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All right, today is Wednesday, June 26, 2024. The time is 6:00 and we're going to open up our Redevelopment Agency board meeting. 00:00:02
We're going to start out by having Board member Rasmussen lead us in an inspirational thought and the Pledge of Allegiance. 00:00:11
First of all, welcome to the Vineyard City Council meeting, everyone. We're glad you're here. Happy to see you. 00:00:21
I just wanted to share a quick quote and just an inspirational thought. Keep your face always toward the sunshine and shadows will 00:00:27
fall behind you. Walt Whitman. Now please stand for the pledge. 00:00:32
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, 00:00:41
indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. 00:00:48
All right, that brings us into our consent items. I just need a motion from the board. 00:00:57
I move to approve the consent items as presented. Thank you first by Amber. Can I get a second? 00:01:10
Second. Second by Marty. Any discussion? 00:01:18
All right, all in favor. Aye, aye. Any opposed? No. All right, that's passed. We'll go ahead and move on to our business items. 00:01:22
We'll start with our public hearing amending the Vineyard RDA Fiscal Year 2023-2024 Budget amendment #2 Resolution U2024-2. And 00:01:29
we're just going to go right into a public hearing and then we'll have our RDA Director, Josh Daniels present the amendments. I 00:01:37
need a motion. 00:01:44
I move to go into a public hearing. Thank you, Marty. Second, second by Amber. All in favor, aye. All right. We are now in a 00:01:52
public hearing, Josh. 00:01:57
So at the end of each fiscal year, local government entities have to. 00:02:06
Basically adopt an amended budget because there may be changes that occurred during the year. So that's what this is. It's so it's 00:02:12
customary at your last annual meeting or last meeting in the fiscal year which is today to adopt A final amended budget, so. 00:02:20
The budget schedule is in your agenda packet and just kind of reflects updates of of any changes. It's actually pretty, pretty 00:02:29
close to what was originally adopted. 00:02:34
OK. Are there? 00:02:42
Any questions from the public? 00:02:44
Come on up, state your name where you're from. 00:02:47
Any comments? 00:02:50
Just did you already do the hearing or is that next? 00:02:52
This is the hearing. This is the hearing. 00:02:55
Hello, my name is John Barrack. I am a taxpayer in the Alpine School District of which the Vineyard RDA is has is a is an entity. 00:03:02
The Alpine School District is a member of the taxing Entities Committee. I came and spoke at your last meeting and I'm here to 00:03:11
speak again. The last time the taxing entities committee met, which is a required meet, it's a required that they meet was 2011. I 00:03:20
am reading from resolution number. Thank you for posting this on your online site. Now resolution number T for taxing. 00:03:30
2901 formed. You're taxing any committee and it says in order to ascertain and stay abreast of the status of the project area, the 00:03:39
taxing entity committee shall meet at least annually during the time that the agency receives tax increment under a budget for the 00:03:46
project area. And if I'm not mistaken, you started receiving tax increment financing in 2011, the last time the taxing entity 00:03:54
committee met and it hasn't met since. So this is what your own document says. 00:04:02
From your own taxing in committee, these are the things that they must do at a meet, at a present, at a TEC meeting at which a 00:04:09
quorum is present. And since they haven't met since 2011, you couldn't have had a meeting nor a quorum to approve a draft plan for 00:04:16
the project area, which they did in 2011, approve or disprove a draft budget, which they did in 2011, approve or disapprove 00:04:23
amendments to a budget for the project area, which you're talking about today, which they did not approve or consent to. 00:04:30
In 2004, in 2015, your phase two was approved by this body and it said that you had the consent of the taxing entity committee, 00:04:39
but since they hadn't met since 2011, that would have been impossible. In 2016, your, your phase three, your resolution said you 00:04:46
had consent of the taxing entity committee, but obviously that was wrong because they hadn't met once again since what, 2011 and 00:04:54
two in your phase four, I can find no resolution for it. And in 2023, your phase 5A. 00:05:02
But your own document shows that Guy Fugle, who was on the Alpine School District board about 10 years ago, was a member of the 00:05:46
Taxing Any committee, as was Rob Smith, who just recently retired. And it still lists Nathan Riley and Nathan Crane from Vineyard. 00:05:53
And I think they've been off the council or the RDA 10 years for a decade or more. 00:06:00
So once again, more questions and answers and I'm still waiting. Thank you so much for your time. 00:06:08
My name is John Gadd. I'm also a resident of Alpine School District so. 00:06:19
I don't like property taxes. I don't think anybody likes property taxes. But if we're going to pay them, everybody should pay the 00:06:23
same amount. And what's going on here with this Rdas? You're giving out 10s of millions of dollars, potentially hundreds of 00:06:29
millions of dollars in tax breaks to certain entities within your city and then people like me. 00:06:35
In another city have to pay more to Alpine School District and Utah County and all these different places and so. 00:06:42
When you give out these tax breaks, all the citizens have to make up the difference. 00:06:48
So I pay more and my parents in their 70s pay more, and my grandma in her 90s pay more, and all these other seniors who are on 00:06:53
fixed incomes pay more. 00:06:57
So it has a meaningful impact in peoples lives. Now as I started to look into this RDA that you guys have going here, I've become 00:07:01
concerned that you're not following the law. 00:07:07
I submitted a grammar request to you guys a couple weeks ago and you came back and what's supposed to happen is all of the taxing 00:07:14
entities who give out who, who miss out on this tax money because you're giving out these tax breaks like Alpine School District 00:07:20
in Utah County and the water district and your own city. They're supposed to be a committee, a taxing any committee with people 00:07:25
from each of those entities and they're supposed to be overseeing what you guys do. They're supposed to be approving things before 00:07:31
you do it. 00:07:37
And so I sent a request to you guys and I said, hey, tell me about this taxing ending committee, show me their minutes where 00:07:44
they've been approving all this stuff that you guys do. And you guys sent me back. 00:07:48
Their minutes and the last time they had a meeting was 2011. So for the last 13 years, all of these entities who are supposed to 00:07:54
be overseeing you haven't been meeting at all. 00:07:59
So what you guys have been doing is just doing your own thing without any oversight, and that's contrary to the law. 00:08:05
So tonight you're going to you want to adopt A budget, right? 00:08:11
Here's two sections from Utah code. You might want to write these down. You might want to have your attorney look them up. You 00:08:14
might want to get better legal counsel because apparently you guys have been doing this stuff for 13 years illegally. 00:08:21
So Utah code 17C-2-204, subsection 1A. Did everybody get that? No. Can you do that again? Sure, 17C-2. 00:08:28
204. 00:08:39
Subsection 1A. 00:08:41
And there's a lot of stuff, but I'm going to read the part that matters for this budget that you're trying to pass tonight. 00:08:46
But what I'm saying is it's going, if you have a timer, you put it up on the board so I can see it. And I know how much time I 00:09:25
have. Yeah, I can't do it after the fact or midstream. I think we actually stated in our code that I can. Well, to stop the back 00:09:32
and forth, I'm going to give you one minute and you may continue. Each agency shall, and when the law says shall, you have to do 00:09:38
it. Each agency shall obtain the consent of the Taxing Enemy Committee for each urban renewal project area budget. 00:09:45
You shall get their approval before you do the budget. Here's another 117C-2 dash 2012 EI. Did everybody get that? 00:09:52
Can you repeat yourself 17C? 00:10:04
201. 00:10:07
Subsection 2 E. 00:10:11
I it reads to adopt an urban renewal project area budget, the agency shall. 00:10:14
Approve or excuse me, obtain the approval of the taxing enemy committee on the proposed project area budget or a revised version 00:10:22
of the proposed project area budget. So both of these code sections clearly state that before you adopt A budget, you shall obtain 00:10:28
the approval of the taxing entity committee, which hasn't met in 13 years. So clearly they haven't given you their approval 00:10:35
tonight since you if you move forward adopting a budget. 00:10:42
That you shall obtain their approval before you do it. 00:10:49
It seems like you're breaking the law. 00:10:53
So please don't break the law. Please don't adopt A budget without without getting the taxing ending committee's approval. 00:10:56
Tonight. 00:11:03
Thank you. 00:11:04
Any further comments? 00:11:11
Come on up. 00:11:13
Ship price Providence. So I'm a little late to the game but. 00:11:16
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I understand that you guys are coming together today to talk about possibly changing the taxes for 00:11:21
the City of Vineyard to accommodate a new budget proposal. 00:11:27
I want to come forward and tell you that. 00:11:35
Everybody in this community is dealing with inflation. 00:11:39
That economies. 00:11:43
Terrible gas prices. 00:11:47
Bad interest rates, all of the things that are affecting every single person in this room. 00:11:49
At this point. 00:11:57
To come in and say we had a shortfall from our spending from last year and we would like to make up with it by raising your taxes 00:11:59
in a moment where everybody's already bleeding to death. 00:12:04
This is a really bad time for you guys to make these types of Corrections to behavior that should have been fixed last year. 00:12:11
There are things in your budget that don't need to happen this year. I would ask, as one of your taxpayers and as a constituent 00:12:21
who voted for you, people who are sitting on the stand. 00:12:26
To be considerate and to think about what kind of impact a tax increase would have on people who are already struggling. 00:12:33
And to make decisions that would benefit the people who live here. 00:12:44
By giving them a reprieve from a terrible economy. 00:12:51
And bad inflation. 00:12:55
I would love to have a pay increase. I can tell you in the private sector those are hard to come by. 00:12:57
I can ask. 00:13:07
But it doesn't come. 00:13:09
The problem with government is that you spend money that's not yours. 00:13:11
I'm asking you to be representative of us. 00:13:16
All right. And just as a reminder, this is the public hearing for the 2324 RDA amendment. So let's keep, let's try to keep the 00:13:23
business within the hearing for this and then talk about any additional things on the other items throughout the agenda. All 00:13:29
right, any other comments? 00:13:35
OK. Let's go ahead and close the public hearing. I move to close the public hearing. Thank you. 00:13:43
I need a second second. 00:13:49
Second by Marty, all in favor. 00:13:51
Aye, all right. We're now out of a public hearing and this is a time for the board to discuss. 00:13:54
Go ahead and discuss what are your questions. 00:14:00
Or can I get a motion? 00:14:03
I move to approve let resolution U 20242. 00:14:13
OK. We have a first by Amber, I'd like to talk. 00:14:18
Jamie with a motion on the table. 00:14:24
There's a motion, a second and then the chair will recognize for discussion. OK, is there a second? 00:14:28
OK. Is there not a second because you want to hear Jakes discussion because we can have the discussion afterwards or do you not 00:14:36
intend to approve the budget? 00:14:41
My full intentions was to approve budgets, but I wanted to discuss some of the concerns, I guess, OK. 00:14:48
Since there's no second Jamie, do I just? 00:14:57
You're a voting member. You can second, or you can have the discussion before the 2nd. 00:15:00
OK, let's go on half of the discussion. 00:15:05
Go ahead. 00:15:07
Jake, you. Yeah, I can go over my stuff. 00:15:09
I'd really like to know about that taxing entity question. I read the documents myself. 00:15:13
And are you referring to the code section that the Yeah, the commenter. So I when, when I sat down with Mayor Farnsworth, it was 00:15:18
very clear the RDA was formed by a lot of government entities and by code they have to give us the jurisdiction every year. 00:15:28
And I reached out to the county personally and they had no clue what we were doing. And I also reached out to the school district 00:15:37
and they. 00:15:41
Normally would be approving every year. I reached out to Nate Riley and he thought he served on it and every and that was in 00:15:46
practice. 00:15:52
And each project, Top Golf or whatever, you know, back in the day it was Megaplex would have to go through approval through them. 00:15:58
So. 00:16:08
Yeah, I. 00:16:10
It says straight in there that they have to do that. 00:16:13
There there may be a misreading of the code by the gentleman that presented that. 00:16:18
And so let me Orient you and then our RDA director can speak up a little bit on what the practice has been of the RDA and and why 00:16:23
it's compliant so. 00:16:29
The two sections of code that were read, it was 17 C 2204, and then I think it was one subsection A and then seventeen, C22O12E 00:16:35
Roman at one. Both of those refer to the project area budget being approved by the Taxing Entity Committee. 00:16:45
This is an annual budget of the RDA. 00:16:56
Expenditures and budget activities. It's not the overall project area budget. 00:16:59
Project area budget is a defined term in the statute. It's in 17 C 110247 which is on the screen. Oh, thank you. You pulled it up. 00:17:06
And it means a multi year projection of annual or cumulative revenues and expenses and other fiscal matters pertaining to a 00:17:16
project area. 00:17:20
Prepared in accordance with and then it lists off. 00:17:24
The various types of Rdas and project areas that can be established so my read of that. 00:17:28
That's your multi year budget that relates to the entire project area and that's the time at which you would have. 00:17:36
That group involved in making approvals not your annual budget. So is that for clarification, are you saying that like on each 00:17:43
phase is when no trigger at the very beginning, when it's when it's established right at the outset. So just like when the RDA is 00:17:50
created, that's the project area budget that we first. 00:17:57
Voted through in 2008, the assertion of the of the commenter during the public hearing was that the city's behaving improperly. We 00:18:06
haven't followed the right. 00:18:11
Not the city. Rather, the RDA board has behaved improperly by bringing the budget forward today because there hasn't been 00:18:17
engagement at that level. And I think it's either a misreading of the statute or an intentional misrepresentation of what that 00:18:24
process is, because it's to occur when the project area budget is established, not when your annual budget's established. So by my 00:18:31
read of the statute and my understanding of what you're doing. 00:18:38
The budget is coming to you properly, but it still means that they they must meet annually though. No, there's no they don't have. 00:18:46
So it says meet annually and then you don't need me annually. 00:18:51
I can look up annually in the code that was that I think that second which which one it was. Well, this is for council discussion 00:18:58
right here. If you'd like to pass something up here, I don't mind taking it. 00:19:03
Yeah, All right there. 00:19:10
So in the entirety of the entire chapter of Utah Code about special purpose local entities, which covers all types of 00:19:19
redevelopment activities, the word annually appears twice. The one that I think was referenced is talking about. The auditor of 00:19:26
the county shall provide a report. 00:19:33
Either at least annually and upon request of the taxing entity committee. There's nothing talking about that the taxing entity 00:19:40
committee meets annually. And I think another thing that's maybe misunderstood is the use of terminology. 00:19:48
So I've noticed that commonly people just say the phrase RDA. 00:19:57
And then they're actually referring to like potentially six or seven different kinds of things. So I think it's helpful to just be 00:20:02
clear about what terms mean what. So the RDA stands for the Redevelopment Agency, which is a special purpose local entity, which 00:20:10
is you all the board of an entity called the Redevelopment Agency. That is not synonymous with the Geneva Urban renewal project 00:20:18
area. It's not synonymous with tax increment financing. 00:20:26
It's not synonymous with. 00:20:34
High, high transit reinvestment zone, it's not synonymous with, there's a whole host of things that occur, whether that's a 00:20:38
redevelopment tool or a legal obligation or, you know, some type of a tax policy. There's all different kinds of things that the, 00:20:45
the phrase RDA does not refer to. So but, but I understand that colloquially you might just use the term RDA, but but you might be 00:20:52
meaning different things. 00:21:00
So the taxing entity committee, for example, has no authority over the RDA whatsoever. The RDA may call a taxing entity committee 00:21:07
when it's required by law that taxing entities be asked to participate in tax increment financing. 00:21:16
You could create a redevelopment agency. That redevelopment agency you all could oversee a whole host of activities that have 00:21:26
nothing to do with taxing entities. You wouldn't need to have a taxing entity committee if you weren't doing activities that would 00:21:33
require the consent of a taxing entity committee. The only reason you need the consent of a taxing entity committee is if you, as 00:21:41
an RDA decide to use the tool of tax increment financing and you seek the tax increment financing or TIF. 00:21:48
Participation of another taxing entity beyond the city of Vineyard. 00:21:56
I mean, and even if you were to, let's say only have Vineyard participate in the TIF, you would still have a taxing entity 00:22:01
committee, which would be a member or two of your City Council who would meet to a consent to the the Vineyard Rdas proposal of, 00:22:08
of, you know, tax increment financing. A silly example, but the only reason there's a taxing entity committee in this scenario is 00:22:14
because. 00:22:20
First, the RDA was formed, that's you all, a legal entity. The RDA was formed. Once the RDA was formed, the RDA investigated the 00:22:28
possibility of designating an urban renewal project area in the form of the Geneva urban renewal project area. So there was an 00:22:36
investigation, so to speak, or research. There was a survey, right. And once the survey results came back, then you know, survey 00:22:43
as in you know, land survey and kind of looking at the brownfield nature of the site, etcetera, etcetera. 00:22:51
Once that process was done, then the RDA board decided to, under the law, the Community Reinvestment Act in Utah, designate a 00:22:59
project area. And so the the Geneva Urban Renewal project area was designated as a redevelopment project area. And so then the 00:23:08
next step would be to have a proposed budget for that project area. And so the RDA at that point met as a board to propose a 00:23:16
project area budget for the Geneva Urban Renewal project area. 00:23:24
And because that budget. 00:23:33
Sought the utilization of tax increment financing, then you wanted to seek the the participation in that tax increment financing 00:23:36
of various taxing entities, the county, the school district, the water district, the city. And so that's at what point the RDA 00:23:42
called for there to be a taxing entity committee meeting. The taxing entity then approved or consented to the project area budget, 00:23:49
which is that multi year budget. 00:23:55
And by approving that budget, they were consenting to participation in the tax increment financing. And so that is a essentially 00:24:03
kind of a one time thing that occurs, although there were some changes early on. And so there were a series of meetings that took 00:24:09
place over a couple of years before the current project area budget that you all operate under for multi years was finally 00:24:16
approved now. 00:24:23
You as a board might choose to utilize other kinds of tools that have nothing to do with the tax increment financing that's being 00:24:30
participated in by the school district, et cetera. And those tools wouldn't necessarily and don't require any consent or meeting 00:24:37
of the taxing entity committee. 00:24:43
So that's, I think it's just important to understand the sort of different legal obligations and definitions of the different 00:24:50
types of entities and and tools so to speak that that you all are involved in managing. And so what's happening today is you're 00:24:58
simply approving budgets, both the annual budget ending this fiscal year and 24 and also next fiscal year's budget for the 00:25:05
redevelopment agency, not the project area budget. 00:25:13
Not anything to do with the taxing entity committee. And so your annual budget as an agency does not require any involvement or 00:25:21
consent from the taxing entity committee because you're not seeking to amend the multi year project area budget. So I think once 00:25:28
you sort of think about those, what those different terms mean and the different requirements and legal authorities of those 00:25:35
different entities, I think it helps for things to then come into come into understanding. 00:25:43
We can just magically say, hey, no, we're going to extend it for 50 and we don't have to go back and talk to them and get consent. 00:26:56
OK. So what would be that budget and why haven't we seen that? So you see that in the annual report. That's the that's a big 00:27:34
budget schedule that shows the total utilization, projected utilization of tax increment financing over the course of, you know, 00:27:41
30 years or whatever it is. I don't forget the number of years that schedule shows. But so that what that shows is we're going to 00:27:48
receive increment for the project area over the course of multiple decades and there's that sort of master document. 00:27:55
So you're saying that if we had an adjustment to that master document, the project area budget, then we would be required to get 00:28:04
together with a taxing entity committee and vote on that together? 00:28:11
Consent to a change to that multi year project area budget and and that was done. Is the date 2008, is that correct? No, I think 00:28:19
the last meeting was in 2011. OK, that's right. 2011, yeah. 00:28:26
OK, so that answered my question. Yeah, the question about the. I can dig in a little more as to the question about the duration 00:28:33
and extension now that we know that we're following the protocols and the laws. Well, that you believe, Mayor, I mean, let's 00:28:39
there's a panel here, there is opinions and then there's the facts that are being stated. And so if there's something more that 00:28:45
you need to understand, we did receive the information that was presented to us. Is there a different question? No, I just want to 00:28:51
make sure it's clear that it's. 00:28:58
You're speaking for you. Well, all I'm stating is that we now know that we're following it according to what was presented. 00:29:04
The facts have been presented to us. 00:29:13
Is there more? Is there another question that you have? I just don't understand how a government, how we can just extend and take. 00:29:15
Alpine School District dollars without for longer periods of time for more sums of money. 00:29:24
And not have to go back to the Alpine School District board for taking education dollars. 00:29:33
Because the size and scope and the amount and the duration have all changed, right? Can we just miraculously? 00:29:39
Bind these government entities without them ever meeting. I just have a question to clarify that I'm wondering what the difference 00:29:47
is. So the, the RDA, typically when we, when we trigger a phase, it's is it 25 years or 30 years, 25? Is that what we agreed on 00:29:55
with the taxing entity committee? Or is it like the duration of the entire project area? Was it like, because with different 00:30:02
phases, there's no way. 00:30:09
If we trigger phases at different times, there's no way we could hold true to that 25 year plan, so I'm wondering. 00:30:17
Was there an agreed amount of time is did we break protocol in extending it for longer periods of time for triggering? Because I 00:30:23
feel like we're talking about two different things, right? 00:30:31
I mean, Marty, Marty raises a good question and I think this is what Mr. Daniels was trying to address when he was saying. 00:30:41
You have to be precise in your use of language because the statute uses some terms that are similar, but they have different 00:30:49
definitions, and those definitions are important. When you look at the the section on the taxing entity committee, it talks about 00:30:56
when it's necessary for that committee to convene, and it's necessary when it did convene, which was to establish the initial 00:31:04
project area, to consent to the tax increment that would be provided to the project area. 00:31:12
And to establish a budget for the project area, the multi year budget, not the single year budget. And then once the project area 00:31:20
is established, you can have different phases within the RDA that. 00:31:27
Trigger at different intervals. When you trigger, it's a maximum of a 25 year interval, but not all portions of the project area 00:31:34
are triggered at the same time. 00:31:39
And so you do have decisions that the RDA board has made over the years to trigger certain parcels at certain times so that the 00:31:44
increment once you trigger it then takes effect. 00:31:50
And begins to be gathered and accrued and can be used for the benefit of that area. 00:31:56
There's not a need other than. 00:32:02
If you expand the tax increment or if you expand the taxing area for that committee to convene on a regular basis. So what you're 00:32:07
saying, So what you're saying is the land size, the map stays the same and the total 300 dollars, 300 million stays the same. 00:32:14
There's no consent or need, need for them to reconvene or have oversized. You're making your decisions within those parameters. 00:32:22
You don't have to take that decision back, back to the taxing entity committee. 00:32:30
OK, this is extremely dangerous for our kids in education. I just don't see how. I don't see how the Alpine School District board 00:32:41
wouldn't be involved with 60% as their money. You're entitled to your viewpoint of things tonight, as we saw last meeting. I don't 00:32:48
wish to challenge that, right. I'm just saying hold on one second. Go ahead, Amber. They are reaping the benefits of it. 00:32:55
But they're making more. 00:33:03
Than they would have had that project area not been developed. 00:33:04
Right. I think what was shown last time is that instead of making 2000, we made 46,000, yet we've put in 180 million. So in All in 00:33:08
all, we haven't won out. We made $44,000 more. Well, it was just being reviewed from one site. So, but I wanted to make clear 00:33:17
we're like hundreds of millions in and making 40,000 more in one parcel. So it wasn't proved last meeting. 00:33:26
Well, I think it was in the sense. 00:33:35
You're changing the context. 00:33:38
That's all I have to say. 00:33:40
But the the conversation for the purpose of this meeting where you you've held your budget hearing and you're making your budget 00:33:42
decision, the assertion that. 00:33:46
Some individuals made during the hearing and that you have asked is, is the budget coming to the RDA Board in an unlawful manner? 00:33:50
And the answer is no. And I think we pointed to the chapter and verse that drives that distinction between what happens for the 00:33:59
overall project area and the overall project area budget and that that's a different action and a different decision than the 00:34:07
annual RDA budget that you'll be acting on today. Excellent. To that point, let's go back to the amendments. Yes. Could we have 00:34:15
some just clarification? Maybe give us some just for the public. 00:34:22
Just some explanation on what the amendment means What? 00:34:30
Just break it down a little bit just to be helpful. 00:34:34
Sure. So the top half of this document are the revenues. 00:34:37
So what this is saying is, you know the previous year tax increment revenues were about 7.9 million and this year the tax 00:34:43
increment revenues are about 10 and a half million. 00:34:47
And then there's other revenues, including interest, and a portion of the tax increment is considered admin revenue. 00:34:53
And then grant revenue is like state funding, which sometimes is available for transportation projects or or any other kind of 00:35:03
outside source of revenue beyond interest bond proceeds and the and the tax increment. So the and then fund balance appropriation 00:35:10
just means that that's your carryover fund balance. So that's characterized as a revenue. So that gives you 36 million in annual 00:35:18
revenue. And then the the lower half of the document are the sort of. 00:35:25
Categories of expenses this year that were budgeted, so you know big ones are like TIF related payments, that's where you make 00:35:33
reimbursement payments for development activities, for backbone infrastructure per the project plan, capital expenses that's you 00:35:43
know fixed assets that are created in the city, a lot of transportation type infrastructure, other kinds of public infrastructure. 00:35:52
Then you have your debt service payments, both principal and interest, and then the general fund transfer of admin. What that is 00:36:03
is you take the admin revenue that you receive and you transfer that to the city's general fund to defray the overhead and 00:36:10
administrative costs of operating the RDA that the city bears. And that's important because basically you're not actually asking 00:36:18
the city's general fund to subsidize the operations of the redevelopment agency. 00:36:25
Rather, the redevelopment agencies administrative cost is borne by the agency through its specific administrative revenue fee. 00:36:33
So, so like a good example is tonight we're using city funds to work for the RDA exactly project area, OK. 00:36:43
Any other questions about the amendment? 00:36:53
If not, there's a motion on the table. I had a first by Amber. Can I get a second? Is this to vote on it? No, I'm not done yet. 00:36:56
OK. What are your questions about the amendments? I just want to put into the record that this process was very flawed not knowing 00:37:03
about obvious our our lobbyist is working for this on the RDA side being paid through that not given obviously me not getting a 00:37:09
broke down of of what that is I think for the record. 00:37:16
Both of the last two meetings I've asked to kind of get an itemized understanding of that and then also just representing the the 00:37:23
history of the RDA and the men and women that created it. None of these projects were envisioned for these side little projects of 00:37:30
a town hall or any of these types of things. 00:37:37
The RDA originally, and I'm shocked that we have the authority legally to do it. 00:37:44
Was one cleanup and that's it. 00:37:49
And two, to bring in a business or anchor business that would create the revenue necessary to sustain our city. It was not to 00:37:52
beautify or clean up or $5,000,000 LRS project in the middle of the lake or just all the various different things that that this 00:38:00
is. And I feel horrible for the taxpayers throughout the county, throughout the school district, throughout the water authority 00:38:08
and the sewer that they have no representation from that beginning meeting back in 2011 that started this. 00:38:16
That we now can. 00:38:24
Exemplify or just take them out of the tax code and not pay our fair share to Alpine School District for our schools. 00:38:27
And I just want to make that in the code of that's why I'll be voting no is I think this, I think the whole RDA is, is flawed. Can 00:38:34
I make a comment? Sure. I appreciate your concern, Jacob, But I, I think we have to stick with the facts here that if you, if we 00:38:42
want to continually look at the RDA and what we're doing, that's, that's a conversation to be had. But right now we're just, we're 00:38:50
just approving the amendments for the year 23 to 24. 00:38:58
And so for me, I'll be voting yes because for me, this looks like an administrative process that needs to be accomplished. And so 00:39:07
you, you don't have to finance any of these projects if you don't want to. So sure. So it's still Marty might fundamentally 00:39:13
disagree on certain things. And so I'm just letting you know and the public know that the reason why I'm voting for this is 00:39:18
because it's an administrative process with the budget. Actually, we're not talking about City Hall anything in this, we're 00:39:24
talking about. 00:39:30
The amendments for 2324 and then we can talk about the budget for next year, which? 00:39:37
I'm looking forward to talking about, but if there's concerns there, we can bring that up. But I will add that from my 00:39:44
understanding that around the state, there are several Rdas and we actually happen to be the only one with a brownfield that 00:39:52
requires clean up. And also in 2008 or whatever year that this was decided, if they only wanted it for one business, then there 00:39:59
should have been some changes in the contracts they signed. 00:40:07
I believe they understood what they were getting into, be it changed and molded a little bit with approvals how they wanted or not 00:40:14
when they signed the documents. If this wasn't what they wanted, I would have hoped that they would have changed it. So I can only 00:40:22
go off of what legally was signed and done and then from there I can go on a project by project basis. So I respect your 00:40:29
frustrations and concerns, but I am voting yes because it's administrative and I'm looking forward to talking about the next one. 00:40:36
Amber, did you have a closing remark? This will not be a back and forth on this discussion. 00:40:43
I just wanted to say that this is amendment, but we haven't even had the opportunity to have a discussion why and what's being 00:40:48
amended. So I will vote no because I I feel like. 00:40:55
These are things that I'd like to know and I have so many questions about it. So if you need something amended in your budget, I'd 00:41:03
really like to know before we're supposed to vote on it. That would be really helpful for me. 00:41:09
OK. Amber, did you have anything? 00:41:16
Just that I move to approve. 00:41:19
We talk about the returns and when we're talking about funding and and what we're getting for a return of investment, it's clear 00:41:53
also when you make statements inside of a RDA meeting where you say and it's not to fund the LRS project, no money was ever put 00:42:00
towards the RDA by. 00:42:06
For the LRS project and to simply state that as if that ever happened, that that was ever the intent or that that somehow this RDA 00:42:14
board would go out of the scope or that their chair would go out of it is just. 00:42:20
Umm, you're not being clear, You're not being honest in it. You've been told it and it's on the record. And so we are within the 00:42:27
scope that is my closing statement. And now we're calling for a motion. We are in the middle of a motion already. So I think we 00:42:33
can't do a point of order right now. 00:42:38
OK. 00:42:44
Mario will second the motion. OK, we have a first. We have a second. We already had a second by you and now we're going to go. 00:42:47
Sarah, no. 00:42:51
Marty yes. 00:42:55
Yes, Amber, I and no. All right, we are now going to move on to the next. 00:42:57
Item. 00:43:04
Let's see. 00:43:06
4.2 And actually I'm going to take a 3 minute pause and then we will come back to this. 00:43:08
I. 00:43:18
Yes. 00:43:24
Are we rolling? 00:43:41
OK. We're going to go ahead and start 4.2 discussion in action Financial final fiscal year 2024-2025 RDA Budget Resolution U2024-3 00:43:42
and our RDA Director, Josh Daniels will present. 00:43:50
Great. So we've had a couple of meetings and public hearing extended across two meetings to hear and review the adoption of the 00:44:01
annual budget for next fiscal year starting July 1. 00:44:07
So this is the budget schedule that's been proposed in your packet that's also up on the screen. So this is your kind of annual 00:44:15
adoption of the budget. What you just did was. 00:44:23
Adopt the final amended budget for the closing fiscal year. This is sort of for next year. 00:44:31
OK. Are there any questions by the board? 00:44:41
I would just reiterate what Sarah said of you know. 00:44:46
When we met with you, we didn't know we were doing a resolution to change last year's and this, so when we meet with you, it'd be 00:44:51
good to. 00:44:55
Closeout those two, I think that's what Sarah is, is we have to have the question or know the knowledge to be able to ask the 00:45:00
questions that we're adjusting it and that wasn't afforded to us on Marty on on your comment about. 00:45:06
That we were given the administrative function. 00:45:14
For the lay individual into this, it basically means that the founders created a $300 million credit card and we have a. 00:45:17
A spending limit to be able to go through and do that. So you are correct. 00:45:27
However, the organizers that set that credit card limit up, we're not thinking about going to all of those various things and I 00:45:31
believe that. 00:45:36
With no representation from Alpine School District to see. 00:45:43
You're right, we do have the ability to use that credit card and it's extremely dangerous. 00:45:48
To see those limits and so, or see where, where it goes, you could take that to Disneyland or you could do it whatever, you know, 00:45:54
like a like a I'm giving you an example of a family right of a credit card, but like. 00:46:00
On this, we're going to go take RDA money that was set aside to. 00:46:06
Build a tax base for Vineyard. 00:46:12
And we're going to put $1,000,000 towards the City Hall. 00:46:15
On that credit card and that was not originally. 00:46:19
And that will not bring US revenue to increase. 00:46:23
This is a this was a lifesaver, a lifeline by Mayor Farnsworth, Nate Riley, all of those to say we've got to go get a tax base to 00:46:27
be able to survive as a city. 00:46:34
It was not for beautification or or these types of things. They're nice things to have. 00:46:40
But we're sacrificing our kids education over it. 00:46:47
So. 00:46:51
In regards to things like the City Hall. 00:46:53
Are we the only ones paying for it? Do we have someone helping us that you know, because we're having partnerships with? 00:47:30
Not HBA, Mac. Thank you. We're having partnerships with MAG. Are we splitting that cost? There's a lot of discussions that we're 00:47:36
going to be having here forward. Yeah. And so and I know all those processes have to take place. Yeah, for sure. And so for me, as 00:47:44
I'm approving different things, I'm approving perspective things. So we're going to be voting on each of these things. And if at 00:47:51
the end of the day, I look at it and go, this is terrible, this isn't what I want or this is fantastic. 00:47:58
We're paying for something. This is a great price. This is something that we can have for a long time, even if we decide that this 00:48:05
isn't the time to build it. So I have a lot of decisions to make in regards to that. But right now for me, as I've gone through 00:48:11
the budget and I've had my meetings, I have under, I understand what I'm approving. And so the concerns I've had, I've brought up 00:48:18
already and I've had revisions behind like this has changed. This isn't the same as it was three months ago. And So what I'm 00:48:24
approving right now is a budget. 00:48:30
And I'm not approving specific projects because they have to be approved by us as we go along. On that note, is there anything 00:48:37
that you disagree with on capital projects in this budget? Well, not on this. I guess I'd have to look at the capital project 00:48:44
breakdown again. Could we put that up on the board? Thank you. 00:48:51
So while you're looking. 00:49:00
Again, I feel like I have to vote no. I'm still learning a lot about the RDA. I feel like I have a small little grasp on it. But 00:49:02
Eric, when we first started talking about this, you told me that that RDA specifically was meant to bring eventually bring revenue 00:49:10
back to the city. It couldn't be on projects that didn't bring revenue back to the city in some form. And there's a lot of these 00:49:17
items that will never bring revenue back to the city. 00:49:24
So I'm just, I'm a little confused. I want, I, I don't want to make decisions that will come back and bite, right? Like I want us 00:49:32
to make decisions going forward that are going to be good for everyone. So when we talk about the scope of the RDA, there is 00:49:39
cleanup, there's environmental and there's that's the cleanup, there's infrastructure and there's economic, there's economic 00:49:46
development that's all wrapped into. 00:49:54
Kind of the scope. 00:50:02
And so all of these things are meant to beautify, make the area good so that economic development and other things want to come in 00:50:04
here. But Sarah, if you do have something that you don't agree with, you can always tell us that you would like it off here and we 00:50:10
can discuss that here in this meeting. So if you see something on your list that you're like, hey, I would like to pull that from 00:50:17
here because I don't feel it fits with our goals and our scope. That's now your time to do that. 00:50:24
Can I add one thing real quick? 00:50:31
I feel like it's the age-old question, what do we invest to make money, right? Like are, is this the best way to spend our money? 00:50:34
Will that bring us a return? What are the values here? And I think we just have to, like you said, these goals that we have and 00:50:40
these things we're looking at. 00:50:46
Are these? 00:50:52
Are these what we want to? Does it work with our goals? Does it work with our plans, just like the mayor said? But I, I really 00:50:55
think the questions that are brought up are valid questions. I'm not, I'm not saying they're not at all. It's just. 00:51:01
It's a really, it's a really hard question to answer all at once. 00:51:07
Well, and I think The thing is, if you're finding something on the list, tell us, let's deliberate and then we can move forward 00:51:12
and check that off the list if we don't want it. They are stating that's not an updated list. It's not an updated list. But I 00:51:17
don't know if you have the list for the capital projects if you want to pull it up, yeah. 00:51:22
Anyway, think about it for a minute. Amber, do you have anything or Jake, do you have something that you'd like to see off of this 00:51:28
RDA budget in general or that you like about it that you wanted to increase anything? That's really what we're discussing here 00:51:35
tonight, a reduction or an increase, whatever you are doing, I just appreciate. I know we've had to cut, we've cut a lot of things 00:51:41
out and we've had a lot of negotiations and discussions with staff and. 00:51:48
I'm actually impressed with where we've gotten and I appreciate all the work that's been put into it. Thanks, Amber. Jake. 00:51:56
We have not had discussion and I believe that these have been. 00:52:06
Developed by staff instead of by citizens. As I reached out to many of them over the past year, I don't see any of the desires of 00:52:10
what they wanted in any of these. Nonetheless, I. 00:52:17
Revenue increases that would bring a tax base into this of what it is. So I wouldn't even like I agree Utah City would love us to 00:52:25
remove their their spur rail, right? Does that increase the value? Maybe it's probably one of the only ones that's there or. 00:52:35
But no, that's why I'd be voting no. But yeah, we. 00:52:45
It's scary. Is there something that you would want to remove? 00:52:50
That we could discuss. 00:52:55
Umm, like. 00:52:58
Go down by the list. I will be voting no on almost all of these. That's OK, we can talk about them if you need to. 00:53:02
If not City Hall design, City Hall construction, and you did talk a little bit about the City Hall design and where you felt. I 00:53:09
think the council has discussed that with you publicly a few Times Now. 00:53:14
So everybody has where they're sitting on that. What? What's another one? 00:53:18
Anderson East West Projects. 00:53:23
East West project. 00:53:26
OK. That's a reimbursement. So we're obligated. 00:53:28
Vineyard beach improvements. 00:53:34
That's a grant. 00:53:37
For some from the county, no From. 00:53:38
Yes, from the county, County TRCC funds the landscaping on the, I mean, we go up and down all yeah. So we got a large grant from 00:53:43
the county to clean up our lakefront. That's from the TRCC committee, the Vineyard Connector Promenade overpass. 00:53:50
Yep, that's that's approved and already, yeah, you got funded. 00:53:58
Yeah, anything that we cannot. I remember like 2 weeks ago we went through what was and what wasn't. 00:54:04
I don't see any business of bringing revenue into our city from it. 00:54:10
OK. Sarah and Marty, do you have anything left that you want to discuss or would you like to make a motion? 00:54:15
Economic strategic plan. 00:54:22
We've already committed to that. 00:54:25
The rail spur. 00:54:33
It is, it is funding we've got from the infrastructure bank. 00:54:35
So honestly like it would be so helpful. 00:54:39
If you. 00:54:42
If you just. 00:54:44
Put that in because I did talk to Eric and he explained a few things. The TRTC funded beach improvement, right? And so and also 00:54:45
the rail spur is also a grant, is that correct? Yeah. So those kind of things are really helpful information and I feel like. 00:54:55
Where we have lots of eyes on us right now, The more transparent we can be, the better. 00:55:05
Because a lot of this isn't coming necessarily directly from us. Then how? I guess I, like I said, I have so many, so many 00:55:11
questions. It would be nice. Yeah. Well, and we did, we did outline, we did outline these for the public before. 00:55:20
I don't know if we went individual and we could do it again if you wanted to, if that's meaningful to you in this discussion, if 00:55:29
it doesn't change how you're feeling, okay, if you'd like to go through them again for the public. But we did do this. 00:55:36
In a public meeting, but we could do it now if it's helpful. 00:55:44
The vast majority of. 00:55:48
Dollars being spent on these capital projects are dollars that are designated for the purpose of projects like these that have 00:55:50
been dollars specifically given to the redevelopment agency for these projects that that actually don't have anything to do with 00:55:59
tax increment financing revenue. So the idea that the project area receives tax increment financing revenues for the purpose of 00:56:07
reinvesting in environmental cleanup plus. 00:56:16
Other kinds of redevelopment activities designed to increase future revenues and land values. 00:56:24
That's separate from some of these things. So for example, Vineyard beach improvement. 00:56:31
None of the funds that are being allocated here for that capital project are tax increment financing revenues. There's a specific 00:56:38
funding source that the county makes available for all cities to use some sales tax, which are earmarked specifically for projects 00:56:44
that will increase. 00:56:50
Tourism and travel and recreation. 00:56:59
That that's what we're talking about here. So there's very little to know tax increment financing revenues being spent on these 00:57:33
capital projects. Largely your tax increment financing revenues are being spent in the form of previously executed reimbursement 00:57:41
agreements with private developers per the master project plan adopted in 2011 to conduct those redevelopment activities. You know 00:57:49
clean up being being a big one that's been discussed but then also. 00:57:56
Backbone infrastructure as they're developing the land. What's the City Hall? 00:58:04
Project is that TIFF? 00:58:11
I'm not certain that that one predates me. Any thoughts on that? Anybody else? 00:58:13
So the the the planning portion of City Hall design, the. 00:58:20
Funds that we're using for the City Hall design, is that tax increment, financing revenue or something else? 00:58:24
Anybody know for a fact? 00:58:30
We can get to the bottom of that. Yeah, it could be bond revenue, I believe so that it's, it's TIFF that that we're using for the 00:58:32
for the design of that. 00:58:37
So we can look into that more in more detail. 00:58:43
I did. 00:58:48
Specifically the Center St. overpass landscaping, to me that's completing a project. That neighborhood has a very large wall of 00:58:53
nothing, just a large wall. And so to me that that is finishing our commitment to a project and completing it for specifically the 00:59:01
people in that area. But the whole city benefits from that. And like you said, yeah. And like you said, it's the completion of the 00:59:08
road. 00:59:16
Yeah, I, I'm actually, I would, I would be a hard pass to stop doing that. I think that would be unfair to the community. 00:59:24
No like designating the project, like beautification and different things like that. 01:00:05
With the TIF money. 01:00:10
Because you're saying like, hey, give me an example off the list. Like specifically, I'm not sure I'm following, sorry. The 01:00:13
overpass is a great one, the 420,000. 01:00:17
The center St. overpass, so that's RDA TIF money. 01:00:23
Like. 01:00:27
Aren't that we the ones that designate like, oh, this because you said this is the purpose of this. It's like, aren't we the ones 01:00:29
designated what the purpose of it? 01:00:33
Well, if that's TIFF money, that's like 60 percent 200,000 from our schools, right? 01:00:39
So. 01:00:45
So if you're saying. 01:00:47
Center St. overpass landscaping costs, if you choose to spend RDA revenues on that project, then then yes, you have the discretion 01:00:49
to choose to spend revenue on that. 01:00:56
In terms of whether it qualifies for the utilization of TIF revenue, well that's pursuant to your project plan and your project 01:01:04
plan allows public spaces as part of your infrastructure in the city. 01:01:11
To be funded with TIF revenues. So if you look at the outline of the original project plan adopted in 2011, there's a like eight 01:01:19
different items that are the summary of kind of what the project plan allows in terms of the scope of your expenditures. Public 01:01:27
infrastructure, including parks and public spaces is included in that. So I suppose in that scenario you can say, oh, the 01:01:35
landscaping can be covered by TIF revenue, so perhaps the cities transportation budget. 01:01:43
Landscaping others was it was hey, as a carrot to bring in a big taxing entity. We could do a little bit of their landscaping or 01:02:23
we could. 01:02:27
All of those fringe things that we're talking about, but what all these projects have is it it's not connected to any tax base. 01:02:31
It's just. 01:02:35
Here's, you know, the overpass, here's a municipality, you know, building a town hall and it's lacking the if, if, if we could 01:02:39
keep this money so that we could go after a Nike or a Adobe or something like that to bring them in as a tax base. That's great. 01:02:47
What do you mean by bring them in as a tax base to lure them in and and give them incentives to be able to bring them into our 01:02:55
city like you're saying, like an incentive. 01:03:03
Incentive of beautification or doing some infrastructure to be able to go through and do it. 01:03:10
Yeah, 'cause I mean, you're not allowed to give direct incentives to the companies. That's right. You can do landscaping. That's 01:03:17
what I'm saying. Like that's what this was originally for, was connected to an incentive. If you can incentivize like an anchor 01:03:23
tenant like that through some type of infrastructure project and exactly that, that's a great example of how you could utilize the 01:03:29
funds. And Josh, if I can just add to the Center St. Overpass, Yeah, please. That that was part of a, a, a larger project. We had 01:03:35
the funds. 01:03:41
Have the time to get the the Center St. overpass, but we didn't have the funds to to do the beautification. And so and by 01:03:48
beautification we really mean landscaping, Yeah, the landscaping that that completes the infrastructure project. So that's how we 01:03:53
had looked at that as part of the infrastructure. 01:03:59
And so. 01:04:06
That's thank you, Morgan. 01:04:07
Hold on one second, Jake, on that. Is there anything else that you feel like you need clarity on? Is that something that, OK, 01:04:11
you're done? I was just telling Sarah and I wanted to put it, I wanted to say it for the record. She asked how is it that Center 01:04:18
St. Overpass can be a part of the RDA and it's within the boundary of the RDA. It also was a huge benefit to the city for safety, 01:04:26
getting people in and out of the city, which helps with the population growth that we're dealing with. 01:04:33
To me, I look at all and benefit to the RDA project, benefit to the RDA project. To me, I'm looking at all of these enhancements 01:04:41
and what I see is that we're improving upon the RDA project area, which will also in turn draw more businesses in if we are just a 01:04:48
barren landscape. 01:04:56
We're not going to be very desirable to businesses that are coming and looking at Vineyard. So yes, it might look like we might 01:05:04
all have different priorities. You know, we could get the whole city to take a poll and people might have different priorities. 01:05:12
But when I look through these lists, when I work with the city, what I've been voted to be here to make these decisions is, is 01:05:19
this best for the RDA project area? And I believe if as we go through each one that I feel comfortable with each of these items. 01:05:27
To improve upon that. Excellent. Sarah, did you have anything else that you want to discuss? Is there something that catches your 01:05:34
eye that you feel like we should talk about that would help you get to the other side of it tonight? 01:05:41
I met with Eric about a lot of it and it made sense because a lot of it isn't necessarily coming from. 01:05:50
And you're it was through grants and things like that. 01:05:57
Or reimbursements? 01:06:01
So I. 01:06:03
I feel like I'm. I feel like I'm OK with. 01:06:05
Because City Hall is just a construction savings, it's not necessarily committing us to anything. 01:06:09
I feel like that needs to be a large roundtable discussion before anything happens, so if it's strictly put into savings, I'm OK 01:06:14
with that. 01:06:18
Umm. 01:06:23
And I think I understand, I think I understand the rail spur is that also is a grant. 01:06:28
Anderson, East and West is reimbursement. So I think the rest of it makes sense. What about the design, like the savings of 01:06:34
construction is 2,000,000, but the design we're going to spend, we'll still have to go through that RFP process, right, That 01:06:39
doesn't. 01:06:44
And from what I understood, Eric said we were splitting the cost of the design with Mag. 01:06:53
Right. So we're, we're only online for half of that, but they would be partners in the build. 01:06:59
So, yeah, we we would send that out for RFP and then we would bring back a proposal that was the most qualified and kind of 01:07:06
cheapest we'd find kind of that that Nexus and then the city count, aren't they City Council would make it, make an approval or 01:07:12
ask for an adjustment or deny it. 01:07:19
OK. 01:07:26
As well, the way that you guys have designed it, it will have slight, not a lot maybe, but some well and the RDA is also run in 01:07:28
that area and they're going to dig deeper into how we're going to finance it. So there's more discussion that needs to be had. OK, 01:07:36
with that, I feel comfortable with going ahead and calling for a motion. 01:07:43
But I need somebody to make it. 01:07:54
God moved to adopt. 01:07:57
I make a motion to adopt the. 01:08:00
2020 I don't have it. The 2024-2025 Redevelopment Agency budget. 01:08:03
All right, we have a first by Marty, can I get a second, second, second by. 01:08:12
Three, Thank you so much, Jamie. 01:08:18
All right. 01:08:21
Sarah. 01:08:24
Aye, Marty. 01:08:26
Yay. Yay. Amber, I and Jake. No. All right, this meeting is adjourned and we'll be starting the next meeting shortly. 01:08:27
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All right, today is Wednesday, June 26, 2024. The time is 6:00 and we're going to open up our Redevelopment Agency board meeting. 00:00:02
We're going to start out by having Board member Rasmussen lead us in an inspirational thought and the Pledge of Allegiance. 00:00:11
First of all, welcome to the Vineyard City Council meeting, everyone. We're glad you're here. Happy to see you. 00:00:21
I just wanted to share a quick quote and just an inspirational thought. Keep your face always toward the sunshine and shadows will 00:00:27
fall behind you. Walt Whitman. Now please stand for the pledge. 00:00:32
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, 00:00:41
indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. 00:00:48
All right, that brings us into our consent items. I just need a motion from the board. 00:00:57
I move to approve the consent items as presented. Thank you first by Amber. Can I get a second? 00:01:10
Second. Second by Marty. Any discussion? 00:01:18
All right, all in favor. Aye, aye. Any opposed? No. All right, that's passed. We'll go ahead and move on to our business items. 00:01:22
We'll start with our public hearing amending the Vineyard RDA Fiscal Year 2023-2024 Budget amendment #2 Resolution U2024-2. And 00:01:29
we're just going to go right into a public hearing and then we'll have our RDA Director, Josh Daniels present the amendments. I 00:01:37
need a motion. 00:01:44
I move to go into a public hearing. Thank you, Marty. Second, second by Amber. All in favor, aye. All right. We are now in a 00:01:52
public hearing, Josh. 00:01:57
So at the end of each fiscal year, local government entities have to. 00:02:06
Basically adopt an amended budget because there may be changes that occurred during the year. So that's what this is. It's so it's 00:02:12
customary at your last annual meeting or last meeting in the fiscal year which is today to adopt A final amended budget, so. 00:02:20
The budget schedule is in your agenda packet and just kind of reflects updates of of any changes. It's actually pretty, pretty 00:02:29
close to what was originally adopted. 00:02:34
OK. Are there? 00:02:42
Any questions from the public? 00:02:44
Come on up, state your name where you're from. 00:02:47
Any comments? 00:02:50
Just did you already do the hearing or is that next? 00:02:52
This is the hearing. This is the hearing. 00:02:55
Hello, my name is John Barrack. I am a taxpayer in the Alpine School District of which the Vineyard RDA is has is a is an entity. 00:03:02
The Alpine School District is a member of the taxing Entities Committee. I came and spoke at your last meeting and I'm here to 00:03:11
speak again. The last time the taxing entities committee met, which is a required meet, it's a required that they meet was 2011. I 00:03:20
am reading from resolution number. Thank you for posting this on your online site. Now resolution number T for taxing. 00:03:30
2901 formed. You're taxing any committee and it says in order to ascertain and stay abreast of the status of the project area, the 00:03:39
taxing entity committee shall meet at least annually during the time that the agency receives tax increment under a budget for the 00:03:46
project area. And if I'm not mistaken, you started receiving tax increment financing in 2011, the last time the taxing entity 00:03:54
committee met and it hasn't met since. So this is what your own document says. 00:04:02
From your own taxing in committee, these are the things that they must do at a meet, at a present, at a TEC meeting at which a 00:04:09
quorum is present. And since they haven't met since 2011, you couldn't have had a meeting nor a quorum to approve a draft plan for 00:04:16
the project area, which they did in 2011, approve or disprove a draft budget, which they did in 2011, approve or disapprove 00:04:23
amendments to a budget for the project area, which you're talking about today, which they did not approve or consent to. 00:04:30
In 2004, in 2015, your phase two was approved by this body and it said that you had the consent of the taxing entity committee, 00:04:39
but since they hadn't met since 2011, that would have been impossible. In 2016, your, your phase three, your resolution said you 00:04:46
had consent of the taxing entity committee, but obviously that was wrong because they hadn't met once again since what, 2011 and 00:04:54
two in your phase four, I can find no resolution for it. And in 2023, your phase 5A. 00:05:02
But your own document shows that Guy Fugle, who was on the Alpine School District board about 10 years ago, was a member of the 00:05:46
Taxing Any committee, as was Rob Smith, who just recently retired. And it still lists Nathan Riley and Nathan Crane from Vineyard. 00:05:53
And I think they've been off the council or the RDA 10 years for a decade or more. 00:06:00
So once again, more questions and answers and I'm still waiting. Thank you so much for your time. 00:06:08
My name is John Gadd. I'm also a resident of Alpine School District so. 00:06:19
I don't like property taxes. I don't think anybody likes property taxes. But if we're going to pay them, everybody should pay the 00:06:23
same amount. And what's going on here with this Rdas? You're giving out 10s of millions of dollars, potentially hundreds of 00:06:29
millions of dollars in tax breaks to certain entities within your city and then people like me. 00:06:35
In another city have to pay more to Alpine School District and Utah County and all these different places and so. 00:06:42
When you give out these tax breaks, all the citizens have to make up the difference. 00:06:48
So I pay more and my parents in their 70s pay more, and my grandma in her 90s pay more, and all these other seniors who are on 00:06:53
fixed incomes pay more. 00:06:57
So it has a meaningful impact in peoples lives. Now as I started to look into this RDA that you guys have going here, I've become 00:07:01
concerned that you're not following the law. 00:07:07
I submitted a grammar request to you guys a couple weeks ago and you came back and what's supposed to happen is all of the taxing 00:07:14
entities who give out who, who miss out on this tax money because you're giving out these tax breaks like Alpine School District 00:07:20
in Utah County and the water district and your own city. They're supposed to be a committee, a taxing any committee with people 00:07:25
from each of those entities and they're supposed to be overseeing what you guys do. They're supposed to be approving things before 00:07:31
you do it. 00:07:37
And so I sent a request to you guys and I said, hey, tell me about this taxing ending committee, show me their minutes where 00:07:44
they've been approving all this stuff that you guys do. And you guys sent me back. 00:07:48
Their minutes and the last time they had a meeting was 2011. So for the last 13 years, all of these entities who are supposed to 00:07:54
be overseeing you haven't been meeting at all. 00:07:59
So what you guys have been doing is just doing your own thing without any oversight, and that's contrary to the law. 00:08:05
So tonight you're going to you want to adopt A budget, right? 00:08:11
Here's two sections from Utah code. You might want to write these down. You might want to have your attorney look them up. You 00:08:14
might want to get better legal counsel because apparently you guys have been doing this stuff for 13 years illegally. 00:08:21
So Utah code 17C-2-204, subsection 1A. Did everybody get that? No. Can you do that again? Sure, 17C-2. 00:08:28
204. 00:08:39
Subsection 1A. 00:08:41
And there's a lot of stuff, but I'm going to read the part that matters for this budget that you're trying to pass tonight. 00:08:46
But what I'm saying is it's going, if you have a timer, you put it up on the board so I can see it. And I know how much time I 00:09:25
have. Yeah, I can't do it after the fact or midstream. I think we actually stated in our code that I can. Well, to stop the back 00:09:32
and forth, I'm going to give you one minute and you may continue. Each agency shall, and when the law says shall, you have to do 00:09:38
it. Each agency shall obtain the consent of the Taxing Enemy Committee for each urban renewal project area budget. 00:09:45
You shall get their approval before you do the budget. Here's another 117C-2 dash 2012 EI. Did everybody get that? 00:09:52
Can you repeat yourself 17C? 00:10:04
201. 00:10:07
Subsection 2 E. 00:10:11
I it reads to adopt an urban renewal project area budget, the agency shall. 00:10:14
Approve or excuse me, obtain the approval of the taxing enemy committee on the proposed project area budget or a revised version 00:10:22
of the proposed project area budget. So both of these code sections clearly state that before you adopt A budget, you shall obtain 00:10:28
the approval of the taxing entity committee, which hasn't met in 13 years. So clearly they haven't given you their approval 00:10:35
tonight since you if you move forward adopting a budget. 00:10:42
That you shall obtain their approval before you do it. 00:10:49
It seems like you're breaking the law. 00:10:53
So please don't break the law. Please don't adopt A budget without without getting the taxing ending committee's approval. 00:10:56
Tonight. 00:11:03
Thank you. 00:11:04
Any further comments? 00:11:11
Come on up. 00:11:13
Ship price Providence. So I'm a little late to the game but. 00:11:16
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I understand that you guys are coming together today to talk about possibly changing the taxes for 00:11:21
the City of Vineyard to accommodate a new budget proposal. 00:11:27
I want to come forward and tell you that. 00:11:35
Everybody in this community is dealing with inflation. 00:11:39
That economies. 00:11:43
Terrible gas prices. 00:11:47
Bad interest rates, all of the things that are affecting every single person in this room. 00:11:49
At this point. 00:11:57
To come in and say we had a shortfall from our spending from last year and we would like to make up with it by raising your taxes 00:11:59
in a moment where everybody's already bleeding to death. 00:12:04
This is a really bad time for you guys to make these types of Corrections to behavior that should have been fixed last year. 00:12:11
There are things in your budget that don't need to happen this year. I would ask, as one of your taxpayers and as a constituent 00:12:21
who voted for you, people who are sitting on the stand. 00:12:26
To be considerate and to think about what kind of impact a tax increase would have on people who are already struggling. 00:12:33
And to make decisions that would benefit the people who live here. 00:12:44
By giving them a reprieve from a terrible economy. 00:12:51
And bad inflation. 00:12:55
I would love to have a pay increase. I can tell you in the private sector those are hard to come by. 00:12:57
I can ask. 00:13:07
But it doesn't come. 00:13:09
The problem with government is that you spend money that's not yours. 00:13:11
I'm asking you to be representative of us. 00:13:16
All right. And just as a reminder, this is the public hearing for the 2324 RDA amendment. So let's keep, let's try to keep the 00:13:23
business within the hearing for this and then talk about any additional things on the other items throughout the agenda. All 00:13:29
right, any other comments? 00:13:35
OK. Let's go ahead and close the public hearing. I move to close the public hearing. Thank you. 00:13:43
I need a second second. 00:13:49
Second by Marty, all in favor. 00:13:51
Aye, all right. We're now out of a public hearing and this is a time for the board to discuss. 00:13:54
Go ahead and discuss what are your questions. 00:14:00
Or can I get a motion? 00:14:03
I move to approve let resolution U 20242. 00:14:13
OK. We have a first by Amber, I'd like to talk. 00:14:18
Jamie with a motion on the table. 00:14:24
There's a motion, a second and then the chair will recognize for discussion. OK, is there a second? 00:14:28
OK. Is there not a second because you want to hear Jakes discussion because we can have the discussion afterwards or do you not 00:14:36
intend to approve the budget? 00:14:41
My full intentions was to approve budgets, but I wanted to discuss some of the concerns, I guess, OK. 00:14:48
Since there's no second Jamie, do I just? 00:14:57
You're a voting member. You can second, or you can have the discussion before the 2nd. 00:15:00
OK, let's go on half of the discussion. 00:15:05
Go ahead. 00:15:07
Jake, you. Yeah, I can go over my stuff. 00:15:09
I'd really like to know about that taxing entity question. I read the documents myself. 00:15:13
And are you referring to the code section that the Yeah, the commenter. So I when, when I sat down with Mayor Farnsworth, it was 00:15:18
very clear the RDA was formed by a lot of government entities and by code they have to give us the jurisdiction every year. 00:15:28
And I reached out to the county personally and they had no clue what we were doing. And I also reached out to the school district 00:15:37
and they. 00:15:41
Normally would be approving every year. I reached out to Nate Riley and he thought he served on it and every and that was in 00:15:46
practice. 00:15:52
And each project, Top Golf or whatever, you know, back in the day it was Megaplex would have to go through approval through them. 00:15:58
So. 00:16:08
Yeah, I. 00:16:10
It says straight in there that they have to do that. 00:16:13
There there may be a misreading of the code by the gentleman that presented that. 00:16:18
And so let me Orient you and then our RDA director can speak up a little bit on what the practice has been of the RDA and and why 00:16:23
it's compliant so. 00:16:29
The two sections of code that were read, it was 17 C 2204, and then I think it was one subsection A and then seventeen, C22O12E 00:16:35
Roman at one. Both of those refer to the project area budget being approved by the Taxing Entity Committee. 00:16:45
This is an annual budget of the RDA. 00:16:56
Expenditures and budget activities. It's not the overall project area budget. 00:16:59
Project area budget is a defined term in the statute. It's in 17 C 110247 which is on the screen. Oh, thank you. You pulled it up. 00:17:06
And it means a multi year projection of annual or cumulative revenues and expenses and other fiscal matters pertaining to a 00:17:16
project area. 00:17:20
Prepared in accordance with and then it lists off. 00:17:24
The various types of Rdas and project areas that can be established so my read of that. 00:17:28
That's your multi year budget that relates to the entire project area and that's the time at which you would have. 00:17:36
That group involved in making approvals not your annual budget. So is that for clarification, are you saying that like on each 00:17:43
phase is when no trigger at the very beginning, when it's when it's established right at the outset. So just like when the RDA is 00:17:50
created, that's the project area budget that we first. 00:17:57
Voted through in 2008, the assertion of the of the commenter during the public hearing was that the city's behaving improperly. We 00:18:06
haven't followed the right. 00:18:11
Not the city. Rather, the RDA board has behaved improperly by bringing the budget forward today because there hasn't been 00:18:17
engagement at that level. And I think it's either a misreading of the statute or an intentional misrepresentation of what that 00:18:24
process is, because it's to occur when the project area budget is established, not when your annual budget's established. So by my 00:18:31
read of the statute and my understanding of what you're doing. 00:18:38
The budget is coming to you properly, but it still means that they they must meet annually though. No, there's no they don't have. 00:18:46
So it says meet annually and then you don't need me annually. 00:18:51
I can look up annually in the code that was that I think that second which which one it was. Well, this is for council discussion 00:18:58
right here. If you'd like to pass something up here, I don't mind taking it. 00:19:03
Yeah, All right there. 00:19:10
So in the entirety of the entire chapter of Utah Code about special purpose local entities, which covers all types of 00:19:19
redevelopment activities, the word annually appears twice. The one that I think was referenced is talking about. The auditor of 00:19:26
the county shall provide a report. 00:19:33
Either at least annually and upon request of the taxing entity committee. There's nothing talking about that the taxing entity 00:19:40
committee meets annually. And I think another thing that's maybe misunderstood is the use of terminology. 00:19:48
So I've noticed that commonly people just say the phrase RDA. 00:19:57
And then they're actually referring to like potentially six or seven different kinds of things. So I think it's helpful to just be 00:20:02
clear about what terms mean what. So the RDA stands for the Redevelopment Agency, which is a special purpose local entity, which 00:20:10
is you all the board of an entity called the Redevelopment Agency. That is not synonymous with the Geneva Urban renewal project 00:20:18
area. It's not synonymous with tax increment financing. 00:20:26
It's not synonymous with. 00:20:34
High, high transit reinvestment zone, it's not synonymous with, there's a whole host of things that occur, whether that's a 00:20:38
redevelopment tool or a legal obligation or, you know, some type of a tax policy. There's all different kinds of things that the, 00:20:45
the phrase RDA does not refer to. So but, but I understand that colloquially you might just use the term RDA, but but you might be 00:20:52
meaning different things. 00:21:00
So the taxing entity committee, for example, has no authority over the RDA whatsoever. The RDA may call a taxing entity committee 00:21:07
when it's required by law that taxing entities be asked to participate in tax increment financing. 00:21:16
You could create a redevelopment agency. That redevelopment agency you all could oversee a whole host of activities that have 00:21:26
nothing to do with taxing entities. You wouldn't need to have a taxing entity committee if you weren't doing activities that would 00:21:33
require the consent of a taxing entity committee. The only reason you need the consent of a taxing entity committee is if you, as 00:21:41
an RDA decide to use the tool of tax increment financing and you seek the tax increment financing or TIF. 00:21:48
Participation of another taxing entity beyond the city of Vineyard. 00:21:56
I mean, and even if you were to, let's say only have Vineyard participate in the TIF, you would still have a taxing entity 00:22:01
committee, which would be a member or two of your City Council who would meet to a consent to the the Vineyard Rdas proposal of, 00:22:08
of, you know, tax increment financing. A silly example, but the only reason there's a taxing entity committee in this scenario is 00:22:14
because. 00:22:20
First, the RDA was formed, that's you all, a legal entity. The RDA was formed. Once the RDA was formed, the RDA investigated the 00:22:28
possibility of designating an urban renewal project area in the form of the Geneva urban renewal project area. So there was an 00:22:36
investigation, so to speak, or research. There was a survey, right. And once the survey results came back, then you know, survey 00:22:43
as in you know, land survey and kind of looking at the brownfield nature of the site, etcetera, etcetera. 00:22:51
Once that process was done, then the RDA board decided to, under the law, the Community Reinvestment Act in Utah, designate a 00:22:59
project area. And so the the Geneva Urban Renewal project area was designated as a redevelopment project area. And so then the 00:23:08
next step would be to have a proposed budget for that project area. And so the RDA at that point met as a board to propose a 00:23:16
project area budget for the Geneva Urban Renewal project area. 00:23:24
And because that budget. 00:23:33
Sought the utilization of tax increment financing, then you wanted to seek the the participation in that tax increment financing 00:23:36
of various taxing entities, the county, the school district, the water district, the city. And so that's at what point the RDA 00:23:42
called for there to be a taxing entity committee meeting. The taxing entity then approved or consented to the project area budget, 00:23:49
which is that multi year budget. 00:23:55
And by approving that budget, they were consenting to participation in the tax increment financing. And so that is a essentially 00:24:03
kind of a one time thing that occurs, although there were some changes early on. And so there were a series of meetings that took 00:24:09
place over a couple of years before the current project area budget that you all operate under for multi years was finally 00:24:16
approved now. 00:24:23
You as a board might choose to utilize other kinds of tools that have nothing to do with the tax increment financing that's being 00:24:30
participated in by the school district, et cetera. And those tools wouldn't necessarily and don't require any consent or meeting 00:24:37
of the taxing entity committee. 00:24:43
So that's, I think it's just important to understand the sort of different legal obligations and definitions of the different 00:24:50
types of entities and and tools so to speak that that you all are involved in managing. And so what's happening today is you're 00:24:58
simply approving budgets, both the annual budget ending this fiscal year and 24 and also next fiscal year's budget for the 00:25:05
redevelopment agency, not the project area budget. 00:25:13
Not anything to do with the taxing entity committee. And so your annual budget as an agency does not require any involvement or 00:25:21
consent from the taxing entity committee because you're not seeking to amend the multi year project area budget. So I think once 00:25:28
you sort of think about those, what those different terms mean and the different requirements and legal authorities of those 00:25:35
different entities, I think it helps for things to then come into come into understanding. 00:25:43
We can just magically say, hey, no, we're going to extend it for 50 and we don't have to go back and talk to them and get consent. 00:26:56
OK. So what would be that budget and why haven't we seen that? So you see that in the annual report. That's the that's a big 00:27:34
budget schedule that shows the total utilization, projected utilization of tax increment financing over the course of, you know, 00:27:41
30 years or whatever it is. I don't forget the number of years that schedule shows. But so that what that shows is we're going to 00:27:48
receive increment for the project area over the course of multiple decades and there's that sort of master document. 00:27:55
So you're saying that if we had an adjustment to that master document, the project area budget, then we would be required to get 00:28:04
together with a taxing entity committee and vote on that together? 00:28:11
Consent to a change to that multi year project area budget and and that was done. Is the date 2008, is that correct? No, I think 00:28:19
the last meeting was in 2011. OK, that's right. 2011, yeah. 00:28:26
OK, so that answered my question. Yeah, the question about the. I can dig in a little more as to the question about the duration 00:28:33
and extension now that we know that we're following the protocols and the laws. Well, that you believe, Mayor, I mean, let's 00:28:39
there's a panel here, there is opinions and then there's the facts that are being stated. And so if there's something more that 00:28:45
you need to understand, we did receive the information that was presented to us. Is there a different question? No, I just want to 00:28:51
make sure it's clear that it's. 00:28:58
You're speaking for you. Well, all I'm stating is that we now know that we're following it according to what was presented. 00:29:04
The facts have been presented to us. 00:29:13
Is there more? Is there another question that you have? I just don't understand how a government, how we can just extend and take. 00:29:15
Alpine School District dollars without for longer periods of time for more sums of money. 00:29:24
And not have to go back to the Alpine School District board for taking education dollars. 00:29:33
Because the size and scope and the amount and the duration have all changed, right? Can we just miraculously? 00:29:39
Bind these government entities without them ever meeting. I just have a question to clarify that I'm wondering what the difference 00:29:47
is. So the, the RDA, typically when we, when we trigger a phase, it's is it 25 years or 30 years, 25? Is that what we agreed on 00:29:55
with the taxing entity committee? Or is it like the duration of the entire project area? Was it like, because with different 00:30:02
phases, there's no way. 00:30:09
If we trigger phases at different times, there's no way we could hold true to that 25 year plan, so I'm wondering. 00:30:17
Was there an agreed amount of time is did we break protocol in extending it for longer periods of time for triggering? Because I 00:30:23
feel like we're talking about two different things, right? 00:30:31
I mean, Marty, Marty raises a good question and I think this is what Mr. Daniels was trying to address when he was saying. 00:30:41
You have to be precise in your use of language because the statute uses some terms that are similar, but they have different 00:30:49
definitions, and those definitions are important. When you look at the the section on the taxing entity committee, it talks about 00:30:56
when it's necessary for that committee to convene, and it's necessary when it did convene, which was to establish the initial 00:31:04
project area, to consent to the tax increment that would be provided to the project area. 00:31:12
And to establish a budget for the project area, the multi year budget, not the single year budget. And then once the project area 00:31:20
is established, you can have different phases within the RDA that. 00:31:27
Trigger at different intervals. When you trigger, it's a maximum of a 25 year interval, but not all portions of the project area 00:31:34
are triggered at the same time. 00:31:39
And so you do have decisions that the RDA board has made over the years to trigger certain parcels at certain times so that the 00:31:44
increment once you trigger it then takes effect. 00:31:50
And begins to be gathered and accrued and can be used for the benefit of that area. 00:31:56
There's not a need other than. 00:32:02
If you expand the tax increment or if you expand the taxing area for that committee to convene on a regular basis. So what you're 00:32:07
saying, So what you're saying is the land size, the map stays the same and the total 300 dollars, 300 million stays the same. 00:32:14
There's no consent or need, need for them to reconvene or have oversized. You're making your decisions within those parameters. 00:32:22
You don't have to take that decision back, back to the taxing entity committee. 00:32:30
OK, this is extremely dangerous for our kids in education. I just don't see how. I don't see how the Alpine School District board 00:32:41
wouldn't be involved with 60% as their money. You're entitled to your viewpoint of things tonight, as we saw last meeting. I don't 00:32:48
wish to challenge that, right. I'm just saying hold on one second. Go ahead, Amber. They are reaping the benefits of it. 00:32:55
But they're making more. 00:33:03
Than they would have had that project area not been developed. 00:33:04
Right. I think what was shown last time is that instead of making 2000, we made 46,000, yet we've put in 180 million. So in All in 00:33:08
all, we haven't won out. We made $44,000 more. Well, it was just being reviewed from one site. So, but I wanted to make clear 00:33:17
we're like hundreds of millions in and making 40,000 more in one parcel. So it wasn't proved last meeting. 00:33:26
Well, I think it was in the sense. 00:33:35
You're changing the context. 00:33:38
That's all I have to say. 00:33:40
But the the conversation for the purpose of this meeting where you you've held your budget hearing and you're making your budget 00:33:42
decision, the assertion that. 00:33:46
Some individuals made during the hearing and that you have asked is, is the budget coming to the RDA Board in an unlawful manner? 00:33:50
And the answer is no. And I think we pointed to the chapter and verse that drives that distinction between what happens for the 00:33:59
overall project area and the overall project area budget and that that's a different action and a different decision than the 00:34:07
annual RDA budget that you'll be acting on today. Excellent. To that point, let's go back to the amendments. Yes. Could we have 00:34:15
some just clarification? Maybe give us some just for the public. 00:34:22
Just some explanation on what the amendment means What? 00:34:30
Just break it down a little bit just to be helpful. 00:34:34
Sure. So the top half of this document are the revenues. 00:34:37
So what this is saying is, you know the previous year tax increment revenues were about 7.9 million and this year the tax 00:34:43
increment revenues are about 10 and a half million. 00:34:47
And then there's other revenues, including interest, and a portion of the tax increment is considered admin revenue. 00:34:53
And then grant revenue is like state funding, which sometimes is available for transportation projects or or any other kind of 00:35:03
outside source of revenue beyond interest bond proceeds and the and the tax increment. So the and then fund balance appropriation 00:35:10
just means that that's your carryover fund balance. So that's characterized as a revenue. So that gives you 36 million in annual 00:35:18
revenue. And then the the lower half of the document are the sort of. 00:35:25
Categories of expenses this year that were budgeted, so you know big ones are like TIF related payments, that's where you make 00:35:33
reimbursement payments for development activities, for backbone infrastructure per the project plan, capital expenses that's you 00:35:43
know fixed assets that are created in the city, a lot of transportation type infrastructure, other kinds of public infrastructure. 00:35:52
Then you have your debt service payments, both principal and interest, and then the general fund transfer of admin. What that is 00:36:03
is you take the admin revenue that you receive and you transfer that to the city's general fund to defray the overhead and 00:36:10
administrative costs of operating the RDA that the city bears. And that's important because basically you're not actually asking 00:36:18
the city's general fund to subsidize the operations of the redevelopment agency. 00:36:25
Rather, the redevelopment agencies administrative cost is borne by the agency through its specific administrative revenue fee. 00:36:33
So, so like a good example is tonight we're using city funds to work for the RDA exactly project area, OK. 00:36:43
Any other questions about the amendment? 00:36:53
If not, there's a motion on the table. I had a first by Amber. Can I get a second? Is this to vote on it? No, I'm not done yet. 00:36:56
OK. What are your questions about the amendments? I just want to put into the record that this process was very flawed not knowing 00:37:03
about obvious our our lobbyist is working for this on the RDA side being paid through that not given obviously me not getting a 00:37:09
broke down of of what that is I think for the record. 00:37:16
Both of the last two meetings I've asked to kind of get an itemized understanding of that and then also just representing the the 00:37:23
history of the RDA and the men and women that created it. None of these projects were envisioned for these side little projects of 00:37:30
a town hall or any of these types of things. 00:37:37
The RDA originally, and I'm shocked that we have the authority legally to do it. 00:37:44
Was one cleanup and that's it. 00:37:49
And two, to bring in a business or anchor business that would create the revenue necessary to sustain our city. It was not to 00:37:52
beautify or clean up or $5,000,000 LRS project in the middle of the lake or just all the various different things that that this 00:38:00
is. And I feel horrible for the taxpayers throughout the county, throughout the school district, throughout the water authority 00:38:08
and the sewer that they have no representation from that beginning meeting back in 2011 that started this. 00:38:16
That we now can. 00:38:24
Exemplify or just take them out of the tax code and not pay our fair share to Alpine School District for our schools. 00:38:27
And I just want to make that in the code of that's why I'll be voting no is I think this, I think the whole RDA is, is flawed. Can 00:38:34
I make a comment? Sure. I appreciate your concern, Jacob, But I, I think we have to stick with the facts here that if you, if we 00:38:42
want to continually look at the RDA and what we're doing, that's, that's a conversation to be had. But right now we're just, we're 00:38:50
just approving the amendments for the year 23 to 24. 00:38:58
And so for me, I'll be voting yes because for me, this looks like an administrative process that needs to be accomplished. And so 00:39:07
you, you don't have to finance any of these projects if you don't want to. So sure. So it's still Marty might fundamentally 00:39:13
disagree on certain things. And so I'm just letting you know and the public know that the reason why I'm voting for this is 00:39:18
because it's an administrative process with the budget. Actually, we're not talking about City Hall anything in this, we're 00:39:24
talking about. 00:39:30
The amendments for 2324 and then we can talk about the budget for next year, which? 00:39:37
I'm looking forward to talking about, but if there's concerns there, we can bring that up. But I will add that from my 00:39:44
understanding that around the state, there are several Rdas and we actually happen to be the only one with a brownfield that 00:39:52
requires clean up. And also in 2008 or whatever year that this was decided, if they only wanted it for one business, then there 00:39:59
should have been some changes in the contracts they signed. 00:40:07
I believe they understood what they were getting into, be it changed and molded a little bit with approvals how they wanted or not 00:40:14
when they signed the documents. If this wasn't what they wanted, I would have hoped that they would have changed it. So I can only 00:40:22
go off of what legally was signed and done and then from there I can go on a project by project basis. So I respect your 00:40:29
frustrations and concerns, but I am voting yes because it's administrative and I'm looking forward to talking about the next one. 00:40:36
Amber, did you have a closing remark? This will not be a back and forth on this discussion. 00:40:43
I just wanted to say that this is amendment, but we haven't even had the opportunity to have a discussion why and what's being 00:40:48
amended. So I will vote no because I I feel like. 00:40:55
These are things that I'd like to know and I have so many questions about it. So if you need something amended in your budget, I'd 00:41:03
really like to know before we're supposed to vote on it. That would be really helpful for me. 00:41:09
OK. Amber, did you have anything? 00:41:16
Just that I move to approve. 00:41:19
We talk about the returns and when we're talking about funding and and what we're getting for a return of investment, it's clear 00:41:53
also when you make statements inside of a RDA meeting where you say and it's not to fund the LRS project, no money was ever put 00:42:00
towards the RDA by. 00:42:06
For the LRS project and to simply state that as if that ever happened, that that was ever the intent or that that somehow this RDA 00:42:14
board would go out of the scope or that their chair would go out of it is just. 00:42:20
Umm, you're not being clear, You're not being honest in it. You've been told it and it's on the record. And so we are within the 00:42:27
scope that is my closing statement. And now we're calling for a motion. We are in the middle of a motion already. So I think we 00:42:33
can't do a point of order right now. 00:42:38
OK. 00:42:44
Mario will second the motion. OK, we have a first. We have a second. We already had a second by you and now we're going to go. 00:42:47
Sarah, no. 00:42:51
Marty yes. 00:42:55
Yes, Amber, I and no. All right, we are now going to move on to the next. 00:42:57
Item. 00:43:04
Let's see. 00:43:06
4.2 And actually I'm going to take a 3 minute pause and then we will come back to this. 00:43:08
I. 00:43:18
Yes. 00:43:24
Are we rolling? 00:43:41
OK. We're going to go ahead and start 4.2 discussion in action Financial final fiscal year 2024-2025 RDA Budget Resolution U2024-3 00:43:42
and our RDA Director, Josh Daniels will present. 00:43:50
Great. So we've had a couple of meetings and public hearing extended across two meetings to hear and review the adoption of the 00:44:01
annual budget for next fiscal year starting July 1. 00:44:07
So this is the budget schedule that's been proposed in your packet that's also up on the screen. So this is your kind of annual 00:44:15
adoption of the budget. What you just did was. 00:44:23
Adopt the final amended budget for the closing fiscal year. This is sort of for next year. 00:44:31
OK. Are there any questions by the board? 00:44:41
I would just reiterate what Sarah said of you know. 00:44:46
When we met with you, we didn't know we were doing a resolution to change last year's and this, so when we meet with you, it'd be 00:44:51
good to. 00:44:55
Closeout those two, I think that's what Sarah is, is we have to have the question or know the knowledge to be able to ask the 00:45:00
questions that we're adjusting it and that wasn't afforded to us on Marty on on your comment about. 00:45:06
That we were given the administrative function. 00:45:14
For the lay individual into this, it basically means that the founders created a $300 million credit card and we have a. 00:45:17
A spending limit to be able to go through and do that. So you are correct. 00:45:27
However, the organizers that set that credit card limit up, we're not thinking about going to all of those various things and I 00:45:31
believe that. 00:45:36
With no representation from Alpine School District to see. 00:45:43
You're right, we do have the ability to use that credit card and it's extremely dangerous. 00:45:48
To see those limits and so, or see where, where it goes, you could take that to Disneyland or you could do it whatever, you know, 00:45:54
like a like a I'm giving you an example of a family right of a credit card, but like. 00:46:00
On this, we're going to go take RDA money that was set aside to. 00:46:06
Build a tax base for Vineyard. 00:46:12
And we're going to put $1,000,000 towards the City Hall. 00:46:15
On that credit card and that was not originally. 00:46:19
And that will not bring US revenue to increase. 00:46:23
This is a this was a lifesaver, a lifeline by Mayor Farnsworth, Nate Riley, all of those to say we've got to go get a tax base to 00:46:27
be able to survive as a city. 00:46:34
It was not for beautification or or these types of things. They're nice things to have. 00:46:40
But we're sacrificing our kids education over it. 00:46:47
So. 00:46:51
In regards to things like the City Hall. 00:46:53
Are we the only ones paying for it? Do we have someone helping us that you know, because we're having partnerships with? 00:47:30
Not HBA, Mac. Thank you. We're having partnerships with MAG. Are we splitting that cost? There's a lot of discussions that we're 00:47:36
going to be having here forward. Yeah. And so and I know all those processes have to take place. Yeah, for sure. And so for me, as 00:47:44
I'm approving different things, I'm approving perspective things. So we're going to be voting on each of these things. And if at 00:47:51
the end of the day, I look at it and go, this is terrible, this isn't what I want or this is fantastic. 00:47:58
We're paying for something. This is a great price. This is something that we can have for a long time, even if we decide that this 00:48:05
isn't the time to build it. So I have a lot of decisions to make in regards to that. But right now for me, as I've gone through 00:48:11
the budget and I've had my meetings, I have under, I understand what I'm approving. And so the concerns I've had, I've brought up 00:48:18
already and I've had revisions behind like this has changed. This isn't the same as it was three months ago. And So what I'm 00:48:24
approving right now is a budget. 00:48:30
And I'm not approving specific projects because they have to be approved by us as we go along. On that note, is there anything 00:48:37
that you disagree with on capital projects in this budget? Well, not on this. I guess I'd have to look at the capital project 00:48:44
breakdown again. Could we put that up on the board? Thank you. 00:48:51
So while you're looking. 00:49:00
Again, I feel like I have to vote no. I'm still learning a lot about the RDA. I feel like I have a small little grasp on it. But 00:49:02
Eric, when we first started talking about this, you told me that that RDA specifically was meant to bring eventually bring revenue 00:49:10
back to the city. It couldn't be on projects that didn't bring revenue back to the city in some form. And there's a lot of these 00:49:17
items that will never bring revenue back to the city. 00:49:24
So I'm just, I'm a little confused. I want, I, I don't want to make decisions that will come back and bite, right? Like I want us 00:49:32
to make decisions going forward that are going to be good for everyone. So when we talk about the scope of the RDA, there is 00:49:39
cleanup, there's environmental and there's that's the cleanup, there's infrastructure and there's economic, there's economic 00:49:46
development that's all wrapped into. 00:49:54
Kind of the scope. 00:50:02
And so all of these things are meant to beautify, make the area good so that economic development and other things want to come in 00:50:04
here. But Sarah, if you do have something that you don't agree with, you can always tell us that you would like it off here and we 00:50:10
can discuss that here in this meeting. So if you see something on your list that you're like, hey, I would like to pull that from 00:50:17
here because I don't feel it fits with our goals and our scope. That's now your time to do that. 00:50:24
Can I add one thing real quick? 00:50:31
I feel like it's the age-old question, what do we invest to make money, right? Like are, is this the best way to spend our money? 00:50:34
Will that bring us a return? What are the values here? And I think we just have to, like you said, these goals that we have and 00:50:40
these things we're looking at. 00:50:46
Are these? 00:50:52
Are these what we want to? Does it work with our goals? Does it work with our plans, just like the mayor said? But I, I really 00:50:55
think the questions that are brought up are valid questions. I'm not, I'm not saying they're not at all. It's just. 00:51:01
It's a really, it's a really hard question to answer all at once. 00:51:07
Well, and I think The thing is, if you're finding something on the list, tell us, let's deliberate and then we can move forward 00:51:12
and check that off the list if we don't want it. They are stating that's not an updated list. It's not an updated list. But I 00:51:17
don't know if you have the list for the capital projects if you want to pull it up, yeah. 00:51:22
Anyway, think about it for a minute. Amber, do you have anything or Jake, do you have something that you'd like to see off of this 00:51:28
RDA budget in general or that you like about it that you wanted to increase anything? That's really what we're discussing here 00:51:35
tonight, a reduction or an increase, whatever you are doing, I just appreciate. I know we've had to cut, we've cut a lot of things 00:51:41
out and we've had a lot of negotiations and discussions with staff and. 00:51:48
I'm actually impressed with where we've gotten and I appreciate all the work that's been put into it. Thanks, Amber. Jake. 00:51:56
We have not had discussion and I believe that these have been. 00:52:06
Developed by staff instead of by citizens. As I reached out to many of them over the past year, I don't see any of the desires of 00:52:10
what they wanted in any of these. Nonetheless, I. 00:52:17
Revenue increases that would bring a tax base into this of what it is. So I wouldn't even like I agree Utah City would love us to 00:52:25
remove their their spur rail, right? Does that increase the value? Maybe it's probably one of the only ones that's there or. 00:52:35
But no, that's why I'd be voting no. But yeah, we. 00:52:45
It's scary. Is there something that you would want to remove? 00:52:50
That we could discuss. 00:52:55
Umm, like. 00:52:58
Go down by the list. I will be voting no on almost all of these. That's OK, we can talk about them if you need to. 00:53:02
If not City Hall design, City Hall construction, and you did talk a little bit about the City Hall design and where you felt. I 00:53:09
think the council has discussed that with you publicly a few Times Now. 00:53:14
So everybody has where they're sitting on that. What? What's another one? 00:53:18
Anderson East West Projects. 00:53:23
East West project. 00:53:26
OK. That's a reimbursement. So we're obligated. 00:53:28
Vineyard beach improvements. 00:53:34
That's a grant. 00:53:37
For some from the county, no From. 00:53:38
Yes, from the county, County TRCC funds the landscaping on the, I mean, we go up and down all yeah. So we got a large grant from 00:53:43
the county to clean up our lakefront. That's from the TRCC committee, the Vineyard Connector Promenade overpass. 00:53:50
Yep, that's that's approved and already, yeah, you got funded. 00:53:58
Yeah, anything that we cannot. I remember like 2 weeks ago we went through what was and what wasn't. 00:54:04
I don't see any business of bringing revenue into our city from it. 00:54:10
OK. Sarah and Marty, do you have anything left that you want to discuss or would you like to make a motion? 00:54:15
Economic strategic plan. 00:54:22
We've already committed to that. 00:54:25
The rail spur. 00:54:33
It is, it is funding we've got from the infrastructure bank. 00:54:35
So honestly like it would be so helpful. 00:54:39
If you. 00:54:42
If you just. 00:54:44
Put that in because I did talk to Eric and he explained a few things. The TRTC funded beach improvement, right? And so and also 00:54:45
the rail spur is also a grant, is that correct? Yeah. So those kind of things are really helpful information and I feel like. 00:54:55
Where we have lots of eyes on us right now, The more transparent we can be, the better. 00:55:05
Because a lot of this isn't coming necessarily directly from us. Then how? I guess I, like I said, I have so many, so many 00:55:11
questions. It would be nice. Yeah. Well, and we did, we did outline, we did outline these for the public before. 00:55:20
I don't know if we went individual and we could do it again if you wanted to, if that's meaningful to you in this discussion, if 00:55:29
it doesn't change how you're feeling, okay, if you'd like to go through them again for the public. But we did do this. 00:55:36
In a public meeting, but we could do it now if it's helpful. 00:55:44
The vast majority of. 00:55:48
Dollars being spent on these capital projects are dollars that are designated for the purpose of projects like these that have 00:55:50
been dollars specifically given to the redevelopment agency for these projects that that actually don't have anything to do with 00:55:59
tax increment financing revenue. So the idea that the project area receives tax increment financing revenues for the purpose of 00:56:07
reinvesting in environmental cleanup plus. 00:56:16
Other kinds of redevelopment activities designed to increase future revenues and land values. 00:56:24
That's separate from some of these things. So for example, Vineyard beach improvement. 00:56:31
None of the funds that are being allocated here for that capital project are tax increment financing revenues. There's a specific 00:56:38
funding source that the county makes available for all cities to use some sales tax, which are earmarked specifically for projects 00:56:44
that will increase. 00:56:50
Tourism and travel and recreation. 00:56:59
That that's what we're talking about here. So there's very little to know tax increment financing revenues being spent on these 00:57:33
capital projects. Largely your tax increment financing revenues are being spent in the form of previously executed reimbursement 00:57:41
agreements with private developers per the master project plan adopted in 2011 to conduct those redevelopment activities. You know 00:57:49
clean up being being a big one that's been discussed but then also. 00:57:56
Backbone infrastructure as they're developing the land. What's the City Hall? 00:58:04
Project is that TIFF? 00:58:11
I'm not certain that that one predates me. Any thoughts on that? Anybody else? 00:58:13
So the the the planning portion of City Hall design, the. 00:58:20
Funds that we're using for the City Hall design, is that tax increment, financing revenue or something else? 00:58:24
Anybody know for a fact? 00:58:30
We can get to the bottom of that. Yeah, it could be bond revenue, I believe so that it's, it's TIFF that that we're using for the 00:58:32
for the design of that. 00:58:37
So we can look into that more in more detail. 00:58:43
I did. 00:58:48
Specifically the Center St. overpass landscaping, to me that's completing a project. That neighborhood has a very large wall of 00:58:53
nothing, just a large wall. And so to me that that is finishing our commitment to a project and completing it for specifically the 00:59:01
people in that area. But the whole city benefits from that. And like you said, yeah. And like you said, it's the completion of the 00:59:08
road. 00:59:16
Yeah, I, I'm actually, I would, I would be a hard pass to stop doing that. I think that would be unfair to the community. 00:59:24
No like designating the project, like beautification and different things like that. 01:00:05
With the TIF money. 01:00:10
Because you're saying like, hey, give me an example off the list. Like specifically, I'm not sure I'm following, sorry. The 01:00:13
overpass is a great one, the 420,000. 01:00:17
The center St. overpass, so that's RDA TIF money. 01:00:23
Like. 01:00:27
Aren't that we the ones that designate like, oh, this because you said this is the purpose of this. It's like, aren't we the ones 01:00:29
designated what the purpose of it? 01:00:33
Well, if that's TIFF money, that's like 60 percent 200,000 from our schools, right? 01:00:39
So. 01:00:45
So if you're saying. 01:00:47
Center St. overpass landscaping costs, if you choose to spend RDA revenues on that project, then then yes, you have the discretion 01:00:49
to choose to spend revenue on that. 01:00:56
In terms of whether it qualifies for the utilization of TIF revenue, well that's pursuant to your project plan and your project 01:01:04
plan allows public spaces as part of your infrastructure in the city. 01:01:11
To be funded with TIF revenues. So if you look at the outline of the original project plan adopted in 2011, there's a like eight 01:01:19
different items that are the summary of kind of what the project plan allows in terms of the scope of your expenditures. Public 01:01:27
infrastructure, including parks and public spaces is included in that. So I suppose in that scenario you can say, oh, the 01:01:35
landscaping can be covered by TIF revenue, so perhaps the cities transportation budget. 01:01:43
Landscaping others was it was hey, as a carrot to bring in a big taxing entity. We could do a little bit of their landscaping or 01:02:23
we could. 01:02:27
All of those fringe things that we're talking about, but what all these projects have is it it's not connected to any tax base. 01:02:31
It's just. 01:02:35
Here's, you know, the overpass, here's a municipality, you know, building a town hall and it's lacking the if, if, if we could 01:02:39
keep this money so that we could go after a Nike or a Adobe or something like that to bring them in as a tax base. That's great. 01:02:47
What do you mean by bring them in as a tax base to lure them in and and give them incentives to be able to bring them into our 01:02:55
city like you're saying, like an incentive. 01:03:03
Incentive of beautification or doing some infrastructure to be able to go through and do it. 01:03:10
Yeah, 'cause I mean, you're not allowed to give direct incentives to the companies. That's right. You can do landscaping. That's 01:03:17
what I'm saying. Like that's what this was originally for, was connected to an incentive. If you can incentivize like an anchor 01:03:23
tenant like that through some type of infrastructure project and exactly that, that's a great example of how you could utilize the 01:03:29
funds. And Josh, if I can just add to the Center St. Overpass, Yeah, please. That that was part of a, a, a larger project. We had 01:03:35
the funds. 01:03:41
Have the time to get the the Center St. overpass, but we didn't have the funds to to do the beautification. And so and by 01:03:48
beautification we really mean landscaping, Yeah, the landscaping that that completes the infrastructure project. So that's how we 01:03:53
had looked at that as part of the infrastructure. 01:03:59
And so. 01:04:06
That's thank you, Morgan. 01:04:07
Hold on one second, Jake, on that. Is there anything else that you feel like you need clarity on? Is that something that, OK, 01:04:11
you're done? I was just telling Sarah and I wanted to put it, I wanted to say it for the record. She asked how is it that Center 01:04:18
St. Overpass can be a part of the RDA and it's within the boundary of the RDA. It also was a huge benefit to the city for safety, 01:04:26
getting people in and out of the city, which helps with the population growth that we're dealing with. 01:04:33
To me, I look at all and benefit to the RDA project, benefit to the RDA project. To me, I'm looking at all of these enhancements 01:04:41
and what I see is that we're improving upon the RDA project area, which will also in turn draw more businesses in if we are just a 01:04:48
barren landscape. 01:04:56
We're not going to be very desirable to businesses that are coming and looking at Vineyard. So yes, it might look like we might 01:05:04
all have different priorities. You know, we could get the whole city to take a poll and people might have different priorities. 01:05:12
But when I look through these lists, when I work with the city, what I've been voted to be here to make these decisions is, is 01:05:19
this best for the RDA project area? And I believe if as we go through each one that I feel comfortable with each of these items. 01:05:27
To improve upon that. Excellent. Sarah, did you have anything else that you want to discuss? Is there something that catches your 01:05:34
eye that you feel like we should talk about that would help you get to the other side of it tonight? 01:05:41
I met with Eric about a lot of it and it made sense because a lot of it isn't necessarily coming from. 01:05:50
And you're it was through grants and things like that. 01:05:57
Or reimbursements? 01:06:01
So I. 01:06:03
I feel like I'm. I feel like I'm OK with. 01:06:05
Because City Hall is just a construction savings, it's not necessarily committing us to anything. 01:06:09
I feel like that needs to be a large roundtable discussion before anything happens, so if it's strictly put into savings, I'm OK 01:06:14
with that. 01:06:18
Umm. 01:06:23
And I think I understand, I think I understand the rail spur is that also is a grant. 01:06:28
Anderson, East and West is reimbursement. So I think the rest of it makes sense. What about the design, like the savings of 01:06:34
construction is 2,000,000, but the design we're going to spend, we'll still have to go through that RFP process, right, That 01:06:39
doesn't. 01:06:44
And from what I understood, Eric said we were splitting the cost of the design with Mag. 01:06:53
Right. So we're, we're only online for half of that, but they would be partners in the build. 01:06:59
So, yeah, we we would send that out for RFP and then we would bring back a proposal that was the most qualified and kind of 01:07:06
cheapest we'd find kind of that that Nexus and then the city count, aren't they City Council would make it, make an approval or 01:07:12
ask for an adjustment or deny it. 01:07:19
OK. 01:07:26
As well, the way that you guys have designed it, it will have slight, not a lot maybe, but some well and the RDA is also run in 01:07:28
that area and they're going to dig deeper into how we're going to finance it. So there's more discussion that needs to be had. OK, 01:07:36
with that, I feel comfortable with going ahead and calling for a motion. 01:07:43
But I need somebody to make it. 01:07:54
God moved to adopt. 01:07:57
I make a motion to adopt the. 01:08:00
2020 I don't have it. The 2024-2025 Redevelopment Agency budget. 01:08:03
All right, we have a first by Marty, can I get a second, second, second by. 01:08:12
Three, Thank you so much, Jamie. 01:08:18
All right. 01:08:21
Sarah. 01:08:24
Aye, Marty. 01:08:26
Yay. Yay. Amber, I and Jake. No. All right, this meeting is adjourned and we'll be starting the next meeting shortly. 01:08:27
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