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Give me just a second. | 00:00:01 | |
August 28, 2024, The time is 6:34 PM and we are going to get our Vineyard City Council meeting rolling. We'll start with our | 00:00:04 | |
proclamation. I'll go ahead and read this Proclamation 2024. Dash 06 is Constitution Proclamation, whereas September 17th two, | 00:00:14 | |
2024 marks the 237th. | 00:00:23 | |
Annual or anniversary of the drafting of the Constitution of the United States of America by the Constitutional Convention. And | 00:00:33 | |
WHEREAS every anniversary of the Constitution provides a historic opportunity for all Americans to learn about and to reflect upon | 00:00:40 | |
the rights and privileges of citizenship and its responsibilities. And WHEREAS, it is fitting and proper to accord official | 00:00:48 | |
recognition to this magnificent document and its memorable anniversary into the patriotic celebr. | 00:00:55 | |
Which will commemorate the occasion now. Therefore, I, Julie, former Mayor of the City of Vineyard, Utah, hereby proclaimed the | 00:01:03 | |
month of September, 2024 as Constitution Month and urge all citizens to study the Constitution and reflect on the privilege of | 00:01:11 | |
being an American with all the rights and responsibilities which that privilege involves. | 00:01:18 | |
Go ahead and sign this. | 00:01:26 | |
And then we're going to go ahead and move into our. | 00:01:35 | |
Staff report and today we have our government consultants here with us today and I just wanted to invite them up to give us a | 00:01:40 | |
report as we start to move into the legislative session. | 00:01:45 | |
Come on up. | 00:01:50 | |
Thank you, Mayor Council members. Jeff Hartley, happy to be with you today. | 00:01:57 | |
Give you an update on kind of where things are at the state level. There's a lot of activity. This is when the busy season begins | 00:02:02 | |
going into the fall. | 00:02:06 | |
The the Legislature met last week in its interim session. There was a flurry of activity around a ballot measure. You may have | 00:02:11 | |
heard about that. There's a there's a constitutional amendment that will on the ballot this fall that affects how ballot | 00:02:17 | |
initiatives will be structured in the state of Utah. It should have passed. | 00:02:23 | |
That was done in reaction to some state Supreme Court, state Supreme Court ruling and, and how the state can address laws that are | 00:02:30 | |
passed by citizen initiatives. So that's coming forward and it's that that in addition to that on the ballot, there's other | 00:02:37 | |
constitutional amendments and other things will be considered including for our deputy, including making sheriff's constitutional | 00:02:43 | |
state office. So that that which will pass will be good. | 00:02:50 | |
But this is also the time when when the. | 00:02:59 | |
Legislative committees start preparing legislative committee bills, which are formal actions by a committee. If they pass a bill | 00:03:02 | |
in in August, September, October, and it passes with a supermajority of the committee, then it becomes what's called the committee | 00:03:09 | |
bill. Those bills skip the can't skip the committee process in the legislative session. So there's a way to expedite bill so that | 00:03:15 | |
activity begins now and and, and. | 00:03:22 | |
There will be several aggressive legislators who will have try to get their bills through committees in advance because. | 00:03:29 | |
It's become become such a. | 00:03:35 | |
There creates such a backlog during the session, it's hard to get things done. So as we see more bills every year in the | 00:03:40 | |
legislature, the committee bills are becoming more popular. We'll be watching for those. Some of those will will, will, could | 00:03:46 | |
potentially affect the city. There will be transportation bills, for example. There will be there. There could be a bill on tax | 00:03:52 | |
increment financing in fact. | 00:03:58 | |
This coming session, so we'll watch for the bills coming forward that may affect the city, may be of interest to the city, and let | 00:04:05 | |
you know what those are when they're made available. But as you know, most bills aren't made public until into the legislative | 00:04:09 | |
session, sometimes late into the legislative session. | 00:04:14 | |
So we like them earlier because it's it's an easier way to get ahold of them. Also, this is the time when the governors office, | 00:04:19 | |
the the executive branch starts preparing their budget. The governor submits his budget to the legislature every fall, usually | 00:04:25 | |
October. | 00:04:30 | |
That's a recommendation of a budget because the legislative branches has a power of the purse, as you know. So it's a | 00:04:36 | |
recommendation that the governors office prepares. They're taking feedback from all the executive agencies right now. That | 00:04:43 | |
includes issues like roads and transit and other things that the state pays for it. | 00:04:50 | |
And so there's there will be a flurry of activity in September and October regarding. | 00:04:57 | |
Spending issues regarding probably housing, probably transportation, probably lots of things that you all want to be aware of and | 00:05:04 | |
we'll be watching those and, and we'll make you aware of what we know of when we know of it that would have impact on the city so | 00:05:11 | |
we can have input early. It's a lot easier to amend things early than to try to change things late. | 00:05:18 | |
So. | 00:05:25 | |
In addition to that, we've been working. | 00:05:27 | |
With the city, with staff and with the mayor on some of the regional. | 00:05:31 | |
Issues like the ongoing discussions with Union Pacific Railroad about realignment of airlines and how that impacts the region. | 00:05:37 | |
There are discussions going on about regional transportation issues that that regarding the Olympics, the Olympics. | 00:05:45 | |
Transportation Plan has been published, but it doesn't include a lot of things that will get added to it overtime. | 00:05:53 | |
I'm I'm so old that I was actually working for Senator Bob Bennett, US Senator Bob Bennett, who was an appropriator the last for | 00:06:00 | |
the last Olympics. And there there will be a. | 00:06:05 | |
A lot of money that comes from the federal government to support the Olympics and and. | 00:06:12 | |
How that gets allocated and how that gets how those appropriations get done and where they get done will be have a big impact on | 00:06:17 | |
the state. It's quite a big cash infusion for the state and a lot of infrastructure in particular can be done in those periods of | 00:06:22 | |
time. | 00:06:27 | |
There's so there were conversations for example going on now about the fact that the Provo airport is increasing in its service. | 00:06:33 | |
It's increasing including international service and moving people from that airport to to venues, whether they be the ice rink, | 00:06:40 | |
which is will be just up the street or whether it be up to Heber Valley or to points N. How you move people from that airport | 00:06:46 | |
efficiently that are here for the games will be discussed. | 00:06:53 | |
And they will very likely be funding. | 00:07:00 | |
Associated with that. And so those conversations are starting now because there's the Olympic planning will begin because ten | 00:07:03 | |
years will go by fast. So again, you're in the Vineyard city, being in the middle of of this valley and on the transportation | 00:07:07 | |
corridors. | 00:07:12 | |
You'll want to be part of those conversations, so we're watching those and monitoring those as well. There are, there will always | 00:07:18 | |
be. | 00:07:22 | |
A myriad of water issues and other things that come up that could affect your city, so we watch for those. | 00:07:26 | |
And. | 00:07:32 | |
I guess if you have any questions, I'm happy to take them, but that's kind of. | 00:07:34 | |
What starts really, it's post Labor Day. Things get really crazy. One of the things that we're going to be doing as we move into | 00:07:37 | |
this year is we're going to be having legislative review meetings with our government consultants so we can start prepping for | 00:07:43 | |
what we want to see as a council. And then we'll bring that back. There's ongoing projects, of course, like the railroad and our | 00:07:49 | |
transit and transportation and water and everything that Jeff mentioned, but. | 00:07:55 | |
Other things that we're interested, we'll have those discussions down the line. So any questions? | 00:08:02 | |
Just say one for the community. With the constitutional amendments on the ballot, do you have a recommendation where voters can go | 00:08:11 | |
and get more information? | 00:08:14 | |
Yeah, well, the Lieutenant Governor's office will have links to. | 00:08:20 | |
Pro the each side pro and con, it's the same thing. That's published in the Voter Information Guide. Those haven't been written | 00:08:23 | |
yet, but they will be. I can't remember the timeline, but they're required well in advance. And so the, the, if you go to | 00:08:29 | |
elections.utah.gov, you'll be able to find links to those in addition. | 00:08:34 | |
I can promise you there will be no shortage of information sent to you by both sides of all issues. | 00:08:41 | |
It'll be election year mail overwhelming volumes in your mailboxes again. But you know, some of these issues are are. | 00:08:49 | |
Can be pretty important to how things function in the state, especially when they talk about, you know, ballot initiatives and | 00:08:59 | |
election laws and things like that. So but for the constitutional amendment, so those ballot measures have written pro and cons | 00:09:04 | |
that get published. So those of you, they'll be available soon, yeah. | 00:09:10 | |
All of our previous clients are actually listed there, so when you unregister for client it stays there so you can see past | 00:09:47 | |
clients as well. | 00:09:50 | |
I noticed in the article that was published in by the Salt Lake Tribune through the. | 00:09:54 | |
I want to quote this right the journalism project. | 00:10:00 | |
That you guys, it was disclosed that you guys, it was fought by the Bensons to not have your names released and it went to court | 00:10:05 | |
for the past four years and you guys were a subcontractor listed. Why? Why are we fighting to not know that you're connected? I'm | 00:10:12 | |
sorry, when you say you guys what, who are you guys, me in particular? | 00:10:18 | |
The Big Game Forever Foundation. | 00:10:26 | |
You guys were subcontractors and made a total of. | 00:10:30 | |
20%, it's in the article. My question is, is why are we fighting for four years for the Ryan Benson and Stage consulting to hide | 00:10:36 | |
the fact that you're one of the subcontractors in that fighting for the Gray Wolf? Well, I'm not sure where you're getting the | 00:10:44 | |
term hiding, but I wasn't involved in any of that. So I can't answer that question. Taking it to court to the records request. | 00:10:53 | |
To stop it from coming up. I wasn't involved in any of that so I can't answer your question. | 00:11:02 | |
Point of order, I don't know what this has to do with our council, so you could clarify and. | 00:11:06 | |
But this doesn't have anything to do with us, has everything to do with how he. | 00:11:12 | |
Can you clarify what you mean? Because I don't see it right now. Yeah, it it, it has to do with how many different people he's | 00:11:16 | |
representing and if there's a conflict of interest. And I think he stated clearly that it's made public. It's online and right. | 00:11:22 | |
But as a subcontractor that wouldn't be listed. Only the main contract. It was listed. I had to register. You can see that I'm | 00:11:29 | |
registered. I was registered for them at that time. I was registered for as a subcontractor. Yeah. OK. | 00:11:35 | |
Mayor, if if the line of question is going to be directed at character and fitness issues, yes, those can be taken to closed | 00:11:44 | |
session or a conversation with Mr. Hart. And I'm happy to have a conversation with you offline about all of these questions as | 00:11:49 | |
I've offered in the past. Please refrain from any of those questions in this meeting that has anything to do with character or | 00:11:54 | |
fitness. Thank you. | 00:11:58 | |
Any other questions that are relevant to this meeting? | 00:12:06 | |
I just like to state for the record that I disagree with the way in which the city approves this. | 00:12:10 | |
Just to have it on the record in a nice kind way. I don't know what you mean by approves this, just having a lobbyist. I don't | 00:12:15 | |
think it's the approach the Vineyard City should have. OK, thank you. All right, thank you so much. Does anybody else have any | 00:12:21 | |
other questions or comments? | 00:12:26 | |
Thank you for coming down. Thanks for all you do. We appreciate it. Thanks. | 00:12:31 | |
All right. | 00:12:37 | |
That moves us into a closed session. | 00:12:39 | |
What we will do is you guys can remain here and our council will leave the room for a closed session and I'm going to have, we'll | 00:12:42 | |
get a motion to go into it. This will be for the discussion of character, professional competence or physical or mental health | 00:12:50 | |
health of an individual. So I need a motion to go into that. Do I have to restate that? Yes, please. | 00:12:57 | |
Just wanted to state it for the public so they knew. | 00:13:05 | |
OK, I move to go into a closed session immediately in the conference room here at the city offices to discuss the character, | 00:13:08 | |
professional competence, or physical or mental health of an individual. | 00:13:13 | |
Can I get a second? | 00:13:19 | |
Second, all in favor roll call. Jake, Amber. Aye, yes. Marty, Sarah. Yes. All right, we will be back. | 00:13:24 | |
And for your patience, we are going to move on to appointments. | 00:13:37 | |
Appointment of a library board member. | 00:13:42 | |
We have Diana Steele here to fill the remainder of Pilar Stills Term as one of our Vineyard Library Board members and she will | 00:13:46 | |
fill out the remainder of Peeler Stills Term and I just need a motion to approve that appointment. | 00:13:55 | |
As an alternate for that term, and if you want to come up and say anything you can do you want to come up and say anything? Okay, | 00:14:05 | |
come on up. | 00:14:10 | |
No, I don't have a lot to say, but thank you for this opportunity. And I just love libraries, so thank you. Thank you. | 00:14:15 | |
All right. Can I get a motion? Yeah. I moved to approve the mayor's appointment to the library that, I'm sorry, the Vineyard | 00:14:23 | |
Library board as presented. Can I get a second? | 00:14:27 | |
Second, All right. First by Marty, second by Sarah. All in favor. Aye. All right, welcome. Thank you so much for taking the | 00:14:33 | |
opportunity to serve our community. We appreciate it. | 00:14:39 | |
OK. | 00:14:45 | |
Should we do it with the Youth Council or in order? | 00:14:46 | |
OK, I was thinking we do the youth council and then we just do it all and get pictures all at the same time. All right. The youth | 00:14:49 | |
council, our executive board had an election and we have a new youth council mayor and manager. And so I'm just going to read your | 00:14:55 | |
names and make that appointment and then our council will vote you in and then we will go ahead and swear you all in and we'll get | 00:15:01 | |
some pictures with you. | 00:15:07 | |
So let's see, the elections were held on July 15th, 2024 and these are our youth Mayor Ashland May Youth Council City Manager | 00:15:13 | |
Russell Rasmussen, Youth Recorder Beckham Sifuentes, Youth Communications Chair Dalia de la Piedra. | 00:15:23 | |
Youth Services and beautification chair Morgan Preet. Youth Council activities chair Darius. | 00:15:33 | |
Viagra and city recorder Pamela Spencer will swear you guys in I was reading you into youth. OK I need AI need a motion. | 00:15:40 | |
I did. I said the city recorders name and I even mentioned Pam. I mentioned all the names written. | 00:15:51 | |
I did OK, All right. Can I get a motion to appoint those youth council members? | 00:15:56 | |
I move to a point. I'm sorry. I move to approve the mayor's appointments to the Vineyard Youth Council Executive Board as | 00:16:02 | |
presented. Thank you. Can I get a second, second, second by Amber? All in favor? Aye. OK. Now we will start our swearing in | 00:16:07 | |
ceremony. | 00:16:12 | |
Come on up, Pan. | 00:16:18 | |
Stand up here. I don't think we have any more. | 00:16:21 | |
Come on up to stand in front of the mayor there. | 00:16:29 | |
You can repeat after me, raise your right, go ahead and. | 00:16:32 | |
Raise your right hand and then repeat after me. I state your name. | 00:16:37 | |
Having been elected and appointed to the Youth Council Executive Board and appointed to the. | 00:16:44 | |
Library Board. | 00:16:49 | |
Having been elected to the library board, thank you. | 00:16:52 | |
That's OK. | 00:16:55 | |
Having been elected and appointed to these Council Executive Board. | 00:16:57 | |
Do solemnly swear. Do solemnly swear. | 00:17:05 | |
That I will support, obey and defend. | 00:17:08 | |
The Constitution of the United States, The Constitution of the United States, and the Constitution of the State of Utah. Utah. | 00:17:12 | |
And that I will discharge the duties of my office and then I will discharge the duties of my office with fidelity. With fidelity. | 00:17:22 | |
Thank you. Congratulations. | 00:17:26 | |
Okay. | 00:17:34 | |
Pictures. | 00:17:39 | |
Oh, shoot. Can we? I can't. Yeah. Thank you. | 00:17:51 | |
Did you come back? | 00:18:03 | |
Thank you. | 00:18:10 | |
Diana Russell, if you come over here, I'll have you sign those. Thank you. Thank you. | 00:18:12 | |
No, that's why. | 00:18:19 | |
Take the brakes off. Let me be. | 00:18:21 | |
All right, that brings us right into our work session. We're going to start out with a mobility device and golf cart discussion by | 00:18:28 | |
Lieutenant Rockwell, and he'll present some recommended changes or options for our municipal code. | 00:18:34 | |
Where are you? There you are. | 00:18:42 | |
I will swap you because you might have to leave. Yes. | 00:18:45 | |
OK. We're actually going to move on to 5.4, the residential North Point Pass discussion for potential opportunity for passes for | 00:18:48 | |
our residents. Eric might have to leave a little bit early, so we're going to move this up. | 00:18:56 | |
OK. So thank you, everyone. This is kind of an exciting opportunity that we have. | 00:19:04 | |
We've been doing a little bit of research on neighboring cities, and every year we do a spring, a spring cleanup, and a fall | 00:19:11 | |
cleanup, and we bring dumpsters into the city. | 00:19:16 | |
And. | 00:19:23 | |
There are some challenges associated with that for residents. | 00:19:24 | |
You don't always have the thing that you wanted to get rid of that's too large to put in the garbage can. | 00:19:29 | |
In the fall or in the spring on those specific dates, and from a staffing standpoint, it takes a lot of work to get out there and | 00:19:34 | |
keep that those bins smashed down. | 00:19:39 | |
And So what other cities have been doing and not all some, some do what we do, but other cities have have worked with North Point | 00:19:44 | |
to establish a punch pass. So every resident in the city gets what we're proposing would be a 2A2 punch pass option. So that at | 00:19:51 | |
any point during the year, if, if your dishwasher goes out, you can throw the dishwasher in the back of the, the, the vehicle, | 00:19:59 | |
take it to the transfer station and you use your punch pass and that waves the $12.00. | 00:20:06 | |
For the first 625 lbs of of trash that you would like to take there, that's kind of your large stuff so that you can clean up | 00:20:14 | |
whenever that's convenient. And we feel that from a convenient standpoint to residents and a convenient standpoint for. | 00:20:22 | |
Managing those spring and fall cleanups. | 00:20:31 | |
It would be a great option to shift to this. | 00:20:35 | |
Punch pass option in lieu of the the spring and fall cleanups. | 00:20:39 | |
And and I would add that. | 00:20:44 | |
A couple small details. The cost could be incorporated into our trash collection. | 00:20:46 | |
So that the punch pass wouldn't cost anything extra for residents. And the the other housekeeping item would be that you would | 00:20:53 | |
need to come. All residents that have an account for trash collection would need to come to the city, grab a physical pass because | 00:20:59 | |
we would need to do something on it to kind of make it unique. | 00:21:04 | |
But that that would be how that project or process would work. | 00:21:12 | |
Yeah. And there's different options we can look at with opt in or opt out. One of the reasons that this conversation came forward | 00:21:15 | |
is because there are some of the dumpsters that are being overfilled in the community and it's really difficult to clean them up. | 00:21:21 | |
And so the idea was, do we lock those dumpsters? One of the reasons why it's there is because there was so much dumping happening | 00:21:27 | |
along the shoreline and in different various areas where we were trying to say please don't put your couches on the side of the | 00:21:33 | |
road or down by the shoreline. | 00:21:39 | |
And we needed to go pick up trash and then bring it to these areas. But now they're overfilling and they're overfilling | 00:21:46 | |
continuously. And even though we do the spring and fall cleanup, I think residents are looking for another option. And so we | 00:21:52 | |
wanted you to start vetting what that looks like and how to either participate or why you would or wouldn't want to participate. | 00:21:58 | |
So if you have any questions or discussion points tonight, as you've heard from residents or if you have thoughts about how to | 00:22:04 | |
move into. | 00:22:09 | |
Program like that, this would be a great time to discuss it before we bring it back to a business item. | 00:22:15 | |
I'm torn because I know a lot of residents are constantly texting me throughout the year. Hey, I've been waiting for this spring | 00:22:22 | |
cleanup. So it'd be cool to be able to say, oh, you don't have to wait like you can load up your truck and then take it. But a lot | 00:22:28 | |
of residents like the convenience. That's why they're using our dumpsters because they like having it in town. And so I'm I'm | 00:22:34 | |
honestly torn. I think it would be interesting to see the cost difference that possibly you said that you would have to compare | 00:22:40 | |
the numbers with. | 00:22:45 | |
Or did you say it would be even? | 00:22:52 | |
It's probably a little bit more expensive to do the punch pass option, but we could incorporate that into. | 00:22:55 | |
Into the fees that we charge already, so it wouldn't come at a an extra cost, the Republic Services just you know. | 00:23:02 | |
Spoiler alert. | 00:23:11 | |
On our consolidated fee schedule, Republic Services has has increased their rate this year. So we're we're proposing a slight | 00:23:13 | |
increase in our in our trash collection. And with that slight increase we can incorporate the punch pass option into into the fee | 00:23:20 | |
so that people don't have to pay the extra. It would otherwise be $24.00. | 00:23:27 | |
Is what is what the city gets billed for those two punches? | 00:23:35 | |
Another thing you'll probably need to review is. | 00:23:39 | |
If we do lock the dumpsters during the times where it's not spring and fall cleanup, what happens if people are dumping couches? | 00:23:43 | |
Because that's one of the issues that we're facing is how do we I. | 00:23:50 | |
Kind of stop them from doing that. And so are there fees associated? Are there signs what kind of ability to do we have to put | 00:23:58 | |
someone over to observe that situation? Those are some other things that will come back into play in this discussion. | 00:24:04 | |
And if you would like some feedback, we've we've been discussing those issues as well. And what we're proposing right now is to | 00:24:10 | |
get all of our dumpsters into compliance with our own city code and have an enclosure for each of those. | 00:24:16 | |
And the ones that we want the public to be using will will keep them open and put signage on them that says please don't put large | 00:24:23 | |
trash. This is for keeping our shorelines clean. You know, day picnic stuff, by all means toss it in here. But anything larger | 00:24:29 | |
than that, please use your punch pass. | 00:24:35 | |
Any of our ones that are not intended to be for public use where you know, near our parks where it's simply a, it's a dumpster so | 00:24:42 | |
that our park staff can take empty all the trash cans and put those in the dumpsters. We will lock the gates when they're not | 00:24:49 | |
being used. We'll put signage on them and we'll have a camera near that says and we'll keep the the lids closed. So if you're | 00:24:56 | |
throwing a couch over an enclosure that's locked onto the top of a dumpster that is closed. | 00:25:02 | |
You know that you did something wrong and when someone shows up to give you a ticket. | 00:25:10 | |
You know you got caught for the right reason. | 00:25:14 | |
And so we'll make it very clear that certain dumpsters are for public use and others are not. | 00:25:16 | |
OK, any questions on this right now or would you like to? Well, it'll I just have one thing newsletter just recently. | 00:25:23 | |
Yeah, usually it comes with a coupon, right? We get like a postcard. So it had one and it does have, it has a, yeah, a coupon to | 00:25:33 | |
go. I wonder if you could just instead of a punch pass, because needing to come to the city to get a punch pass a little | 00:25:40 | |
inconvenient. But if we did like a citywide newsletter, Spring and fall that had that too. I thought that was a really good idea. | 00:25:47 | |
Just if, yeah, if, if, if a physical mailing is taking place, then we could, that is another way to get them out. Well, I mean, we | 00:25:55 | |
just need to make sure that they're an original copy because the city will get billed. | 00:26:00 | |
$12.00 each time the transfer station tracks that and then they just send a bill to the city for each each one that is is used. So | 00:26:07 | |
we wouldn't want to make it so that it was something that. | 00:26:13 | |
That could be replicated easily and everybody's dump, you know, 100 dumps for the year would get thrown into our our billing. | 00:26:20 | |
And if residents have any comments on this, you can mention it during public comment, but you could also just leave your or e-mail | 00:26:28 | |
us and connect with one of our staff members over here and submit your comment and we will incorporate that into what we are | 00:26:33 | |
working on and talking about. | 00:26:38 | |
Any other questions from the Council? | 00:26:44 | |
OK. Thank you so much, Eric. We look forward to discussing this more. | 00:26:47 | |
We'll go back to 5.1. | 00:26:52 | |
With our Lieutenant. | 00:26:55 | |
I'm going to back this up just a little bit. I talked too loud to be that close to you. | 00:27:01 | |
Good evening. So we put this on the work session tonight for a couple reasons. And we said golf carts and mobility devices because | 00:27:07 | |
it's really hard to quantify, you know, is it an electric scooter or electric bike, a moped, a go pet, a auto cycle, auto driven | 00:27:13 | |
cycle? I mean there's a hundred different types of devices out there. So mobility device, what we're talking about is things that | 00:27:19 | |
are like electric or gas powered thing self-propelled via vehicles or devices. | 00:27:26 | |
Couple things that brought this up. We've had some recent complaints about golf carts. | 00:27:33 | |
And even scooters and other things on our sidewalks and trails and roads. I've had two incidents that the Sheriff's Office | 00:27:38 | |
recently with golf carts. We had one run through the fence of Grove Park, had another one over on the overpass where somebody was | 00:27:44 | |
driving a golf cart on the sidewalk and a scooter was going the other direction and there was a collision. We didn't really | 00:27:50 | |
determine who was at fault because we had different stories on what happened. We did have that incident. | 00:27:57 | |
We also had a video sent to me from one of you about a golf cart incident right here on Center St. | 00:28:04 | |
Where the golf cart was going eastbound on Center St. Got to the roundabout, didn't even look or yield, just entered right into | 00:28:09 | |
the roundabout right in front of a car. Golf cart ended up going off the side up near the wall and there was a scooter going by at | 00:28:13 | |
the same time. It was great. | 00:28:17 | |
We've also we I just got an e-mail from a resident who runs in the city about some some conflicts with him running and cars, but | 00:28:23 | |
also people using a scooter on the sidewalk or electric bike cruising really fast on the sidewalk. That was a close call. So | 00:28:28 | |
that's some of the stuff that's brought it up. The other thing that is in speaking with Brian and Parks, they have some concerns | 00:28:33 | |
about. | 00:28:38 | |
These devices within our parks, especially during like soccer games where the soccer game ends and people are driving their golf | 00:28:43 | |
carts out onto the field or out onto the grass to pick up kids or whatever, and it's just kind of chaotic at that time. So we got | 00:28:48 | |
some safety concerns. Also, obviously concerns with tearing up the grass or ruining things that would cause them to have to do | 00:28:52 | |
more maintenance. | 00:28:57 | |
So what I'd like to do tonight is just kind of get a feel of where you guys stand on what you'd like to see. | 00:29:03 | |
I'm going to go over some of the stuff we already have in place and what our current laws are and then whatever you guys | 00:29:09 | |
recommend. I have some recommendations or some ideas that we could do. But really before we get really knee deep or get deep into | 00:29:15 | |
drafting ordinances, just want to see what is something that you'd be interested in potentially passing or or at least looking at. | 00:29:21 | |
So I think for me, we could definitely brush up on our main roads and thoroughfares. I think it's. | 00:29:28 | |
Kind of bold to take your golf cart out on a place that's like people are going 4050 mph. Yeah, yeah. And we'll talk about that. | 00:29:34 | |
So right now, if we're talking about golf carts, golf carts are not allowed on roads and vineyards by state code. State codes says | 00:29:42 | |
that golf carts cannot be operated on a road. However, municipalities can allow them on on roads. And then they can, as long as | 00:29:49 | |
they're specifying and taking precautions that it's safe and specifying when, who and where those can be operated on. | 00:29:57 | |
Currently, as far as our sidewalks and trails go, we don't have anything particularly banning a golf cart or any kind of electric | 00:30:05 | |
device on our sidewalks or our trails. Right now. What we have in place is there's no off Hwy. vehicles on those on sidewalks or | 00:30:12 | |
trails. And that state code defines there's three different grades of off Hwy. vehicles, but that's more like your 4 Wheelers and | 00:30:19 | |
your side by sides and your motorcycles and three Wheelers, whatever that would be. | 00:30:25 | |
Within our parks, we don't really have anything that says you couldn't, couldn't drive those within the parks right now. | 00:30:33 | |
As far as on the grass or even on the sidewalk or trails, obviously our park rules like at Grove Park say you can't have them in | 00:30:39 | |
the splash pad, but that's not an actual ordinance. It's just one of our park rules that's that's written on there. | 00:30:46 | |
So that's kind of where we stand right now as far as what we have. We do have speed limits in place on our trails of 15 miles an | 00:30:52 | |
hour. Sidewalk doesn't really have that. We have something in place that says you have to be basically driving or doing things | 00:30:57 | |
safely on our sidewalks and trails as far as safe travel. | 00:31:02 | |
Run the plate, try to contact the owner, kind of take a more conservative approach of being friendly and trying to get people to | 00:31:39 | |
comply before we take such drastic measures as towing vehicle. The same has been true with golf carts and things on our roads and | 00:31:44 | |
things like that. We aren't out issuing citations to people driving their golf carts on the streets or the sidewalks and things | 00:31:48 | |
like that. | 00:31:53 | |
Now, if they're doing this unsafely, we're going to go talk to them and, and hey, or they got 10 kids hanging off the sides and | 00:31:58 | |
it's unsafe. That's something to talk to him about. But we haven't been issuing citations for that, even though technically they | 00:32:05 | |
can't be on the roads. So just to put that out there, how, how enforcement is going, We can be more, more, we can increase that | 00:32:11 | |
enforcement. Obviously, if that's the desire of the council or if we continue to see the issues, we, we could do that as well. So. | 00:32:17 | |
What the preference is and and speaking with Brian at parks, if we go over that first and what we'd like to see in the parks is | 00:32:24 | |
potentially we could look at no motorized scooters, bikes, golf carts, etcetera, within, on the grass or within the open space of | 00:32:28 | |
the park. | 00:32:32 | |
We can allow continue to allow them to be on the trails. We could put something in place like they're restricted to designated | 00:32:37 | |
sidewalks or trails. | 00:32:41 | |
They can't be on the grass unless they're parked there and so many feet from a trail or a sidewalk. We could do something like | 00:32:44 | |
that. | 00:32:47 | |
Harriman, for example, they don't allow them in their open space. They recently did a, a post basically showing a, a bike trail | 00:32:52 | |
that was worn into the grass and said they're not allowed in the open spaces. You can't have them there. And they have that in | 00:32:58 | |
their ordinance, ordinance. And that's really in speaking to Brian, in the parks, that's kind of what their desire would be is to | 00:33:03 | |
try to keep them out of those open spaces within our parks. | 00:33:09 | |
Say, Brian, is there a code that says, hey, we don't want him here, but we do want them here because this community loves. | 00:33:15 | |
Yes. So we could specify areas that they would be allowed. The same thing goes for when we're talking about like other areas like | 00:33:23 | |
the streets and stuff for golf carts. We are. We definitely have the ability to say we'll allow golf carts on any road 25 miles an | 00:33:30 | |
hour slower and any trail 8 feet or wider. We could definitely do that. I would. I don't think I'd recommend allowing them on golf | 00:33:38 | |
carts on sidewalks. Sidewalks 5 feet wide, golf carts 4 feet wide doesn't leave enough room for people to pass. | 00:33:45 | |
We want to be able to have that still still exist on our sidewalks, but we definitely have the ability that we could restrict it | 00:33:53 | |
down to that and say, hey, you can have those in this area, in these parks and we could, we could specify that, for example. I | 00:33:59 | |
mean, I've been searching a lot on other cities on golf carts and all these things. Very few have ordinances on golf carts right | 00:34:06 | |
now. Saint George just did pass one in May where they do allow golf carts on certain streets. | 00:34:13 | |
During daylight hours, you have to be 16 years of old of age or older to operate the golf cart. | 00:34:20 | |
And then they actually in their code list out the streets that they are allowed on certain neighborhoods and certain areas that | 00:34:25 | |
they're allowed. So we could do that. | 00:34:30 | |
And we have the ability to say what age we want them to be. If we wanted to say 16 or, you know, some areas in other states say | 00:34:36 | |
you have to be. | 00:34:41 | |
You have to have an active drivers license if you're to be 16, but if you're 18 or older, you just have to have an ID to be able | 00:34:46 | |
to operate a golf cart. So on a on a city street. | 00:34:51 | |
The other thing we could do that was brought up with potentially is if we wanted to require some kind of a course that this we | 00:34:57 | |
could provide. I mean I could come up with some curriculum and kind of like the state is done with their new OHP course that they | 00:35:01 | |
make you go through if you want to drive a four Wheeler or side by side or things like that, that's something we could do to | 00:35:05 | |
increase safety. | 00:35:09 | |
Let's see what else I had on here. | 00:35:16 | |
Eagle Mountains, another one, I looked at them, they don't allow motor vehicles on there within their parks as well and that their | 00:35:19 | |
definition of that includes. | 00:35:22 | |
Tote gels, motorcycles, motorbikes, snowmobiles, anything like that within their parks. They don't allow that I. | 00:35:27 | |
Residents would be on board with that. We could at least look at start down a path of drafting an ordinance. I I specifically | 00:36:03 | |
think I. | 00:36:07 | |
In regards to the. | 00:36:13 | |
The electric vehicles on the grass, I think that's a really good rule, except I think a lot of people have expensive vehicles that | 00:36:14 | |
they don't want to leave, you know, 50 feet away from them while they're watching their soccer game. Like I think there's a | 00:36:20 | |
concern of that some of these electric bikes are really nice and people aren't going to feel comfortable setting them off to the | 00:36:26 | |
side while they're in the middle of the field. Do you have any thoughts towards that? So we could designate a parking area and put | 00:36:32 | |
in racks if we. | 00:36:38 | |
Interesting. Yeah, I think that's a good idea. | 00:37:13 | |
I like looking at the busy roads. I like the idea of finding where we don't want it, where we do want it. I thought those | 00:37:16 | |
opportunities with Saint George and Harriman, the open space was good. I'd be interested to find out what happens if we've lowered | 00:37:22 | |
the age. Are there suddenly different liabilities that are put on us for lowering an age for drivers or do we just not talk about | 00:37:28 | |
it? Liability is AJV question. | 00:37:34 | |
This is where it gets a little bit complicated because we're talking about a lot of different vehicle types. You you now see | 00:37:43 | |
electric skateboards that have a handheld control and can go at a pretty high speed, but. | 00:37:50 | |
An interaction with that kind of vehicle is really different than an interaction with the golf cart that weighs a lot more. | 00:37:59 | |
Takes up a lot more space and so. | 00:38:04 | |
One thing you could do is tailor your rules on the the vehicle type. I think when you're talking about the parks, you're concerned | 00:38:07 | |
about busy times when interaction with an electric vehicle and people walking. | 00:38:14 | |
Can be difficult and then the other thing you're dealing with is just damage to city property that is difficult to maintain if you | 00:38:22 | |
have. | 00:38:26 | |
If the fields wet and somebody's taking a golf cart across, it's going to damage the grass. | 00:38:31 | |
So. | 00:38:37 | |
Specifically with golf carts. | 00:38:39 | |
With how, if we were to say. | 00:38:41 | |
I'm just throwing out a number. I'm not suggesting it. You're saying like oh, 12 and up is fine on a golf cart. Does that make us | 00:38:44 | |
liable when a 12 year old is going on a golf cart? Before you answer my question, just to clarify, I think people are going to let | 00:38:53 | |
their young children drive golf carts and they I don't. I think enforcing this would be really hard. So liability in Utah is. | 00:39:02 | |
Varied in In some states, liability is if you're more than 50% responsible, you're fully responsible. | 00:39:11 | |
In Utah, liability can be shared among a number of different entities and cities can have liability. | 00:39:18 | |
The city's liability is reduced a little bit by the Governmental Immunity Act. There's procedures and then there's a per incident | 00:39:25 | |
and a per individual cap. | 00:39:30 | |
On damages, so you would certainly want to consult with your insurance provider to get their input on this because it will have an | 00:39:36 | |
effect on premiums if you do it as it relates to driving age and the type of vehicle and where those vehicles are allowed to | 00:39:42 | |
drive. | 00:39:48 | |
I think we need to look at that carefully. | 00:39:54 | |
You know, before you make those decisions, it may be that you say it's safe for. | 00:39:57 | |
Younger than 16, teenage driver to operate a golf cart on trails and sidewalks of a certain size, but not on roads where they're | 00:40:04 | |
going to mix with. | 00:40:09 | |
Vehicular traffic and those kinds of things. | 00:40:15 | |
And then I guess the other thing I would strongly urge is when you make these decisions, you do want to look. | 00:40:18 | |
Established design standards for these kinds of vehicles. There are a couple of different places that you can go to where those. | 00:40:25 | |
Standards would be acceptable, but the way I think of it on my mind is it's OK to be on the cutting edge. We don't want to be on | 00:40:34 | |
the bleeding edge. And so we'd like to follow what somebody else is or what a more national organization has blessed in terms of | 00:40:40 | |
design and what kind of vehicles can safely operate there. Before we say that's OK within the city, but I think you can get to a | 00:40:46 | |
place where. | 00:40:52 | |
If you want to allow. | 00:40:59 | |
People younger than 16 to operate certain types of vehicles. | 00:41:02 | |
On. | 00:41:08 | |
Where they're not mixed with automobile traffic that you probably can do it safely as long as you make sure the facilities that | 00:41:10 | |
are on are within established design standards. | 00:41:14 | |
Easement and things like that, and I could see that being meaningful, but otherwise wouldn't we just update our policy and enforce | 00:41:50 | |
on core routes? We could definitely increase enforcement when we see them on our bigger, busier roads, especially roads 30 miles | 00:41:57 | |
an hour faster. The state code basically says the municipality shall provide sufficient parameters regarding the operation of to | 00:42:04 | |
ensure public safety. That's the way the state code reads it. We have to ensure, you know, sufficient parameters to do that. | 00:42:11 | |
I will tell you the two incidents that I talked about, the fence and then the scooter and the golf cart, one driver was 15, one | 00:42:19 | |
was 14. So not that that's indicative of it, you know, widespread, but those two incidents, that's how old they. | 00:42:25 | |
And I think to be to be transparent, I think Parks is really interested in as far as timeline goes in trying to get something done | 00:42:33 | |
quicker as far as keeping them off the open space areas. So I think that may be a higher priority as far as what their their | 00:42:40 | |
desire to do if we want to take a little more time as far as the rest of you know, on the streets or sidewalks or trails. | 00:42:47 | |
We could definitely spend some time designating certain areas where we would want them and kind of come back with, hey, this is | 00:42:55 | |
what we think would be acceptable. | 00:42:59 | |
I feel like if you need to do something quick, I even feel like we could just update our park policy for certain areas. Yeah, we | 00:43:03 | |
definitely could. We make a clarification and hear me out, Brian, I care about your grass. What if people were to, could we allow | 00:43:09 | |
people to walk their bikes or walk their scooters on the grass? And I would say a hard, fast rule of no golf carts on the grass. | 00:43:15 | |
But I just worry that. | 00:43:21 | |
I want families to be able to, you know, feel like they're having their property and being able to keep it near. Feel like she | 00:43:27 | |
knows somebody that owns an electric scooter. | 00:43:32 | |
I may or may not have driven my electric scooter here. | 00:43:39 | |
Yeah. No, I think that's a great point to to bring up. There's a number of residents that have been coaching for us for years that | 00:43:44 | |
I know have some of those vehicles and are using them. There's just been a number of residents that have expressed concern and | 00:43:50 | |
seen near accidents. I. | 00:43:57 | |
So I do think I don't know what the solution is to that, so I want to think about that a little bit more. | 00:44:04 | |
Of I think. | 00:44:11 | |
Go ahead. I think walking a vehicle, just like an elementary school, you're allowed to bring your bike to the you ride your bike | 00:44:13 | |
to the property, and then you walk your bike in the rest of the way. | 00:44:18 | |
And I feel like walking an item is safer. I don't know if that will solve the grass issue. | 00:44:22 | |
That you could bring back to us quickly and then each council member can send their concerns or their experience with these | 00:44:59 | |
vehicles. | 00:45:03 | |
I'm pro golf cart and they're designed to be driven on grass. So they don't really do damage on grass. That's why they're designed | 00:45:08 | |
that way, right? But the damage isn't obviously it's a concern with certain types of vehicles, right? And and some golf carts, | 00:45:14 | |
depending on what kind of tires they put on them and if they've souped them up a little bit. Some of the golf carts you see are | 00:45:19 | |
not the golf carts you drive on your golf course. They're a little bit different, but the other one is more is more of the safety | 00:45:24 | |
too, right So. | 00:45:30 | |
I think. | 00:45:36 | |
I actually was at the National League of Cities and they were talking about how children's brains develop at an earlier age, the | 00:45:38 | |
sooner you can get them driving, and how cities should promote early driving 910 and 11 years old because it helps some kind of | 00:45:44 | |
figure it out. I thought that was pretty crazy because I learned how to drive a tractor at 11 years old with a baler and back | 00:45:51 | |
without lights on by moonlight. So. | 00:45:57 | |
But. | 00:46:04 | |
I think we want to be pro, but I think one adjustment where you could police that is if there are accidents you're giving a ticket | 00:46:06 | |
and you tell, I think that's hard of like give, give a citation, not give a citation. But I think if it's a clear delineated of | 00:46:12 | |
like what it is, hey, we are going to be pro, but parents if there is an accident. | 00:46:18 | |
There will be a citation that goes out. So teach your kids to be better. And then #2 IA 100% agree with getting golf carts off of | 00:46:25 | |
the sidewalks. Like that's where I think your problem is, is it's two people going separate ways and it's like. | 00:46:33 | |
This one needs you need to be in the road. It's a slower Rd. but you're still on the sidewalk type thing. So if there's | 00:46:41 | |
delineation on a map that you say like hey do not be on the sidewalk here. | 00:46:47 | |
Because it is such a slow street, right? And then lastly, I met with Strongtown, the what's his name, my buddy last night about | 00:46:53 | |
strong Towns. And it's actually, there's a couple of videos about how people won't agree, but the golf carts actually slow down | 00:47:00 | |
traffic because people will see it and they'll get our cars to drive even though they only go 2025 miles an hour. That's kind of | 00:47:07 | |
what we want them driving anyway in terms of where it's going and so. | 00:47:14 | |
There's study after study that if if they're not there and you know, you have the visualization. | 00:47:21 | |
And it's wide open. They're just going to drive like crazy. So those are my feedback of adjustments. Can I just add, I assume | 00:47:27 | |
Jordan? Yeah, Jordan, this is also a good opportunity, Jordans on the bike Commission to collaborate with the bike Commission. | 00:47:33 | |
They're looking for opportunities to add more facilities for bike parking and things like that. So they might be able to give you | 00:47:39 | |
some good insight. Can we have them lead it? Because he's great. | 00:47:45 | |
Sure. | 00:47:52 | |
So as far as enforcement goes, just everyone's on that. You understand, the only thing I can issue a citation for right now is if | 00:47:55 | |
they're on the streets, right? That's the only as far as a golf cart goes, not sidewalks, not a sidewalk, because we don't have an | 00:48:01 | |
ordinance against that in the state. Can't wait till they break a rule and get onto the road and be like, hey. | 00:48:06 | |
I could, if it's not written, it doesn't exist. Holden needs a written rule. So yeah, the state law is no roads. I think we could | 00:48:14 | |
write a pro golf course kind of thing where we keep them off those main roads and we keep them off sidewalks, but we allow them to | 00:48:19 | |
be on paths. And I like that idea for a long term approach. And my thought in speaking about it, I can get with Naseem as far as | 00:48:25 | |
like the like you're talking about like building standards for where they're allowed, where they're not and and work with him on | 00:48:30 | |
that as well. So. | 00:48:36 | |
But I also think if we drafted something as code of like when you do see it and it is a minor that we have some sort of paperwork | 00:48:42 | |
of like. | 00:48:46 | |
Hey, you're a parent. Would love to know that my kid is doing such because a lot of times we'll get sent things of like this bad | 00:48:51 | |
behavior that a visit by you is very helpful for parents. When we encounter juveniles, we always speak well as long as we can get | 00:48:59 | |
ahold of parents, we always and just advising people to contact you with take pictures, videos or whatever to solve it. I do, I | 00:49:06 | |
think it's smart if they're going to be under 16 that we have some kind of city certification because we have that. | 00:49:14 | |
I think it was 14, they decided it was farmland, right? And everybody rode their four Wheelers everywhere. But this is this is | 00:49:21 | |
more congested. And I feel like if you want to give that right to somebody under 16, they should go through a city certification | 00:49:27 | |
and we can decide what that age is, if we want it to be 12 or 14, right? I think we can just see what the need is and reach out to | 00:49:33 | |
the community. But I think that's I think that's really important because I think when the younger they are right, maybe the more | 00:49:39 | |
reckless. | 00:49:45 | |
Can be right. And if they go through the certification, then they understand, right, the risks involved and their parents sign off | 00:49:51 | |
that they get that certification. I think that would be really valuable. And Brian, is it the entire grass field that you're | 00:49:59 | |
worried about or could they bring him on to the perimeter around the the sidewalk? Yeah. So one thing that we talked about Holden | 00:50:06 | |
and I was we just have something in place to where they can just park it within, you know, 5 to 10 feet of the trail. | 00:50:13 | |
And then they can just walk the rest of the way. Because one thing I didn't mention too is it's also kind of a space thing. We | 00:50:22 | |
have about 25 feet between fields and you've got parents on both sides. And so there's really not a whole lot of room for a golf | 00:50:28 | |
cart or or bikes and things without obstructing. | 00:50:34 | |
I guess for people to walk, they have to go around and then they're ******* into people. | 00:50:41 | |
But they could park near the game, just not. | 00:50:47 | |
Far into the field, yeah. And I, I'm just a little worried that if we allow people to even just walk these vehicles on, it'll be a | 00:50:50 | |
little bit hard to enforce because there's other incidents where, say, for example, movie at a park and there's dirt bikes that | 00:50:56 | |
are driving through the field. | 00:51:02 | |
Right during the middle of the movie, Um. | 00:51:09 | |
And or there's just, you know, golf carts that are just zoom in and there's games going, kids are running around it just I see a | 00:51:13 | |
lot of room for potential accidents, but I do want to be open to. | 00:51:20 | |
Solutions to that? So I'd be happy to also reach out to a resident that I know has a golf cart to kind of get. | 00:51:28 | |
Their thoughts on maybe what a happy medium would be and see if we can figure out a solution that way. Let's move forward with | 00:51:36 | |
that. You go ahead and work on that policy and bring it back and then we can have longer term discussion council. If you have | 00:51:40 | |
additional thoughts on this, please make sure you're emailing Eric and copying these guys in. So thank you. This is really | 00:51:45 | |
helpful. OK. | 00:51:50 | |
All right, we'll move on to our agenda management and our city recorder. Pam will discuss. | 00:51:55 | |
This item. | 00:52:01 | |
It's like, what is it? | 00:52:04 | |
This item is part of my life, so yeah, I'd love to discuss it with everybody first. I just I, just I. | 00:52:08 | |
I went through and I. | 00:52:18 | |
Figured out how I put together an agenda and so I did this this little paper I split everything up on it and our timeline and | 00:52:20 | |
everything that we do. But I thought I'd give another little bit more background on this is that state code requires us in our | 00:52:29 | |
open and public meetings act to have an agenda and that agenda should be have I cannot say this words reasonable specificity. | 00:52:37 | |
To notify them. But what is on the agenda so that people understand what's on the agenda? | 00:52:47 | |
Itself the agenda. | 00:52:52 | |
Has to have the date, time, place. | 00:52:56 | |
They were holding it and then just this. | 00:52:59 | |
A synopsis kind of, of what is going to be discussed on the agenda. Can't talk about anything that's not on the agenda unless | 00:53:02 | |
there's emergency. | 00:53:07 | |
Those types of things. But we're not going to go into all that because it's Jamie's job to teach Open Public meetings ACT because | 00:53:13 | |
I assigned it to him. | 00:53:17 | |
Not today, though. | 00:53:21 | |
But anyway. | 00:53:23 | |
There's noticing requirements that go with agendas. | 00:53:25 | |
And so. | 00:53:29 | |
In the state code, no less than 24 hours to post an agenda unless it's an emergency, and there's only certain things that might be | 00:53:31 | |
considered an emergency. But the. | 00:53:36 | |
So that no less than 24 hours public notice is kind of what we we hit. | 00:53:45 | |
And I can be honest with you, and I know you're pushing for. | 00:53:50 | |
Publishing them earlier. | 00:53:55 | |
But that 24 hours is a little stressful in our department. | 00:53:59 | |
And so I have always pushed, I would love to do the day before. We tried Friday before those types of things, but it was, it's | 00:54:03 | |
always something comes up, there's an issue and we're always amending things. And I reached out to some other cities. | 00:54:11 | |
I'm not going to go through everything I wrote up, but you can reach out to me on some other things. But I reached out some other | 00:54:20 | |
cities to find out when they're doing them. Cedar Hills is the Friday before Tuesday meeting, Drapers Thursday before the Tuesday | 00:54:26 | |
meeting. Eagle Mountain was Friday before Tuesday meeting. So you can see they're kind of all over the place. And then the the fun | 00:54:31 | |
one was was Orem. And then she said they do it. | 00:54:37 | |
Like just a couple days before the meeting but I can't remember when their meetings. I don't know why I didn't put them in here. | 00:54:44 | |
Anyway, but then I looked at their website and their postings are all over the place. So we're at least consistent, right on that. | 00:54:51 | |
Some of the concerns that they had with posting too early, they agreed that seven days was way too was too soon. And they said | 00:54:58 | |
some of the concerns that they had with it was that you posted seven days and then things come up. | 00:55:06 | |
That then you're amending your agenda and they said it just doesn't look good and it confuses people as to what's on the agenda. | 00:55:16 | |
If you mend it once and then you mend it three times. So something like that. I would say we amend it once and that's it. You | 00:55:23 | |
know, maybe that within that 24 hours if we need to amend it or something. Regardless of when you guys decide you want us to try | 00:55:30 | |
to post these agendas. Some of the things that I want to bring up though, is to why I wouldn't recommend the full seven days. | 00:55:37 | |
Is this like, for instance, we have a public hearing where it needs to go to Planning Commission first? | 00:55:45 | |
Then it goes to council the next week for consideration, which you have one of those on the agenda tonight. Well, they don't have | 00:55:51 | |
time to get that report ready before they have the Planning Commission meeting. So having the report ready, they need to have time | 00:55:57 | |
to, if Planning Commission has any additional recommendations to get those reports updated and into the agenda packet so that you | 00:56:04 | |
guys have all the information that you need those packets or for the council's. | 00:56:11 | |
Use there for the council so they can see what's being changed. | 00:56:19 | |
There's certain things you can't approve without a resolution or an ordinance in front of you and the supporting documents that go | 00:56:23 | |
with it and have some of those to rush them to get those done. | 00:56:28 | |
You know, is it could be a little frustrating for those trying to do it. We also have posting deadlines for those public hearings | 00:56:35 | |
that I was talking about. | 00:56:39 | |
Like budget is 7 days out so I'd be posting a public hearing the same day of posting the agenda for it. | 00:56:43 | |
Land use is 10 days and there is 10 days, but there are other ones that there's other ones that are different days. And so it's | 00:56:50 | |
kind of crazy how we can how we would work things out. So we may know some things ahead of time, but we might not before those | 00:56:56 | |
seven days. So, so those are some other things that. | 00:57:03 | |
There's just a few of the things I wanted to bring up on that the other question was having if we could have the fiscal impact on | 00:57:12 | |
the consent item itself. | 00:57:17 | |
We've, we talked about it, we said, well, it's not impossible. We'd have to go figure out what that is. But there are issues with | 00:57:24 | |
having it there when we could have it in the staff report where they can spell it out. It's already in the staff report. You can | 00:57:30 | |
look at the staff report. If you're not finding it, please make sure you're reading the reports. | 00:57:36 | |
Because that's where it really should be. The other, the other concern on it is that some of those fiscal impacts are complex. And | 00:57:42 | |
so there's, there's going to be several numbers in there and they're not going to be totals that necessarily that you could put on | 00:57:50 | |
an agenda because they might be if this happens, then this and if this happens, then this would be the impact. And so putting that | 00:57:57 | |
as a on our on the headline in the, the consent might be a little. | 00:58:05 | |
Wordy when we've already gotten the staff report. So that's just a recommendation. What if you just put the word fiscal impact so | 00:58:13 | |
people knew it like this has a fiscal impact because to make sure everything has a fiscal impact. Yeah, yeah, if that's what you | 00:58:17 | |
guys want. | 00:58:22 | |
I'm just curious. | 00:58:28 | |
Would you like it like like right in the title that so that people are known to look for it? Sarah, what's your thought on it? | 00:58:29 | |
On the last agenda there were there were consent items and there were there was just a simple fiscal impact. | 00:58:37 | |
Amount and that was really helpful. But if it's more involved then maybe you just put you know that it's more involved and to see | 00:58:42 | |
other other documents to get information that that would be helpful. I think you're OK if it's just in the staff report, right, | 00:58:49 | |
You don't 'cause it, but just to let you know that there's a fiscal impact. | 00:58:55 | |
On the consent item, do you want it? I mean with that being since. | 00:59:02 | |
I guess because you're consolidated fee schedule in your budget might be the only other ones. | 00:59:07 | |
Any budget items in a business item would state that it's for a budget. So you would know to look for fiscal document explains it. | 00:59:12 | |
So if it was just put in there fiscal impact OK, for like contracts and bid awards and and different things like that put a fiscal | 00:59:17 | |
impact for it. | 00:59:22 | |
Could you also for your agenda, talk about how you guys operate your executive meetings and vet these things in those days? | 00:59:29 | |
You're talking about our staff meetings that we have. OK, so. | 00:59:38 | |
What happens with the agenda, I can just go a little bit detail there. So people submit items with our new agenda management | 00:59:44 | |
software. It has saved me many and Tony now Tony, many hours of work of changing and moving things around. So that's great to | 00:59:51 | |
throw that out there a little plug for that. But so staff are asked to put in their agenda items, then that goes through. | 00:59:59 | |
Verbal approval process right now with the city manager and the mayor. | 01:00:08 | |
And then they they put in their staff report or they put in any attachments they might have. But we do discuss it. | 01:00:14 | |
The day before council meeting, which we could probably change that if you guys at some point time decide that you want to put a, | 01:00:21 | |
some kind of a policy in as to when we do things. But we discussed those agenda items, what's going to happen with those agenda | 01:00:28 | |
items so that staff understands what's going on with them. And so we do discuss them during our staff meeting before council | 01:00:35 | |
meeting this Tuesday before the council meeting. | 01:00:41 | |
So, but yeah, no item goes on an agenda without an approval. Well, the reason why I asked you to mention it is because oftentimes | 01:00:49 | |
some of the amendments that come are because you're reviewing it, you're getting ready to post it, and then people find out what | 01:00:56 | |
is needed in order to complete the agenda item, which causes a change or an amendment. | 01:01:03 | |
And that is because those meetings are so close to each other back-to-back. That's what's been a little bit complicated for the | 01:01:10 | |
seven. We could probably do them, you know, the Tuesday before. | 01:01:15 | |
That, but still there's always things that come up that say, hey, we've got a deadline. | 01:01:23 | |
And so it needs to go on this agenda. So you're going to have things that come up. | 01:01:29 | |
The day before a council meeting that says, hey, this has got to go on an agenda. We've had that several times. | 01:01:33 | |
So I mean, this is just the way it runs, it works. I think the point is, is that if that happens, though, we're happy with having | 01:01:41 | |
it wait for the 8 days or 15 days so that the citizens have a right to be there. But sometimes we have deadlines we have to meet. | 01:01:47 | |
And so we can't wait those extra, that extra time. If it's a state deadline or a county deadline and they've just sent it to us, | 01:01:54 | |
then we're going to need to put it on that agenda. | 01:02:00 | |
In order to meet that deadline, so we're not losing out on a contract or funding or. | 01:02:08 | |
Or different things like that that that just. | 01:02:13 | |
Sometimes they're a little slower at getting things to us. | 01:02:17 | |
Sometimes we have developers, I mean, we don't have some of that now on our agenda, but we would have developers need to get your | 01:02:20 | |
red lines back to us, get your, get your correction, wait two weeks. | 01:02:25 | |
Sometimes it costs them money if they wait. | 01:02:31 | |
And so that's, that's another issue. But they would learn our process, right? I mean, they go at our speed, not we go to them. No. | 01:02:34 | |
But like I said, there are some things that there aren't gonna wait. The state's not gonna wait. The county South not gonna wait. | 01:02:41 | |
I yeah. And we don't have as many developers stuff anymore because it goes through the DRC committee Planning Commission. Yeah, | 01:02:48 | |
yeah. The reports they there's they cannot wait those extra two weeks. You're gonna cost the developer money. | 01:02:55 | |
And that's not gonna be be good if we have to wait. | 01:03:02 | |
And there's codes that we have to follow that says code here you have to go to by state law, I think. Yeah, there's some codes we | 01:03:06 | |
have to follow. | 01:03:10 | |
Yes. | 01:03:14 | |
OK, So what would your recommendation be, Pam, if not seven days? | 01:03:15 | |
If we can make it work, you know, I send you guys out the draft on Fridays, so I don't know how I would send you out a draft if we | 01:03:21 | |
posted them on Fridays. | 01:03:26 | |
But that would be up to you guys. But posting on Mondays. | 01:03:32 | |
What would be helpful as well? I mean that's 48 hours before the meeting or more so. | 01:03:38 | |
If we did the Thursday, that Thursday would be a crunch for depending on what's on the agenda. But I mean it is up to you guys | 01:03:45 | |
what you want. | 01:03:50 | |
Where you feel like it's reasonable, that's reasonable to me. We obviously do work sessions for things so that the public can see | 01:03:57 | |
it two weeks before and then we bring it back and we work that process in this year, which I feel like is working really well. | 01:04:04 | |
If we feel as a council we need to continue something, we can always continue it. So we have protocols for making sure that | 01:04:13 | |
there's enough public discussion. But if there's a reasonable timeline, you feel like you wanted it sooner and you wanted to post | 01:04:20 | |
on Mondays and you wanted to not do it 24 hours in advance and you think Thursday's the day. I think whatever you think is | 01:04:27 | |
meaningful because I know agendas are hard and they take time and there's a lot of people that work on them. | 01:04:34 | |
And being someone that has to go through it and see my process and make sure I'm meeting the council's process and then going | 01:04:41 | |
through and making sure we're making legal process. And then your process. It's a it's quite a task actually. And so if you feel | 01:04:46 | |
like there's opportunity. | 01:04:51 | |
I would love you to tell us and if you feel like there's not, I would love to watch the push. I think I mean right now and maybe | 01:04:57 | |
we we work it in slower, but if we made it so that they're posted on Mondays and then we reevaluate it to see what Friday would | 01:05:05 | |
look like for the Wednesday before, I wouldn't go any further than that. Your biggest issue is. | 01:05:13 | |
Just if we're needing to amend anything in the meantime, I think is what you're going to be. You've got holidays and stuff. So | 01:05:23 | |
maybe we need to post a little earlier. It might, you know, go a day later or something around holidays. | 01:05:29 | |
Different things like that, but those are some things we can work work around. | 01:05:35 | |
Yeah. So I just whatever you guys decide you want to do. | 01:05:40 | |
No, it makes sense. It makes sense to me. I. | 01:05:46 | |
To not do it too far ahead, I think that would be equally frustrating. If you did it seven days ahead and then there were three or | 01:05:49 | |
four amendments, right, I think that would be more frustrating than having to wait. If you could do it Monday. I love the draft on | 01:05:54 | |
Friday. I. | 01:05:59 | |
If it's not too stressful, I think Monday would be great. | 01:06:05 | |
And just for, for me, Sarah, if she was going to do it Monday, I would need it Thursday in order to get all of my things met. | 01:06:11 | |
Yeah, we could talk on Thursdays rather than Fridays and then send out the draft Friday. I'd have to do my review again, and then | 01:06:18 | |
we could do it Monday. But. | 01:06:25 | |
Half the people aren't working on Monday, I mean Friday, and they only work until 12. | 01:06:32 | |
But anytime we could do it sooner but. | 01:06:38 | |
Sometimes we take Monday to fix any issues and to have any legal discussions, so we'd have to shift it back. | 01:06:40 | |
I mean, I would love to post even by noon on Mondays if it's at all possible. Yeah, that would be ideal because I can give you an | 01:06:47 | |
example, and I'm not trying to throw anybody under the bus or anything, but this just happened yesterday. We're posting the | 01:06:53 | |
agenda. I look up, we're putting it on the bullet board, and I discover that there's a public hearing notice I didn't know about. | 01:07:00 | |
And so I'm hurrying and just throwing it on and they were continuing it anyway, but I didn't know about it because I'd been on | 01:07:07 | |
vacation. I, I was told I'm not allowed to go on vacation again. So there you go now, you know. But anyway, so it's just an | 01:07:13 | |
example of issues of posting. | 01:07:20 | |
That so late in the day on a Tuesday. | 01:07:27 | |
That's been my stress for. | 01:07:30 | |
11 years well and that is stressful and any way we can make that stress go off, we if we could do it Monday, we would just have to | 01:07:33 | |
work together. | 01:07:36 | |
Yeah, I guess there or anybody just because I interrupted your comment, Sarah, my thing would be I think we should shoot for that | 01:07:40 | |
and then do our best to kind of start building a process to it and then before formalizing anything just to learn how it works. | 01:07:46 | |
Yeah, we'll start doing that with the with the next one and we'll add the fiscal impact on anything that's on consent or if maybe | 01:07:52 | |
it's not clear on a business item. | 01:07:59 | |
One thing that would be helpful because I know that we're going to have last minute change amendments and there's going to be | 01:08:07 | |
circumstances that are unavoidable and I know that'll put us down to that 24 hour mark. | 01:08:12 | |
And. | 01:08:18 | |
Even different with emergency things that qualify as an emergency, but I was wondering if we could just make a policy of a | 01:08:19 | |
standard that emergency last minute items won't be consent, that they will actually have to be something that's itemized. Do you | 01:08:25 | |
want a business item then, so that it's a discussion in action? Yeah. And I think, I think this is an interesting thing because at | 01:08:32 | |
any point you see something on consent that you don't want on there, just pull it off. | 01:08:38 | |
Sometimes we just do administrative things on there because otherwise the agenda can become. | 01:08:45 | |
Complex and it becomes too much of things that this will be like a two second thing that we don't actually need on the business | 01:08:50 | |
item. And so if you see something that looks complex that we missed that should have gone on business, my recommendation would | 01:08:56 | |
just be to pull it off because administratively this is just to conduct proper timing on the agenda. Yeah and and the the other | 01:09:02 | |
thing is is that almost. | 01:09:08 | |
Almost anything can go on consent, like the mayor said, and you can pull it off and talk about it. So that's something to to just | 01:09:15 | |
think about because what we're doing and the reason we're putting them on consent is so that you really only have to to do 1 | 01:09:21 | |
motion on things you don't really. | 01:09:26 | |
We feel it doesn't need discussion. | 01:09:32 | |
And so, but if you see something in there, like Mayor said, then just you can pull it off. A consent. I don't think that's an | 01:09:35 | |
issue at all. Maybe it's more of a training issue because I think that as a new council member, it was a little bit overwhelming | 01:09:41 | |
to see the consent items and feel kind of this pressure, like, okay, everyone just voted for it. I better say aye. But if it's a | 01:09:47 | |
last minute item. | 01:09:53 | |
24 hours and I I go over the agenda all weekend and then Tuesday night it gets posted and be it I'm with family Tuesday night and | 01:10:30 | |
Wednesday I'm at work all day and I'm like frantically trying to prepare for council and I and I come prepared I make sure of it | 01:10:37 | |
but it's it would be nice to shoot for that Monday and then to avoid putting last minute consent items on whenever possible yeah | 01:10:45 | |
and I would say this too well maybe we can do for policy internally is. | 01:10:52 | |
Say if something was put on, I mean, the goal is always that Eric is reaching out and saying, hey, we added these things, but we | 01:11:00 | |
could say, hey, these things were added if you need to pull them off, you know, yeah. So, so back to, to, to Jake's point on some | 01:11:07 | |
of that, then would you like it to say that it's, it must have a type of a deadline with it that we're putting it on last minute? | 01:11:14 | |
Or just have a reasoning yet, or even feel like we know how to do that right now. I think we'd have to go back and try to figure | 01:11:22 | |
out the timing of the dates and figure out how to start even moving things back for review. | 01:11:28 | |
Yeah. But if there is anything, we can always pull it off and discuss it and we can always come up with better policy to discuss | 01:11:35 | |
it, you know? | 01:11:39 | |
Yeah. And and like you had mentioned earlier, we, we did bring back the work sessions so that the items, but, but this way the | 01:11:44 | |
items these are, these are the initial introduction to the items or the work session. So a lot of times when they come back as a | 01:11:50 | |
business item or as a consent item, you've already had at least one discussion on it. Because I know with the some of the code | 01:11:55 | |
changes you had a couple different discussions and some individual discussions with the some of the stuff that you guys had worked | 01:12:01 | |
on. | 01:12:07 | |
For some code changes so I mean if you don't feel like it's ready, then we put it back on as another work session as well so and | 01:12:13 | |
that's just you guys giving direction to staff and letting us know that we're. | 01:12:19 | |
Yeah, We have so many opportunities as a council to pull it off, continue it, discuss it further. So I feel like it's manageable | 01:12:26 | |
inside of them. | 01:12:30 | |
OK. | 01:12:35 | |
Thank you, Pam. I just I just I just want to say that if it's not a hard and fast rule and it's just like, oh, we tried. I mean, | 01:12:37 | |
I'm thinking back of the angry. | 01:12:42 | |
Months of the fall and it's like, if it's just, oh, we're going to try, but then everyone has the power to just add it on and say | 01:12:47 | |
OOP, it's a last minute thing. There's not a hard and fast policy and I think that. | 01:12:54 | |
I just don't want I don't feel like we have to have a culture of, oh, it has to be done. There's there's no way in waiting 7 or 14 | 01:13:01 | |
days to just get it right. And I think it's not me and you read the I. | 01:13:08 | |
Or the Council reading the. | 01:13:15 | |
Approve or consent items. | 01:13:19 | |
It's the citizens reading and understanding. I mean, we might have a conversation about. | 01:13:21 | |
You know, anything that's controversial, but if it's not understood clearly in the consent item and there's not a dollar amount, | 01:13:29 | |
citizens will never know and it'll look bad. And that's why I just want to make sure that that's something else that maybe we, we | 01:13:36 | |
talk about a little bit. Is, is when is a staff report required expected? | 01:13:42 | |
Maybe is a better way to say it because we've we just kind of started using staff reports probably in 20. It's been a while | 01:13:49 | |
obviously, but they weren't using them when I first started. Rarely did we have a full staff report. I know Nathan Crane would do | 01:13:55 | |
one because he came from. | 01:14:01 | |
You know a different area. And so, and I feel like the policy is good to talk about where, where we decided. But I think the other | 01:14:08 | |
thing is if somebody sees something on consent, they do have the 24 hours. So if they see it and they have a question about it, | 01:14:15 | |
they can tell their representative and the representative can pull it off. So, so I I feel and this is. | 01:14:22 | |
Pam's opinion is that we have a staff report for everything except for our the minutes those are. | 01:14:29 | |
Self-explanatory I think. | 01:14:37 | |
So but I just want kind of wanted your feedback on that as to. | 01:14:39 | |
I mean, I would like to see a staff report. It gives Tony and I more information about what is this agenda item. And if now you're | 01:14:44 | |
wanting us to include that it's got a fiscal impact in that title. We need to make sure that that's included. Because if, if the | 01:14:50 | |
person putting the agenda item on doesn't put that on, then we we need to do a little deeper dive and make sure we include it for | 01:14:56 | |
you guys, for everybody in general, for, for publishing and noticing the agenda. My recommendation would be that you take this | 01:15:02 | |
back to staff. | 01:15:08 | |
Meeting and that you guys kind of go through this and review it and say how can we feed these things into it as we start building | 01:15:14 | |
the new agenda? No, I like it. Yep. I want to give some feedback because you're saying staff report, do the staff members write an | 01:15:20 | |
e-mail weekly or biweekly to Eric right now? | 01:15:25 | |
Umm, I'm not sure exactly what he's doing. I know he's trying to send you guys out of is it a weekly Tony? | 01:15:32 | |
Tony, I'll have a little more insight on that. So Eric should be we are going to start playing together. Weekly reports from the | 01:15:39 | |
department heads to air. | 01:15:43 | |
There are there are reports from the department heads to Eric and then a summarization of the past weeks work that Eric has been | 01:15:48 | |
doing to the council. | 01:15:53 | |
Right. I would just give some feedback in that that is such a high level report that it doesn't give anything. And if if council | 01:16:00 | |
members or the mayor is getting one, wouldn't we give the opportunity to get that report as well? | 01:16:05 | |
I think we're talking about two different types of reports, right? I think the report that Eric's compiling to send you guys is | 01:16:12 | |
just an overall overview of what each department's doing. The staff reports that I'm talking about actually go with the item | 01:16:17 | |
that's on the agenda. | 01:16:23 | |
So I'm talking about clarifying the item like if the mayor is getting a staff report from the department heads to then Eric, I | 01:16:29 | |
think it's going to all of the council. I'm not getting any of them. | 01:16:36 | |
So I only get Eric's synopsis of like that's what she said. They send it to Eric, Eric does a synopsis of it and then sends it. | 01:16:43 | |
Can I be copied on all staff reports? I'm going to clarify it and then I'm going to end the certified item and move on. But here's | 01:16:51 | |
what she's saying. Staff reports, the recommendations are attached to your agenda. Everybody gets them in the agenda. | 01:16:58 | |
Additionally, there's a report that goes out from Eric. That's the synopsis that you're copied in on. So you receive all reports. | 01:17:05 | |
The same as the whole council, we all receive reports simultaneously. Thank you, we appreciate you. Right. And for point of | 01:17:13 | |
clarification, is there any, could we vote to get this direct report instead of the brief synopsis from the department heads? | 01:17:19 | |
Because we can get those right? We can't make any vote tonight, but you do get the direct report in your packet. That's what | 01:17:24 | |
they're discussing. If you were wanting a different report, we'd have to. | 01:17:30 | |
Weekly report that they submit to Eric instead of getting the aggregate. | 01:17:39 | |
I would like the council on this particular issue to by statute have that included. So if we don't want the high version of Eric | 01:17:44 | |
that we get the very lengthy from the department head. So Jamie, I'll give you you can go ahead and talk in a minute. We would I | 01:17:52 | |
think we would have to ask Eric how he wanted to designate that time and if he wanted them to write reports, we would have to have | 01:17:59 | |
that discussion at a different time. No, we're not. We're not we're not talking about Eric's writing the. | 01:18:06 | |
Well, I understand apartment heads that are already writing it just to copy us on it so that if we read Eric's report. | 01:18:14 | |
And we say, hey, well, let's get into the details of it. We can also know because you're getting that, right, No. | 01:18:23 | |
I am not getting that. What I'm saying is we get the same reports in the packet. | 01:18:29 | |
And in his synopsis, all of us get the same reports and that is all. But if you do want to have a future conversation about it | 01:18:35 | |
where we ask for additional reports, we could have that, but we can't tonight. So we're not going to do that tonight. Please, | 01:18:39 | |
Jamie, next agenda item. | 01:18:44 | |
OK, this is a bit of A tag team presentation with Jenna Hearn. | 01:18:50 | |
The communications director, So what we wanted to do is give you kind of a brief orientation as to the law as it relates to social | 01:18:55 | |
media comments and social media posts made by the city, and then Jenna will get into some of the details of the policy. | 01:19:04 | |
So there, by way of background, there are a number of different social media platforms. Each of them have their own. | 01:19:14 | |
Different rules for. | 01:19:22 | |
How you post, how you comment, how you moderate comments, whether you have to. On some platforms, you have to block people | 01:19:25 | |
outright. There's no option for. | 01:19:30 | |
Removing or moderating posts. Others do allow a little bit more detail on how you moderate and work through things, so there is a | 01:19:35 | |
little bit of a difficulty applying the law to some of the specific platforms, but I'll walk through. | 01:19:42 | |
In a nutshell, how that works, there are two primary concerns when we look at social media. The 1st is any of the city, any use by | 01:19:50 | |
the city of social media or by city officials of social media when they're when you are acting in your official capacity. | 01:19:59 | |
Are public, so comments are visible. Comments are accessible by search engines, and they're classified as public records under | 01:20:09 | |
state law if there were a request for that information. | 01:20:14 | |
The First Amendment also comes to bear Commenters on social media posts have First Amendment rights. | 01:20:20 | |
Which means the city can restrict certain types of comments, but you can only do them according to legitimate time, place, and | 01:20:27 | |
manner restrictions. So things like offensive comments they may remain if they are legally protected speech. | 01:20:36 | |
These are the categories of things that are allowed by law to be removed. So if you have a discriminatory comment, a comment about | 01:20:45 | |
somebody'd race, somebody'd marital status, somebody'd sexual orientation, their religion. | 01:20:52 | |
You can remove those types of comments. | 01:21:00 | |
Slander or defamation if you have a threatening, harassing or profane comment. A sexual comment. | 01:21:03 | |
And then as you go down through the list, there are a number of other things for which you can moderate. | 01:21:09 | |
Or remove a comment. Essentially hear what you're trying to do is keep people from harm. | 01:21:16 | |
Or keep. But what you cannot do is remove a comment based on its content. What if you're if you have a position on something that | 01:21:23 | |
is A and somebody comments and says I like B, you can't remove those comments that say they prefer the other. | 01:21:31 | |
We. | 01:21:41 | |
I'll skip that one because we'll get into it a little bit, but that's that's the basic framework for comments by way of | 01:21:43 | |
background. | 01:21:46 | |
The city used to allow comments on its social media posts. | 01:21:50 | |
And then with. | 01:21:55 | |
More and more social media use and more and more controversial issues, there begin to be posts that were, I thought, within the | 01:21:58 | |
category of being threatening, harassing or profane. | 01:22:04 | |
And the city did not have in place a policy for dealing with those types of comments. And so your options were a little bit more | 01:22:11 | |
binary. It was either you allow comments or you disallow comments. But if you don't have a policy. | 01:22:17 | |
You can't remove them without. | 01:22:24 | |
Inviting a First Amendment lawsuit, and we've seen in just this last Supreme Court calendar 2 cases that related to Section 1983 | 01:22:27 | |
claims against cities and public entities. | 01:22:33 | |
For social media use. So what we have now done is taken some time to go through and prepare a policy and Jenna and her office have | 01:22:40 | |
done quite a bit of work to put that together. The policy will allow for removal of comments based on these criteria that are up | 01:22:47 | |
on the board. And then the other thing the policy allows that I think is really healthy and important is that if a comment is | 01:22:55 | |
removed, hidden, muted, depending on what the platform is, there would be. | 01:23:02 | |
Appeal process where the person who had their comment removed could come to the city and say I think you interpret it incorrectly | 01:23:10 | |
and it should remain. | 01:23:14 | |
And then the communications director can remove that or can review that appeal and then make a decision on it. | 01:23:20 | |
So I'm going to step aside and yield to Jenna to talk a little bit about how she'll her office will go about implementing this and | 01:23:28 | |
then I'll be available as a resource if you have questions. | 01:23:33 | |
Yeah. Thanks, Jamie. So like we said in the past comments used to be allowed and without that policy in place, it is hard to | 01:23:39 | |
handle those situations that come about that are violations of. | 01:23:46 | |
Those non protected areas. So in going forward with this policy with our new digital media specialist, we have that staff power to | 01:23:54 | |
dedicate more time to addressing these comments. And we think it's a great option, like social media is a great option for | 01:24:01 | |
residents to be able to interact with staff, interact with the city, get questions answered. | 01:24:07 | |
Be able to voice concerns, give feedback. Of course we want it to be a healthy interaction and like we can't control all the | 01:24:15 | |
negativity out there and we recognize that. | 01:24:21 | |
There was there going to be angry posts, There's going to be some negativity that we see as such based on looking at other cities, | 01:24:28 | |
other state departments, they don't. | 01:24:34 | |
Respond to every single comment. So that's not something that we would plan to do just as a city like we don't have the resources | 01:24:43 | |
to. | 01:24:46 | |
Go in depth every single time anybody brings up anything. I mean, of course we're going to do our best to respond to valid | 01:24:51 | |
concerns and questions and feedback, but yeah, we don't have the staff power to really. | 01:24:57 | |
Respond to every single question. And we want to keep comments open so that people can interact with each other as well. And as | 01:25:04 | |
part of our policy, we're making it clear that this comment section is not meant to be a replacement for emergency reporting or | 01:25:11 | |
report a concern or safety concerns. So we'll make it clear that there's appropriate channels to go through to report those | 01:25:17 | |
concerns or get help for that and that the social media is meant to be an interactive. | 01:25:24 | |
Place where people can, you know, interact with each other, interact with the city and get answers to their questions. | 01:25:32 | |
Right now, based on our estimates, about 20% of residents follow the social media channels, so. | 01:25:39 | |
We think it's going to be a really helpful thing that they can find answers to questions straight from the city and be able to | 01:25:45 | |
interact with each other as well. | 01:25:49 | |
We'll be creating templates for certain common questions, like if people try to report concerns via comments, templates that we | 01:25:54 | |
can respond to make that process a lot easier and less time intensive on staff and that we get that kind of a cohesive. | 01:26:03 | |
Response going so that people get the same the same level of. | 01:26:13 | |
Response when they have those questions. | 01:26:18 | |
I I just want to add in the reason why Jenna is saying this is there's a lot of frustration as we've been working on this policy | 01:26:21 | |
about. | 01:26:26 | |
What it means to report a concern or to. | 01:26:31 | |
Their comments not being answered. | 01:26:35 | |
And there's a lot of feedback that the Council and others give about how these questions aren't addressed and the issue is that | 01:26:37 | |
there is not enough. | 01:26:42 | |
Umm, resources or people to actually follow and look through comments and find out? | 01:26:48 | |
How to respond to those questions, That's why going through the podium channel or the report of concern, you can see that instant | 01:26:58 | |
feedback. And sometimes that's really upsetting to residents when they're like, you haven't responded for three weeks and that's | 01:27:04 | |
not the point. The place to make that dialogue, and that's a big reason why people want this open, is so that they can report | 01:27:10 | |
their concern or put something inside of there or ask for help. | 01:27:16 | |
Inside several threads of questions, and it can be very complex because what Jenna is stating really clearly is that's not. | 01:27:23 | |
We're not an emergency service like this isn't report a concern. This is meant to be community engagement and helping people get | 01:28:01 | |
answers to questions about the events that we're talking about or the programs that are going on. But that real concerns do need | 01:28:06 | |
to be channeled through the appropriate resources. So. | 01:28:11 | |
Well, and I guess when we talk about that there. | 01:28:18 | |
This was a plan from when this was put in. The policy to make it an information site was to give everybody at the opportunity to | 01:28:21 | |
obtain this information and to do the things that Jamie was articulating, and then this plan was being built. But as you think | 01:28:28 | |
about why you would open it back up, if you're just considering this to be a place where people gather information, if you're | 01:28:35 | |
thinking this is a place where people go and they get the answers to all of these other things, it will be a confusing. | 01:28:42 | |
Platform because there's not the resources or ability to do any of those things on this well and I could see a concern | 01:28:50 | |
specifically. | 01:28:54 | |
Just from the history of the current Council, sometimes I think. | 01:28:59 | |
When this does get opened up or however we push forward. | 01:29:03 | |
Sometimes the council will have opinions on how it needs to be answered and they think there needs to be a clear policy that this | 01:29:08 | |
is in the purview of our social media director. And if there's something of great concern then it could be brought to the | 01:29:14 | |
director. But I think we would want to make sure that as a council we understand we can't micromanage that. | 01:29:20 | |
There's there's a really important legal issue. | 01:29:27 | |
Related to what Councilwoman Cifuentes just mentioned, and I didn't put it on my presentation, but you do need to be. | 01:29:30 | |
Thinking about it. | 01:29:37 | |
Anytime that you have a quorum of the council gathered, it is a quote meeting. | 01:29:39 | |
And it has to be properly noticed and there's an interpretation of the Open and Public Meetings Act that. | 01:29:45 | |
If you all are on the same thread commenting that it would be a quote meeting and so my strong advice on city social media posts | 01:29:52 | |
would be that members of the council limit. | 01:29:59 | |
Their interaction on those if you do decide to open comments up and. | 01:30:07 | |
I should also note, and I didn't say this at the beginning of the presentation, we have a draft policy. Nothing is set in stone | 01:30:12 | |
yet. What we wanted to do is take it to you and broad strokes today to get your feedback on it and then we'll refine it, circulate | 01:30:19 | |
it. You can review it and and then consider it fully. But you're not obligated to turn comments on on social media. You can choose | 01:30:27 | |
to continue to use social media as just a way to push information out. | 01:30:34 | |
But not a forum. | 01:30:42 | |
Public forum in the sense the 1st Amendment uses that word. | 01:30:44 | |
If once you open it up, it does become a public forum, it's a limited public forum. You can put time, place, and manner | 01:30:49 | |
restrictions on it, but not many. I mean it really. It really essentially is this list. | 01:30:55 | |
And so there will be situations where each of you may want to weigh in on comments or talk on the same thread to those comments | 01:31:02 | |
and you're going to be restricted a little bit just because of the Open and Public Meetings Act. | 01:31:09 | |
So I have a question, if that's the case and there's something we want to respond to, can we just reach out and say direct message | 01:31:17 | |
me and not have a conversation on the same thread? Yeah, you can certainly do that. You can reach out to your constituents, you | 01:31:22 | |
know, through that platform, you can reach out to them. | 01:31:28 | |
By e-mail, text, whatever is convenient. It just can't be. | 01:31:35 | |
Conversation including three or more of you on the same thread. And there can be. | 01:31:39 | |
A little bit of tension among councils in that context, because if Sarah reads it first and comments. | 01:31:46 | |
And then Marty reads it second in comments. Then the rest of you are left out of the conversation. | 01:31:53 | |
OK. Any questions? If not, send your thoughts to these two and we can start having a further discussion on it. | 01:32:02 | |
Does that mean all comments would be turned on Instagram, Facebook and every account that we have? Well, there Twitter, there's a | 01:32:12 | |
you can make a few different choices here. You could elect to continue to keep comments off. | 01:32:18 | |
You could turn them on for certain posts and not others. | 01:32:25 | |
So the city may wish to put something out that would say we have an event this Thursday night, you know, please come. | 01:32:30 | |
And you may not want comments on that thing and you may have another one that would be. | 01:32:36 | |
We're doing a planning study on this area and we would like your feedback where you then would invite feedback and you could use | 01:32:41 | |
the social media tool as a way to gather that. | 01:32:46 | |
Not all platforms let you turn some comments on some comments off, and so it gets a little tricky because it becomes binary. | 01:32:52 | |
Within how those systems work and so. | 01:33:01 | |
You could also have a discussion, and Jenna will know this better than I do, about how the different platforms work and whether | 01:33:05 | |
you wanted to have it open. Comments across the board, comments on, you know, limited items, but not every item. But the moment | 01:33:11 | |
you open comments on an item, you have to leave them open on that item and you can only. | 01:33:18 | |
Call or restrict those comments that fall into those really strict categories that I had up on the screen. | 01:33:26 | |
Great. Thank you. | 01:33:36 | |
All right, Jamie, you're up again. | 01:33:38 | |
For the Finance Committee. | 01:33:40 | |
I'm going to slide into this seat because. | 01:33:44 | |
This is really Councilmember holdaways item. | 01:33:47 | |
But I'll give a little bit of background on it. | 01:33:50 | |
There have been questions during the budget discussions of. | 01:33:54 | |
What are the right ways for council members and for residents to engage in? | 01:33:59 | |
Financial decisions of the city. | 01:34:05 | |
And so a piece of advice that I have given. | 01:34:07 | |
Council member Holdaway and other members of the City Council is that some cities form. | 01:34:12 | |
Finance Committee. | 01:34:17 | |
And the Finance Committee typically is formed by a few council members and then. | 01:34:19 | |
Those members of staff that have. | 01:34:26 | |
Areas of responsibility related to finance, it could be budget responsibilities, it could be treasurer responsibilities, it could | 01:34:30 | |
be audit responsibilities, but anything in kind of that grouping in that category. | 01:34:36 | |
Could attend those meetings. | 01:34:43 | |
They because it's not a quorum of the council, they wouldn't meet publicly. But what it would do is provide a structure where in a | 01:34:45 | |
few different council members could dive a little bit deeper into that topic and then anytime you had. | 01:34:52 | |
A discussion as a council on a financial topic, you could look to those council members as more expert than they would be if they | 01:35:00 | |
just had brought responsibilities across the council and so. | 01:35:06 | |
Council Member Holdaway asked to have this be placed on the agenda for discussion. The Mayor acquiesced and put it on the agenda | 01:35:13 | |
today as an option. | 01:35:18 | |
I have done a little bit of work just to review how a few different cities use finance committees. | 01:35:23 | |
It's just based on the experience of the lawyers in my firm in the different cities that we represent. | 01:35:30 | |
They're the only city we could find in the state that had a formally established Finance Committee that had code sections and the | 01:35:35 | |
like was Salt Lake City. That's in a really different government structure, and they actually had a Finance Committee for their | 01:35:41 | |
RDA, their council and their. | 01:35:46 | |
City administration. | 01:35:53 | |
And it was really different than I think what you'd be, what you'd be talking about, but. | 01:35:55 | |
Essentially, by my experience, most cities have to function with a few different council members and then staff as needed. They | 01:36:01 | |
don't name anybody other than the council members to the committee and the the committee members under Vineyard code would be | 01:36:08 | |
appointed by the mayor and then work in that capacity as their their council assignments. | 01:36:15 | |
Well, I'll add just for context, typically what we've done is I usually appoint someone to finance or I hold the seat myself and | 01:36:23 | |
then invite rotating council members to have discussions with our executive staff and our finance team. And then all council goes | 01:36:31 | |
through the budgeting process and has their individual meetings through that section. So because we had a lot of. | 01:36:39 | |
Questions in detail. This year we had a lot of group discussion and then individual discussions and then. | 01:36:48 | |
We held a lot of open discussions for people that wanted to bring in people they were working with, but. | 01:36:55 | |
Following that line, we can definitely move forward and even assign one or two people as we go forward. And the way that we've | 01:37:01 | |
processed it in the past is quarterly meetings. | 01:37:07 | |
That's typical. And then just any insights or any meetings that they have questions and then we would still remain the Council | 01:37:13 | |
through that same budget process. | 01:37:17 | |
Jake, did you have anything to add or anything that you wanted to clarify? I just can't believe how, like I'm just really | 01:37:29 | |
disappointed in the spirit of it. | 01:37:33 | |
Umm, you know, we have a very long history and I wish Eric were here. | 01:37:39 | |
To defend himself, but we've gone back and forth in emails. | 01:37:44 | |
You know, as I called the state auditor today, I called a lot of different cities. | 01:37:48 | |
And I have had to help him understand. | 01:37:55 | |
My city manager wants to deny meetings and I now have been corrected that he can deny meetings under his authority. | 01:37:58 | |
It's just disappointing. | 01:38:09 | |
You can have two different sides of stories. | 01:38:13 | |
Of I think this happened. | 01:38:17 | |
And there's a long history there. I even called, you know, previous late Commission members of How do I Deal better with Eric? | 01:38:21 | |
And the first thing that the first thing that came up was. | 01:38:30 | |
He does have a right, but the council has the ability to put in different policies or ordinances that maybe we might not be able | 01:38:37 | |
to force him, but we have the ability to do open working sessions. | 01:38:43 | |
Knowing the history and I don't want to belabor the point of all the instances. | 01:38:51 | |
But there are many and I think everyone knows for the vast majority where whether it be the Ledger. | 01:38:57 | |
Or or different issues. | 01:39:04 | |
There's a different story and having a witness and. | 01:39:08 | |
An advisor and I would quite frankly say that the vast majority of things, and I understand that I'm more of the whistleblower | 01:39:14 | |
role or the one that picks it thinks not to be negative, but to try to improve. I try to come with an eye of, hey, what is this? | 01:39:21 | |
Whether it be, you know, concert tickets or different things that come to light that are ugly. | 01:39:29 | |
Umm, you know they, I know they are accusatory of staff or things, but. | 01:39:37 | |
To go in all by yourself. | 01:39:43 | |
Is not good government are you not being accommodated with this discussion being provided an Ave. to start set up a committee that | 01:39:46 | |
you could be on and do these things. Yeah. So reading through the e-mail the mayor would pick her own committee. She would pick | 01:39:52 | |
the people. It would be the finance director, it would be Eric and it would in his words and I'm reading it straightforward. I | 01:39:58 | |
would not advise or recommend that that a city that a citizen be on that. So that's not what we're talking about we're talking | 01:40:04 | |
about the ability. | 01:40:10 | |
For me to have somebody there as a witness so that false accusations don't come up. | 01:40:16 | |
And I don't want to go through because we've gone through close happen countless times, right? We're I don't want to go through | 01:40:21 | |
closed door meetings of things that have happened in our city where there are questions of what did or did not happen. And as a | 01:40:26 | |
council member with. | 01:40:31 | |
False accusations that have come up before in the past where investigations have had to happen, closed door meetings have had to | 01:40:37 | |
happen and people's integrity have been questioned. I would be foolish to put myself in a one-on-one situation without an advisor | 01:40:45 | |
or somebody there. No, I'm saying there's two different stories. No, he's not here. | 01:40:53 | |
Actually, we have talked about it in open and we have shown that there have been multiple witnesses in the room. | 01:41:02 | |
And that they have disagreed with you and you have, you have been told that Eric has met with the people that you were talking | 01:41:09 | |
about and then said we can't continue to expend resources on this committee, right. And it wasn't that it wasn't. He had very | 01:41:17 | |
specific reasons for it and it followed exactly what he needed to do. He was open about it. He talked about it here. | 01:41:26 | |
And to come out and act like he wasn't trying, especially when you just randomly bring up things. | 01:41:34 | |
Like the Ledger or that you're a whistleblower. Nobody has been doing any activity that is illegal. Nobody has been trying to cut | 01:41:41 | |
you out of meetings. And even now when you brought up the Finance Committee, we're saying this is how we've done it. This would be | 01:41:47 | |
a great and appropriate way to do it. And if this isn't and I'm still talking, you can wait. You can wait your turn. This isn't a | 01:41:53 | |
word salad. This is stop. Stop and take your turn. | 01:41:59 | |
This isn't a word salad. This Is Us disagreeing with you, or me and Amber speaking disagreeing with you. | 01:42:05 | |
A word salad. This is not a word salad. You're saying and the Ledger and then you don't talk about the Ledger or what was | 01:42:12 | |
discussed or how you asked. I'm still talking and then you can talk. You can talk when I'm done. You, you are not just saying that | 01:42:18 | |
there was a disagreement. You are making an accusation. You are stating that you are a whistleblower. You are stating that you're | 01:42:24 | |
creating transparency while other people are accusing him of doing something illegal and that there are investigations. You are | 01:42:30 | |
alluding to things. | 01:42:36 | |
That is inappropriate for this discussion. If you want to tell us that you want an advisor and that you want to expand this beyond | 01:42:42 | |
an executive meeting, that would be appropriate. | 01:42:46 | |
Go ahead and take your turn. Do you mind do can I openly talk about the issues and problems or do we have to go into a closed door | 01:42:52 | |
session? Because I would love to name names right now. | 01:42:56 | |
I don't have any context for. | 01:43:02 | |
If we need to go into the history of what's gone on, I think I'd like to go into a closed session. | 01:43:04 | |
I'd like to add that. | 01:43:10 | |
For character someone, no. I would like to be able to openly talk about the instances. | 01:43:12 | |
Because they're known. If if you wish to talk about the character, competence or performance of an individual, then yes, a closed | 01:43:18 | |
session is the place for that. | 01:43:23 | |
If what I. | 01:43:28 | |
I'm struggling to follow. | 01:43:31 | |
No, someone would be so foolish knowing just a minute. | 01:43:33 | |
I I'm struggling to follow the how the conversations going to kind of personalization like it doesn't hang on, it's still not done | 01:43:37 | |
there there is. | 01:43:43 | |
The question that was put to me is. | 01:43:48 | |
What are ways that other cities engage in the finance of the city, the budget process, audit processes, bigger decisions that | 01:43:51 | |
might require financial tools or debt to fund? And one of my answers to you was that many cities, most cities have a formal | 01:44:01 | |
Finance Committee that has a few council members on it and then those council members. | 01:44:11 | |
Get to do a deeper dive and focus their time on that. And councils will have other assignments for other topics. And by dividing | 01:44:22 | |
them up and and diving deeper as a council, you then have council members that can develop some expertise so that when you have a | 01:44:29 | |
question about the budget or finances or expenditures, you don't always just have to go to your city manager. You also could turn | 01:44:36 | |
to the council members that are on the Finance Committee. | 01:44:43 | |
So that was the basis of my recommendation was. | 01:44:51 | |
If you want as a city to have. | 01:44:54 | |
Multiple layers of expertise and multiple eyes on things that a Finance Committee is a good way to accomplish that. | 01:44:58 | |
No, we're dealing more with trust issues and the ability to have an open dialogue and understand what did or did not happen in | 01:45:07 | |
meetings. | 01:45:11 | |
And I don't mind openly talking about it, but I don't want to say, hey, you're not allowed to talk about this. | 01:45:17 | |
So I mean, just with the Ledger, right, We went back and forth for two months of is Jaker? Eric asked using the word Ledger. | 01:45:23 | |
In these meetings and you go, if it was recorded or someone was there, they would know. And that's good for both sides, right? I | 01:45:31 | |
think I'm being very generous where I'm not saying who was right or wasn't, but as a council putting in putting forth a policy to | 01:45:38 | |
say Jake is not going, Eric is now and he apparently under his authority now has the ability to deny meetings if there is a | 01:45:46 | |
witness or an advisor present. And that is just unacceptable. See, you added that. | 01:45:53 | |
Thing at the end that made it seem like that was the reason why he did it. You wanted to have a meeting, you called it on the same | 01:46:01 | |
day at 3:00 in order to create actions by a committee that isn't deputized, wasn't brought on by the council. | 01:46:09 | |
It was about wanting to hold it the same day. I read through the evening. It wasn't the same day. The budget committee was months. | 01:46:19 | |
It was like weeks later. No, you met several times with this specific meeting that he was talking about not holding was scheduled | 01:46:25 | |
and planned for, and then you ended up holding it somebody's house at 5:00 at night. | 01:46:31 | |
No, no, that was not Eric. Eric denied that meeting. That's what I'm talking about. Because it was a short term schedule, wasn't a | 01:46:37 | |
meeting. He's denying all meetings moving forward. Mayor, he does not want to meet. He sent an e-mail out to me and said he will | 01:46:43 | |
not meet unless I'm all by myself. That's unacceptable. | 01:46:49 | |
That's not true. That's not true. That is, do we want anyone to raise their hands about what he's been going back on for? Listen, | 01:46:55 | |
no. I mean, I was copied on some of these emails. And I think if you're going to quote what his intentions are, I think you should | 01:47:01 | |
read the whole thing if you're going to, if he's not here to speak for himself and if you're going to summarize, well, I'm glad to | 01:47:07 | |
hear it that he will be willing to meet with somebody else in the room because. | 01:47:12 | |
It's, I think that you, it's not that he's not, it's not that he's not willing to meet with somebody else in the room. He's saying | 01:47:19 | |
that he wants, I don't even want a hyper. I don't want to summarize his e-mail because I felt the way he worded it was very fair | 01:47:26 | |
and explained why he was denying it, but he's. | 01:47:33 | |
He's denying, he says that. I just don't think it's fair. I don't read the e-mail. Read the e-mail publicly if you want to. Jacob. | 01:47:40 | |
I feel bad that we don't want to meet often. I meet with the other council members and mayor at least every other weekly. These | 01:47:46 | |
are productive one-on-one meetings in which council members, the city manager and the city mayor can work together to discuss | 01:47:52 | |
issues facing the city in a collaborative manner. Having these meetings help council members to be better representatives of those | 01:47:58 | |
Vineyard. | 01:48:04 | |
Who elect them to that position? It allows you to be informed. Oh sorry, I'm reading the wrong e-mail, sorry. | 01:48:11 | |
Let me grab it. | 01:48:18 | |
Jake, please review my most recent communication. I did not accept your request to continue group meetings. Rather, I encourage | 01:48:25 | |
you to accept the offer to meet regularly with the Mayor and me. I also encourage you to take to take the content of those | 01:48:31 | |
one-on-one meetings back to your constituents and advisors. | 01:48:37 | |
So yeah, he has. And we stopped reading, though you stopped read the whole thing because he talked about making sure that at the | 01:48:44 | |
end of the meeting that you two could discuss what the what the tape was from the meeting. Hold on, let me finish. You guys would | 01:48:50 | |
discuss at the end of the meeting. This is what we talked about. This is where we stand. This is what we agree upon. This is what | 01:48:55 | |
will be reported to anyone and everyone that wants. | 01:49:01 | |
But that was in the e-mail. You've read that e-mail. No, I'll keep reading. It doesn't say that, It says. | 01:49:08 | |
Why would I have that e-mail and you wouldn't? | 01:49:14 | |
As if well, point of order, we're going to go back to this discussion. We we see that. I'm excited to hear that he's going to | 01:49:17 | |
allow somebody in the meeting. No, I'm happy to go. That's not what I said. That's not at all what I said. Yeah, it's. | 01:49:24 | |
Point of order, you guys, many of the things actually, Marty, finish what you're saying and then we're going to go back to this | 01:49:31 | |
discussion in that e-mail. I'm not sure if it's that exact one, but it's in that thread. He said that he really wants to meet with | 01:49:37 | |
you more regularly and he understands your concern of the he said he said thing. But what he said that at the end of the meeting | 01:49:43 | |
with you and him and potentially the mayor, you would be able to sit down and say these are the points we talked about. These are | 01:49:49 | |
what we. | 01:49:55 | |
On like a record of the meeting so that there is no confusion on oh Jake said this or Jake didn't say this because you both would | 01:50:01 | |
agree on how hold on Jake meeting would be reported on. So for me what I'm saying is I see intent here. | 01:50:08 | |
He doesn't want there to be this conflict with you. He understands your distrust of him and he's trying to find solutions. And I | 01:50:16 | |
think it's healthy for a city manager or any employee within any kind of city or corporation to have boundaries on how they're | 01:50:23 | |
able to conduct conduct their position and their job. So, So hold on one second. Now the reason no hold on Jake, Jake, hold on | 01:50:31 | |
Jake, hold on one second. So Marty's point to you is that there's an. | 01:50:38 | |
Opportunity to have a discussion because you shared your point and then she responded and the point of the reason why I let it go | 01:50:46 | |
on is because. | 01:50:51 | |
This allows us to decide if this is the way we want to hold. | 01:50:57 | |
The Finance Committee or if we want to formalize it in policy, we now know how it's been happening. Jamie talked about how other | 01:51:02 | |
cities do it and how we could do it. If you would like to offer a suggestion about doing it a different way, please present it to | 01:51:07 | |
the council. Council, then you can discuss. That is the conversation we're having. We're not going back to the the other | 01:51:13 | |
discussion. That is irrelevant to this. We have to keep business moving forward. | 01:51:18 | |
We already understand that you feel there's disagreement. We recognize it. We understand. | 01:51:26 | |
You feel that there's a story going on that you're not having representation. So if you want representation, no, it's not that. | 01:51:32 | |
Again, like when when we meet and there are key differences and we bring in a few witnesses and immediately they recognize that | 01:51:40 | |
what he is saying isn't true. It's awesome to have somebody there. I'm excited to have people come up that were in the meeting. | 01:51:47 | |
Jake, we all, we, I can't speak for everybody. | 01:51:54 | |
In the meeting, I just listen. | 01:52:02 | |
I don't believe this is important to continue to rehash because we under important is to have a witness there. That's what we're | 01:52:04 | |
fighting for. No then that fighting, hey, can we have somebody there's fighting nobody but you, nobody else is fighting Jake. | 01:52:11 | |
Jake, then I guess your recommendation, I'm hearing it that you guys are open to it because I've been preparing the last two days. | 01:52:17 | |
Nobody has said it, but we are understanding that you're asking. | 01:52:24 | |
Please stop. You've been asked to stop. You've been asked to stop talking about this because it's irrelevant. | 01:52:31 | |
Eric said this and you can go over and say, did that or did that not happen? And it's been time and time again that it's we caught | 01:53:07 | |
this, OK, So Council, sometimes he will catch me on me, miss. We all misspeak, OK. So Council, I think what's on the table is that | 01:53:14 | |
Eric offered that those meetings could be recorded and Jake is offering that he would like somebody from the outside that he | 01:53:21 | |
trusts within those meetings if he's part of the Finance Committee. | 01:53:28 | |
Doesn't need to be a Finance Committee. There does not need to be. And I don't know if Jamie didn't understand that. I just talked | 01:53:36 | |
about how there were multiple instances where things happened and it was like. | 01:53:42 | |
I'm glad you were there and I'm glad my integrity is not being questioned. I'm glad that that did occur and that we we don't put | 01:53:48 | |
ourselves into open liability. OK, I'm going to turn comment over to another council person. You often talk about the spirit of | 01:53:55 | |
things, right? I think that we're, we're failing to have a good spirit about this because it seems like the issue is, is that | 01:54:01 | |
you're going into these meetings with. | 01:54:08 | |
A deep distress of the person that's giving you the information. | 01:54:15 | |
And so you want someone there to be a witness of when he quote UN quote life. I don't want it to continue. Hold on. I'm not going | 01:54:19 | |
to have a back and forth. Marty is going to speak and then I'm going to give other council opportunity to speak so so frankly I. | 01:54:26 | |
I respect the position of a city manager and a council member needing to be able to work together. And I have no problem going | 01:54:36 | |
into a meeting and working with Eric. And if Eric saying, listen, Jake, when you bring in extra people to these meetings, it's | 01:54:43 | |
just becoming like a witch trial of sorts or you're just trying to catch me in lies. Then he is saying that the spirit of these | 01:54:50 | |
meetings aren't working. So if it was just like you wanted to bring in. | 01:54:57 | |
Council member Holdaway brought forward a committee that he said had been deputized, picked and brought in to discuss and go line | 01:55:35 | |
by line through itemization of the budget and that they were making these recommendations and that they were all designated to a | 01:55:42 | |
certain area. And we said as a council, this wasn't done by the council. This isn't representative of the people. And so we have | 01:55:48 | |
to formalize the committee if we're going to do something like that and the way that we would formalize it. | 01:55:55 | |
Perform a job in a duty and we either have to acknowledge it as a council and formalize it or we have to not spend our staff time | 01:56:32 | |
on it and spend our staff time on other things that we're putting our resources to. And I think that's what's on the discussion on | 01:56:38 | |
the table tonight. So Jamie, it's either, it's either Sarah or. | 01:56:45 | |
Amber, I'll take a second just to say this because I don't want the mayor or anyone being blamed for you not being able to meet | 01:56:52 | |
with people. I told you when we met one time, I would not talk to you outside of public meetings because you will not work in good | 01:56:57 | |
faith with me and you will not work in good faith with Eric. I don't know how the other council people feel, but I just want to | 01:57:03 | |
make sure you understand. | 01:57:08 | |
This is not some tyrannical mayor or city manager controlling everything. | 01:57:15 | |
Sarah, did you have a comment? | 01:57:20 | |
Honestly, that's been my experience too. I've invited people mostly because I don't understand government finance, and every time | 01:57:22 | |
I've asked them to meet with me, they've answered all my questions. But I feel like the difference is, Jake, is you going to these | 01:57:29 | |
meetings to find things to accuse, not to question, not to, not to gain understanding, but but to accuse and to find fault and to | 01:57:35 | |
find anywhere you can where you can go. | 01:57:42 | |
Say what you're going to say. I have a whole different experience than you do, and I've been working with them for. | 01:57:50 | |
For the same amount of time. And so I think it might be what Marty said, your energy going into the room is more about revenge | 01:57:56 | |
than about than about learning and about figuring out where things are good, where things are happening correctly in the city. And | 01:58:03 | |
even Kim herself, she said I went, she went through with me and Christy line by line. And she said Christy is so conservative. | 01:58:09 | |
She's so careful on the budget. | 01:58:15 | |
That we were both completely satisfied with what was happening and what we were seeing in the city. But we never hear that | 01:58:22 | |
response from you. We never hear that acknowledgement. | 01:58:26 | |
About how hard people are working and what a great job they're doing. And that's really frustrating. Well, I, I don't want it to | 01:58:31 | |
be a negative thing, but I mean, obviously I think I play a different role in playing the devil's advocate. And it's not to be | 01:58:37 | |
personal or anything like that, but I will tell you the integrity of those that were. | 01:58:44 | |
In our group, they did not come with a got you. No one said it was them. We're saying it's you. I didn't talk in both meetings. | 01:58:52 | |
OK, I didn't talk, Jake. I think what would be helpful because this is a work session. No, but, but I just want to be clear | 01:59:05 | |
because if that's what you're hearing, that's what scares me, is the second meeting that was the most contentious. I was told not | 01:59:12 | |
to talk and I got a candy bar at the end for not talking. And so when I leave, I go, why is Marty Sifuentes and Sarah hearing that | 01:59:18 | |
I'm contentious? This bothers me about the spin. | 01:59:25 | |
You're this way in every meeting. You're you're. But this isn't a bad time. | 01:59:32 | |
You act this way every time as points of order though for you to to get to the heart of what you really need here, Jake. | 01:59:37 | |
It seems like you're not talking about a Finance Committee. You're talking about no, and I got hold on, wait, hold on, hold on. It | 01:59:44 | |
seems like you're talking about meeting with people. I I think you need to recognize that if you're wanting to meet with your | 01:59:50 | |
Finance Committee that you put together, we have to have a different discussion and that you have to understand that resources and | 01:59:56 | |
time of the city have to be designated in a certain fashion. If you would like to formalize and work on a policy to put committee | 02:00:02 | |
to Finance Committee together. | 02:00:08 | |
That's a different discussion. I think we can recognize that you now understand the resources and ability that Eric has. I think | 02:00:14 | |
the rest of the council feels comfortable with that. I think as far as the Finance Committee goes, we're open to a discussion of | 02:00:21 | |
policy. I'm feeling the council's open to that. We already have something like that, but we can formalize it because it's a work | 02:00:27 | |
session. I'm going to let you guys submit more of your ideas. | 02:00:33 | |
For an agenda item for business for either policy and then I'm going to. | 02:00:40 | |
Let this go back to a discussion about resources and legal outside of this discussion because I think it's been understood here. | 02:00:46 | |
So I'm going to closeout of this item and we're going to move into public comments. Is there anybody in the audience that would | 02:00:51 | |
like to speak to this? | 02:00:57 | |
Council. | 02:01:05 | |
State your name, where you're from and we're going to put 2 minutes on. Can you raise your hand if you want to speak so I know how | 02:01:07 | |
much time I have? | 02:01:11 | |
Have kept to be here online. I've got some things to say. Can you raise your hand if you want to speak tonight so I can know how | 02:01:15 | |
much time we have? | 02:01:19 | |
OK, I've got two people, all right. | 02:01:25 | |
Three people. | 02:01:27 | |
OK, go ahead. | 02:01:29 | |
Karen Cornelius, Vineyard resident. | 02:01:30 | |
I take offense to a lot of what has just taken place. I have been in these meetings and I have heard Jake maligned by Eric. Now I | 02:01:34 | |
recognize that there's a history that Jake and Eric have. | 02:01:42 | |
That Marty and Eric don't have, Sarah and Eric don't have. | 02:01:51 | |
Amber and Eric don't have. | 02:01:57 | |
I think you're aware of it, Julie, but I hear him being accused of. | 02:01:59 | |
Misinform. Spreading misinformation. | 02:02:07 | |
When the reality was when I checked it further the following day. | 02:02:10 | |
The information that Eric gave us was totally inaccurate. Totally inaccurate about. | 02:02:16 | |
And RDA payment. | 02:02:22 | |
Jake didn't even mention it except after it was brought up by someone else. | 02:02:24 | |
And that was Sean Herring, and Sean kind of knows our DA. | 02:02:31 | |
But nobody accused him in that meeting of speaking falsely. | 02:02:36 | |
But in a conversation I had the following day with another Councilwoman, she shared with me. | 02:02:42 | |
A completely different scenario. | 02:02:49 | |
And she said that is what has taken place. So I really take offense with him going in and being the bad guy. I think we have to | 02:02:52 | |
understand if he goes in without anyone else, it's not going to be the same as Marty going in or is Sarah going in Because there's | 02:02:59 | |
a history there. And I don't think either one of them trust each other. And that is a sad scenario. And I think that Jake needs | 02:03:06 | |
people with him. | 02:03:13 | |
And if anybody wants to know what the situation is, I'm Speaking of is the Forge and it is the RDA. | 02:03:21 | |
Having been having reimbursed the forged developers, that is exactly what Marty told me the following day. I didn't ask you about | 02:03:28 | |
it. The forge. We were talking about the forge. | 02:03:35 | |
At the open house. | 02:03:42 | |
We were talking at the at the. | 02:03:44 | |
See, I needed a witness. | 02:03:46 | |
I needed we're not going to have it back and forth, but thank you for your comment. Is there anything else to this? OK, go ahead. | 02:03:49 | |
We had also in a meeting with Eric as we were discussing some of the ways that we might fortify the budget, the city budget we | 02:03:54 | |
recognize. | 02:04:00 | |
That the tax increase is taking place and we are excited that we're going to have the safety. | 02:04:06 | |
The safety avenues here in this city, but we brought up that we would like to see. | 02:04:14 | |
The $3,000,000 that has been set aside for a City Hall that is not currently needed, we would like to see that money go to the | 02:04:22 | |
fire station. That money then that we have set aside for the fire station could be a surplus in our budget that could help us. | 02:04:31 | |
And this was a discussion we had and he gave some story about RDA money has to go for in ground infrastructure, for roads, for | 02:04:41 | |
lighting. And the the question came up, how is how is the fire station any different than the City Hall? They're both vertical. | 02:04:52 | |
He said he would have to get back to us and that he would bring it up. I don't think any of you have heard that, but so I think he | 02:05:03 | |
is running his agenda too and I think that it's very wrong. I'm sorry he's not here because I would be saying the same things, but | 02:05:10 | |
it's very wrong to put the blame on one. | 02:05:17 | |
And I think that it would be in the best interest of everyone on this Council if they allowed him to have a scribe and another | 02:05:24 | |
person with him at each of these meetings. | 02:05:28 | |
Because we are at an impasse there. And I think that I think we need to respect that. And I think that it's very Amber. I'm so | 02:05:33 | |
tired of you shaking your hand. I'm sorry. But I think that it's really important that we don't malign his character. And none of | 02:05:41 | |
you understand because you don't have the history. | 02:05:48 | |
With Eric. | 02:05:57 | |
That Jake and Eric have, and I think that's very unfair that we're trying, and I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be a | 02:05:59 | |
troublemaker. I am not trying to do anything like that. I'm a mother of five and a grandmother of 18, and I know sometimes when | 02:06:06 | |
you're not in the room, you're not going to get the whole story. | 02:06:12 | |
When they're coming out telling on one another. | 02:06:20 | |
I think that that is human nature and I think we're in an interesting position here because of the history that this small little | 02:06:23 | |
town has and we need to respect one another. And that's one of the ways that I think we can show respect is by allowing him, Jake | 02:06:30 | |
and Eric to have meetings where there is someone else in. | 02:06:37 | |
Present at the time. | 02:06:44 | |
And one more thing, I was really taken aback tonight when it was not on the agenda, but our lobbyists were brought up to speak. | 02:06:47 | |
However, they weren't called lobbyists, they were called legislative. | 02:06:53 | |
They're just saying legislative consultants. Nowhere on the budget do I see legislative consultants. So let's call them what they | 02:07:01 | |
are. They are our lobbyists and that's the way they show up in our budget. Thanks. | 02:07:07 | |
It's the same. | 02:07:18 | |
Anything. | 02:07:23 | |
Russell Evans, our resident of the Villas. We're happy to live there, feel blessed to live there. | 02:07:29 | |
This is a first I don't think my wife S talking tonight and she doesn't have learned gitis or anything like that. But this hasn't | 02:07:34 | |
been very fun and hope some good comes out of it. I really do I know sometimes there needs to be some storming and so on. I. | 02:07:42 | |
But we do need to move forward again, said last time. We're all on the same team. | 02:07:51 | |
But I'm not going to talk about something different too that I well, also I think it's wrong too that we have to wait 195 minutes | 02:07:58 | |
before the public comments. | 02:08:02 | |
I'm not sure why the closed session had to be whole held when it did, Why it's not held at the end like it has been before. | 02:08:07 | |
Maybe there's a reason for it? | 02:08:12 | |
But waiting over three hours for it to be able to make public, public comments isn't right. | 02:08:15 | |
Least isn't isn't good, I'll say that. | 02:08:22 | |
But my wife and I attended the Planning Commission last week and they talked about the grocery store. | 02:08:25 | |
And a couple things troubled me. One is that we found out that the owners owners of the grocery store is flag borough. | 02:08:31 | |
We were told Bella's. | 02:08:39 | |
And. | 02:08:41 | |
Lee's is managing it. | 02:08:42 | |
And to me, that just, I don't know, just doesn't sit right with me. That would seem like we should we thought, but I'm not sure | 02:08:45 | |
anything people on the council even knew that that Flagborough is the owner of the grocery store. | 02:08:51 | |
And that that bothers me because they just. | 02:08:59 | |
Just seemed like they've got their hand and everything and they're controlling everything over there. | 02:09:06 | |
And my wife and I wrote a letter a long time ago that well, last year, that to the council and the mayor that said this looks like | 02:09:10 | |
Flagborough is controlling everything and and we're subservient to them. But that troubled me. Another thing troubled me about the | 02:09:16 | |
grocery stores, the design they want the when the trucks come to deliver. | 02:09:23 | |
They have to block a public road to back in. | 02:09:29 | |
And poor design. And, you know, people said, well, they'll be coming in the wee hours of the morning. You can't assume that they | 02:09:33 | |
come all times of the day. And and then they say, well, it's not a very busy road or whatever, but that that bothers me too, that | 02:09:40 | |
they have to just put every little square inch in there for their benefit to make their dollar. | 02:09:47 | |
Instead of making it a better place for the for the people of Vineyard and I just wanted to express those comments and. | 02:09:54 | |
Thank you very much. | 02:10:01 | |
Thanks. | 02:10:03 | |
All right, I'm Justin Hammer. I live in the solstice neighborhood. I sent an e-mail to everybody. I just want to put a face to the | 02:10:06 | |
words bit of a tonal shift, I think, but I just want to I noticed in the the papers that I got that public comments are supposed | 02:10:13 | |
to be for non agenda items. So just a couple other things for my e-mail that I I sent to you about some public safety stuff. I've | 02:10:19 | |
talked to the mayor a couple times over the last couple years about. | 02:10:26 | |
Off leash dogs, let's just continue continual thing that I see when I'm out running. | 02:10:33 | |
It's always, there's all, it's probably a weekly occurrence where I have a dog that comes after me. Thankfully nothing bad has | 02:10:38 | |
happened so far. And then in addition to that, just another point for my e-mail that I wanted to reiterate about just car safety | 02:10:44 | |
in general. I think that there's, there are a number of streets where I especially recognize that need extra attention when I'm | 02:10:50 | |
out. Anytime somebody's turning on the Main Street feels like they're not looking both ways left and right for pedestrians. And I | 02:10:55 | |
know that. | 02:11:01 | |
One of our paths goes right along there as well, so I think both sides of the road. But yeah, we've already talked about the golf | 02:11:08 | |
carts and everything and obviously, you know, that was in my e-mail too, but yeah, so. | 02:11:14 | |
I, I think if there's anything I can do to continue to facilitate the conversation, I'm happy to do that. I will continue to be | 02:11:21 | |
recording my runs as well. I don't know if I need to keep sending updates or whatever, but yeah, open to a conversation. So | 02:11:27 | |
thanks. Thank you. | 02:11:32 | |
All right. | 02:11:39 | |
We'll go ahead and move on to our consent agenda. | 02:11:41 | |
Do you need a motion? | 02:11:46 | |
I move to approve the consent items as presented. Thank you. First by Marty. Can I get a second? | 02:11:53 | |
Second. Second by Sarah. All in favor, aye. | 02:12:01 | |
All right, we'll move on to our business items public hearing for zoning text amendment Sections 151250 and 1532 to 20. | 02:12:05 | |
We'll go into the public hearing and then we will have this discussion. Morgan, will you be talking about this? | 02:12:14 | |
Yes. OK. Can I get a motion to go into a public hearing? | 02:12:23 | |
So moved. Thank you, Marty. Can I get a second? | 02:12:27 | |
2nd Thank you, Sarah. All in favor, aye. All right, go ahead, Morgan. OK, great. I'm going to pull up a map really quick to show | 02:12:31 | |
you the. | 02:12:35 | |
Part of the city that would be affected by this change. | 02:12:40 | |
OK, Thank you, Mayor and members of the council wanted to show you really quickly that this change affects the FOI district. This | 02:13:17 | |
is from Enigma 3. They're a studio on the north side of the city located off 1600 N They provide studious space. | 02:13:28 | |
For filming and they are requesting a text amendment to the FY district to allow for. | 02:13:39 | |
Events and specifically Event centers. | 02:13:48 | |
To operate as conditional use permit, the Planning Commission did review this change. They recommended approval to the. | 02:13:53 | |
To the City Council with the amendment that a definition for resents center be added. | 02:14:02 | |
Umm, this right here shows. | 02:14:10 | |
The table, so this is just the kind of a cross section of the table Event Center is being added conditional use being put into the | 02:14:15 | |
FOI. There are other districts throughout the city where we could probably have event centers as well. We are doing a a larger | 02:14:21 | |
kind of bulk amendment to our zoning code, but that so potentially we could fit that into like the retail districts. There's | 02:14:28 | |
there's some other areas that we think it would be really beneficial. | 02:14:34 | |
Overall, we found that the proposal. | 02:14:41 | |
Would be a very positive one who would bring people from outside the city into the city. So from an economic development | 02:14:44 | |
standpoint, that would be really helpful. | 02:14:48 | |
Additionally, the conditional use permit process would allow the Planning Commission to impose conditions to mitigate any | 02:14:52 | |
potential impacts, you know, to safety to the public or to impacts to surrounding neighbors. Some of those impacts that be kind of | 02:14:57 | |
looked at in the FOI district could be. | 02:15:02 | |
The mixing of, you know, visitor parking and traffic with that of of trucks and and and deliveries. And so the conditional use | 02:15:10 | |
permit process would allow for the Planning Commission. | 02:15:15 | |
To control some of the hours of operation, ensure that there's traffic. | 02:15:22 | |
Control on site that parking areas are well lit. Typically in the industrial districts there are some parking lots that are a | 02:15:27 | |
little bit darker. This would affect the whole FOI. But we do know that they they would propose having an Event Center or more | 02:15:34 | |
more regularly scheduled events that would fall under the Event Center use on their property. | 02:15:42 | |
And so with that, staff is also recommending approval and stand ready for any questions. | 02:15:49 | |
OK, are there any questions from the Council? | 02:15:56 | |
Well, actually, I'll put it to the public. Any questions for the public? | 02:15:59 | |
Not at this time. | 02:16:05 | |
OK, let's go ahead and go out of a public hearing. | 02:16:07 | |
I need a motion. Thank you, Amber. Can I get a second, second, second by Marty? All in favor, aye. | 02:16:10 | |
OK, Council questions. We we show the map again. I didn't see the map. | 02:16:16 | |
While you're doing, if you're ready, never mind. | 02:16:25 | |
So the the FOI district is the district that covers a large portion of the northeastern part of the city. | 02:16:29 | |
FOI stands for flex office industrial. So that's where we do have a lot of flex office, typically warehouses with like a retail | 02:16:36 | |
frontage or an office frontage. So that's kind of the primary building form that you see up there. The applicant is intending to | 02:16:43 | |
do more regular events. If you remember I think it was a few months ago the there was a one off approval for an event up there. So | 02:16:51 | |
this would allow them to just function as a regular business, it would provide them another revenue source. | 02:16:58 | |
And we feel it would be very positive. | 02:17:07 | |
OK. Any additional questions? Otherwise I need a motion. | 02:17:10 | |
I support it. | 02:17:15 | |
Great. It's that I'll have a first by Jake. Can I get a second? | 02:17:16 | |
Second, second by Sarah. I'll do roll call. Jake, does this go through the whole property? So anyone in the FOIA area can now do | 02:17:20 | |
this? Yeah. So what they would be allowed to do is to apply for conditional use permit, then they would go to the Planning | 02:17:27 | |
Commission. And so the Planning Commission could right size it depending on where it goes and the. | 02:17:33 | |
I met with them. It makes sense. And we need to be flexible for businesses in that area to stay in business when business models | 02:17:40 | |
change and shift. Yeah, this is also a use that would be positive for other businesses. It would provide a place for other | 02:17:45 | |
businesses to hold events and they said that's their primary function. I think they then had a large event there. So this would be | 02:17:51 | |
good for our business community as well. Great. Any further discussion? | 02:17:56 | |
No. OK, Jake. | 02:18:02 | |
Aye, Amber. Hi. Aye, Marty. Yay, Sarah. Yes. All right, we'll go into our second public hearing. This is the consolidated fee | 02:18:04 | |
Schedule Amendment Resolution 2022 for 2025. Our utility billing clerk, Maria, will come and present. I need a motion to go into a | 02:18:11 | |
public hearing. So moved. Thank you, Marty. Can I get a second? | 02:18:17 | |
Second, second by Sarah. All in favor, aye. We're now in a public hearing. All right, So I submitted this and I wanted to just | 02:18:25 | |
give you guys an update that I did change some today just so we got clarification on the morning that I needed to do so. The ones | 02:18:31 | |
that we changed as of today that you might have not seen are going to be the fire hydrant meter meter. | 02:18:38 | |
We're going to do a residential daily rental fee that's going to be for people that are renting it out to like fill up their | 02:18:46 | |
pools. So instead of charging them the commercial price, we're going to do $10 a day plus the residential fee for water usage and | 02:18:51 | |
then. | 02:18:56 | |
For fire hydrant meters for the commercial use, we've changed it to now say that they will be paying the base rate for a three | 02:19:03 | |
inch meter every month and then after those, that'll be for the initial 5000 gallons. After that they'll go to the tiered rate on | 02:19:10 | |
the commercial usage. Will you bring up any other changes for the public if you want me to, Yeah, yes, please. | 02:19:17 | |
Oh yeah. Do we have it that we could pull it up? | 02:19:25 | |
If not, you can read them if it's in the staff report. Is it OK? Yeah, give me a second. | 02:19:30 | |
That one. | 02:20:11 | |
I'm assuming there are red lines, so we can probably, yeah, a little red line. So #5 is going to be the first one. | 02:20:13 | |
At the bottom so. | 02:20:21 | |
Non Vineyard resident business fee. So this is for water rates if we they are outside of the city. So this is going to be kind of | 02:20:23 | |
towards Linden Marina since we service them since they are not Vineyard residents or not in Vineyard, we would charge them double | 02:20:30 | |
the rate. So that's just adding that in there. Next one is collection. So as of now we do not have a collections policy in place. | 02:20:36 | |
That's something that I've been working on for the last year. | 02:20:43 | |
And we have kind of finalized it to where we're going. We're going with one. So we were just adding it into the fee schedule. | 02:20:51 | |
This will be for any unpaid utility bills, fees or civil penalties that are not paid. They will just go into collections after 30 | 02:20:57 | |
days past the due date. OK. | 02:21:02 | |
And then Eric kind of brought it up. | 02:21:09 | |
Yeah. | 02:21:13 | |
So collections like. | 02:21:14 | |
Outside of the city where height we send it out. | 02:21:16 | |
So because how it's worked as of now is we've never, we haven't had a collection agency in years. There's been discussions that | 02:21:20 | |
there's been one in the past, but we haven't used one since a lot of people have known. | 02:21:26 | |
Look into most what cities do and I've contacted every city in Utah County. | 02:22:03 | |
Is they all typically do 30 days, so and they kind of have some lenience. What they do is they'll send out a initial letter that | 02:22:08 | |
says, hey, here's your notice, you owe this past due balance. They'll send a warning saying, hey, now you're going to go to | 02:22:15 | |
collections. If you don't pay it within this time frame, at that point goes to collections. I believe from what I remember, | 02:22:21 | |
there's only two to three cities that go past. | 02:22:27 | |
30 days and usually they go to 45 days and that's kind of where they give their cut off. | 02:22:34 | |
For the most part, how we've been is very lenient and even then we typically would probably be a lot more lenient after working | 02:22:39 | |
with us. This is going to be for people who haven't get in contact with us, have blocked our numbers, anything like that where we | 02:22:43 | |
can't reach out to them. | 02:22:48 | |
I I think it's kind of an aggressive policy. | 02:22:55 | |
I mean, we can focus on this later, I guess. Yeah, we can. We can look at changing in the code if you want to change it to an | 02:22:58 | |
additional days as of now, because it's in the code. That's why I put 30 days. I just worry for people that might not check their. | 02:23:02 | |
It sounds like the. | 02:23:07 | |
What you're doing is great. I just think that that's so this isn't for like people typically who are in the city. So how I usually | 02:23:12 | |
do it is I reach out to them multiple times and I usually get a response. This is more for people, like I said, who have moved out | 02:23:18 | |
of Vineyard and are no longer residents. So we have they even offer payment plans and then they put on cycles. So we have about 10 | 02:23:24 | |
accounts that are closed right now for people who have not been here in a couple years and we haven't been able to reach them out | 02:23:30 | |
and right now we have. | 02:23:36 | |
An account balance of $5000 that we haven't been able to collect on, but those accounts would clearly be past 30 days if they | 02:23:43 | |
haven't lived here years. So I'm just saying as a policy, if you want to read it, yeah, we can do that. So we could do that on a | 02:23:49 | |
future. Yeah. So I can put that down, but yeah. And then. | 02:23:55 | |
I said for sanitation fees, Eric talked about that, but Republics is raising their fees, so we. | 02:24:02 | |
Have to also to kind of keep up with that. | 02:24:08 | |
Page 8, the next one. | 02:24:13 | |
Food truck vendor fees. This is for special events, they just didn't have one in place. This is so that they can now have a fee | 02:24:17 | |
for their license. | 02:24:21 | |
Personnel. We just changed city staff per person. We decided to just do one rate instead of having separate rates for individual | 02:24:27 | |
departments. | 02:24:31 | |
#9. | 02:24:35 | |
Illegal trash dumping that wasn't in place before, so that we have added a fine of $250 for that. | 02:24:38 | |
On that one. | 02:24:45 | |
Maria, maybe this is something we could do at another time, but is there something for wetland? | 02:24:47 | |
Dumping it, it seems like maybe that's something we need to talk with Jamie on. But if there's people dumping in like sensitive | 02:24:53 | |
lands area that we, we may want to bump that up a little bit. That could be pretty bad. We do get that. | 02:25:00 | |
So yeah, we can look into that the next time around. | 02:25:08 | |
#11. | 02:25:14 | |
Water sampling lab cost plus 10% and a $300.00 fee. That's going to be more Naseem. | 02:25:22 | |
The rest of it on there is just kind of adding words that make more sense. Public works is also part. | 02:25:31 | |
Of that engineering team, so we've added that. | 02:25:36 | |
Uh, same deal. | 02:25:41 | |
Go down more. | 02:25:45 | |
This is all just red line because they've redone the whole page, so the next page will just show all of the new fees. | 02:25:48 | |
And then the last one. | 02:26:05 | |
Which we've talked about most of them. | 02:26:07 | |
The only other ones that I haven't talked on that page are Unauthorized opening of meter box. | 02:26:10 | |
And water main flushing, those have been added. | 02:26:16 | |
OK. Any is that it? Any questions from the public? | 02:26:19 | |
OK, I need to go out of a public hearing. I need a motion. | 02:26:25 | |
So moved. Thank you, Marty. Can I get a second? | 02:26:32 | |
Second, second by Sarah, All in favor, aye. Thank you. Any questions or comments by the council? | 02:26:35 | |
I was just hoping Maria would explain the report concern. I talked to her today about that because I, I know I've seen it on the | 02:26:42 | |
city page, but I didn't it didn't really register. Will you, will you come back up and just explain what you told me today? | 02:26:50 | |
Because I think it's really beneficial if we're in unison where we on social media, if we can just. | 02:26:59 | |
Direct people back to the report of concern instead of trying to solve it and reach out. I've done that a few times trying to | 02:27:08 | |
reach out to Cash or Naseem. | 02:27:11 | |
Where I can just give them to you and then anyway just tell everybody yeah so a part of my I'm part time in utility billing and | 02:27:15 | |
I'm also part time in neighborhood services coordinator. So that also entails code enforcement for the city. What we've kind of | 02:27:22 | |
discussed today is kind of our what our plans are going forward. One of the biggest thing that I've noticed is enemy and cash have | 02:27:28 | |
kind of talked about this is on social media we've been getting. | 02:27:34 | |
A lot of people just saying, hey, the city's not doing anything and they'll post their concerns to Facebook. | 02:27:41 | |
And Jenna kind of talked about it earlier where people are kind of venting their issues or what they're what they're seeing in | 02:27:47 | |
terms of concerns. | 02:27:51 | |
But they're not sending it to me through the report of concern, so half the time I'm not getting it. | 02:27:55 | |
And so I've gotten calls saying, hey, I made this post and nobody's gone back to me. And I have to then say, well, that's not the | 02:28:02 | |
right channel. | 02:28:05 | |
So what we've kind of talked about is if while you guys are on Facebook and you do see these comments where people are saying, | 02:28:09 | |
hey, there's Wasps here, hey, there's garbage here that we want to discuss. If you could then just instead of. | 02:28:16 | |
Some people have been saying, oh, I wish the city would. | 02:28:23 | |
Get back to you. I hope I'll tell the city to reach back to you. What they should. What I would prefer is to say here's the report | 02:28:27 | |
of concern link. Please make a report here and then someone will get back to you. And then that would go to me and I could look | 02:28:34 | |
into it and work on it. Perfect. Yeah. And can you tell them about your new your new software? Oh, yeah. So we do have new | 02:28:40 | |
software that we just got, which is Civic Review. | 02:28:46 | |
Umm, that has gotten a lot easier because before what we would do is it was a spreadsheet. | 02:28:54 | |
That I would mark everybody's information, address, phone number, and then what I had done and contacted what this new software | 02:28:59 | |
does. | 02:29:04 | |
Is it will give me the capabilities to notify people what process they're in, so when a concern comes in I can say in progress. | 02:29:10 | |
Investigating or resolved and then that will send them an e-mail to let them know where they're at in the process. | 02:29:21 | |
So they know when I'm working on it, when I've looked at it and when it's done and during those. | 02:29:26 | |
Once it's resolved or in the process, I can write a note and it'll also send it with that notification. So if it says resolved, | 02:29:32 | |
it'll say. | 02:29:36 | |
Deer so and so this is I've looked into this, this is what I've done. | 02:29:40 | |
Please reach out to me if you have any other questions and that'll send it with them. | 02:29:44 | |
And then that will also give me a tracking system so I can see. | 02:29:48 | |
What areas might be more concerned? | 02:29:52 | |
And then like. | 02:29:57 | |
What areas, what issues are there? So if there's a lot of weeds? | 02:29:59 | |
A lot of like parking issues, occupancy, anything like that. | 02:30:04 | |
Perfect. Thank you. Yeah. | 02:30:08 | |
All right, I need a motion. | 02:30:11 | |
Little of Marty show today I moved to adopt Resolution 2024-25 consolidated fee schedule amendments presented as presented by | 02:30:18 | |
staff. All right, I have a first by Marty. Can I get a second? | 02:30:24 | |
Second, second by Sarah. I'll do this by roll call Jake. | 02:30:31 | |
This is 10.3 right? | 02:30:35 | |
10.2. | 02:30:38 | |
Amber Ay. | 02:30:41 | |
Aye, Marty. Yay, Sarah. Yes. | 02:30:43 | |
All right, that brings us to 10.3 discussion and action adoption of the fiscal year 2024-2025 Budget Resolution 2024-24. | 02:30:46 | |
And. | 02:30:57 | |
Chrissy Yes. | 02:30:59 | |
You will be. | 02:31:00 | |
Discussing. | 02:31:02 | |
Thank you, Mayor. | 02:31:12 | |
I feel like we've talked. | 02:31:14 | |
Very much about the budget in the last couple months. I feel like the council is probably very familiar with it, as are many of | 02:31:16 | |
the residents. | 02:31:20 | |
I I just wanted to mention some of the changes that had happened since 2 weeks ago. It was tabled and there have been some | 02:31:25 | |
housekeeping items that have come up since then. Just some changes in some estimates as well as some other things that we were | 02:31:32 | |
trying to cut everywhere we could. I just wanted to make the citizens and council members aware of that. In the communications | 02:31:38 | |
budget, we did cut 25,000 related to a consultant. | 02:31:45 | |
In the capital projects. | 02:31:53 | |
Budget, we took out the modular roundabouts that had been discussed. We have tabled that. | 02:31:57 | |
To help with the fund balance as well. | 02:32:04 | |
There were some adjustments that were needed related to water use in the parks and the public works maintenance. Those allocations | 02:32:08 | |
needed to be adjusted and and moved to different funds and I was able to take care of that. | 02:32:14 | |
And roundabout, in the end, we were able to decrease the prior use of fund balance for the general fund with almost $190,000. | 02:32:22 | |
Umm, so at this time I just ask that the Council approve the budget for fiscal year 25. Also mentioned that we by law have to have | 02:32:31 | |
a budget approved and uploaded to the state website by the end of this month. So this is kind of an important action that we have | 02:32:37 | |
that we are coming to. | 02:32:43 | |
Perfect. Thank you so much. Council. Can I would anybody like to make comment? Jake, I'm gonna rotate the comments really quick. | 02:32:50 | |
Sarah or Amber, do you? | 02:33:00 | |
It's come a long way. It's been a lot of work, a lot of input from a lot of different people, and you've managed it very well, so | 02:33:02 | |
thank you very much. | 02:33:06 | |
Thank you, Sarah. I agree. I appreciate your patience and. | 02:33:11 | |
Answering all of the questions that you did and. | 02:33:15 | |
The. | 02:33:21 | |
The line items that you did, that you broke down for me for miscellaneous and the other things that you did made a big difference | 02:33:22 | |
and I appreciate everything that you've done. | 02:33:26 | |
Thank you. | 02:33:30 | |
Jake, what was the total dollar amount that was cut? | 02:33:32 | |
Did you add that up? | 02:33:36 | |
The total decrease in priority from the previous from two months because you said the roundabout. | 02:33:39 | |
The roundabout was 405,000 coming from the Capital Projects Fund, so you cut that whole thing out. | 02:33:44 | |
Yes. And then did you add up all of the cuts from the past two weeks just so that it's on the record of what was the total dollar | 02:33:50 | |
amount? What was it? | 02:33:54 | |
Which fund where would you like like all of the various, I don't have a total by all of them, but they obviously have to balance. | 02:33:59 | |
Was it a total impact? | 02:34:04 | |
Like was there a total impact on it of all the cuts? | 02:34:09 | |
Yes, we had $190,000 additional in the general fund that we did not have to use prior year fund balance when all was said and | 02:34:13 | |
done. | 02:34:17 | |
OK. | 02:34:21 | |
Thank you, I appreciate any cut we can get. | 02:34:23 | |
Marty. | 02:34:26 | |
I don't have any questions or comments besides thank you for your hard work. | 02:34:28 | |
I know it's been a rough one. | 02:34:33 | |
Yeah. Thank you so much. And we appreciate you working with us and kind of figuring out different ways to still make those | 02:34:35 | |
priorities a priority for our residents, but finding different ways to offset costs and pay for them in different ways. So we | 02:34:40 | |
really appreciate you. You've done a marvelous job. All of our staff has, it's been incredible. All right, with that, I need a | 02:34:46 | |
motion. | 02:34:51 | |
I move to adopt resolution 2024. | 02:35:00 | |
2024-24 The Vineyard City Fiscal Year 2024 Dash 2025 Budget as presented by Hey, I have a first priority, can I get a second? | 02:35:04 | |
Second, Second by Sarah. I'll do this by roll call. Sarah, Marty, Yes, Amber and Shake. | 02:35:13 | |
10.4 was a public hearing that's being postponed to a later date, so I'm going to go ahead and adjourn this meeting. Thank you for | 02:35:25 | |
coming. | 02:35:28 | |
Oh, did you have something to report? Yeah, it's my only time I get to talk. | 02:35:33 | |
I wanted to go through that. | 02:35:37 | |
I, you know, you get 30 minutes to calm down. And I think that's why it's important to meet in person. I don't think a Finance | 02:35:42 | |
Committee, if it was selected like I read through and I don't know if, Jamie, you said that of like the parameters like the mayor | 02:35:49 | |
would pick it and then we would have consent And it's the city manager on it. And the financial purpose, you know, the whole | 02:35:55 | |
purpose was to get people outside to have a double check on it And as long as. | 02:36:02 | |
We can have a witness and an advisor depending on the issue, whether it be RDA that's going to be on the council, then you bring | 02:36:10 | |
somebody with that or a CPA. | 02:36:14 | |
Or, you know, different people, a strong townsperson with Eric where it's like, hey, there's somebody there. I, I really want to | 02:36:18 | |
mend whatever relationship and look for a pathway forward with Eric. And I know that is with having someone there when there's a | 02:36:25 | |
misunderstanding, you know, you can't just. | 02:36:31 | |
Right to sentence after and say these are the two things that happened in a 60 minute meeting, right? | 02:36:38 | |
And a lot of accusations are hurting our city instead of like what did or did not happen. So fighting for. I just have a quick | 02:36:44 | |
question. Transparency helps. Are you making a report to us with something new? So that's the first thing I wanted to cover. The | 02:36:50 | |
second thing is on our social media that today we had a lot of people just explode about the parking agreement that we passed a | 02:36:57 | |
couple of weeks ago. | 02:37:03 | |
And the social media post detailed a lot of the various things. So then I went in and looked at it and I just feel like we missed | 02:37:10 | |
an opportunity by not negotiating that in a. | 02:37:15 | |
Open working session where not it wasn't advertised and nobody really knew about it. I wasn't even in the negotiations. It |