
But they have established a cycle for that reappraisal. Again, they're not sending people to run through your house and really 01:46:57
appraise it. But they do reappraise those houses, but they don't do. 01:47:03
An entire city at a time, right? So they may do. Let's assume you have. 01:47:10
5 segments of your city and they're gonna do one of those segments every year. So if you're in segment one and it was a year where 01:47:18
property values went up a lot, right? Because you have to think of the total pie when they're when they're coming up with whatever 01:47:24
that same revenue is for you. 01:47:30
From year to year to year, what did they look at? You remember the total taxable value number, that 2 billion, what are the number 01:47:37
was right? Well, that, that total number is made-up of, oh, look, there's five of you, 12345, so your area gets reappraised, 01:47:46
right? So you're now a bigger piece of that total pie. There's hasn't been reappraised yet. 01:47:54
So in that year. 01:48:03
Your property taxes may go up a little because your valuation went up a little relative to theirs. 01:48:06
Next year, right? So eventually it catches up, but in anyone given year, your property taxes on your own bill may go up for one of 01:48:12
those two reasons. 01:48:17
All right, next I think we're getting, oh, conclusion. Yeah, you're all happy, right? 01:48:24
So if if you don't act to adjust those property tax rates from time to time, you lose purchasing power. If I have convinced you of 01:48:31
nothing else. 01:48:36
Please understand that right the only viable alternative to increasing property taxes occasionally. 01:48:41
Is to reduce your level of services. 01:48:50
Several years ago I had a similar discussion with Orem City and their council, and their council was really convinced because. 01:48:52
Dare I say it, I think they hate raising property taxes more than anybody in the state. Terry Peterson can be that way. OK, so, 01:49:02
so, so it was, I mean, it was a process to get them educated, right? And they had, you know, come to the table with with ideas of 01:49:09
like, oh, well, here's what we can do. We can. 01:49:16
Lower the the hours at the library is open. They they operate their own library. 01:49:25
And their finance director, you know, had met with them in advance. I went, OK, what? What are your ideas, right? If you don't 01:49:31
want to raise taxes, what are your ideas? So he had time to put the math to. 01:49:36
What that would look like? 01:49:42
Less than the library hours close the senior citizens center, which there are people in the audience who were like, no, right, you 01:49:46
can't do that. close the rec center close all of the things that they came up with that they that they knew were hard political 01:49:53
asks weren't even much of A needle mover, quite frankly, right. Most cities we work with South Jordan years and years ago. I still 01:50:01
work with them today, but we work with them on a long range financial sustainability plan for their general fund and. 01:50:09
Learned that I give me a little bit of leeway, but approximately 72 to 75% of their total budget was on payroll. 01:50:18
They take into account what you actually pay and the benefits, right? And as a small business owner, guess what? My largest 01:50:30
expense is payroll #2 my rent. 01:50:35
Right. So if you apply that business sense to a city, your largest is probably payroll, your second is, you know, I think of rent, 01:50:40
I think of your cost to operate City Hall, right. So those are the big needle movers. Anything else you know, so when you're 01:50:47
talking about reducing level of services as your alternative, who you going to fire? 01:50:54
Who and how many? 01:51:03
Because that's going to be the fastest way to reduce your level of services. And it's not fun. Citizens do not like their taxes 01:51:04
raised, but they do not want their services hit. So it puts you in a conundrum. 01:51:10
But those are your two levers that you can move. They'll think of your teeter totter, right? I can either raise taxes, I can lower 01:51:17
services. That's it all you can move. Now I think it's time for questions. I'm so psychic. 01:51:24
OK. Are there any questions for Laura? 01:51:31
I just think it was awesome. Can we get? 01:51:38
Spreadsheets. Oh, absolutely. That was. It was really helpful information, honestly. 01:51:40
Laura, the only question I have is when you use red color. 01:51:48
I should have used purple. 01:51:56
So here, here, I didn't know when I was going to school, but I went to so many universities in the state that I can cheer for 01:52:02
anybody. 01:52:06
What to BYU the you Utah State and graduated from Westminster so I bleed purple. 01:52:11
That was really helpful. I learned a lot that I didn't even know I didn't know. So thank you so much. Welcome. 01:52:20
Well, if you think of anything afterward, no, please feel free to shoot that to me. 01:52:25
It was. 01:52:32
Early on, I mean, I bet it's been 20 years when I was working for Clearfield and they hold their tax rate. I don't know if they 01:52:33
still do, but they held their tax rate similar to what central Utah does and people just came to expect it. And instead of people 01:52:41
coming out with pitchforks like what the blah, blah, blah, blah are you doing, it was they educated them, they saw it. It wasn't a 01:52:48
huge increase as opposed to, I mean, I got war stories coming out my ears as opposed to West Valley City before they built. 01:52:56
Their rec center, they hadn't raised property taxes for a long time. They needed to raise property taxes so that they could pay 01:53:04
for that building. And it was. 01:53:08
I don't think all the people could fit in this entire building and they were pitchfork mad and but the kind of comments that they 01:53:14
made was we'd rather have a little increase every year than a big whopping one, right. So my question is, if you if you strive to 01:53:20
do that consistency, are there years that it could possibly go down? Absolutely always goes because if you educated the people to 01:53:26
to understand. 01:53:31
That we want that tax. 01:53:38
Neutrality, right? Is that what you called it? 01:53:41
Right. And then you help them understand that there there are going to be years that it goes up a little and there are also going 01:53:43
to be years that it could go down a little, but we want to maintain. 01:53:48
That consistency, yes, so. 01:53:53
Ogden's in my head because we're working a big water deal right now, but I know specifically with their water rate, so I don't 01:53:57
know that they apply the exact same thing to property tax rates. I do know they look at adjusting them every year, but 01:54:04
specifically with their water rates, they actually have a stated thing in their ordinance that they adjust their water rates every 01:54:10
year based on the inflationary costs. 01:54:16
Or a portion, I mean, so they, they break their like into fixed costs and variable costs, right? And the variable cost element of 01:54:23
their water system, they adjust according to inflation every year. So some years inflation goes down, right? Some year like 2008, 01:54:29
2009, it went down. 01:54:35
Every other year almost it goes up. Some years it goes up a lot. So inflation went up 8% a couple years ago. They didn't they, 01:54:42
they went, oh, that's a little much, right. But but you could apply the same philosophy if you wanted to, to your tax rate. And 01:54:47
it, it might, you know, you might not need to hold it constant like central Utah does. It might still fall a little, but it's, 01:54:53
it's a good thing to think of. 01:54:59
Thank you. May I add a short? 01:55:05
Addition to Laura's presentation and I should say I have sat through a lot of these presentations and nobody does it better than 01:55:08
Laura. 01:55:12
It's, it's a, it's a great explanation of how the process works. When you make a decision on your tax rate, there is a truth and 01:55:18
taxation process that you have to follow. It's outlined in state law. They are set processes. You can't deviate much. 01:55:26
From what it is but. 01:55:36
The way the truth and taxation process is set up, it can be difficult to explain to your neighbors and constituents what it all 01:55:38
means. 01:55:42
And it's it stems from the portion of Laura's presentation where it talks about revenue neutrality. 01:55:47
And the tax rate? 01:55:53
When we hear rate in common language, what we usually think of is what's our percentage, right. You have a rate on your home and 01:55:56
it's what percentage you pay interest. 01:56:01
Everywhere you hear rate, it's that kind of a thing. When the truth and taxation notices go out if the dollar, if the baseline 01:56:07
dollar amount goes up a dollar. 01:56:13
Folks will get a notice that says their tax rate is going up. 01:56:19
And they think it means percentage, like at that very first Montana example. And what it really means is dollar amount, not 01:56:23
percentage. 01:56:27
And so there is always an educational hurdle to explain that. 01:56:32
If you're making a tax rate increase. 01:56:38
That as a percentage increase. 01:56:42
That holds your rate at that percentage. It will be communicated to residents as a larger it will be communicated as a percentage 01:56:45
increase over the dollar amount they've been paying, not a rate increase in the way we would traditionally think of that. 01:56:54
So relative to that, I'm glad you. 01:57:04
Trigger something in my head. So we talked about that certified you do nothing on the certified tax rate just falls right. So for 01:57:07
you to bring it back up. 01:57:11
To what Even what it was, even if you bring it up to half of what it was right, you are still going to have to notify that we're 01:57:16
raising our rates because it automatically has fallen. 01:57:22
They wouldn't, I mean, your, your constituents won't have seen that yet. They don't, they don't see, oh, my tax rate was this and 01:57:29
the certified tax rate is now saying it's this and you're seeking to just put it back up to where it was. So education is really, 01:57:34
really important. 01:57:39
Because we are raising or projected to raise a tax rate. When did our truth and taxation notice go out for the first time? 01:57:46
To our citizens. 01:57:53
There will be so in the resolution that will that you'll consider today it lays that out. So the IT it I have added a section to 01:57:55
it that I'll put on the screen when you get to that point, but it says the property tax rate of and then you have a blank spot 01:58:00
where you can fill that in. 01:58:06
For the tax year 2024 is hereby proposed, a truth and taxation hearing will be held and then the date is August 14th, 2024 at 6:00 01:58:13
PM. 01:58:17
And then after that, the Council will deliberate and adopt the final property tax rate. 01:58:23
On August 28, 2024. But if we're approving the budget, aren't we locking that in now already? You are making your budget based on 01:58:28
assumptions and one of the assumptions is the tax rate you're proposing. 01:58:34
We'll go on. 01:58:41
Not to not to adopt that tax rate, then you would have to make a budget amendment right to to match whatever that is because your 01:58:43
projected revenues would change. Is it normal for a city to do that reverse? Why wouldn't we do that in May and March? I don't 01:58:50
know why state law doesn't have all the timing aligned. 01:58:56
It's a difficult thing for every city. I was in a meeting last night where the they were having the same conversation because. 01:59:03
They hadn't made an increase since 2019, and so their buying power had declined in exactly the way that Laura talked about it. And 01:59:12
what? 01:59:17
That city did was ironically looked to Clearfield. It was a Davis County city. 01:59:22
And they said we want to have an informal policy as a city that we. 01:59:28
Make a property tax adjustment at least every two years. They want it Their goal with that is to keep that line flat so that you 01:59:34
don't have those alligator jaws between what your inflationary costs are and what you can do in terms of service and then what 01:59:39
your. 01:59:44
Revenue costs are they wanted to try to keep both of them. 01:59:50
It it might be, and Christy may know even better than me, the state has a certain process with when when you're notified of your 01:59:54
certified tax rate. 01:59:59
And I again, it might be that because of that timing, you don't there's like time that you have to set your budget. If you're not 02:00:04
going to raise your certified tax rate, then there's an extra time that you can set your budget if you are considering and raising 02:00:11
it. And so I know that most of my clients are considering this kind of thing right now. 02:00:18
Yeah, they don't align with when you get the numbers back from the county. 02:00:26
And the county numbers even can change a little bit down the road, as as Laura mentioned, the county is making its estimate based 02:00:29
on. 02:00:33
The total revenue amount that the city would receive and if that and so to hold the certified tax rate means that your revenue 02:00:37
would be dollar value equal as to what you collected in the last year. 02:00:44
When they make that, when they then take that dollar value and allocate it among the different property owners within the city, 02:00:52
they're doing that based on their estimates of the assessed value of the property. 02:00:57
Those estimates don't always stay the same. You get people that can test that valuation and so it changes and. 02:01:04
There's some adjustment even there. And so it's not uncommon for City Council members to get calls from people saying, hey, my. 02:01:10
What I thought my rate was going to be is not exactly what it ended up being, and part of that is that reconciliation process with 02:01:18
the county and how that all plays out. 02:01:22
My my two comments are. 02:01:29
They don't. That's not unique to Vineyard. 02:02:04
That's the same everywhere, but notices will go out. A hearing will have to occur. 02:02:07
Before you can make any adjustments, the only. 02:02:12
The only scenario where you wouldn't have a hearing and wouldn't have to. 02:02:15
Do notices at a later time as if you accept the certified tax rate as it's put to you by the county. 02:02:19
The county sends out the tax notices in July and that is when the citizens will be notified. So they will have a good 5-6 weeks 02:02:25
before their before we have our hearing to discuss it. Yeah, but we're setting the budget today though. 02:02:31
Right. But today, typically we do an absolute final fiscal year 25 budget. I mean, we can amend it throughout the year, but what 02:02:39
we have to do tonight is we do what's called a working budget so that we can so that we can start paying things at the beginning 02:02:45
of July through September. We would then approve an actual final after the taxation hearing in August. It has to be submitted to 02:02:52
the state by the end of August. So that's when we would do our final budget and that's not considered a budget amendment. That 02:02:59
would be our final budget. 02:03:05
That we would then go forward with. 02:03:12
And that answer your question. With that, we are getting to the close of the evening, so I want to run through the budget and see 02:03:15
if the Council has anything before we because we will have to adopt the budget and the certified tax. 02:03:23
Opportunity. 02:03:32
At the same time, so we need to talk about anything we are keeping or getting rid of out of the budget. 02:03:34
Right now, and I appreciate Laura coming to present, but I had asked Chief Sanderson if he would take a minute just briefly to 02:03:39
again educate on what it is that we're doing here tonight. So I'll turn the time over to Chief Sanderson from Orem Fire. 02:03:46
Mayor Council, thank you. Thank you for this opportunity. As you guys know, you're really ramping up the services with Vineyard, 02:03:57
with fire from Orem servicing you guys. It's a huge expense and we're within this budget. If I'm not mistaken. We're just looking 02:04:05
at phase one, hiring 6 full time employees that will then be housed out here as soon as. 02:04:12
Houses completed, they're still going to be phase two. Phase three, we're starting with six employees and we're going to end up 02:04:20
with 18. 02:04:24
And so I think that supporting a tax increase. 02:04:27
Specific to public safety is very prudent and very responsible. 02:04:32
From a property tax perspective in being able to accomplish what you've asked of us from service level. 02:04:39
And like Laura mentioned, your only options if you can't afford that is to reduce the level of service. And I think fire police is 02:04:46
something that's very specifically from your community been asked for. And so I'm hoping that you can leverage the fire and police 02:04:53
in support from the community with the tax increase. 02:05:00
At least with the other two cities I've worked, that seems to be very favorable because of the. 02:05:08
The services we provide. 02:05:15
Thank you. Any questions for Chief Sanderson? 02:05:17
No, OK. 02:05:20
Thank you so much for being here. So we will jump right into the fiscal year 25 or do we need to? 02:05:24
Should we have Holden say anything about our police? 02:05:30
I asked him if he wanted to so. 02:05:33
Our Lieutenant. 02:05:37
And provide a high level of service. And in order to do so pretty much every year I have to add new deputies because we grow in 02:06:12
our demographics change, we get more businesses, we get different things like that that create more calls for us. So in this 02:06:17
budget that you're going to receive today, we're looking at adding a full time deputy in July and then another one in January, 02:06:22
which would give us. 02:06:28
Two teams of five deputies and a Sergeant. There's some logistics there that help us out to be more safe as deputies, help us be 02:06:34
more proactive, make sure that we have two people on at the same time 24/7 to keep our deputies safe and, and provide a better 02:06:40
service to the public. When I look at that, I mean, and I try to look to the future, There's other asks and I get pressures from 02:06:46
some of the, the resources that we use at the county. You know, one of those that I've been that have come up lately as a special 02:06:51
victims unit detective. 02:06:57
We don't currently pay for one of those. I've pushed that off to next year, hopefully because I understand the budget constraints. 02:07:03
But I would just echo the same thing as we grow and we try to provide that same level of service, we we have to be able to fund 02:07:10
that. And I'm happy I haven't answered your questions. So I just wanted you to mention on record when, when I came to meet with 02:07:16
you, you said the national average per. 02:07:22
Per citizen for deputy, can you just state that so people have it? I understand that you are being very careful with the money. 02:07:29
One of the metrics that the fire department uses and Chief Sanderson, correct, correct me if I'm wrong, but there's kind of 02:07:35
standard level of services response times, you know, they need to be able to get to somewhere in 5 minutes. 02:07:41
Currently in Vineyard we fall below that standard. We're at like a 7 minute time frame. The national standard for police services 02:07:48
is how many police officers do you have per thousand residents. The national standard generally is one per thousand. 02:07:55
And we came up with a number. If we have one deputy per 2000 residents, we can provide A level of service that's acceptable at the 02:08:37
time. 02:08:40
As we've continued to grow, as we've got more businesses, we get more influx of people into the city, we add different things and 02:08:44
I look at the whole thing, not just residents, right, call volume, response times, type of calls. We've had to lower that number 02:08:52
and we we lowered it in our budget goals to one per 1750. We currently have, I feel like should be at one per 1500 to maintain the 02:09:00
level of service that you have asked and I feel the citizens have asked as well and have come to expect from us. 02:09:08
I perceive down the road as thing as we get more commercial, more business, more people, different types of calls that that number 02:09:16
will have to come down possibly to that one for 12:50 or one per thousand depending on how the city grows and what what we see in 02:09:24
the future. But right now kind of my goal if we're just going off of that, that number alone is one per 1500, so. 02:09:32
Thank you. That answers the question. Any other questions for Lieutenant Rockwell? 02:09:41
Thank you. 02:09:47
All right, Christy. 02:09:50
OK, so now that I've got it turned on. 02:09:58
We did add a second meeting with the council where they went over their goals session as requested. And so that is the only thing 02:10:33
that was changed. As far as the budget process. I have met with all of the departments over the last couple months. We've seen 02:10:39
what their asks are. I've met with the council members and they've been able to ask questions about what's in the line items and 02:10:45
what what they would like to see happen with the budget. And we had our public hearing and now tonight we are to the point that by 02:10:50
law we are required. 02:10:56
To adopt A final budget now again, if we do the truth in taxation in August, then we would again we would have a more final 02:11:02
budget. I should call, I should call it. 02:11:07
So that's where we are. The budget that I've put together has very many assumptions. 02:11:13
I have just put the I just put a few basic ones on here. The number one that everyone is talking about is the increase in the 02:11:19
property tax rate. 02:11:24
If you it is only going to be increased .000534. 02:11:29
So the certified tax rate that was brought out by Utah County, the auditor's office was .002835. 02:11:34
We are recommending that it go to .003369. This is the same rate that we had in 2019 and it is not our highest rate over the last 02:11:42
five to 10 years. 02:11:48
Umm, we are assuming that there will be a sales tax revenue. We projected that there will be a 5% increase in sales tax revenue. 02:11:56
Building permit, there's a lot happening in the city right now and we project that the revenue for the building permits will go up 02:12:04
by 26%. 02:12:07
Then if you look at the expenditures, the biggest assumptions that were made. 02:12:12
We have a $740,000 increase for our fire, as was explained, and a 434,000 increase for our police force. I also wanted to mention, 02:12:16
I don't believe it's been mentioned yet, but Lieutenant Rockwell asked for two individuals and our our. 02:12:25
Compromise was we said we will give you one in July and the other one in January. So we are trying to be fiscally conservative as 02:12:35
much as we can. Just wanted to make sure you're aware of that. Employee health insurance has gone up by 6.2% and then as we were 02:12:41
talking earlier about the cost of living adjustment and the merit increase, that is also an assumption that was put into this 02:12:47
budget. 02:12:53
This slide. 02:13:02
Is relative to what Laura was talking about, but it's looking at it a little bit differently. This pie represents our total public 02:13:05
safety costs for the fiscal year 25. 02:13:09
The yellow portion that you can see is the amount that is covered by the property tax revenue with the rate increase that I've 02:13:15
proposed. So you can see that even with the rate increase that's proposed, we have 29.38% of our public safety that is not 02:13:21
covered. 02:13:26
By our property tax, so that would have to be supplemented with sales tax and other revenues. 02:13:32
This again, we had some concerns raised about fund balance and of course that is an issue everywhere you go. It's ideal to keep it 02:13:42
at least 17%. 02:13:46
Just for the record, if we do not do a tax increase and we use the general fund to fund the difference that's needed for public 02:13:52
safety, it will take our general fund balance down to 11%. And that is not an acceptable level, especially when you have bonds 02:14:00
outstanding. So we need to be cognizant of that. So the certified tax rate that I am recommending is the .003369 that will bring 02:14:08
in 626,000 of the 1.1 to $1.2 million that we need. 02:14:15
Just as a final note, my final bullet there is if we were to go in and. 02:14:25
To fund public the public safety increase and no need to use the general fund, we would actually have to put the certified tax 02:14:32
rate. 02:14:35
To be 44168 instead of the 3369. 02:14:39
So we are aware that this is a tax increase and just for the record, the the state sets a ceiling at which you can go and we are 02:14:44
not even close to that ceiling. The amount that we can put on a certified tax rate is .007. 02:14:53
And so like I said, we are not anywhere maxing out our capacity to tax. We are trying to be fiscally conservative. 02:15:03
And are aware that prices are going up for everyone, everywhere. 02:15:10
And with that, I'm just going to go into. 02:15:17
The. 02:15:21
The slides that I have, council members should have received the updated 20 fiscal. 02:15:23
Your 25 budget and so if you have any questions as we're going through this, please feel free to interrupt. 02:15:29
This pie chart shows our total general fund expenditures. Just a reminder, our general fund is different from an enterprise fund 02:15:38
like our water, our storm water, our wastewater, our transportation, those are all their own enterprise funds. The general fund is 02:15:45
police, fire finance, the recorder, parks and rec and those kind of funds. And you can see all of that listed there on the left. 02:15:53
So this pie chart shows of our total expenditures, which department and how those have those funds are allocated. 02:16:01
Excuse me going into the water fund. 02:16:12
This just shows you can see that we in fiscal year 24, it shows that our revenues are higher than expenses. 02:16:16
That's related to bond proceeds that came in, but then you can see that reverses in fiscal year 25 when we actually have the 02:16:22
projects that have carried over. 02:16:26
The same thing with the wastewater fund, again, we had bond proceeds come in and fiscal year 24, those are going to be spent in 02:16:33
fiscal year 25. 02:16:37
I think this one is a very telling slide. We're in the process of doing a storm water master plan and you can see that it's much 02:16:47
needed. The general fund is currently supplementing the Storm Water Fund I. 02:16:52
And that is an enterprise fund is meant to be self supporting, self-sustaining. And so there are some adjustments that need to be 02:17:00
made there as well as in the transportation department, the same situation is there and we are working on master plans that will 02:17:05
help us assess that and correct that problem. 02:17:10
Internal service fund, I know we've had a lot of questions about that. The internal service fund is fleet facilities, HR and IT. 02:17:18
And so obviously all of the city funds and departments use those those services and so each of them pays a part of it into the 02:17:28
internal service fund. You can see that our costs have gone down our total budget from fiscal year 24 to 25. And a big reason for 02:17:34
that is that we are leasing vehicles instead of outright buying them. 02:17:41
Here are the capital projects that we currently have listed. 02:17:50
We already went over this last time so if anyone has questions please speak up, but this is just. 02:18:00
The slides from the last time that we were here, as we're going through this council, do you want to look through these really 02:18:06
quick and decide if that's an up or down, if there's something that somebody wanted to discuss or try to convince somebody to take 02:18:10
off or add to, now is the time to do that. 02:18:15
I'd like to run through this as fast as you can so we can get out of here. So if you see something, just be like, don't want the 02:18:22
75. Do you want the whatever you know? And we can say whether or not we're obligated or that it's already. 02:18:28
So, OK, we'll just start at the top. 02:18:40
Looks like nobody has any questions from the council so far, so let's go to the next page, OK? 02:18:42
Again, these all were listed in the packet that you received as well. 02:18:58
Very few changes. 02:19:01
From the last budget that we had, I'd actually I'd like, I'd like it if we could arrange a town hall where the citizens are 02:19:03
allowed to come in and see the capital projects and see. 02:19:09
What's being spent? I mean, education goes a long way to help people understand and if they feel like they have an option. 02:19:15
Right knowing knowing what we have a fire station coming for a fire Firehouse coming right and that's going to add. 02:19:23
A significant amount to the budget. 02:19:32
Right, if they'd be willing. You know, it's, it really is like helping people understand that they need to pick and choose, right? 02:19:35
If they want more services more than capital projects, or if they they want to keep the tax rate the same and not have all the 02:19:42
services. It really is a matter of education. So people understand because the problem. 02:19:50
I mean, I, yeah. 02:19:58
I don't know. 02:20:30
Just helping them understand, right, that there's, there's a give and take. And, and when, when the community understands that 02:20:31
there's a give and take and we haven't, I mean, our tax rate will match what it was at 2019, that that's a whole different 02:20:37
conversation. Then we're raising taxes on you, you know what I'm saying? So I, it really is about helping the community understand 02:20:43
and like you said. 02:20:49
Always bringing transparency out as much as we can to the community, right? I think that's so important, so thank you. I think we 02:20:55
should do that at the next town hall before. 02:21:01
Before you know the tax rate. 02:21:06
OK. 02:21:09
Eric, you probably want to make note of that. The next town hall is in September, so she's talking about putting. 02:21:11
Yeah. Didn't we move it to September? 02:21:16
Oh, perfect. 02:21:20
Perfect. Let's let's put it there. OK. Marty, did you have anything, Jake, Amber? Well, the format of those are very important 02:21:22
that we're all there as a council kind of like this with an open mic, right? That's what we've been demanding or kind of asking 02:21:28
for. Well, I was at the last one and it was more open house style. I don't know for sure if I'll be at this next one that we have 02:21:34
some family things happening. 02:21:40
It just depends on what timing is. What are you? What are you? I mean, did you go to any of the first two that we've had? I didn't 02:21:47
get to go to the first. Yeah, I went to the first one. 02:21:51
That's the real question right now. Otherwise there's a motion. So basically we're 1,000,001. 02:22:29
So if we were to just put the modular roundabout, we're over halfway there just off a year, right? 02:22:36
I'm not sure I understand When you say basically we're 1,000,001 like we're a million one over like we're we're gonna go into debt 02:22:42
or not doing debt. We're short. Short what? 02:22:47
What it what number? It's 937 now. 02:22:54
$937,000. 02:22:58
Is this what we're? 02:23:01
Yes, that's what we would be using from the fund balance, from the fund balance if we if we don't or we already are. 02:23:03
Projector No. If we increase the taxes we still have to use 937,000 in. 02:23:11
Yes, my slide, I don't know if you remember my slide that was showing that what it would have to be if we wanted to cover the 02:23:19
whole amount, we would be more like a 4168 so that we didn't have to draw from the general fund to help. 02:23:25
Fund public safety. So the 1.1 is just the increase in public safety alone for fiscal year 25. But I see a lot of these projects 02:23:32
up here if you go back there that are just like not time sensitive like. 02:23:39
The garbage or. 02:23:46
Just different things. Benches on a trail, I mean, those are nice. 02:23:49
Cemetery, same thing. 02:23:53
I mean, nice, but it's like in a down year and hitting it, it's like, why couldn't we just push a lot of these off and not do a 02:23:56
rate increase? But I feel like that's something we should let the community decide, right? That's what I'm saying. We should have 02:24:01
that discussion. But yeah, just bring it out and let them discuss. 02:24:06
Correct. And that's why I think having a quorum and having an open mic of like, hey, what are things that you think how would you 02:24:13
like us to make up to this would be great. 02:24:18
And what we've been doing, and I think we could talk to a few of them. I mean, people have petitioned for these things like the 02:24:25
cemetery and the benches. I'm happy to discuss back and forth with you on what you want to get rid of. If you want to get rid of 02:24:31
some of those things inside of here, we can go ahead. But I feel like. 02:24:38
I think there's, I mean, I kind of went through a list, Christine, I don't know, I asked you and Eric to kind of bring them up. I. 02:24:47
You know. 02:24:54
The 14,000 on employee appreciation, having an employee appreciation week or whatever of something that I would like cut, is that 02:24:58
employee appreciation or is that motivacity? It's the program point of clarity on that one. The the cost of motivosity is a 02:25:07
separate budget item. It's $22150 or something around that ballpark, all 15,000 that is requested. 02:25:16
Goes directly to staff through a variety of programs that that enhance Wellness and and provide. 02:25:25
OK. 02:25:36
I'm against that one. 02:25:38
What about no, no, I'm not going to cut it. I want it. So anybody else agree with Jake to cut it? You just need a quorum. 02:25:39
What about World Trade Center Utah? World Trade Center Utah is not on here. I know it's not on here, but it's from previous years 02:25:48
and it's something that could close the gap. 02:25:53
I think if you're gonna ask me about the idea that we're having to increase taxes right now and that is an economic thing that can 02:25:58
diversify our tax base and lower property taxes, it's not something that I would be willing to do on a clawback for a contract 02:26:05
with the return of investment that it brings to communities. But again, not on this agenda. So we need to move it because we're 02:26:11
coming to the close of the evening. We have that scheduled to be on an agenda where we can reevaluate it and then look at if we do 02:26:18
want to somehow pull out of that. 02:26:24
Well, it started in April and now we're into June. Yeah, we have full agendas every time. We're not. 02:26:31
Like doing short meeting. All right, point of order, though, let's get back to this agenda. Yeah, X Factor 40,000. OK, So my 02:26:36
thought on X Factor is we already paid up until next October. So I say we reevaluate it and see if we like the services we've 02:26:44
received. And if we don't feel that it's useful, then let's not renew. Yeah, and I say it's a 30,000 decrease from the PIO budget 02:26:51
that was put in last year, and they were able to figure out how to decrease by 30,000. So I think it's been going well. 02:26:59
Want to point out I'm open to reevaluation, but I just want it's a frivolous thing that most cities aren't doing right. It's not 02:27:07
something above and beyond doing studies like that. I disagree, but anybody else have any comments for him? So I don't have three 02:27:13
there. I want to reevaluate that one later. I don't see Harmon keeping it in the budget and then deciding if we want to renew come 02:27:19
September. I'm cool with that. 02:27:25
All right, next Qualtrics 74,000. 02:27:31
Three-year contract for that we we can't get out of a contract. 02:27:35
Have you evaluated that contract, Jamie? 02:27:41
I did add it onto the agenda for you to reevaluate. 02:27:44
Having worked there, I know they're easy to get out of. 02:27:48
Jake, that's what I want to make sure. If you remember from our meeting the other day, we have to have baseline assumptions in 02:27:52
order to get a budget to go correct. But you're talking about $130,000 on a 900 that gets us what? Okay. But we're talking World 02:27:59
Trade and Qualtrics. We would be backing out of a contract, which is not a good idea for City. It's not a good reputation, it's a 02:28:07
not, it's not a good practice. And right now, tonight we can't do that. So tonight we go on the assumption. 02:28:15
That it's not going to happen. And then if it does, we do a budget amendment and say, hey, we were able to claw back this money. 02:28:23
But for tonight and and this budget that we're talking about, I don't feel like that's relevant. OK. And Jake, I did put it on a 02:28:28
future agenda so we can address it at the time. So let's go to the next one. 02:28:33
I work for the public group. We do electronic contract management. 02:28:39
About 4% of all contracts nationwide are pulled back. That's OK. We can do that on another agenda. I'm just making clear that you 02:28:44
say, hey, it's not done or people don't do it. It's actually quite regular in government when cutting things. And I think what 02:28:50
Christy is suggesting is just that. 02:28:55
Getting us on the record as if to say we're just disagreeing with you when we think it's the right, wrong time to reevaluate it is 02:29:38
miss. Miss the meeting. What? We're stating no. Should this be in the budget or not? Yeah. And we're saying we have to reevaluate. 02:29:43
But if it's a contract, I'm not gonna say yes or no. 02:29:49
Like evaluating those scheduled, I thought. I'm not sure what you're asking. I know that the mayor, as chair of the council, 02:30:26
keeps. 02:30:30
Running list of things that are agenda for future meetings, right? I know an evaluation of the Qualtrics agreement is slated for a 02:30:35
future meeting. It's not slated for today. And I can't speak for the rest of staff, but I can't speak for myself that I structure 02:30:43
my work to lead up to the meeting. And so it's not work I've done yet. But when that meeting occurs, I'll look at the contract and 02:30:51
if there are options for modifying or changing it, we can talk through whether those are prudent or wanted by the council. 02:30:58
It's just time is of the essence with a, with 100 with a like a Qualtrics contract $74,000 that's $1000 a week. So every week we 02:31:06
wait, it's just another $1000, right? It's actually a $1500 a week just waiting and waiting and waiting $3000 every between every 02:31:15
other meeting, right. And so are we getting $3000 between every meeting on Qualtrics? You know, it's just, it delays it out. What 02:31:23
about I think you have to prioritize your work and the mayor leads those discussions and it's it's on your slate. 02:31:31
All right. What about Sage Solutions 42,000? That's a two year contract that if we pull out, we still have to pay for it? 02:31:40
You know that we did, Jamie, did you review the contract on that? And I am familiar with that contract and that you pay the bottom 02:31:48
line amount whether you use the service or not. 02:31:53
You and I have discussed that in a meeting before, and you acknowledged it. 02:31:59
I we tried to do it and he didn't. I don't remember that part. It was, we'll talk about it. 02:32:03
And I disagree with that one. If you get $10 million and you paid 42 in, how much did you pay? You know what I mean? And we got 10 02:32:09
million. I don't recall the details of the earlier conversation, but I do. I am familiar with that agreement and I know that power 02:32:15
line transmission line study 50,000. There's no way I will back out of that one. Nope. 02:32:22
That one is so important to our city. The idea of taking those huge power lines down and burying them underground would be such a 02:32:28
value to the city. If it's the only legacy I leave, I'll take it. I'm not kidding. I agree as well. I hate them. I just studying 02:32:35
it out. Have you ever seen those transmission lines ever moved? 02:32:41
With the easement, I have another client city that is in the process of burying above ground lines similar to Vineyards. It's not 02:32:51
the same length, it's a different length. It's the former Cottonwood Mall site and it has transmission lines. And as they're 02:32:59
redeveloping it into denser mixed-use, so why would we, why would we bury the lines on like one? 02:33:06
If you don't want to spend the 50,000 this year and you wanted to do it a different time, that's really fine. I'm hitting hitting 02:33:48
like we're in a downtime. It's like, why now? We we haven't done it for any other property looking at doing it now. So we need to 02:33:54
do it at the same time as them to save money and to get them. So why wouldn't we have them pay for it? They are paying for their 02:34:00
portion, yes. So why are we paying any of it? Why wouldn't they pay the 50? 02:34:05
So they're paying. They're paying, but we're paying for the study. I think maybe what you're getting at with the council is that 02:34:11
you think that Utah City petitioned the city to do it. But I think what this council is saying is that. 02:34:18
We have been evaluating it and found somebody to take some of the cost. 02:34:26
And so it's a different discussion. And so they're saying, hey, look, we can cut costs down if we also get some more people on 02:34:30
board and potentially we could get more costs down if we kept going along the line and it was meaningful to other people. But like 02:34:37
I said, the right of way is turned over to the city. So it's going to be who's looking at the the views that really dips into 02:34:43
that. But we recognize it looks like you don't have three votes, so go to the next one. 02:34:50
I guess I would just close, which is saying I have zero issues with the extra public safety and services being provided by fire 02:34:58
and by police, But I I expected this to be offsetting and finding reductions. You know, we increase our city manager's pay this 02:35:06
year off a new one to another. We're not that big of a city to do that. 02:35:13
From the previous city manager to this. 02:35:23
My, my pay is, is contingent upon the passing of a COLA and the no, no, no, I know, but you're, you're paid more than what Ezra 02:35:26
was. 02:35:30
I didn't see what Ezra was paid, right. I know. But I'm saying that for the budget, it's 30,000 more. And so there's an extra 02:35:35
quarter employee that's added to the city manager that we discussed this at our meeting. It's the deputy recorder that does 1/4 of 02:35:43
his time in my budget, right. But again, with downtime, we're just increasing it, right? We're we're just splitting. 02:35:51
We had a deputy recorder before, we have a deputy recorder now. 02:35:59
Pam was kind enough to allow 1/4 of his time to be spent helping me, and so it's. 02:36:04
It's not extra dollars, it's just extra dollars showing up on my account and and a quarter less showing up on her. Are you asking 02:36:11
for that to be removed from the council? No, I'm just saying that like it just balloons and and I think that I. 02:36:18
There simply needs to be some sort of accountability of past actions in all of this spend to then and what I feel obviously is my 02:36:26
opinion of being irresponsible and we just need to be more accountable of. 02:36:32
You know, obviously I don't agree that we should be raising by $1,000,000, so we're 900,000. So that's my comments. Thank you. 02:36:39
Any other comments? Sure, go ahead, Marty. I see the concern. It's not, it's not like it's not a noble cause trying to save the 02:36:51
residents money. I understand that. I look at the budget. I feel like we have made content contingent, contingent. 02:36:58
We've made adjustments. 02:37:07
Concessions. Thank you. It's getting late. It is 10:00 for me. 02:37:09
We have made concessions over the past three months as we've been working on it. I've actually looked at a lot of things and made 02:37:15
adjustments just on my end and and discussing with staff. I know that we had several staff or department heads asking for a 02:37:21
certain amount of employees and we said no, we were looking at different park spaces. We said no. There's a lot of things that had 02:37:27
to be cut from this budget already. And sure. Are there a few things that I would like to reevaluate? Yes, But most of those 02:37:33
things are contracted out. 02:37:39
And so it would be something later that we'd have to reevaluate and we can make amendments in the budget like we do throughout the 02:37:45
year. 02:37:48
The other aspect of it, I do not find it prudent to go through and cut, take capital budgets to pay for our day-to-day. I think 02:37:52
that if you need, if you're not making the cut, you don't cut out, you don't take from your savings. 02:38:01
The one thing that keeps modeling outright is economic development. And what these people need are corporate recruitment and 02:38:44
businesses coming in so that their property taxes can stay down so that we can diversify the tax base. And I completely say it. 02:38:49
And then we're all silent and we just sit here. It's so frustrating to me because no, it's not honesty. That's that's the 02:38:55
detracting part is that you've heard the facts, you know, you've seen the data, and you keep repeating things that are alluding to 02:39:01
a, a falsehood. 02:39:07
Mayor, I won't keep going back and forth with you. I'm I'll, I'll let it go. We'll just, we'll just say this. 02:39:13
The founders of our city all have really small homes and one bedroom and one bedroom garage or one car garages and they learn to 02:39:22
live under their means. I understand that there are so many times when a family wants to go to Disneyland and wants the nice 02:39:29
things and wants to go through and do things and, and, and I understand that there are needs and times to do a tax rate increase 02:39:36
when we are prudent in everything that we're doing. 02:39:43
The facts actually lie in the minutes they are on record, and what you're saying is not accurate. 02:40:23
To end this agenda item. 02:41:36
I move to adopt resolution 20/24/19, the final fiscal year 2024-2025 budget as presented. OK, may I read the adjustments to the 02:41:38
resolution from what was in the packet? So I've changed the title, it now reads. 02:41:46
A resolution of the City Council of Vineyard, Utah approving and adopting a budget for the fiscal year 2024-2025 and proposing a 02:41:54
property tax rate. And then there is inserted a new Section 3 that says the property tax rate of 0.003369 for tax year 2000. 02:42:05
24 is hereby proposed. A Truth and Taxation hearing will be held August 14th, 2024 at 6:00 PM. 02:42:17
After which the Council will deliberate and adopt the final property tax rate on August 28th, 2024. Excellent. So to clarify, this 02:42:26
is a working budget so that we can function and we don't have a government shutdown on July 1st, correct? Okay, we have a first by 02:42:32
Amber, that was clarified by Jamie. May I have a second? I'll second it. All right, first by Amber, second by Marty. Any 02:42:38
discussion? 02:42:45
OK, We're going to go by name and roll call. Sarah, Marty, I, Amber, I, Jake. All right, this moves us on to the discussion and 02:42:52
action. Adopt adoption of an ordinance, ordinance for salary increases. This is the discussion that we had. 02:43:01
Partially talked about before. Cory, do you have anything to add to this particular item or just that we have to make an approval? 02:43:11
All right, As you discussed it before, you heard what Jake said, you guys had a little bit of deliberation. Now you need to make a 02:43:16
choice. So I need a motion. 02:43:21
I move to adopt the ordinance 202407 as presented. 02:43:31
I have her first, my Amber. Can I get a second? 02:43:37
I'll second it. All right. I have a second by Marty. I'm going to start with Sarah. Sarah. 02:43:42
Voting to raise my own salary. 02:43:55
So. 02:43:57
No. OK, Marty. 02:43:59
Yeah, Amber, I Jake, no, OK, we're going to 9.6 forms of government and. 02:44:03
And I don't know who is presenting this particular item. I think we can table it. I don't think we have the support. 02:44:09
Well, let's check really quick. Do we need to discuss this today? 02:44:16
I think we're due to meet timelines. We've discussed it, we've come to the public, we've had some work sessions at this point, 02:44:23
Jamie, maybe you could talk to us about process and the the forms that are before us. 02:44:29
A few slides, they're not lengthy, then I'll go through and. 02:44:38
Well, I was just saying that I've kind of removed my support for doing it. I don't think it's at the time that the right change of 02:44:43
government. And so if if there isn't support, I think we can just cancel it. OK, that's fine. If there are three votes, you'll 02:44:49
have a vote at the end. There's a resolution prepared and. 02:44:55
Just the same time. 02:45:02
Give me just a moment. 02:45:06
OK, my screen is up. 02:45:20
When we had this topic on the agenda last, I gave a lengthier presentation that went through historically, the background on the 02:45:22
different forms of government, how they came about, what they are. 02:45:27
A reminder that there's three core things the government does We provide services, we build communities, control land use and then 02:45:34
make laws that affect that. 02:45:39
You Currently the form of government in Vineyard is A5 member council form of government. Your mayor's elected directly chairs the 02:45:46
council votes on all matters. 02:45:51
Is the chief executive officer and makes the key appointments with the Council's ratification. 02:45:56
The council holds all the legislative functions within the city, the budgetary and appropriation functions and then it provides 02:46:03
the oversight for the performance of the executive and administrative duties within the city. 02:46:10
A5 and six member council are very similar in almost every respect. The one key difference is that the mayor in A6 member council 02:46:19
form of government. 02:46:25
Does it? The mayor chairs the council but does not vote on most issues they do vote on. 02:46:31
Any ordinance changes that affect the mayoral duties they vote on. 02:46:38
Tie to break tie votes and then they can vote on certain other matters, but on most matters on a day-to-day basis, the mayor does 02:46:45
not vote in that format. 02:46:50
In all other material respects, the five and six member Council are almost identical. 02:46:56
There are slight variations in the language used in the code, but the functions are essentially the same. 02:47:02
There are two slides in the packet, these you've seen before. I'm not going to go through them because the five and six member 02:47:08
council are so similar. It's just an overview of what they are. 02:47:13
How they came to be what what some of the key advantages or disadvantages are? 02:47:18
If you'd like to come back to these and talk through them, I'm happy to do it, but. 02:47:23
I think it's all information that you're familiar with. 02:47:27
The process for changing to another form of government is and we're up in the top left corner where it's. 02:47:31
Brown and shovel shape The City Council adopts a resolution or voters file a petition. 02:47:40
To change to another form of government. 02:47:46
You will have before you today a resolution that you can adopt if you wish to change. 02:47:49
To another form of government than within 45 days you have to hold at least two public hearings. 02:47:54
On the topic so you'll be able to. 02:48:00
Notice those and then hold those. 02:48:03
Those hearings have to occur. 02:48:05
Within that time frame, and then after those hearings are heard, you can rescind the resolution if you wish. 02:48:09
And then if you do not rescind it. 02:48:16
And have passed that resolution, then it would go in an election would be held. 02:48:19
Mayor Fulmer asked me to put together a slide that lists the fiscal impacts. There are one time costs and then there are ongoing 02:48:25
expenses that would be related to this. They're pretty simple to understand. 02:48:30
The one time cost relates to the election. 02:48:36
And the county charges a set rate for an election. It's between 15 and $20,000. 02:48:39
It depends on population number of registered voters, but it will be within that range. 02:48:47
And then? 02:48:52
The additional council member would be a salary of between 17 and $20,000. 02:48:54
Is what I estimate that out and that would be the ongoing cost annually? 02:49:00
If you. 02:49:06
Resolve to consider this. 02:49:09
And to put it on the ballot and it's voted in. 02:49:12
Here is essentially what happens The new form of government does not take effect immediately. 02:49:15
It would not affect any term of any sitting council member unless that Council member decided of their own will and volition to. 02:49:21
Have their turn be affected. 02:49:31
So everybody who's on the council now would continue on the council. 02:49:34
Through the end of their term. 02:49:39
The new mayor and the new council members will not be elected until the new municipal general election. That's fall of 2025. 02:49:41
And then the effect would take place January 1, 2026, after those elections. 02:49:49
There, the practical considerations we've talked about, there are many of the authorities and reasons for making a change in the 02:49:55
form of government that have been discussed publicly that I think. 02:50:02
Are available to you now, they're not dependent on a change to A6 member council form of government. 02:50:09
And then I'll just show you. 02:50:15
So you have the actual dates in front of you. 02:50:18
The current term of everybody on the Council right now is what you see on the screen there. This is taken from the resolution that 02:50:22
you'll consider today. 02:50:26
The mayor and then council member Rasmussen and council member Sue Fuentes. 02:50:32
Are serving terms that expire at the end of calendar year 2025. 02:50:37
Council Member Cameron and Council Member Holdaway are serving terms that expire at the end of calendar year 2027. 02:50:43
Those terms would not be affected by a change. 02:50:51
In the form of government. 02:50:54
If you propose a change and that change is voted on. 02:50:56
The terms would stack, as they show here on the screen, so council member Cameron Council member Holdaway would continue to see 02:51:02
out the end of their term. 02:51:06
The three additional council members would be elected with. 02:51:11
A term horizon of the end of calendar year 2029 and the mayor would be elected with that same horizon. 02:51:15
So it would be. 02:51:23
I know originally we talked about because it's kind of an imbalance, you'd have to up for election at once and then four up for 02:51:26
election another time. You can modify that. The statute, what the statute requires is that roughly half of your council members 02:51:31
are up. 02:51:35
Each year, clearly with. 02:51:40
5 voting members on the Council. 02:51:44
You can't get to an exact half, so it's three and two. If you wanted to have one of the council members be a shorter term to 2027, 02:51:46
you can modify that here. The way the statute provides that that's decided is by lot. And So what would happen is you'd have your 02:51:53
election for all the council seats and then after the election you would. 02:52:01
By some form of lot you could choose what that is. 02:52:08