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Event transcript
Green lines there so we know we're getting audio. 00:00:00
All righty, let's go ahead. Let's go ahead and get started. 00:18:57
Good evening everybody. It is 6. 00:19:00
April 14th I am Mayor Zach Stratton and I'd like to open up the Vineyard City Council meeting. I've asked Harry. 00:19:02
To come and get our opening prayer and Pledge of Allegiance and. 00:19:08
Grab a pin. 00:19:12
So come on up, Perry. 00:19:14
Come up to the microphone, play or a prayer, then we'll do the pledge. 00:19:18
Our gracious Father in heaven. 00:19:30
We come before you this evening and thank thee. 00:19:33
For the many gifts. 00:19:36
That we have in the freedoms that we still enjoy in this country. 00:19:37
We ask that that would bless us this evening. 00:19:42
That we may share our thoughts and ideas. 00:19:45
In a manner that is pleasing to thee. 00:19:48
We pray for resolutions and we pray for peace. 00:19:51
He sings, We pray for Father, In the name of thy Son Jesus Christ, Amen. 00:19:55
OK. 00:20:01
I pledge allegiance to the flag. 00:20:08
Of the United States of America. 00:20:11
One nation under. 00:20:15
Earl. 00:20:21
All righty. Thank you so much. 00:20:25
I'm going to share a quick. 00:20:28
I think it's important. 00:20:33
I think it's important for the public to. 00:20:38
Understand a couple things. 00:20:41
As the mayor, I chaired the City Council meetings. 00:20:44
But there's an ordinance in our code. 00:20:48
That says if two members of the City Council or more requests for an item be put on the City Council agenda will put it on. I 00:20:50
think that's I think that's a really good check and balance. 00:20:54
I think that's really important. 00:20:58
My inspirational thought though. 00:21:01
Is. 00:21:03
And I think this applies to all of us is. 00:21:04
If everything becomes an emergency, nothing's an emergency. 00:21:06
And I would just. 00:21:10
We need to be judicious with our time. 00:21:16
And transparent. 00:21:19
There's a bunch of business items here in 5.1 and I've spoken to council about this one-on-one. I've communicated with everybody 00:21:22
today. 00:21:25
I really think we need to work session these. 00:21:29
But due to our city code. 00:21:32
Where two members of council can ask for anything on. 00:21:34
Which I again, I think that's important. 00:21:37
It's a good check and balance. 00:21:39
We kind of saw what. 00:21:41
Has happened in the past. 00:21:43
And I don't ever want that to happen in the future regarding. 00:21:44
Items that needed to be discussed being paid. 00:21:47
Put on there but my invitation. 00:21:49
And my thought for the day is. 00:21:51
As counsel. 00:21:54
Legislates. 00:21:56
I would recommend. 00:21:58
That, uh. 00:22:00
Just be judicious with that. 00:22:03
And make sure that we are. 00:22:05
We are following our the transparency that as laid out in my April 4th e-mail. 00:22:08
Where resolutions need to get. 00:22:14
We need to have. We just need to work session on before. 00:22:17
It's not. 00:22:20
Can understand that maybe there was an intent or an understanding at the time that. 00:22:22
Some of these were time sensitive that. 00:22:27
Upon further. 00:22:30
Reviewing is not the case. 00:22:31
And I don't necessarily have again. 00:22:34
I'm gonna do my best as the mayor to stay out of your way. 00:22:37
And let you guys legislate, but I just. 00:22:41
I think that. 00:22:43
It would just be prudent we had. 00:22:45
Our staff is putting in. 00:22:47
Crazy amount of hours. 00:22:48
In preparation for this meeting and. 00:22:50
As you know, we are really trying to shrink the size and making sure that we're being very. 00:22:53
Judicious with our taxpayer dollars so. 00:22:58
Thank you for all you guys do and. 00:23:01
That'll be my thought. 00:23:04
All right, we're going to move down to the work session. 00:23:05
To discuss public safety and compromise on Florida South and Geneva Road and Main Street, I'm going to turn the time over to Jake 00:23:08
Holdaway to lead out this discussion. Go ahead, Jake. 00:23:12
All right. Can you guys hear me? 00:23:16
Hello. 00:23:19
Can you hear me? 00:23:20
If you guys can. 00:23:21
Sorry. 00:23:26
So. 00:23:30
This is a lot of. 00:23:35
Gathering of information from hundreds of. 00:23:37
Citizens that live across. 00:23:40
400 S. 00:23:43
We've had a few deaths in key areas. 00:23:46
And we've had children that have been. 00:23:49
Putting very dangerous situations and been hit and luckily I think we've had three. 00:23:52
Life flighted and. 00:23:57
Not die. 00:23:58
Gratefully but. 00:24:00
They were very, it was very dangerous so. 00:24:01
As we start. 00:24:04
We're going to be opening up 400 S from Geneva Road to Main Street. 00:24:05
It's a very large section section that's usually more quiet. 00:24:09
And there are key safety concerns. Over the past eight years, citizens have emailed in. 00:24:13
Certain concerns. 00:24:19
And they've fallen on deaf ears and so. 00:24:21
The hope for tonight is before we have council and staff go and work and make those changes, is that the council can find some 00:24:23
sort of agreement. 00:24:27
Consensus to then. 00:24:32
Act upon staff without a vote of just saying hey. 00:24:34
We all agree on this because there's there's. 00:24:37
Competing interests and different moving parts so. 00:24:39
I'm going to start on Geneva Rd. 00:24:42
Where the first problem occurs. 00:24:45
On the Grant Old Grant Holdaway property. 00:24:47
I'm going to have Google Maps open here so we can go through it together. 00:24:51
Grant has sold his house and he's no longer there. 00:24:56
But there is an exit. 00:24:59
Onto from Geneva Road to 400 S that sits there and legally there is still an exit and an entrance and it hasn't been adjusted. 00:25:00
Where that young individual? 00:25:09
Died that evening because of the over parking. 00:25:12
400 S She was parked right there by that exit. 00:25:17
It still resides open today. 00:25:20
If you can see and zoom in on that section. 00:25:22
There's no way they could turn left or right. 00:25:25
In that section, and so I'm asking Council on the first point and change. 00:25:28
Is to by statute or resolution? 00:25:33
Tell the. 00:25:36
The Planning Commission to adjust that zone and work with the landowner to move the entrance to the Geneva roadside on the far 00:25:37
South side. 00:25:43
Similar to what? 00:25:48
Grants or Vineyard Gardens does they only have an exit here and they only have an entrance here, so doing the same way keeping it 00:25:49
there will make the road safer. 00:25:55
The second thing in gathering information. 00:26:01
Is moving and I don't know if you guys can see my screen. 00:26:04
But. 00:26:08
The ask would be on the next thing is. 00:26:11
Alpine in meeting with Alpine School District 2 1/2 years ago. 00:26:16
It was apparent that the intersection of Vineyard Rd. and. 00:26:20
And hold away run 400 Sal. 00:26:24
Is not aligned on the east. 00:26:27
Parking lot. 00:26:29
Because that is not aligned. If you zoom in here, you can see that the left hand turn lane. See how dangerous this is? The left 00:26:30
hand turn lane is saying to park here. 00:26:35
But it doesn't even go until here, so the cars wait right here in the middle of the intersection because of the off alignment. 00:26:41
And that off. 00:26:48
Makes it so there is no pedestrian. 00:26:50
Crossing in either of these intersections. So in the resolution I would be asking Council. 00:26:53
Because ASD has been. 00:26:58
Open to the change on that is moving this parking lot 25 feet. 00:27:01
To the east. 00:27:06
There is no power lines and they've obliged. They've said we could do this and they could get funding to align with that. 00:27:07
And that's a very. 00:27:15
Dangerous part in the intersection. 00:27:16
The next. 00:27:19
On that in aligning that is. 00:27:20
Oh, the next part. 00:27:24
Problem with this. 00:27:26
Is that there is an immediate exit here? 00:27:27
On there and it's only. 00:27:31
Like I think 42 feet. 00:27:32
From the other. 00:27:34
And ASD has been open to closing this. 00:27:36
Double exit because they have a left hand turn and a right hand and a left hand and right. They're too close to each other. 00:27:39
So the idea is that they would close this. 00:27:46
And that they would move this dirt. 00:27:48
So that there would be a roadway here. 00:27:50
And that it would align with this intersection, so we would have a very clean intersection. 00:27:52
Again, I know Timpanogos school district. 00:27:56
Oh, do you guys want to go take a front row? See, I don't know if you want to. 00:28:00
It's yeah. 00:28:05
Someone want to go point it out I can. 00:28:08
Yeah. 00:28:11
So closing the road of that parking lot. 00:28:13
Right there. 00:28:16
Closing that and moving it all the way down through a skinny Rd. 00:28:18
Makes the whole process safer. 00:28:22
We don't need 2. 00:28:24
It's only driving 30-40 more feet, it's aligning everybody and it aligns everyone in the same. 00:28:25
Intersection. 00:28:32
Hundreds of parents have emailed Alpine Vineyard or Orem because there's three different government entities that are involved. 00:28:33
And this feedback has fallen on deaf ears, so we're just asking. 00:28:40
Can the Council in resolution? 00:28:44
We're saying please go meet with them and this is our directive to close this and negotiate that. 00:28:46
The next point on the 400 S safe plan. 00:28:53
Is talking about Vineyard Rd. 00:28:56
In. 00:29:00
The width of hold of Vineyard Rd. 00:29:03
Is five lanes of traffic. 00:29:06
It is one of the most wide roads. 00:29:09
We have in the city. 00:29:11
It has two lanes over here on the east side it has a middle. 00:29:13
Medium. 00:29:17
Section and it has two lanes on this side. 00:29:18
And it sits vacant. 00:29:21
But because we don't. Because of the. 00:29:22
Painting on this, what it does is is that. 00:29:24
All we have is parallel parking. 00:29:27
So the request here is to have the left hand turn lane, but immediately after the left hand turn lane is no longer needed. 00:29:30
To get rid of it. 00:29:36
And also repaint it to move it 12 feet to the east. 00:29:37
What that does is it allows for parallel parking. 00:29:42
Safe parallel parking because not only will they be able to back up. 00:29:45
With five lanes of traffic. 00:29:49
They could have two and three lanes and it would only take a lane and a half to be able to back up, so they would be backing up 00:29:52
into nothing if the road is that wide. 00:29:56
And it would create an additional. 00:30:00
Depending on how it's painted. 00:30:03
30 to 50 additional stalls. 00:30:04
And it would take. 00:30:07
Because Vineyard Rd. is not. 00:30:09
A busy Rd. as a thoroughfare of 400 S, it's a safer road to be able to to back up there. 00:30:10
So that's point #3. 00:30:17
Point #4 and I have a little. 00:30:20
Wrote a video to talk about here. This is what. 00:30:23
Vineyard. 00:30:26
How Orms park? 00:30:27
Is used. Let me go back. 00:30:29
Or the experience of 400 uh. 00:30:32
Sorry about that. 00:30:35
See if I can get there. 00:30:36
OK, this is kind of a little video every single Saturday. 00:30:37
Orem City uses Orem Park to Max capacity. 00:30:43
And this is the stake center. They fill up the stake center. 00:30:47
On certain days. 00:30:51
Because they have no parking whatsoever. 00:30:53
For the capacity of what it is and so. 00:30:56
It it makes it so 400 S is extremely dangerous. 00:30:59
And it makes it so people cross at different at different sections, so. 00:31:04
Why do we have a? You know, we love our neighbors. 00:31:08
To the east, Orem city. 00:31:11
However, Orem City does not comply with their own ordinance. 00:31:14
To give you an example of Sleepy Ridge Golf Course when that was built. 00:31:18
All businesses in Orem have to do this. 00:31:23
They have to provide enough parking. 00:31:25
For their events that they are scheduled and so when sleep Ridge Golf course was built. 00:31:28
They told the owners no, you have to buy four additional house lots. 00:31:34
To provide the adequate parking. 00:31:38
Orem City does not comply with that with their own park. 00:31:41
And we have. 00:31:44
Vineyard City over many, many years. 00:31:46
With many different councils have said please, please, please. 00:31:48
And I and I believe as we open up 400 S. 00:31:52
We have leverage. 00:31:55
When the park was sold to Orem City. 00:31:57
We at Vineyard City retained ownership of a very large portion. 00:32:01
Of property night. 00:32:06
10 acres almost. 00:32:08
To be exact, that we still own. 00:32:09
And they use it for small. 00:32:13
Soccer games and. 00:32:15
The capacity they can either do baseball. 00:32:17
Or they can do soccer. 00:32:20
With their parking capacity. 00:32:22
But what they do is they schedule both. 00:32:24
But they only have one parking lot in order to do it. 00:32:26
And so. 00:32:29
The resolution, if we have the solution of Council, would be to take the property that we own. 00:32:30
Not all of it allowing for still some parking. 00:32:36
Some small soccer games and big soccer games. 00:32:40
And say you've got to get these cars off of the road. 00:32:43
You have to. You have to fulfill. 00:32:46
With your ordinance. 00:32:48
Just like if you were a business, you would have to go through and comply that and since we have leverage there. 00:32:51
I think we need to have a very serious conversation now. I know they're already aligning, so I'm not bringing up the discussion of 00:32:57
the alignment of the. 00:33:00
Of the light. 00:33:04
But that needs but that. 00:33:06
That's going to make it safer as well. 00:33:08
The next component is. 00:33:12
At the end of the park. 00:33:15
The dedicated bike path. 00:33:17
Just ends. 00:33:19
I wish you guys could see this. It has the. 00:33:21
Let me go through in here. 00:33:26
It has just the monument to Vineyard. 00:33:28
And because of the. 00:33:31
The differences in councils. 00:33:32
Plans were shifted and changed. 00:33:36
And the. 00:33:38
Properties on the north side of the road from Orem Park. 00:33:39
To the Holdaway Rd. 00:33:44
North-south. 00:33:46
Only have a right of way of 66 feet. 00:33:47
So we do not own, the city does not own that right of way. 00:33:50
However. 00:33:54
At my house. 00:33:55
West. 00:33:56
A different council came in and said we are going to require. 00:33:57
A right of way. I believe it's. 00:34:01
75 feet, so there's a 12 feet. 00:34:03
There's a discrepancy. 00:34:06
So. 00:34:08
As we widen it out. 00:34:10
We are asking. 00:34:12
A landowner and full discrepancy my father. 00:34:14
To say you need to go and we should have the standard of a 75 foot right of way. 00:34:16
And the argument is. 00:34:23
OK, we're going to force this through court. 00:34:25
Or should we have a 65 foot right of way which everyone else has? 00:34:27
On the West side. 00:34:32
And so the Council, we are fighting two different. 00:34:34
Councils of different age groups of what that right of way is. 00:34:37
And so it. 00:34:42
We need to give directive to staff, of which one aren't we And so? 00:34:44
Now before I. 00:34:49
Before I go after that. 00:34:51
The current. 00:34:53
And this is These pictures are incredible. 00:34:55
Because we these were sent by citizens and I appreciate it. 00:34:56
Oh. 00:35:00
I don't know why. 00:35:03
Can you see him now? 00:35:08
Lame. 00:35:10
Is it shut off? 00:35:17
OK, share, share screen. 00:35:20
Can you see it now? 00:35:27
Are you able to see it now? 00:35:34
Kind of on a delay. 00:35:37
So this is the segment from. 00:35:39
Holdaway Rd. to the park. Was there a red line over it? You guys see that? 00:35:41
So. 00:35:46
Let me go back. I think there's a massive delay, OK? 00:35:50
So we do not own that segment. 00:35:53
So if we are going to go with the more expensive, if we're going to be fair, and that's what I'm asking, the council is. 00:35:55
Are we going to have a very wide Rd. on the West? 00:36:00
Side of Holdaway Rd. 00:36:03
That is the 75 feet or 7475. 00:36:05
Or are we going to have the shorter one which is the 66? 00:36:08
But the shorter one from Orem. 00:36:12
Park to. 00:36:14
Holdaway Rd. does not own that. 00:36:16
12 extra feet for a bike lane so. 00:36:18
The goal of having a continuous bike lane that is separated. 00:36:20
From Geneva Rd. 00:36:25
To the lake. 00:36:27
Will have an entire city block where it's not where it doesn't have that right. 00:36:29
And so there are many people that are this is a very expensive. 00:36:34
Buy to buy that specific section. 00:36:38
And it would be very. 00:36:41
Expensive to get to that same standard, right? 00:36:42
Also in this section, the way it's painted. 00:36:46
It's painted so that people just park in it because they have a bike lane, it's red or whatever, and so every Saturday and every 00:36:49
weeknight. 00:36:52
Cars just park up and down in it and the mayor gives tickets over and over and over. 00:36:57
Or not Mayor. The sheriff does. The sheriff's do. 00:37:01
And. 00:37:04
Cities, our kids rarely use it. Their golf carts are always they're they're fighting even though they have one of the largest 00:37:05
roads in the city. 00:37:09
Because it has no protected bike path, everybody. 00:37:13
Fights over the. 00:37:17
Sidewalk. 00:37:19
And so it moves everyone into doing that and so. 00:37:21
There isn't litigation yet, but. 00:37:26
My father, he's here today and I'm. 00:37:29
I mean, he's more than April willing to talk about it. 00:37:31
Is. 00:37:34
A city must act in a fair and consistent and legal defensible matter in an application of its policies if a city determines that 00:37:36
an acquisition of property or right of way. 00:37:40
Purpose is necessary along a given stretch. 00:37:45
Such requirements should be applied. 00:37:48
Uniformly to. 00:37:50
To all similarly situated property owners. Selective enforcement where one property owner is required to dedicate or relinquish 00:37:52
right of way property. 00:37:56
Including through the use of eminent domain. 00:38:01
While others an entire block. 00:38:03
Along the same corridor are not subject to the same requirement raises concerns regarding equity, consistency and potential legal 00:38:05
exposure. 00:38:09
Because it's like you haven't asked this of everyone. 00:38:13
And accordingly, the city should establish and follow a clear, uniform approach. And that's what I'm asking the council tonight, 00:38:16
is to either apply the right of way. 00:38:20
Acquisition requirements consistently along the entire Rd. 00:38:24
And refrain from imposing such a requirement on individuals for just. 00:38:28
For just one, right? 00:38:31
So there are two solutions. 00:38:34
There's a wider solution. 00:38:35
That would be. 00:38:38
And in meeting with everyone, there's not. 00:38:39
On the road. 00:38:42
Their affordable solution is to treat everyone equally under the law. 00:38:44
And have an uninterrupted. 00:38:48
Separated bike path from Geneva Road to the lake. 00:38:50
This saves taxpayers. 00:38:53
But finds an affordable solution and it fulfills. 00:38:56
Campaign promises of connecting the bike path and so. 00:38:59
In the compromise needed. 00:39:02
To be fair to both the east side of Holloway Road and the West side of Holdaway Rd. 00:39:04
The compromise is in the section where there isn't a bike path. 00:39:09
Is to save money and if the council wants to do it now and wants to spend $1,000,000 in doing it the right way, but the affordable 00:39:13
way is just to in that section of 400 S. 00:39:18
Would be to combine both lanes. 00:39:23
Because right now there are 6 feet on the South. 00:39:25
And six feet on the. 00:39:27
And move both of them to the north side of the road. 00:39:30
The West Side. 00:39:35
Would be would be built the right way? We don't need to do Ballards, we can build it. 00:39:36
With a separated bike path. 00:39:40
And have a separated design to be able to do that. 00:39:43
This treats everyone fair now in one plan. 00:39:46
The plan that. 00:39:50
I think I can get we got consensus on is not to acquire anymore right of way property. So it saves about 1,000,000 bucks. 00:39:51
The plan is affordable with the same 66 foot. 00:39:57
Standard right of what we already own on both sections. 00:40:01
Now both plans have the exact same speed limit. 00:40:04
Both have. 00:40:08
Two lanes of traffic. 00:40:09
The same capacity. 00:40:11
The A2 Lane Rd. 00:40:12
Has the capacity of 20,000 cars a day. 00:40:14
We're only adding 300 houses. 00:40:17
Right. So like we're doing a little bit of overkill here and Clegg Farm is only adding three, but there is a little bit overkill, 00:40:20
let's say the other half. 00:40:24
Of the houses. 00:40:28
From where like the mayor lives. 00:40:30
600 houses. OK, let's say there's. 00:40:31
5000 people. 00:40:33
Even 10. 00:40:35
We're still not even half the capacity of what a road would need. 00:40:36
And both would have a separated bike path and I know that segment. 00:40:40
Wouldn't be ideally designed and we could spend $1,000,000 to design it the right way. 00:40:44
But. 00:40:50
But it would it would save the taxpayer a lot of money. 00:40:51
And the last thing that I would tell Council is. 00:40:55
These are the pictures of center and main. 00:40:57
This is a larger capacity Rd. by statue. 00:41:00
But it's a 14 foot wide Rd. in either direction. 00:41:04
This is the same thing with no standard in Main Street, right next to the City Hall. 00:41:08
On the same corridor, except for this has no standard and no sidewalk. 00:41:13
You can go around the city and say this is 300 W. 00:41:17
It's again 14 feet wide on either direction. This has no bike path. 00:41:21
It just has sidewalks and so like. 00:41:26
On this corridor, each development. 00:41:29
Developer has. 00:41:31
Created a completely different standard. 00:41:32
And so that's why. 00:41:35
Having a larger Rd. on the West side. 00:41:37
Then what is on the east? It's like they should have the same 66 foot standards. 00:41:40
To council is is that. 00:41:46
Before getting any staff involved, we need to. 00:41:48
We need to come together and say. 00:41:51
One, do we believe that we should treat everybody equally? And then two. 00:41:54
Should it be a larger, more expensive 70? 00:41:59
Like 75 foot. 00:42:02
Right of way and acquire the property. 00:42:04
Or. 00:42:06
Can we all agree and direct staff to design something out that fits? 00:42:07
And finds a solution. 00:42:12
I don't know if I spoke with the landowner. 00:42:14
Correctly. 00:42:16
If you want to say something better, you could. 00:42:18
Please come on down. We'd love to try to solve the solution. Love to hear from you. Come on down. 00:42:23
It's OK. 00:42:27
I have never talked litigation with anyone of you. I've I've talked to all of you about this. I actually want a safe Rd. along 00:42:29
there. 00:42:32
And as a resident there forever, ever since they put in those bike lanes. 00:42:36
With respect to where the church is. 00:42:42
You never see anybody out there in the bike lanes. 00:42:45
When the kids go to school. 00:42:49
Where do they ride their bikes? 00:42:51
They ride their bikes on the sidewalk. 00:42:53
I know the residents of Sleepy Ridge. I have conversations with them all the time and I've asked a bunch of them. 00:42:56
Why don't you have your kids use the bike lanes? It's too close to the cars. 00:43:03
And so they don't even like those bike lanes. 00:43:08
My daughter, 2 of my daughters are in that ward so I know. 00:43:11
I know. 00:43:15
A lot of people over there, besides dealing with them about the golf course. 00:43:15
And. 00:43:20
The idea simply for me. 00:43:21
The short of it is to take. 00:43:24
The width of those bike lanes, one one of them 6 foot on one side and 1 seven on the other. 00:43:26
Take those out and move them to one side like Jake says, move the road over. 00:43:32
Let the kids that have always ride their. 00:43:37
There are bikes to school on the sidewalk there and then we have a really nice big trail. 00:43:40
On the other side. 00:43:45
And it can be 10 foot. 00:43:47
I've done my homework and gone up the Provo River Trail and. 00:43:50
And along University Ave. both of those are 1010 foot wide. 00:43:53
The one on University Ave. right there next to the golf course Riverside. 00:43:59
The road is there with cars going 60 miles an hour, there's a curb and then you've got the 10. 00:44:05
10 foot. 00:44:10
Wide lane with a stripe down the center. 00:44:11
And that works really good. 00:44:15
I spent a lot of time. 00:44:17
On my electric bike going up Provo Canyon. 00:44:18
And and even in the news, I don't hear of any accidents. 00:44:21
You get some yahoos coming down on their skateboards and they're going way faster than what they should. 00:44:25
And uh. 00:44:30
And I and I haven't heard any accidents, I really do believe. 00:44:31
That those bike lanes on 400 S by the stake center. 00:44:35
Are really a waste. 00:44:39
Thank you. But what? 00:44:41
Thank you. 00:44:43
So anyway. 00:44:43
I just, I just think. 00:44:45
I'm a trails guy myself. 00:44:47
I love them. 00:44:49
I want to help them out in the future, but but we ought to do things that are common sense that really make. 00:44:50
Things safer. 00:44:56
Awesome. Thanks. 00:44:57
Council for. 00:44:58
To for the purpose of the discussion here, so as I see this. 00:45:00
We really have. There's three different issues here. 00:45:04
We have a Rd. 00:45:07
Or the ORM owns. 00:45:09
We have an area that Alpine School District owns. 00:45:11
Right. And then there's what we can do. 00:45:14
I'm gonna give a quick report. 00:45:17
I'm on where? 00:45:18
David, Kyle and I are on. 00:45:20
In ongoing negotiations to get this forum. 00:45:21
Problem fixed. They are aligned they. 00:45:24
Recognize that it is a problem. 00:45:26
They're getting the phone calls from the state present as well. 00:45:29
Regarding the the parking, so they they're, they're lined. 00:45:33
So I think that if we could just let. 00:45:37
Me can continue down that road of discussion and and come to back with you guys with some options to kind of. 00:45:39
Help with that? 00:45:45
Because at the end of the day. 00:45:46
We don't own the road. 00:45:48
Right, it's there's a couple. 00:45:50
Things that Naseem made me aware of is that road is up for micro surfacing this year. 00:45:52
And so as long as we keep that. 00:45:57
Discussion and Oram has said we'll paint however you want to paint it. Yeah, they will. 00:45:58
They just said you just tell us how you want. 00:46:02
So there's some steps in our local agreement we need to enter into and different things. 00:46:04
So we can work on that. 00:46:08
With the Alpine School district as well. 00:46:09
I haven't met with them. 00:46:12
But I have talked to the board about that saying this is an issue and they they recognize that as well. So. 00:46:14
In just for our own time this evening, if we could narrow the discussion of this work session on. 00:46:19
What we can do? 00:46:24
I think that would that would be helpful. 00:46:26
So I would just say that since we own property at the park. 00:46:28
We can have leverage of. 00:46:32
Please do not. 00:46:34
Schedule events because. 00:46:35
They if they don't. 00:46:36
Double schedule. 00:46:38
There's not a parking problem until it's fixed. 00:46:39
And I think as. 00:46:42
I don't think we have to do a resolution. 00:46:43
I think just this conversation, yeah, they're buying on it. 00:46:45
Hey, we want to give you, I don't know what it is, 12 months, 18 months to figure that out. 00:46:48
But after an 18 month period. 00:46:53
We don't want the facilities used for park like yeah, in that way. 00:46:55
Because. 00:47:00
It's our property that we own, so you're going to need to stop soccer. 00:47:01
Fields. It might take a little while to plan that, sure, but I mean, they've had. 00:47:05
Since Ross Holdaway sold that property, there has been complaints for 18 years and it's fallen on deaf ears to. 00:47:10
Park so it's like. 00:47:16
What do we have as leverage to make them move? 00:47:18
Yeah, on that right or action that. 00:47:21
2:00 on that one. 00:47:23
I know there were some terms on the sale like we don't. 00:47:25
We don't have any programming rights on that piece of property we own, right? That's correct. There's no programming rights. 00:47:27
And so all the programming rights lie with Orum. So do we. There's maybe look at that sale and see. 00:47:33
What? Uh. 00:47:39
We're even allowed to to do as part of the contingency. Yeah, it's a lease, isn't it's not a sale, right? It's not a sale. We own 00:47:40
the property. 00:47:44
Yeah, 99 year, I think. 00:47:47
But I could be wrong, I'll check. 00:47:49
We'll look into that for sure. I think though that. 00:47:51
The fever pitch, I mean, we. 00:47:54
We were with Bran and their whole city. 00:47:56
They're they're interested, their leadership team working together. Yeah, they're, they have a just huge desire to get this fixed, 00:47:58
so. 00:48:01
But they're right now just. 00:48:05
Entering into baseball season so. 00:48:07
I'm sure they've already got that program down. Yeah, already programmed, that's why. 00:48:09
That's why I say there needs to be some time, but it needs to be something of like. 00:48:13
A priority. 00:48:17
18 to 24 months, whatever planning, like I'm saying we own this property we don't want, we've talked in the short term about. 00:48:18
Crossing. 00:48:26
New crosswalk and lights for crosswalks. 00:48:27
And that sort of thing. 00:48:30
Which would be very helpful considering the circumstances of. 00:48:32
The previous incidences that were on 4 S. 00:48:36
OK, so let's jump down to. 00:48:40
What do we want to do? What do we don't want to do with the vineyard? 00:48:43
Property, yeah. 00:48:48
The vineyard portion of the of the road. 00:48:50
All I know is we need to be united, so OK. 00:48:53
Like. 00:48:57
I generally like. 00:48:58
Are we? Is the microphones really on? I can't hear them. 00:49:00
Coming out. 00:49:03
In the room, Jesse, tell me if you can hear me. 00:49:04
You didn't chime in. Yeah. 00:49:09
Normally I tell Tony to turn up the microphone like two or three times. 00:49:12
Yeah. 00:49:16
I can hear, I can hear you. There's a little bit of static. 00:49:18
From time to time, but I can hear you OK. 00:49:21
Generally, I'm in favor of the. 00:49:24
Separate bike path, I think that kind of matches the existing infrastructure that's. 00:49:27
Prevalent in the city and those are well. 00:49:31
Received and used. 00:49:33
I think that also enhances the safety of the location. 00:49:35
My uh. 00:49:38
Big concern. 00:49:39
As I've. 00:49:41
Talked with council members as I've talked to members of the community is I don't want to do something. 00:49:42
You know we've. 00:49:48
Busted our butts to try and get. 00:49:49
Aligned with a reduced budget. 00:49:52
And to make sure that we are. 00:49:54
Being good fiscal stewards for the Community. 00:49:56
We're trying to get. 00:49:59
Accounts and reserves in place. So anything that's a big ask, especially like $1,000,000 ask up front. 00:50:01
Is just going to be a hard no from me. 00:50:06
Generally speaking, I don't think that that. 00:50:09
Aligns with what we've been trying to do. 00:50:12
Yeah, I think the 66 foot cross section. 00:50:14
That is in front of the. 00:50:18
The church there. 00:50:20
I think it's very workable. 00:50:21
Cross section we can adjust the lanes however we want and the paint how we. 00:50:24
We want and that works fine and I don't see why that wouldn't suffice. 00:50:28
All the way down. 00:50:32
To Main Street. 00:50:33
From there. 00:50:34
And I think I generally agree with what what David saying we looked at. 00:50:34
You know, before there was these two plans, there was the three. 00:50:40
Previous plans The big. 00:50:43
Road, the small road. And then there was the medium compromise that Councilmember Larae presented on in a work session. 00:50:45
And I generally felt like that was. 00:50:51
Pretty sufficient infrastructure because it made it uniform. 00:50:55
While simultaneously addressing I think. 00:50:59
The safety concerns now I would want to look at, you know, the cost assessment between. 00:51:01
That variation. 00:51:06
But I'm. 00:51:08
I'm not opposed to that idea. I thought that. 00:51:09
There was. 00:51:12
Maybe some excessiveness where there was. 00:51:12
Sidewalk on both sides and the trail that maybe went through. 00:51:15
But I think if you have the trail on one side, the sidewalk on one side, the road is uniform. 00:51:18
That's probably a good. 00:51:23
Yeah, middle ground. 00:51:24
Agree, I think the only requirement I would have. 00:51:26
Is it the road? 00:51:29
Size appropriately that emergency vehicles could use it. 00:51:32
You know, we have a, we have a fire station down there and, and they, they have an out. 00:51:35
Outlet on 300 W over there and I see in the future that they could come down. 00:51:38
Go South on that road, come down and connect up there to. 00:51:43
To 400 S and go out that way. 00:51:46
And I think the requirement there is that. 00:51:48
You would have to have no. 00:51:50
Street parking. 00:51:52
I think the fire code right now is. 00:51:54
24 feet of uninterrupted. 00:51:57
Road is at the width for the fire code, right? I don't know if that's so this will fit the solution we're presenting. Chris is 00:52:00
looking like he might know. 00:52:04
Development where you have fire access roads, yes, I think. 00:52:08
And, and this is much wider, so the Ballards wouldn't be wouldn't take a. 00:52:14
Full lane in talking with. 00:52:19
Scott Johnson and the whole Ashley. 00:52:21
Acres group, I went. 00:52:24
And knocked every door. 00:52:26
You know you've got. 00:52:27
14 feet and a bike path a ballard's could take half a lane at. 00:52:29
You know, 10 to 8 feet. 00:52:34
And making the road very wide. 00:52:37
And I know the sheriff. 00:52:39
Is on that road because of the speeders. It's so wide that that's where they set up. 00:52:40
They get calls all the time, so shrinking it down. 00:52:45
Would actually. 00:52:48
Help it. 00:52:50
But it's not shrinking down to a skinny Rd. I mean, you're still going to be going. 00:52:51
Someone wanted to go 40, they could still go down 40. I mean we want them to go at a save. The 66 foot cross section is a pretty 00:52:54
decent Rd. Yeah, it's a very decent Rd. but putting the bollards on it to make sure that there is a. 00:53:00
A A dedicated bike lane because. 00:53:05
The thing that we haven't brought up is. 00:53:09
The uh. 00:53:11
Bike Blvd. which is Holdaway Rd. That's already past the council. 00:53:12
Kids are supposed to use. 00:53:16
You have the stretch from the park. 00:53:18
And then it crosses Center St. onto Holdaway Rd. 00:53:20
They're supposed to, that's supposed to be the bike road or whatever and connect, but it just ends. 00:53:23
There's no bike path to get to the park, so that's. 00:53:29
To help me understand just a little bit better, is the proposition for the bollards just for the? 00:53:32
Just that section, that strip between the Lakefront Sports Complex and Holdaway Rd. Correct. And and there is a second if we want 00:53:37
to pay. 00:53:41
To RIP out the city, the. 00:53:45
The sidewalk. 00:53:47
And shrink it to match. You could do something in the middle but then it's another $1,000,000 and then talking with. 00:53:49
You know, Nate Riley and everyone that's on that road, they're like. 00:53:55
We presented the bollard solution and it's great. It's not that bad. They're all totally. They're like, I love that. 00:53:58
They want this. 00:54:05
As a solution, I spoke with every single landowner on that road and they they support this. 00:54:06
And I also spoke, so there's no. 00:54:12
There's no. 00:54:14
Not one person has spoken to us against this proposal. 00:54:15
On the road now. 00:54:19
People might that. 00:54:20
Are driving through. 00:54:21
You know, might not get the I-15 Interstate of the 75 feet wide that they would enjoy, but it's not. 00:54:23
So the thing from council would be. 00:54:30
Could we, if we find a general consensus, could we now then go to Naseem and draft? 00:54:33
That. 00:54:38
And draft the legal to we do have to acquire. 00:54:40
A section. 00:54:43
From Keith. 00:54:45
And we've put this to bed and we can build it. 00:54:46
Could I just get a map of? 00:54:49
The uh. 00:54:51
Two side by sides, because we've got some existing plans right that. 00:54:52
Have been through the process already. 00:54:55
I just want to see that compared to what's being proposed. 00:54:57
So instead, yeah, and we can map that, we can post and say here is. 00:55:00
Like, here's the sketch. Here's what the road is going to look like. Here's what the sidewalk a trail. 00:55:03
Seen like a few different maps and so. 00:55:07
I just don't know what. 00:55:09
It's hard just kind of describing it to see. 00:55:11
Like just. 00:55:14
But here's where the bollards would go. 00:55:15
Here's what the cross section would look like. 00:55:17
Just having a basic sketch of that compared to. 00:55:19
You know what we've got and then? 00:55:21
We could do that kind of timeline of what we need to do to approve that, I think, right. I just didn't want to spend thousands of 00:55:23
dollars because I knew that. 00:55:26
There's so much different variation in just an easy, so it doesn't have to be, We could just something like. 00:55:30
Well now I got a week ago walk it me and you, but also sketch it so I could have. 00:55:36
Naseem, if you guys are OK with that? 00:55:41
Draft up. 00:55:43
Just a basic this basic picture. Yeah, just something that. 00:55:44
You know, you have the, you have that temporary segment, yeah. 00:55:48
You have the temporary. This is block is going to be treated the same right of ways the same. 00:55:51
But it's with. 00:55:56
The same right of way is the same, but this is designed with. 00:55:57
The right way, right? So it has a bike path that's there. 00:56:02
And if the Council wants to pay to do that, I don't think it. 00:56:06
I don't think we need to spend the $1,000,000 the. 00:56:08
Bollards are like $25 apiece. You don't have to buy very many of them. 00:56:11
It's going to be between 6:00 to. 00:56:15
$10,000. 00:56:17
To buy them for that segment. That's how cheap this is. 00:56:18
And. 00:56:22
And so it's a. 00:56:24
And it also there's a massive cost savings. 00:56:25
If we go on the old plan, we have to. 00:56:30
Build a retaining wall on my corner of my house and we haven't even priced that out. The current this corner here, yeah. 00:56:33
So we haven't. 00:56:40
Because my my corner is 5 1/2 or. 00:56:41
5 feet tall. 00:56:45
We have to build quite a substantial. 00:56:48
Retaining wall. 00:56:50
On that. 00:56:51
And then we also the city. The city will have to. 00:56:53
And that wasn't in the plan like the when the contractor came over, it was like, what are we doing? He's like. 00:56:56
You don't have a retaining wall above 3 feet. 00:57:00
You have to pay for a retaining. You have to build a retaining wall. It has to be engineered, has to be engineered. 00:57:03
And so that. 00:57:09
Made the cost even more expensive on the other plan. 00:57:11
And then you've also got a. 00:57:14
Acquire the other property, so it's like. 00:57:16
This is getting really expensive and that's when I said the council doesn't know all of these costs. 00:57:19
And they don't know the different right of ways don't align. 00:57:23
In that so. 00:57:27
But I'm more than happy to say OK. 00:57:29
Yeah, the map, we're consistent with everyone. 00:57:30
I'd like to just. 00:57:35
Personally if we can get the map or get the graphics. 00:57:36
Go and try and share that and collect feedback with that area, yeah. 00:57:39
I think that there are. 00:57:44
Differing perspectives but like I know Ashley Akers and Sleepy Age are very aligned on this. 00:57:45
Generally speaking. 00:57:50
But then you get down towards the Mayors neighborhood. 00:57:51
And those people? 00:57:55
Were more interested in the larger Rd. because they want to use that as an ingress. 00:57:56
Totally. So I just would like to collect as much feedback as we can. 00:58:03
Sure. Well, I think they're informed decisions. 00:58:07
So. 00:58:09
If I. 00:58:10
Get a consensus, draft the plan as is, but we'll come back to council for a vote. 00:58:11
Just a picture of what concept? Like, yeah, just like concept. Just something like this. 00:58:18
This is Yeah. Here's the road. 00:58:24
This I can tell you. 00:58:26
I can tell you more than that. Yeah, I can tell you it's 14 feet in both directions. It's got a 2 1/2 foot draw it for me. Yeah, I 00:58:30
can do that. We can do that. But do you want to do it over Google Maps? We want to wait a week, say here's what we're considering. 00:58:35
Yeah, let's. 00:58:41
Look at it. 00:58:47
And then we can run cost estimates based on that like we can get all that. 00:58:48
Information if we have like. 00:58:51
Defined, but don't draft all official plans yet. 00:58:53
No, no, no, just a. 00:58:56
Something that high level concept of, yeah. 00:58:58
Because even that that draft like. 00:59:02
Both. You were just saying that allows us to start looking at the costs for everything. 00:59:04
And getting those estimates in. 00:59:08
OK, OK. 00:59:09
All right. Is that good direction? Yes. 00:59:12
OK, all right, Council, it is 645. I told you I spoke to Muncie. I have a hard stop. 00:59:14
If you'd like to keep going, we could appoint a mayor Pro Tem, but I gotta get to that pillar in the valley event. 00:59:20
Can I like? 00:59:25
Ask we've. 00:59:26
I know Mr. Riddle had sent an e-mail to all of you earlier today. I don't know if you guys had seen that. 00:59:29
As we have done the research in these. 00:59:34
Business items. 00:59:37
I think largely. 00:59:40
We've identified that these are not. 00:59:42
Immediately urgent. 00:59:45
Yeah. We've we've determined that that really the. 00:59:47
The immediacy is only really. 00:59:49
Applying to one of them? Really. 00:59:52
Correct. And and even that one I think is is. 00:59:53
The deadline for that would be May 6th. 00:59:57
So in theory. 01:00:00
If we continue, we can move it to a work session next week. 01:00:01
We can then move it and vote the following week as a business item and that would be April 28th. 01:00:05
The risk that we as. 01:00:11
Take on when we do that. 01:00:12
Is. 01:00:14
You don't have. 01:00:15
Any bolstered protections between now and then, but it would be essentially the same as. 01:00:16
If the state Bill 284 didn't happen because it's just our current. 01:00:21
Code and ordinances. 01:00:25
So I'm I'm OK with a continuance if. 01:00:27
You all are OK with continuing all of those items. I would like to continue 5. 01:00:30
5.2 so yeah, but 5. 01:00:34
I'm sorry, 5. 01:00:37
20202620. 01:00:38
Dash 23, I'd like to discuss that. 01:00:41
A little bit and and see if see if we have consensus to pass that. 01:00:43
If we don't, we can continue it, but the other side I think do need to be continued. 01:00:47
OK, so then I'm going to. 01:00:51
If I'm doing this right. 01:00:53
Do you want? Do you want full consensus? 01:00:55
On 5/2 because I would love to just continue all of them. 01:00:57
Discussing the work session at length. 01:01:01
I don't see any. 01:01:03
Immediacy to. 01:01:05
Can't we do a work session tonight on that one? So at least we're. 01:01:07
Like, I think we get a lot done just talking tonight. 01:01:10
I'd love for staff to have more time to review. There's some data points that I know that they're probably not prepared to have 01:01:13
and I'd also like. 01:01:17
To request that the planners are here, if we could get our planning department, I think that that's one. This is a note they were 01:01:21
invited to come. 01:01:24
So they were invited though. 01:01:29
We should direct them to come. 01:01:32
That would be the mayor's. 01:01:36
Prerogative. 01:01:38
Yeah, I I would. 01:01:40
I would support I mean. 01:01:42
I would recommend. 01:01:44
And. 01:01:46
Ask. 01:01:47
That we. 01:01:49
**** to the work session. 01:01:50
Then a vote. 01:01:52
Process as outlined. 01:01:55
And I would ask that we. 01:01:57
Do that. 01:01:59
But. 01:02:00
That's what that is. I just don't feel, I don't feel comfortable. 01:02:03
With how this process has come about. 01:02:07
I said my piece at the beginning. 01:02:11
And then that's all I'm I'm. I'll be done. But so I'm. 01:02:12
The mayor wants to. 01:02:15
Get out of here. 01:02:17
So yeah, I'm OK if we work session that item and we move to continue the rest, because I plan on being here for two hours either 01:02:18
way, right? 01:02:22
Sometimes it's 345, but. 01:02:25
So are you? Yeah, that's fine. 01:02:28
So but. 01:02:30
So what's your heart? What time is your heart? Stopped 5 minutes ago. 01:02:33
Yeah, so. 01:02:36
I'll make a motion to. 01:02:37
Continue Uh. 01:02:39
All the items 5. 01:02:41
.1 through. 01:02:43
6.1. 01:02:44
To next week's meeting. 01:02:45
Work session. 01:02:47
OK, I have a motion. Do I have a second? 01:02:49
What? 01:02:54
I'm not looking at you. 01:02:57
I'm trying to gauge the view down the table if we're not voting for it tonight. 01:02:59
And I generally agree, but I also don't want to waste the time. 01:03:03
And. 01:03:06
I believe that. 01:03:08
Council Member Holdaway and Councilmember Loray just proposed that they would like to at least work session that one item. 01:03:09
So I'm. 01:03:15
Looking to see how they feel, trying to gauge down the line because. 01:03:16
I don't want to second something if we can use the time effectively. 01:03:20
To just at least address, I think we can use it effectively. 01:03:24
We can let the mayor go and just. 01:03:27
Like because we don't get to talk amongst ourselves. And I think there's not misinformation, but like. 01:03:29
I would like to ask just general questions so we're prepared for a work session next week. 01:03:34
You know if we if it needs to be. 01:03:38
So motion was given. Do I have a second? 01:03:40
OK, I'll offer revising it. 01:03:43
Well, OK, so I'll motion to continue. 01:03:46
51. 01:03:49
53. 01:03:51
54555657 and 61. 01:03:52
And then we can talk about. 01:03:56
Did you say you said 57, Ezra? 01:03:57
Yes, you did OK. 01:03:59
All right. Do I have a second for that? 01:04:00
That's all of them but the one, right? Except for the one. 01:04:03
Yeah, we all generally agree with that case. 01:04:06
Second by Jacob Wood. All in favor. 01:04:08
Aye. Motion passes. 01:04:10
All right, next is we need to do a mayor Pro Tem. 01:04:12
Who wants the hot seat? 01:04:16
Parker I like hitting the gavel. 01:04:19
To I think. 01:04:22
In honor of. 01:04:24
His newborn baby we should make in honor of his new son shocks. 01:04:25
OK. All right. 01:04:30
So I have a motion to have. 01:04:31
Parker be mayor Pro Tem. 01:04:33
For the rest of the meeting. 01:04:34
Or in perpetuity. 01:04:36
Either way, let's let's no and I clarify the motion, Israel. 01:04:37
Nominate her to appoint Parker as the mayor Pro Tem was the point. OK, awesome job a second. 01:04:46
I'll second that. 01:04:51
OK, all in favor. 01:04:52
Hi, All right, bring that gavel down here when you walk past. 01:04:53
Yeah, There you go, Parker. 01:04:57
I'm excited about this one. Here you go, buddy. 01:04:58
Use it. Thank you. 01:05:01
Thanks guys. 01:05:04
Again, I yeah, just talking. No, this will be good. I. 01:05:06
Again I. 01:05:09
Committed to this pillar of the valley thing, thinking that this was going to be work session. 01:05:10
And we need to get to it so. 01:05:14
Hey, well, we had a public comment and we have a couple people. 01:05:17
I apologize. 01:05:20
That last mayor just totally disregarded the public comment. Allow me please, could we have public comment? Mayor Pro Tem, I have 01:05:22
an introduction, introductory comments for this if you if you have say again. 01:05:28
I have introductory comments for this if you if you have. 01:05:33
OK, after we do the public. 01:05:36
Comment or your introductory comment for public comment. 01:05:38
Well, it may set the tone for all that. 01:05:41
Karen, are you OK if we allow Councilmember Larae to set the tone? 01:05:44
Absolutely. 01:05:48
Thank you. Thank you. 01:05:51
So I wanted to say that start out here. 01:05:53
That we recognize that the Vineyard RDA is already entered into several contracts and agreements with various land developers. 01:05:56
We further recognize that these arrangements are binding. 01:06:04
And that the Vineyard RDA expressly intends to honor these arrangements. 01:06:06
We likewise recognize that land owners have certain vested rights associated with their properties. 01:06:10
Which the Vineyard RDA also intends to abide by. 01:06:15
Any action taken as a result of these proposed resolutions that we're working on? 01:06:19
Will only apply in conditions where there are no existing contracts, agreements or vested property rights. 01:06:23
Or were there changes being requested to property rights? 01:06:29
These only applied, so it's just new or renegotiated agreements only. That's what we're talking about. 01:06:32
So any existing arrangements we have? 01:06:37
Would stand. 01:06:40
There is no intention to change them. 01:06:42
So that's let me start with that. 01:06:44
Also, I want to say that as we value highly of the principles of transparency and deliberation. 01:06:47
Our normal process for any proposed legislation would be to 1st examine the issue and any proposed legislation in a working 01:06:52
session for the City Council. 01:06:56
2nd, to allow the Council time to research the issue and its implications, as well as to allow the public time to weigh in on the. 01:07:00
On it during the week or so. 01:07:09
3rd, we would pick up the proposal legislation in a subsequent meeting as a business item where it would be discussed further. 01:07:11
And when the council is ready, voted on and that's that's the process we would like to follow. 01:07:16
And we intended to follow now I would I would point out that these. 01:07:21
There have been a lot of things happening these last little while we've had spring break. 01:07:25
You know, there's there have been medical issues and. 01:07:29
More than one person involved with that. 01:07:32
And and so forth. There's it's just been, it's been a rough these, these things were first looked at. 01:07:34
Over a month ago. 01:07:40
And so the. 01:07:41
Because there is a time sensitive date attached to at least one of them. 01:07:43
It was it was felt that we had to press forward to make sure that we did. We didn't miss that deadline. 01:07:48
And so as a result of that, we pressed forward to try to have. 01:07:52
To have this as a business item. 01:07:56
Tonight. 01:07:58
We have sensed as we. 01:07:59
And I'd have to say that as I've researched this, I found it. 01:08:01
Found it hard to learn things about it to the last 24 hours and all of a sudden everybody had information about it. 01:08:04
And all their inquiries I had made and started coming in. 01:08:09
And we've learned that. We've learned that there is indeed. 01:08:12
Not they're not as pressing as we had. 01:08:16
Where were we? 01:08:17
Given to believe initially. 01:08:19
And so that we can delay some of them and. 01:08:21
And out without losing. 01:08:24
Much ground. 01:08:26
And so we wanted to acknowledge that and so and that's the reason that we've agreed to go ahead and continue most of them, but 01:08:27
just look at the one that does it is more time sensitive. 01:08:32
So be aware that we understand that the transparency is something we ran on and we believe in. 01:08:38
And we want to abide by. 01:08:43
And so and. 01:08:44
And if. 01:08:46
If everything were. 01:08:47
Not time sensitive. We could do that better. 01:08:49
So just. 01:08:51
You know, actually. 01:08:52
I don't know if you. 01:08:55
When I was running for office, I've sent out these little cards and the first first thing on there is that. 01:08:56
We want to restore. 01:09:01
Transparency of public trust, the government and I got it's a return, it came back today even just to remind me about that so. 01:09:02
But so anyway, so I. 01:09:11
And so it's kind of funny, but at the same time. 01:09:14
You know, I really do believe that. I think we all do. And we want to, we want to abide by those principles and we're trying hard 01:09:17
to do that. 01:09:20
But we're also trying to balance the the the needs that have been thrust on us by. 01:09:24
The legislature in some in some cases. 01:09:28
And this. 01:09:31
We believe is one of them. 01:09:31
So that's why we're here now. 01:09:32
And so. 01:09:34
So that's my introduction. We wanted to deal with the first. 01:09:35
The first. 01:09:40
Basically the first resolution which basically sets them a framework. 01:09:41
In which the rest of them would then. 01:09:44
Reside and worked work together with and so by. 01:09:46
By establishing the framework, we are hoping that. 01:09:50
You know, that would allow us to be able to meet. 01:09:52
You know the first deadline and we'd have time to really work through the issues on the other ones, make sure they're right. 01:09:55
And that there. 01:10:01
And they're not. 01:10:02
They're not objectionable terribly to people, and they're actually actually doing. 01:10:04
Good for the citizens of Vineyard. 01:10:08
So that's. 01:10:10
So that's my opening statement. 01:10:11
OK. Thank you. 01:10:14
Karen. 01:10:15
Thank you, David. 01:10:17
Karen Cornelius Fellows. 01:10:20
I just want to say one thing. 01:10:22
Before I get into. 01:10:23
The the things that David talked about. 01:10:25
You were talking about. 01:10:28
Oh, sorry, you were talking about accessibility for emergency vehicles coming down the road and. 01:10:31
Being able to turn. 01:10:36
Do any of you realize that there is no way a fire truck could? 01:10:38
Turn off of Main Street. 01:10:41
On the Vineyard loop. 01:10:43
Going West. 01:10:49
Yeah, to go, but turning off of Main Street and particularly. 01:10:50
If they have to come. 01:10:54
Off of Main Street heading South. 01:10:56
And turning there is. 01:10:58
That road has just been decimated. 01:10:59
Right, and I know none of you did it, but I it's an important thing to consider. 01:11:02
Because there's such density on that one side of the street. 01:11:07
And they couldn't get in. 01:11:11
So. 01:11:12
My other question and. 01:11:13
You explained a lot of it, David, but. 01:11:15
Mayor was sharing with us that the time constraints are not what we thought they were. 01:11:18
So could you explain what the time constraints are on 5.2? 01:11:23
And with all of the noticing that we would have to do. 01:11:28
In order to. 01:11:31
Make all of this legal with the state. 01:11:32
What? What are our time constraints? 01:11:35
That's my question. 01:11:37
Well, these many of these would involve. 01:11:38
Public notice, public hearing and so we would have to give a 10 day notice for that and that would be the case for the for the 01:11:42
Planning Commission and then after their their action it would also. 01:11:46
Apply to the City Council, so that's another 20 days or so. 01:11:50
The Legislature. 01:11:54
Imposed an implementation date of May 6th, 2026. 01:11:57
And so can I clarify that? 01:12:00
Though the. 01:12:02
May 6 deadline. 01:12:04
Is largely. 01:12:06
Applicable to the 5.2 item. That's the resolution 202623. 01:12:08
So that's the one that we're going to stay to talk about. 01:12:14
That one is. 01:12:17
A resolution. 01:12:18
It would not. 01:12:20
Be the same. 01:12:21
There are other resolutions that we were talking about. There was maybe some question as to whether or not. 01:12:24
We were. 01:12:29
Bypassing Planning Commission, and we wanted to look at that a little bit more thoroughly and make sure that we're going through 01:12:30
this process the correct way. 01:12:33
And that's where those notices may be applied, but that's not. 01:12:36
Affected by the May 6 deadline, to my understanding. 01:12:40
In fact, some of there are other dates in there, they're further out like July and then October for some of the issues, but. 01:12:43
But for the overall framework. 01:12:50
May 6th. 01:12:52
Because it's been a long time, you know, very drawn out that we have not. 01:12:53
Address this issue. 01:12:56
In these meetings. 01:12:58
And that is not a new deadline, that May 6 is not a new deadline. And so my concern is. 01:13:00
That sometimes. 01:13:08
Transparency is not. 01:13:10
Possible. 01:13:12
As one council member is complaining that we have not done, however. 01:13:13
He had. 01:13:17
An item on the agenda a few weeks ago to vote on that had never been heard. 01:13:18
Well, as a business item, but anyway I just want to make sure. 01:13:22
That we are not missing the important deadlines. 01:13:27
Because. 01:13:30
There are many things. 01:13:31
That were run on. There are many things that were. 01:13:32
Many promises that were made to the residents, transparency being only one of them. There are others that we need to address and 01:13:35
face and this deadline happens to deal with one of them. So that's that was my concern is why the mayor. 01:13:43
Made mention. 01:13:50
That we weren't in time constraints and I just wanted to clear that up because I don't want to see us miss any of our deadlines. 01:13:52
So thank you. There are differing opinions about how applicable. 01:13:56
All of them are, and that's part of the reason we want to discuss these things. 01:14:00
So. 01:14:05
No, I just wanted to echo what Karen said. We ran on transparency. We also ran on. 01:14:07
Over sort of the RDA we ran on. 01:14:12
Parking around a lot of things and. 01:14:14
I feel like. 01:14:16
The RDA itself, it's taken. 01:14:17
Little longer than. 01:14:20
I think is appropriate and I think we got to get. 01:14:21
Around to addressing that again. All of us won. 01:14:24
Well, most of us won. 01:14:27
On these issues and. 01:14:29
And I think we have to. 01:14:31
Make necessary changes before we lose power. 01:14:33
In on May 6. 01:14:35
So, so and and. 01:14:37
Frankly, this is a. 01:14:38
You know, the end of the Legislature session was what was it? 01:14:40
And wasn't very far into February, right? Was it 45 days at, 45 days from? 01:14:43
From. 01:14:49
Middle of January. 01:14:50
Middle of January, Is that when I start? Yeah. 01:14:51
The end of February, so the end of February, right? 01:14:53
So we had basically March and now here we are, you know, in April. It's it's, you know, yeah, you've been working this for a 01:14:56
while. 01:14:59
Since we got a hold of it, which is about two weeks after the Legislature closed. 01:15:02
Daria, before Daria goes, I'd like to oh gosh, you council members, rascals. 01:15:07
I would like to commend Councilman. 01:15:14
Luray for. 01:15:16
Working hard on this. 01:15:17
The thing that we're talking about right now is a loss of trust. 01:15:20
That's why I believe we were a little bit. 01:15:24
Putting these resolutions out. 01:15:27
Vineyard is. 01:15:30
Struggling with. 01:15:31
A syndrome, and rightfully so. 01:15:35
The contract for the. 01:15:39
HID that affected $1 billion was put out. 01:15:42
With 24 hours notice. 01:15:45
And it scared the hell out of us. 01:15:48
The vote and that was done. 01:15:51
That the legislature without us even understanding that that could happen to our. 01:15:53
Small. 01:15:57
City. 01:16:00
The vote to create the RDA. 01:16:02
Was a legislation if you go way back. 01:16:04
With Governor Herbert. 01:16:05
How it was forced upon us as a city. 01:16:07
With nobody wanting it to happen. 01:16:10
And saying you will either dissolve as a city. 01:16:12
Or you will take those. 01:16:14
It creates less trust. 01:16:16
The legislation to remove the school district vote in 2021. 01:16:19
That did not come to this body. 01:16:24
We found out about it a year after the fact. 01:16:26
That the largest funding entity in the RDA. 01:16:30
Was not required to even be notified. 01:16:33
So there is a lack of trust at the state legislature. 01:16:35
And in all of those? 01:16:39
I would talk to the League of Cities. The lack of trust at the League of Cities. 01:16:40
Has been broken. 01:16:45
When the legislation to remove. 01:16:46
Power of a newly elected official and going to the League of Cities and saying I'm just elected. 01:16:48
This is going to happen. The league remained silent. 01:16:54
And so when we go and approach. 01:16:57
The League. 01:16:59
Let's make it clear there are now 2 leagues. 01:17:01
There's a second league and a second opinion and I. 01:17:04
Wholly recommend and grateful that. 01:17:07
David Luray is going out and getting a second opinion of a second league now. 01:17:10
It's unfortunate that. 01:17:14
We say league or the association and there's a misunderstanding of which one David is working with and. 01:17:16
People use words and they go, oh, you're talking. 01:17:22
Because there is somebody that. 01:17:25
Actually believes in municipal rights. 01:17:27
And in protecting them because for far too long. 01:17:30
Those cries have gone on deaf ears. 01:17:33
And so but. 01:17:37
They still are a league wheat. They still pay us. 01:17:38
We still pay them to represent us, but I would say they don't represent all of us while they represent everyone and so. 01:17:42
We can have a differing opinion on the league. 01:17:48
Now, respectfully, I like them and there's a lot of bills. 01:17:51
But I think we do need to take some time and we want to hear both sides of both the league. 01:17:54
And of the other association, what are the two leagues? What are the 2. The Utah League of Cities and Towns you see 3. 01:17:59
And then the UC 3, the Utah coalition of cities and counties. 01:18:06
And they're both. 01:18:10
Have diverging opinions on this bill? 01:18:11
And so I'm great. I'm grateful for David Larae to go out and search out for both. 01:18:14
I am in his e-mail today. He's like, hey, this is where it's at. I go. 01:18:18
Great. But where were you in two or three weeks ago when this legislation came passed? Why didn't you come and talk to us? 01:18:22
When it was before us, why didn't we hear both sides right? 01:18:27
And so. 01:18:30
But I'm still willing to go down and sit with them. So I think, I think it's smart, but. 01:18:31
I will say. 01:18:36
That I think that. 01:18:37
We need to use the time and wisely and and find out. 01:18:38
And I'm and I'll echo. 01:18:43
David Larae, we're not going to go after everything that's already been voted on and. 01:18:44
Everything that they have contractually done. 01:18:48
Everything in writing. 01:18:51
And this I'm going to point out. This involves us working with. 01:18:52
Anyone who has a contract with the RDA, correct. And there's, there's several developers, not one developer, all of them and 01:18:56
they're anybody at all. 01:19:00
And the writing wasn't perfect. So I mean, we need to clean up on that. But what I will say, Jake. 01:19:04
And other council members, we have essentially moved into a discussion about an item that we're going to come back to in a minute. 01:19:09
No, no, but I please go back to public comment. 01:19:14
Right. Uh. 01:19:19
I would just end with we want to get it better and we want to improve everyone, so go ahead. 01:19:19
Thank you for your patience, Dora President. Thank you. Hi, Daria opportunity. You too. 01:19:29
Make a public comment. 01:19:34
I would just. 01:19:36
Personally like to thank Monica in billing. 01:19:37
Our city staff for her considerate and efficient resolution to an issue that a resident had today. 01:19:40
Good on her. We do have some. We have great city staff and I just want to. 01:19:47
Make that known. 01:19:52
Tonight we have many resolutions tonight on the agenda. 01:19:54
And I truly hope that each will be a benefit to Vineyard. 01:19:57
As we continue working through those resolutions in the next. 01:20:02
Council meeting. I did have a question on 5.2 so I'm glad we're kind of discussing it. 01:20:06
I was. 01:20:12
Concern that vested rights previously. 01:20:13
Acquired. 01:20:16
Would continue under this. 01:20:17
Whether they would continue or not under this resolution, and Mr. Larae, David Larae answered that question for me, So I 01:20:19
appreciate your. 01:20:23
Tenacity. 01:20:28
And finding out. 01:20:30
Appreciate that very much and if you find wording in there that would say otherwise, please let us know so we can fix it. 01:20:31
Will do. 01:20:37
OK. 01:20:38
You mentioned about. 01:20:39
Planning Commission. 01:20:41
Having a parted. 01:20:43
Did I hear that correctly correct some of these other? 01:20:44
I can pull it up real quick. 01:20:49
The other resolutions that we've continued. 01:20:51
I think. 01:20:54
The best practice is to. 01:20:54
Involve the Planning Commission, have them notice. 01:20:57
Do their public hearing, do our public hearing and actually go through the. 01:21:00
Ordinance and code changing processes. 01:21:03
OK, please let the. 01:21:06
Planning Commission, No. 01:21:07
The planning department, thank you. Thank you. 01:21:09
OK, You want to get started, David? Did you have a? 01:21:15
Comment. 01:21:17
David Pierce, I'm a resident. 01:21:23
I have. 01:21:26
Well let me start off 1st. I have an issue with this I. 01:21:28
I can't find anything. 01:21:31
In the agendas from previous meetings. 01:21:34
Where? 01:21:36
Any of these resolutions, particularly the wonder? 01:21:37
Going to be discussing. 01:21:41
Was brought up. 01:21:43
At a previous City Council. 01:21:44
So there has not been any work session on this the public. 01:21:47
Had enough time? 01:21:52
To look at it and to analyze it. 01:21:53
Right, that's that's what they agreed any. 01:21:56
Comment from the staff on this. 01:21:59
And you can say, well, the staff was invited. 01:22:02
The staff was not directed by the mayor. 01:22:06
To appear here. 01:22:09
And give the opinion. 01:22:10
So you are correct I think. 01:22:12
And I don't believe. 01:22:14
That. 01:22:18
Putting this off for a work session. 01:22:22
Will impact. 01:22:25
Its implementation. 01:22:26
By this presumed deadline. 01:22:29
The 6th of May. 01:22:32
So I. 01:22:34
That's why we pushed it as a citizen. 01:22:36
Would like this. 01:22:39
And all the others to go through a. 01:22:40
A work session so that the people have enough time. 01:22:43
To look at it. 01:22:47
To analyze it. 01:22:48
Decide if they like it. 01:22:49
And if they think that to. 01:22:52
Appropriate. Now we can say, well, there are more important things than transparency. 01:22:53
But I think the card said. 01:22:59
Your your little piece of advertisement. 01:23:01
You're what's the number one item. 01:23:06
Restore true transparency and public trust to both city government and the culture within the city. 01:23:09
Thank you very much. 01:23:15
I think. 01:23:16
Putting this in a work session. 01:23:18
Postponing it for a week is the appropriate thing to do. 01:23:20
Yeah, I'll also have a comment. 01:23:24
Or question. 01:23:28
About 400 S. 01:23:30
Yeah. 01:23:33
If just. 01:23:34
I am confused. 01:23:38
From Holdaway Rd. 01:23:40
West, uh. 01:23:41
Would the southern boundary. 01:23:42
The southern curve of the road. 01:23:46
Be the same. 01:23:48
As it is now. 01:23:49
And it would be the northern side of the curb. 01:23:51
That would change. 01:23:54
Yeah, the North is gonna be my understanding. You're not gonna tear out the South. 01:23:55
It's all built and beautiful. You have big trees. 01:23:59
So it's just taking it, it's like. 01:24:02
When when the it's two different councils and one council said we're going to do 66 and the other said 75. 01:24:04
And then? 01:24:10
When they did 75, they go, we're going to go and tear out and make everyone do 75 and it's like, are you guys going to, I'm sorry, 01:24:11
what do you mean by everyone? 01:24:15
Everyone on that, the people who the people that live on that entire block from. 01:24:20
From 400 S. 01:24:25
From. 01:24:26
From the Lakeside Sports Complex to hold away to hold away. 01:24:27
It's in there if we're going to do 75 and we're going to. 01:24:31
Acquire all of that property. 01:24:34
So that it's consistent, right? So it's not consistent throughout that whole right of way. 01:24:37
So. 01:24:42
If I understand what's being. 01:24:44
Proposed or an alternate? 01:24:47
So the northern border. 01:24:50
On the east side of Holdaway Rd. 01:24:52
Would be different than the northern border. 01:24:57
If we didn't change it. 01:24:59
If your proposal. 01:25:01
Is to change it. 01:25:04
So the northern borders. 01:25:06
On one side of Holdaway Rd. would not line up. 01:25:08
Not all alike the northern border. 01:25:12
On the West side, I think this aligns confusion. 01:25:14
I think the proposal that was discussed today would make both sides aligned, either the West and the East. N says we're going to 01:25:19
stay at the 66. 01:25:23
And it'll all align or we're going to go to the 75 or you know. 01:25:27
And it'll all align. But which one are you doing? And if and if you're going to go and do? 01:25:31
Eminent domain. 01:25:36
To acquire this to go to 75. 01:25:37
How are you not? 01:25:40
Going to go and do eminent domain on the other to get that. Just Jake. 01:25:42
He'll draw a map for you and I can walk you. Sorry, we didn't have the PowerPoint, but it's like, I'm sorry, but it's like you 01:25:46
have two consistency plans for two different councils. 01:25:50
And so I'm glad my dad came and pointed that out just like, hey. 01:25:57
OK, so because I have. 01:26:00
Oh, and if you go to 75, you've got a. 01:26:03
Finish what? That is because. 01:26:08
There's not a. 01:26:10
Well, I apologize because I had this. 01:26:13
The platform for. 01:26:17
The other one I do have it. 01:26:23
I don't know where it is so you can show me. 01:26:25
Now I can meet with you after on the side. 01:26:29
It's just I'm sorry. 01:26:31
I can meet with you and walk you through and show you on the map where the and I can get Nasim. 01:26:33
I appreciate that it's just. 01:26:38
Let's do the same on both sides. 01:26:40
And whichever it is, that's. 01:26:43
That's as a citizen what I would prefer, right? 01:26:45
I do have. 01:26:50
Another point with that. 01:26:52
It deals. 01:26:56
With uh. 01:26:57
Don't know, I won't make that point tonight. 01:26:58
But those are my two cents. Thank you. Thanks, Mr. Pierce. 01:27:02
Any other public comment tonight? 01:27:08
Yeah, Pete. 01:27:11
Pete Evans. 01:27:16
So just a point of clarification and. 01:27:17
Because I honestly don't know. 01:27:19
Under public comment it says these are for items not on the agenda. Sorry recorder, didn't know your name. I was telling her I 01:27:21
wasn't trying to catch off sorry. 01:27:24
You can call me Steve. Most people when they hear Pete say hi, Steve. 01:27:29
Yeah. 01:27:32
So in the public comment, it says that they're set aside for citizens to express their views on items not on the agenda. 01:27:36
These items are all on the agenda. Is now the time to? 01:27:43
Talk about the agenda items or are you going to go through the agenda item? 01:27:47
And then open it up for public comment before the resolution. I'll do both. 01:27:50
OK, I'm pretty lazy. Fair when it comes to getting public comment. 01:27:54
I want all of the feedback we can get. 01:27:57
Let us have it. 01:28:00
Great. If you would like to share now before we. 01:28:01
Discuss any of that. 01:28:04
You're welcome to or we'll discuss it and then open up public comment great. So just. 01:28:05
Briefly and then and then if we open it back up. 01:28:09
I'd be happy to. 01:28:13
Respond to some of the things that is discussed in the. 01:28:16
In the resolution. 01:28:19
Discussion. 01:28:21
But. 01:28:22
You know the the. 01:28:23
A couple of things concern me right off the bat on the six resolutions. 01:28:26
And for City Council, the 1st is on the first page, which is a strategic note. 01:28:31
And this is actually contrary to what it says in the beginning, which says these are countermeasures. 01:28:36
For the state statute, SB-284. So each of those are a countermeasure. 01:28:41
Which is trying to counteract the measure. 01:28:46
Of the state statute. 01:28:49
It says. 01:28:51
That these. 01:28:52
Are to preserve vineyards maximum negotiating authority? 01:28:54
Over all, large scale development, including Utah City. 01:28:58
So. 01:29:04
It feels very targeted. 01:29:04
We removed that and the we're working on one. It's already been removed. 01:29:06
That actually hasn't been renewed. 01:29:11
Well, it has been removed. The copy we're working from here. And you're right, the public, the one that was attached to the 01:29:14
agenda. 01:29:17
Yesterday. 01:29:20
Didn't have that removed. It was intended that those resolutions would be exerted from that file and used because those are the 01:29:22
only things we are. 01:29:25
Paying attention to. 01:29:29
We recognize that the that. 01:29:30
Those comments are inappropriate. 01:29:33
And we apologize for that. We're not trying to target anyone. 01:29:35
In an effort here, we're not. Yeah. 01:29:38
Granted that we receive some help in editing these at one point from someone who who? 01:29:40
Probably was, but we recognize that that's a. 01:29:45
You know, that's a problem and should be there. Appreciate you being honest about that. Well, and also been an effort to be more 01:29:48
transparent. It's better just to throw it out and get hundreds of people to see it and go, hey, this is the current resolution. 01:29:53
By law, we don't even have to. 01:29:59
Post the. 01:30:00
Actual attachment, previous councils, you remember, we were so angry, like we're not getting anything. 01:30:02
And we were like, let's just post what we're currently at. 01:30:07
It might change or adjust, and so Robin's asked us for attachments. 01:30:11
OK, let's just post what we're up. 01:30:15
I think the more succinct way to say that was. 01:30:17
He threw, we put a rough draft or something that was not complete out and it was not. 01:30:21
Properly vetted and done, and that's. 01:30:26
Our collective mistake. 01:30:28
So is it safe to assume? 01:30:30
Just I don't want to put words in. 01:30:33
Restate what I think you're saying is that what's been posted for a public review is a rough draft and not. 01:30:35
Yeah, not ready for. 01:30:42
Correct. And then there's no intent to vote on anything tonight. 01:30:43
As we've vetted this and I've tried to work very extensively with legal now and and. 01:30:48
Try and build some consensus and talk to all of the council members. 01:30:53
We are identifying where these issues were. 01:30:57
Coming from. 01:30:59
We've kind of. 01:31:00
Severed that we're working to make all of these corrections. 01:31:02
I definitely am sympathetic and understand the frustration. 01:31:06
It was inappropriate for. 01:31:10
Something to be posted like that because it does read as a target. 01:31:13
And I don't think that that is the Council's intent. 01:31:16
I think. 01:31:20
Largely. 01:31:20
The goal here with these resolutions and again, we're only going to talk about the one tonight and move the rest to next week. 01:31:21
Is largely to just make sure that. 01:31:28
The council and RDA board. 01:31:31
Maintains any oversight authority that they can or should maintain to represent the public. It's not a. 01:31:34
Attack in my perception, I would. I would also. I absolutely agree with that. Not not. 01:31:43
Yeah, tended to be an attack and. 01:31:48
In fact, I want to say that we very much appreciate the work that's been done out there that you're doing at Utah City well. 01:31:50
I would also say that. 01:31:56
The confusion of your name. 01:31:58
Utah City actually thought that the. 01:31:59
They thought you were a city. 01:32:02
So it includes you thought we were a city because it's included in large scale development. 01:32:03
Yeah, well. 01:32:08
They don't know there's lots of people that touch this document. No, that's my main question too. We're always disingenuous. 01:32:10
That's not true. 01:32:14
That can't be hundreds of people. No, no, no, no, I'm not. I'm not saying that that's not true. I'm saying a lot of people, what 01:32:19
this says on its face, they couldn't have thought, oh. 01:32:23
We're sending this to a city called Utah City as part of our coalition. That's not true. 01:32:28
Correct. I think there's a confusion here. The issue that Jake is saying is that. 01:32:35
A lot of. 01:32:39
The collection of information there. 01:32:40
I think came from residents and people who supported right various members of this. 01:32:43
Council in their campaigns and that was not. 01:32:47
Properly. 01:32:50
Vetted or. 01:32:51
Thoroughly. 01:32:53
Parsed through. 01:32:55
And so. 01:32:56
What you're seeing is. 01:32:57
A collection of. 01:32:59
Citizen feedback. 01:33:00
So the the City Council did not draft, no one on the City Council drafted these resolutions. There was quite a few. I believe 01:33:01
there was involvement. 01:33:05
I certainly did not. 01:33:09
Yeah, yeah. 01:33:10
I mean, I, I had AI did some editing on at one point and it went somewhere else and got more, more editing and so forth. It's 01:33:12
gone. It's made the rounds. Didn't you send it to Jesse? 01:33:16
But this is also and yes, our legal reviewed it and he also identified, you know that. 01:33:21
These changes need to. 01:33:25
To be made. 01:33:26
In my conversations with him over the last two days. 01:33:27
The point being. 01:33:30
I wholly recognize that this. 01:33:32
Document that was attached to the agenda should not have been attached to the agenda and wasn't ready to be attached to the 01:33:34
agenda. I think that there was. 01:33:38
A lot of resident fear. 01:33:42
About this May 6 deadline and what SBB? 01:33:44
284 is and isn't. 01:33:48
And I don't think that there was good understanding of that. And that panicked a lot of people and out of the constituent panic. 01:33:50
I think there was council panic and that. 01:33:55
Pushed this faster than it needed to be pushed. I'm just going to call the spade a spade there. And I don't mean to offend anybody 01:33:58
in the room. Yeah, it was. That sounds logic. I would point a question, though, Pete, you recognize that you want us to have 01:34:04
authority as a governing entity Still, you're not. Your goal is not to remove future authority, is it? 01:34:10
What do you mean by that? 01:34:16
Well, when we read through the legislation, it looks like if it's not written, we don't write it out, that we retain it, that we 01:34:18
would lose it. 01:34:21
So I wanted to know your. 01:34:24
You support us in having, yeah, I mean oversight. Have you read through SP? 01:34:26
284 Yeah. And there were opinions of it that it would. 01:34:31
Minimize or restrict that. So that's my question. Well, the big, the big. 01:34:34
I mean I I read it, I don't think that's what it says at all. If I can opine based on my reading. 01:34:38
Since. 01:34:44
I mean, we're having the discussion anyways. Did anyone else have public comment? 01:34:45
OK, we're just kind of rolling now. 01:34:48
That's good enough, right Robin? Just teasing, yeah. 01:34:51
My understanding of it was largely that. 01:34:55
If you don't have. 01:34:59
Very robust. 01:35:01
Definitions. 01:35:04
Code ordinance. 01:35:05
You're required then by law through SB 284. 01:35:07
To always. 01:35:10
Default. 01:35:12
To an applicant. 01:35:13
If there's an appeal process. 01:35:14
You default to what they've. 01:35:16
In their favor. And that was our understanding, yes. 01:35:19
That is how I understand 284. 01:35:21
Yeah, same here. 01:35:24
And so the. 01:35:26
Purpose of these resolutions largely as we move forward is to make sure that we have a very clear and robust. 01:35:26
Process and definitions. 01:35:33
In place so that. 01:35:36
There isn't ambiguity. 01:35:37
Because if there is ambiguity. 01:35:39
We lose the appeal authority. 01:35:41
Due to SB-284, yeah, I think that's largely. 01:35:43
I mean, again, I'm not. I don't, I'm not. 01:35:47
Qualified to issue a legal opinion on it? That's for your city attorney. 01:35:50
But I think. 01:35:54
You know as you read SB 284. 01:35:55
A lot of what it's saying is that. 01:35:57
It's codifying what's always been in. 01:35:59
Utah case law, which is. 01:36:02
When someone makes an application. 01:36:04
A complete application. 01:36:06
Then they get treated under the rules. 01:36:07
Under which that application was made right and that. 01:36:10
That goes to the purpose of that is so for example in another municipality. 01:36:13
We made an application. 01:36:18
For subdivision. 01:36:21
The City Council literally said. 01:36:22
Oh, we don't like this because we don't like. 01:36:24
Those lot sizes. 01:36:26
We said well. 01:36:28
We're just going off of your code. 01:36:28
And they said, oh, we didn't. 01:36:30
We didn't know those were in our code. 01:36:32
And they denied our application. 01:36:33
And then change their code to eliminate those lot sizes. 01:36:35
And then said, well, you're welcome to resubmit. 01:36:39
Your subdivision. 01:36:41
And so. 01:36:42
That's the kind of thing that SB 284 is trying to avoid is by saying. 01:36:43
Whatever, whatever the. 01:36:48
Statutory construct is the zoning construct at the time. 01:36:50
You submit a complete application. 01:36:54
Those are the rules that you get judged by with your application. 01:36:56
And I think the intent of your. 01:37:00
Your resolution is to say. 01:37:03
If that's the case. 01:37:05
Then let's more clearly define what constitutes a complete application. 01:37:06
Correct. Let's make sure that we're lining all of those out. 01:37:11
Exactly right. 01:37:14
Yes, I don't. 01:37:15
I personally don't. 01:37:17
Have any problem with that? I think that's your right. 01:37:18
To be able to define those things. 01:37:21
What? What I'm? 01:37:23
More worried about IS. 01:37:25
What Councilman Larae said at the beginning of There are. 01:37:26
All of these developments already in the city. 01:37:31
That have these vested entitlements. 01:37:34
That this wouldn't apply to. 01:37:36
And I. 01:37:38
I'm struggling to think of any. 01:37:39
Property over 5 acres that would meet these definitions. 01:37:42
Of this resolution that this would even apply to. 01:37:45
Well, then it doesn't apply. It doesn't. It's no harm, no foul then, right? 01:37:48
So who cares? 01:37:52
When we well, I care because it specifically says. 01:37:53
So that we can retain maximum leverage over Utah City. 01:37:57
That's why that's why I care is because you're saying. 01:38:01
Hey, this doesn't apply to you, so why do you care? No, it applies to everyone equally. I mean, we've already established that 01:38:04
your name shouldn't have been. 01:38:07
Applied. No. No, I agree it shouldn't have been applied. 01:38:11
But I'm just saying it is in there. 01:38:14
Saying, hey, this is specifically so we can have leverage over that project. 01:38:16
Right. But I mean, let's go back to the school district, Bill, what you guys ran or it was run? 01:38:21
To remove the school district and we describe it as a 1200 acre RDA. 01:38:26
It's not named, but the only entity written in the entire legislation that it applies to is you. 01:38:31
Right. 01:38:37
So and you weren't named in the bill? 01:38:38
But it's literally the school, I mean the state. 01:38:41
Auditor even came out and said. 01:38:43
This only applies. 01:38:46
After reading the bill, there's not an RDA. So you're saying all of these resolutions were for us, you just No, no, that's not 01:38:47
what we're saying. No, that's what we're saying you're implying here. I read it. I read it in that implication to make sure it 01:38:52
applies to everyone and them. That's how I read that. 01:38:56
It was a quick draft. 01:39:01
He's already agreed that we should improve upon that. 01:39:03
But my question you didn't answer the question. 01:39:05
We recognize. 01:39:08
We didn't answer. We were not here to remove any rights that you currently have. 01:39:09
Right, we agree that anything that you were given in previous councils. 01:39:15
But you didn't answer. You recognize our future, right to have authority as a governing body, right? That's what we're trying to 01:39:18
establish. 01:39:22
So it will will improve this. 01:39:27
Yeah, we just don't want that. Absolutely, absolutely do. But I also think that you ought to think about. 01:39:30
How you create the flexibility to govern in the future that you want to, instead of pigeonholing yourself so tightly into 01:39:36
something that eliminates the flexibility that you want to have in the future. 01:39:41
To do some of those things. 01:39:46
Yeah, because to answer your question, please say your name for the recorder. She doesn't know you. Good to be with you tonight. 01:39:48
Thanks for having us. 01:39:51
Obviously, you know, we saw this yesterday. 01:39:55
This is the first time we've seen it. We're responding quickly. It was very. 01:39:58
We've gone through all that. We don't need to rehash that in response to your comment on the school district. 01:40:02
There's been a lot of. 01:40:08
Frankly, defamatory comments made about the negotiations that occurred between us and the school district. 01:40:09
And to say that we didn't approach the school district or have discussions with the school district, does that all went along. Can 01:40:16
you disclose who those are? 01:40:19
It was with Rob Smith. 01:40:23
So why hasn't when, when, when the that happened originally? I mean, we didn't form the RDA. We weren't here. So let me finish. 01:40:25
Let me finish, please. 01:40:28
Jake, let me go. Can you ask the question? I'm gonna respond to you. 01:40:33
People continue to say. 01:40:37
That there was number negotiations with the school district. 01:40:39
There is a mechanism built into the RDA. 01:40:42
A school district mitigation payment. 01:40:46
Are you aware of this and how that whole mechanism works? Yeah. Would you explain it for the public? So, Jake, I'll let you, I'll 01:40:47
let you explain it. You probably know it better than I do. It's basically there's a minimum amount of how much we, the school 01:40:53
district gets back. And when they didn't get much, they adjusted it to make sure it covers their bases. 01:40:58
So they were concerned that they'd come down here. 01:41:04
Build a lot of housing. 01:41:07
Not have commercial development occur. 01:41:08
And not be able to pay for the students that are going to school. 01:41:10
Which is literally the message that people continue pointing out saying oh this isn't happening. 01:41:13
What's happened though? 01:41:18
Contrary to. 01:41:20
The belief of everybody is that what the school district negotiated as a part of this with the state Prius, that wasn't us. So 01:41:21
let's be clear that this was all pre us. 01:41:25
We've spent hundreds of millions of dollars buying this property. 01:41:30
Because there was an. 01:41:33
Because. 01:41:35
The $170 million that we have currently right now this second. 01:41:36
In the cleanup, an environmental. 01:41:41
Environmental Cleanup. 01:41:43
Between US and other private parties and all the infrastructure that's gone in. 01:41:45
Only has gone in because of the RDA. 01:41:50
Had it not been for the RDA? 01:41:53
They're beat. I mean, almost everyone that's here tonight wouldn't be here tonight because almost everyone in this room is here 01:41:55
because the RDA existed. 01:41:59
And built a lot of the roads coming in here and pioneered the thirty, $40 million of infrastructure that went in, which was us. 01:42:03
And we did that. We felt like we've. 01:42:08
We might be the big bad developers. 01:42:12
You know. 01:42:14
But when you actually. 01:42:15
Look at our track record in Vineyard. We really do care about this place. 01:42:16
The thing that's been the saddest thing to me, to see what's happened and transpired in the city over the last five years. 01:42:20
Is the contention that started to occur here. 01:42:26
And I'm not trying to take sides. We've stayed comple. 01:42:29
Wheatley out of politics? 01:42:31
We haven't got involved in politics. 01:42:33
But at some point. 01:42:36
When I continue to hear and see the defamatory things talked about specifically with the school district. 01:42:39
No one talked to the school district. That's not true. 01:42:44
There's no meetings. 01:42:47
There's no text message, so why e-mail? So if there was no entire gram, why did they negotiate? 01:42:48
Why did they negotiate the mitigation pay? 01:42:54
Where did that contract come from? Do you think the developers? 01:42:56
And the state came up with that. 01:42:59
Where's the documents that you don't know? Figure it out. There's already been a grandma and there's no. 01:43:02
Because the trail, but they because they they were there involved in all the meetings that created that. 01:43:06
And there's been enough commercial development that has occurred here so that mitigation payment has not reported back to us. The 01:43:12
RDA board, you've never know paperwork showing that it happens 20 years ago. 01:43:18
But anyways, I'm going to move past this point. 01:43:24
I should have brought this point up before and I've let things go with public comments and now. 01:43:27
Please address everything to me as the mayor Pro Tem, Jake. Same goes for the council. Thank you. 01:43:32
So when this stuff comes out. 01:43:38
And the concern in the document, especially the way it's drafted in the attacking nature of Utah City. 01:43:40
Is that it's not just saying that you have the power to negotiate future contracts? 01:43:46
It's saying before any payments are made. 01:43:51
We're currently out. 01:43:53
This second. 01:43:54
Six and a half million dollars of RDA funds over the last few months, in the last couple of years that we've submitted invoices 01:43:55
for. 01:43:58
That we have contracts for. 01:44:01
We've turned invoices in for. 01:44:03
That you've actually. 01:44:05
Received property tax payments from the county for that you're contractually obligated to give back to us. 01:44:06
For those dollars that we've spent. 01:44:11
That go towards that $170 million bucket. 01:44:12
And we don't have those. 01:44:16
And I said a few months ago, we're being patient because we're saying it's a new council. You're getting your arms around this 01:44:17
stuff. We're being what we believe to be patient here. 01:44:21
I don't think there's a lot of developers in this state. 01:44:25
That would just continue floating this and not start filing lawsuits and doing some of these other things. 01:44:27
And so. 01:44:32
That's not to say we're going to do that now, but these are things we've got to sit down. 01:44:33
Look at the agreements that exist. 01:44:38
And I think. 01:44:40
I think. 01:44:42
It's it's unfair of the city right now. 01:44:43
To just not be abiding by the current agreements that they have, and that's currently what's occurring. 01:44:48
And I'm OK if you want to. We've even said if you want to change some of the process in this moving forward. 01:44:53
Let's talk about what those changes might look like. 01:44:59
If it's similar to bidding and. 01:45:01
Processing and you know, if you're saying we have to come in and do a new economic study or a new study every time you owe us for 01:45:03
something that we've already contractually agreed to and we've paid for, that's not going to happen. That's. 01:45:09
And I, and I think what you're all saying is that's not what this is for. I also think. 01:45:15
Let's say somebody in the city comes to you right now. 01:45:20
And says here's some tenant. 01:45:23
It's a huge sales taxpayer. 01:45:25
We want some already. They want some RDA dollars to come here. 01:45:28
You all 5 immediately say well wait a second, we can trade $1,000,000 of RDA dollars for three or $4 million annually of sales tax 01:45:32
revenue. 01:45:36
It's a no brainer. All 5 of you say yeah, let's do that. 01:45:40
That's something we should do right now. 01:45:43
You pass what you're passing tonight. 01:45:45
And you can't do that. 01:45:47
Can I ask did you understand? 01:45:49
The resolutions because I worked. 01:45:51
Very extensively with our legal representation the last two days. 01:45:53
To my understanding. 01:45:57
None of this is retroactive or would influence any of the agreements, but that's what I'm talking about. This would be something 01:45:58
new coming in. 01:46:02
And so the question to you all, I think is so if you're doing this. 01:46:05
And before you're going to lose power and you're nervous about the next group coming in and you want to do and put some process in 01:46:09
place. 01:46:12
I think. 01:46:15
You can ask anyone that comes in with a new RDA application. 01:46:16
It's all discretionary what you guys decide to do anyway. 01:46:20
So we're looking at this. 01:46:24
And it's kind of both sides because Jake, I hear what you're saying is like, why are you guys nervous about this? It doesn't apply 01:46:25
to you. And we're saying, well, why are you doing this if. 01:46:29
You already have the discretion to do this anyway if somebody comes in with an RDA application and. 01:46:33
Jacob finally talks the big. 01:46:38
Concert venue that he's talked about coming to town and he gets them and they need a little bit of money and they'll build you a 01:46:39
$200 million concert venue. 01:46:43
And they're ready to go and. 01:46:47
Now all of a sudden you've layered in a bunch of additional processes that you guys don't want to do. 01:46:48
But you have to do. 01:46:53
You know, I think that's another thing to consider. I'm not saying obviously we're just getting this. We're digesting this. You 01:46:54
guys are all getting this, You're digesting this. And so there's going to be some back and forth. Our attorneys are looking at 01:46:58
this, I'm sure. 01:47:01
Your attorneys are looking at this and. 01:47:05
I think that's all I have to say. I also I just. 01:47:07
My last comment will be. 01:47:11
I just hope we can all work together. I would hope that you guys can come up with. 01:47:14
I've heard from every single one of you except Jake. Jake, we've never talked. We've talked to the rest of you on the East Side. 01:47:19
It's been a big consensus from what we've heard. 01:47:22
We would like the east side to get cleaned up faster. 01:47:26
We went back to our group. We're starting to spend millions of dollars more additional to clean up the east side faster. 01:47:29
But then we're sitting here scratching our heads saying well. 01:47:35
If we're doing this faster and we're and you're getting these dollars, it's not like these dollars aren't. 01:47:38
In your account, like there's going to be some processes moving forward, we're going to have to be expending things like we always 01:47:44
do out ahead of things before tax increments created. 01:47:48
But we just want you to know we're here. We're willing to sit down, we're willing to work through things. 01:47:52
We do think it's important to start bringing some economic, more economic engines. You know, Jake, you had mentioned this is all 01:47:57
big failed experiment because we don't have anchors. 01:48:01
I think there are some anchors. I think there should be some additional anchors and that should be a priority. I think we should 01:48:06
all focus on that. 01:48:09
The real way to lower property taxes in the city. 01:48:12
Is going to be generating. 01:48:16
Millions and 10s of millions of dollars of sales tax. 01:48:18
That is the way for you guys to. 01:48:21
To be able to pay for everything else that you're doing and be able to lower the property taxes for everybody else, you can cut 01:48:23
all the staff which you've done. 01:48:26
There's only so much you can cut out of the cost side of things and sometimes the revenue side. 01:48:30
Has to be another big component of this so. 01:48:34
That's the last thing I'll say. And we're willing and happy to meet with any of you individually. We're happy to do this in a 01:48:36
public setting. We don't ever want to have this be. 01:48:40
You know, in closed doors and. 01:48:45
Like all the discussions we've always had with everyone, we're happy to have them in public and. 01:48:47
Whoever wants to attend is welcome. 01:48:52
Thanks, Nate. 01:48:54
Thanks and. 01:48:55
Sure. 01:48:57
And so. 01:48:57
Can we check with made assistant to the? 01:48:59
Mayor, Mr. 01:49:01
David Kyle, we would. 01:49:03
To find out if we have that, if we really. 01:49:04
Have invoices to. 01:49:07
Six and a half million dollars. 01:49:09
That Nate was speaking about. 01:49:11
Do we really have that here? Do we, do we know about it? Are we? That also might be a better question for our RDA Director and we 01:49:12
can. 01:49:15
Gavel in as the RDA at the end of the meeting. 01:49:18
OK, OK. 01:49:21
Thank you. I mean, I keep on. 01:49:22
Point of order just as an olive branch. Is it a point of order? Yeah. OK. I want to make sure there's an olive branch because I 01:49:24
could, I could understand. And listening to Nate about how he could feel like it was attacked on like. 01:49:29
Old scale. I mean, I felt attacked when I saw the bill. I'm like. 01:49:34
I don't want to lose any more authority in the future. 01:49:38
But I I can agree like. 01:49:41
The rough draft could. 01:49:43
Be viewed as. 01:49:45
Hey, we're going to go and rehash the past on on. 01:49:48
On contracts that were there. So that that's a point we'll take in. And I think as a council, if we just agree that we're going to 01:49:52
include Nate. 01:49:55
In the draft and hey, this is where we're at. 01:49:58
Because he should look at it. I believe both. 01:50:01
Leagues of cities and towns should look at the draft and give. 01:50:05
Of good feedback as well. 01:50:07
I think. 01:50:10
You know both of those. 01:50:11
But the last thing is is. 01:50:12
I think, I think we want all both sides want to establish trust. 01:50:14
Like. 01:50:18
I it's it's hard. 01:50:19
You know, we looked into the school district on. 01:50:22
You know Rob Smith. 01:50:25
And we did a. 01:50:26
We did a grandma and there were no documents as to why they lowered their amount and it was like why didn't the city lower amount? 01:50:27
And not even knowing. 01:50:34
So that just there's not good documentation and I'm not throwing the school district under the bus. 01:50:36
The previous Council of Vineyard or you? 01:50:40
But it's just like the history of it and the way in which it was done. 01:50:43
Is it just leaves? 01:50:46
There's no documentation in place to be able to do that. And that's what we're trying to do is. And the last thing is, is I hope 01:50:48
you guys would also support us. 01:50:51
In retaining our authority and not. 01:50:55
Shrinking it down. 01:50:58
I think one of the other concerns, that's the only thing we're trying to fight, Ezra and I had identified earlier today. 01:51:00
Was that in the agenda packet? There's also two versions of each resolution. 01:51:07
There's whatever that first. 01:51:11
Draft thing was in that package and then there's also. 01:51:13
Additional resolutions that I think have already been. 01:51:19
Edited from. 01:51:22
Our legal representation as well. 01:51:23
And so there's. 01:51:25
Added confusion there, which I think is part of the reason why. 01:51:26
We kind of unanimously agree that these should be moved to work sessions and we have to work through those things so. 01:51:30
I'm gonna end public comment and we'll go into. 01:51:36
Discussion. 01:51:40
On uh. 01:51:41
Resolution 2026-23, which is to establish a complete land use application. 01:51:42
And applicant vesting control policy. 01:51:48
Since I'm only, you know, mayor Pro Tem and I actually still am a council member that gets to do stuff. 01:51:54
I'm just going to share some of my. 01:52:00
Thoughts. 01:52:02
Get it out there for the public to hear. 01:52:03
This resolution, the intent of it to my understanding, is largely to define what makes a land use application complete. 01:52:06
Four large scale projects. 01:52:14
There's a little bit of ambiguity there, maybe with large scale projects, but. 01:52:16
That's defined in the. 01:52:20
At least second draft of the resolution. 01:52:22
So that gets clarified, I think, and then. 01:52:25
This would essentially require utility letters, traffic studies, phasing plans, fiscal impact analysis. 01:52:29
Before vesting occurs. 01:52:34
This is the. 01:52:37
Vesting gateway that's. 01:52:39
I think. 01:52:40
Identified by. 01:52:42
State Bill 284. 01:52:43
Which? 01:52:45
Has to be in place before May 6 or we lose the ability to put something like that in place. 01:52:46
The real issue that I think. 01:52:51
From my perspective is that it identifies. 01:52:54
Where we were very weak as a city when it came to what our. 01:52:56
Code, process and ordinances. 01:53:00
Defined and specified. 01:53:03
So from my perspective, there's a couple pros. 01:53:05
With this I do think that. 01:53:08
We need to fix some language in it, and I'll touch on that in a minute. 01:53:10
But the first Pro is that I don't think it actually expands. 01:53:13
Government or government overreach? I think that it's largely. 01:53:17
Defining information thresholds. 01:53:21
That should be met. 01:53:23
And it prevents. 01:53:25
Gaps in taxpayer. 01:53:26
Supervision is maybe the right term to say it. 01:53:30
I recognize that oversight, yeah, that the council is essentially the the taxpayer oversight. 01:53:32
I also think from a local perspective. 01:53:38
That this. 01:53:41
Essentially prevents vesting under thin standard. 01:53:42
It would just make the standard robust. 01:53:45
I think that that's better. 01:53:48
For everyone in the long run that you have. 01:53:50
Essentially a very defined. 01:53:52
Process of what's required. 01:53:54
We talked at length last week about or. 01:53:57
I guess two weeks ago now. 01:54:00
About. 01:54:01
What powers we wanted to allow? Maybe the mayor. 01:54:02
To have or not have, largely because we didn't want there to be perceptions of favoritism. And so this is also in part to combat 01:54:06
that and make sure. 01:54:10
One, the oversight board has oversight. 01:54:14
And 2nd that we're. 01:54:17
Applying it evenly across the board. 01:54:18
My legal concerns with this? 01:54:21
Resolution as it's. 01:54:24
Written right now. 01:54:25
The second one in the packet. 01:54:27
Is that I think that there needs to be a fix when it comes to language regarding. 01:54:30
Already completed applications. 01:54:36
And I did get a couple emails from our city planner, senior planner Cash Hans. 01:54:39
He identified a concern that. 01:54:47
All of Vineyard could be defined as transit adjacent, and that we as a council would essentially need to define what that actually 01:54:50
means. 01:54:54
Prior to moving forward. 01:54:59
And then I would recommend. 01:55:00
Stating that this is interim policy until we have an actual ordinance adopted. 01:55:03
That's my thoughts. 01:55:09
We'll go down the line. 01:55:10
Jake, you want to go next? 01:55:12
I have nothing more to add. I I concur. I think there's wisdom and. 01:55:14
And passing something. 01:55:18
Think the language and verbiage could get better? 01:55:20
I think that it's wise to gather. 01:55:22
Like I've already said that the 2. 01:55:24
And and we've also consulted with other attorneys in other cities. 01:55:27
Head conflicting. 01:55:31
You know the three cities I contacted they. 01:55:33
Small deal. 01:55:37
It's a nothing burger so it's interesting to see. 01:55:38
The. 01:55:40
Difference of opinion and if there is any not a solid consensus, I would pass a resolution just. 01:55:41
To make sure we're protected and our bases are covered. 01:55:47
No, nothing really more to add. It's just that I think that like you said. 01:55:51
To have real teeth, we have to make it an ordinance rather than resolutions. Correct love to. 01:55:56
Do that is it? Yeah. Thank you. 01:56:01
It's important to point out this is a resolution that doesn't. 01:56:03
Find anyone? 01:56:06
Yeah, we an ordinance is required to do that. This is a simply instructions on. 01:56:07
On how to produce an ordinance that would bind us. 01:56:12
And that's, that's the, that's the important, an important distinction here. 01:56:15
So. 01:56:19
It's also. 01:56:22
I like to point out it's possible to repeal resolutions and ordinances too. I mean, we've. 01:56:23
The previous council was was able to repeal a funding. 01:56:29
Mechanism for the. 01:56:32
Their proposed you know. 01:56:34
Vineyards that are. 01:56:35
It's possible to do that? 01:56:37
If we find that, we're really terribly in error. 01:56:39
We're trying hard not to be. 01:56:41
And try to use due process where we can to make sure we're not. 01:56:44
One of the things I learned. 01:56:49
Discussing this with our senior planner. 01:56:51
Is that? 01:56:53
That many of these things we already have enshrined in our zoning code. 01:56:54
And so they. 01:56:58
It really wouldn't take much, if anything, in addition to you know what's already there. 01:56:59
And then but there but does identify a few places where we we need to perhaps make it more robust. 01:57:04
To be honest with you, I really wish we could maintain the old system. 01:57:10
But the Legislature is. 01:57:14
Deemed that can't be. 01:57:15
That can't be done, so we're going to try to follow the law they've given us and and to. 01:57:17
Transfer over to these controls from. 01:57:22
You know, from simply zon. 01:57:25
Text amendments to requirements for a complete. 01:57:26
Package. 01:57:30
You know it's a developer agreement. 01:57:32
It's not a completed development agreement, but it's a perspective. 01:57:35
Developer agreement needs to be there as part of the application. 01:57:40
For some for new development and that's. 01:57:44
And so with. 01:57:47
With that in mind, I think that a little time we can get. 01:57:49
We can identify those things and put them all together, and I think that it would work well. 01:57:54
Our legal advice says that's possible. 01:57:57
Our planners say it's possible. The issue is simply do we have the? 01:58:02
The bandwidth and the planning department to be able to do it. 01:58:05
And within the. 01:58:09
You know, a lot of time. 01:58:10
And I think just to share a thought on on what you've said one of my. 01:58:11
Concerns here with that, specifically the bandwidth aspect. And Ezra, we talked about this earlier today too. 01:58:16
There's some duplication I think that gets created in this and other resolutions that adds checks to. 01:58:23
The planners. 01:58:30
For example. 01:58:32
One of I think it was this one, but it adds a. 01:58:33
Development agreement review and a zoning. 01:58:37
Review in addition to the code and ordinance review and then you have. 01:58:40
Essentially the same scope of work being performed multiple. 01:58:44
And that's that's further on. But yes, you're right and it probably is a duplication of work there the way it's written. 01:58:47
I would think it could be combined. They wouldn't need to be duplicated. 01:58:52
I agree with that I. 01:58:55
Don't want to run into the issue where we've worked very hard to. 01:58:57
Build a lean and efficient. 01:59:01
Organization. 01:59:04
And then we turn around because we're in a panic or a frenzy or we're doing something out of fear. 01:59:05
That, uh. 01:59:10
Pushed us into a position where now we have to hire a lot more staff again and we didn't actually shrink government. 01:59:11
You know, umm. 01:59:17
Ezra, what thoughts do you have? 01:59:18
I have many. 01:59:21
First and foremost. 01:59:24
This document with. 01:59:26
So I'm sorry and. 01:59:28
Kind of my archaic. 01:59:31
Before, when I was at the city, how we. 01:59:34
Had resolutions and things on. 01:59:36
We used to have staff reports that kind of identified. 01:59:39
Here's who's writing it. 01:59:41
Here's who's making this recommendation. 01:59:43
There's some strategic notes that were included in the packet. 01:59:46
But I don't have any direction on who is providing that guidance so. 01:59:50
As you mentioned that. 01:59:54
A lot of people have had their hands in this. 01:59:55
Is that? 01:59:57
Strategic direction. 01:59:58
From our legal counsel from. 02:00:00
City Council. 02:00:04
Could somebody help answer that question for me? 02:00:05
It has. The city was not involved. 02:00:08
At all. 02:00:11
In these documents. 02:00:11
Except for interpreting them. 02:00:13
Are attempting to interpret them. 02:00:15
Our city attorney was involved. 02:00:17
Not in writing it. 02:00:18
Not in Norway by a reviewing. 02:00:20
Well, yes, where did this? We tried to interpret it. 02:00:22
But we did not write it. 02:00:25
I got and these comments that Ezra is mentioning. 02:00:28
They weren't written by our city attorney. 02:00:32
Right, I'm not saying written, but. 02:00:35
We submitted it. 02:00:37
For approval and he said they look fine. 02:00:38
Did you send this to Jesse? Two weeks, yes. I sent it to him, yes. 02:00:40
What did he say? And he said that he. 02:00:45
He was defaulting to. 02:00:48
Mostly to the. 02:00:50
Utah League of Cities and Towns. We thought that time that they were the original authors of this. 02:00:51
We've since found out that that's not the case. 02:00:56
But we. 02:00:59
But it has been through. 02:01:00
Many other. 02:01:02
Well, other citizens have worked with this and so forth, so it's a. 02:01:03
So you sent it to Jesse? 02:01:07
Yeah, where did you get it from? 02:01:10
I was directed. 02:01:13
By a couple of people. 02:01:14
That have been working with us on the RDA. 02:01:16
Where do we find this? And I went and found it. 02:01:18
Did you use my version? 02:01:21
It may have been your version that I ended up with. 02:01:24
I out of no problem. Let's see Christie Henshaw Republican Party. We talked but I didn't give her the version. 02:01:27
You see, three got it. 02:01:34
I spoke with Saratoga Springs, Linden, Orem, there were quite a few people that. 02:01:36
We gave. 02:01:41
Hey, adjust this or I don't think we have it written. It was. 02:01:42
I did. How did this document come to be? 02:01:45
You can do zoom meetings and write with people and zoom meetings all the time while somebody dictates it. 02:01:49
I mean, David Larae helped most of it, putting it all together. I love it. Yeah, there's a lot of us we've. 02:01:55
Well, let's see, the people have been advising us a great deal with the. 02:02:01
RDA has been. We've had Carson Walker, we've had. 02:02:05
John Barrick we've had. 02:02:10
Kim Cornelius is with us here as advisors on some things as well. 02:02:13
And so forth. 02:02:18
We've had, are you wanting us to keep like a Word document like this suggested change and that suggested change like I'm not 02:02:19
understanding we didn't do that. So there's very clear like with your parking ordinance like. 02:02:24
I wrote that. I put on. I wrote it, I put it on. 02:02:30
So I just there's strategic direction here and then instructions on how to use this packet, a point of order for the Council. 02:02:33
Just like we're not. 02:02:41
Allowed to disclose. 02:02:42
Names for resident emails and things like that When? 02:02:44
They reach out to us. 02:02:48
Our recorder and I just are leaning over and there's a. 02:02:51
We have privacy. 02:02:55
Issue concern. So let's not use names unless they have given you permission to use their name. 02:02:57
Yeah. 02:03:01
Right. Yeah, that's why I'm wondering. Like that's like sad. Well, that's my question is like I'm wondering this the League of 02:03:06
Cities and Towns. 02:03:09
Wrote this and we found out that they didn't write this. 02:03:13
Yeah, that's that's my like. 02:03:16
David Lewis staff report, for example, it says. 02:03:18
I've learned a lot in the last 24 hours that were. 02:03:20
Where its origins were, and I'll be happy to discuss those with you privately earlier. 02:03:23
I think. 02:03:28
If we're I mean, this was on the agenda to vote today. 02:03:28
With clear instructions on how to use the packet like. 02:03:31
When I'm getting this, I'm reading this as these are instructions for me from. 02:03:34
Someone. 02:03:38
When I submit this, when I submit this to go on the packet, my understanding my understanding was that the. 02:03:39
That the resolutions themselves will be exerted from this and the packet would not necessarily would not be part of it, it just it 02:03:44
would just be the individual resolutions because that's all I really worked on. 02:03:49
I rather ignored the other other comments on the side. 02:03:53
OK. 02:03:57
We'll move past that one. I just, it just feels very like. 02:03:59
I know this happens a lot in the federal government. Where? 02:04:02
Legislators just proposed stuff that. 02:04:04
Lobbyists or whoever like I don't. 02:04:06
I just don't like that. 02:04:08
So I would love to in the future. 02:04:09
If we're getting like. 02:04:12
Direction or something like. 02:04:13
Is this a staff report? Is this coming from a council member? Like what? 02:04:15
Like who is providing that that instruction? So that that was my first. 02:04:18
Question but. 02:04:21
To address the comment on. 02:04:23
The the. 02:04:26
That this doesn't affect any existing applications. 02:04:29
So in Section 2 and I think. 02:04:32
We can keep pushing towards that goal, but. 02:04:35
Here are some of the things that I've noticed that would need to be changed for that to be effectuated in writing. 02:04:37
So I'm in the document that's. 02:04:42
I'm in the. 02:04:45
The one that says 2026-23? 02:04:46
Not the one that says 202601. 02:04:50
That's in the sub. 02:04:53
Sub item. 02:04:54
So Section 2, it says effective immediately upon adoption of this resolution. 02:04:56
No land use application for any of the following project categories shall be deemed complete. 02:05:00
For purposes of Utah code 109A509. 02:05:05
Unless all items specified in the city's published application. 02:05:09
Checklist for the applicable project type. 02:05:12
As amended by this resolution. 02:05:15
And the implementing ordinance described here and are submitted and final non placeholder form. 02:05:17
So that's my first. 02:05:22
Question of. 02:05:23
Or my first comment of. 02:05:24
It says that like it's saying this is forward-looking. 02:05:26
But this statement means. 02:05:29
We are. 02:05:31
With this resolution changing. 02:05:31
The standards that we had previously published, we were amending those standards we had previously published. 02:05:34
And now all of those applications will be deemed not complete. 02:05:38
So that's my. 02:05:42
My biggest? 02:05:43
Issue with how this is set up and how should we resolve that so that doesn't mean. 02:05:44
It doesn't look backwards. 02:05:48
You had to submit language to improve it. 02:05:49
My. 02:05:51
Recommendation. 02:05:52
Yeah. Is that we clarify. 02:05:53
Language. 02:05:56
To my like I read it and I can see what you're saying. 02:05:57
I think. 02:06:02
Largely you just clarify that. 02:06:07
Any anything that's been vested. 02:06:09
Is still. 02:06:13
Held to the Rules and the Agreement at the time of vesting. 02:06:15
Yeah. So if we've approved, approved. 02:06:20
Applications to go forward if there's development happening like. 02:06:23
And this is what I want staff to input on is. 02:06:26
Of these. 02:06:29
Revised standards How many How many applications don't meet these revised standards currently? 02:06:30
What are those deficiencies? And that way we get a scope of like. 02:06:35
OK, who are we? 02:06:38
Who are we talking about? Does this even affect anyone? 02:06:39
Or is this all? 02:06:42
Not urgent because there's no pending applications that we need to worry about. Well, and I would also. 02:06:44
Want to maybe just add language that specifies? 02:06:48
Just very clearly that this is. 02:06:52
All forward. 02:06:56
Motion. 02:06:58
Yeah, I think we can work on that and. 02:07:00
Subsequent work sessions and. 02:07:02
As we review that which I'd be. 02:07:04
Great to clarify, since that's the direction that's being given here. 02:07:07
You know, since, since. 02:07:10
284 requires us to be upfront about everything. 02:07:12
We're just trying to make sure we are upfront about appearing. 02:07:16
OK then in Section 4. 02:07:21
It says no application shall be. 02:07:24
Deemed complete if any required exhibit. 02:07:26
Is submitted in draft. 02:07:29
Placeholder to be determined or incomplete form. 02:07:31
So it's saying submitted in draft form. 02:07:33
But then one of the required documents is a draft development agreement, so. 02:07:36
There's a clarify that because those are contradictory. 02:07:39
Contradictory right there. 02:07:42
And then also that section still references a planning director. 02:07:45
If we're not going to. 02:07:49
Plan on having one then we can. 02:07:50
Strike that reference to the planning director there. I left that in because we had city planner also mentioned there. I figured. 02:07:52
Yeah, for future, if we ever have one. 02:07:57
That's great. 02:07:59
And then? 02:08:02
As far as the interim application, again I. 02:08:04
I don't think this is. 02:08:06
Ready to pass? 02:08:08
As an interim given. 02:08:09
Those. At least those those. 02:08:11
Issues and. 02:08:14
Again. 02:08:16
All a lot of these are spelled out in ordinance. It'd be great to have staff reviews say. 02:08:18
What's already in ordinance? We don't need to. 02:08:21
Re include that and then try to have this supersede the ordinance, because then there's a. 02:08:24
A question of. 02:08:28
Do we follow the resolution? Do we follow the ordinance? 02:08:29
I believe the ordinance would be. 02:08:31
The prevailing document in any given situation. So I think that just muddies the water to. 02:08:33
One of the other ones do the ordinance. 02:08:38
Right. One of the other resolutions that we're not considering tonight specifies that we do that review you're Speaking of. 02:08:40
Yeah, I think that was actually the next one. 02:08:46
The Dash 24. 02:08:48
So my recommendation? 02:08:51
Open to feedback. 02:08:54
Look, we know we're going to continue this item. 02:08:57
I would like to see this. 02:09:00
Maybe we take this copy the second copy from the. 02:09:03
The agenda packet? Yeah, the body that's numbered. 02:09:07
Let's have 23 correct? Let's have. 02:09:10
I don't know if it's appropriate to have. 02:09:13
Robin do it. Or or. 02:09:16
Mr. Riddle or? 02:09:17
But send it out to each of the council members like we did with. 02:09:19
The code revisions. 02:09:22
Let us redline our bits, send it back to Jesse or Mr. Riddle for a reconciliation and consolidation. 02:09:24
Then we can bring that. 02:09:31
To the work session. 02:09:33
Next week. 02:09:34
Does that sound like an appropriate? 02:09:35
Course of action. 02:09:37
Sounds great. I agree with that, with the understanding that the following week we would have a vote and meet the deadline. 02:09:38
Correct. I think that that's the intent. I don't think anybody here is pushed against. 02:09:44
OK. One of the things we're concerned about in this and this is. 02:09:48
This is a risk we take in doing that. 02:09:52
Is that we not allow ourselves staff time enough to actually? 02:09:55
Create the documents that are contemplated here. It's the instruction to go do it. 02:09:59
You mean maybe specifically like the ordinance? 02:10:03
Yeah, the ordinance wouldn't be created necessarily. 02:10:05
And we're also looking, you know. 02:10:07
And I guess we don't really have time for a. 02:10:09
There's not 20 days left to do the public hearing and stuff. 02:10:11
That affects different resolutions. I don't think that affects this resolution. 02:10:16
It's just the applicant. This one is just application. 02:10:20
And this one is because it's a resolution right now and not an ordinance is largely us setting legislative policy for the staff. 02:10:23
So it's the like you said earlier, the direction. 02:10:30
To go and make. 02:10:33
What needs to be made? 02:10:35
I also think that in doing this though. 02:10:38
We've probably redlined a little bit of the required completeness submittal stuff I. 02:10:41
I'm just thinking. 02:10:47
If we're redlining and we're actually looking at this, we need to. 02:10:48
Involve the staff in the conversations. 02:10:51
Get very realistic about. 02:10:53
Where the hours are and the allocation and make sure that we're not. 02:10:55
Putting ourselves in a position because this is a concern that I have and I know that the mayor has. 02:10:59
Is that we? 02:11:04
Have moved very quickly as a council for the last 100 days. 02:11:06
And in doing that, we. 02:11:10
While shrinking the size of the city government. 02:11:12
Have tapped. 02:11:14
Are people out to a position now where there's. 02:11:15
We're looking at do we have to hire more people? 02:11:19
So we have to be very clear at. 02:11:22
Making sure that we are not. 02:11:26
Overtaxing. 02:11:27
The employees that we have. 02:11:29
We need to take care of them. 02:11:30
And this is the point. This is a note. 02:11:32
We have the staff had this for the last two weeks and. 02:11:34
I know that they started looking at it yesterday because I met with. 02:11:38
Our planners to. 02:11:41
And that was the first time they opened it, looked at it with me. 02:11:42
So. 02:11:47
So there was an attempt at least to let them. 02:11:49
Comment correct, but we also need to look at. 02:11:51
And I'm just. 02:11:53
Playing devil's advocate here, you got to look at the timing. 02:11:54
The same way that we didn't have a City Council meeting last week because it was spring break. They're probably on spring break 02:11:57
with their families. You've got medical emergencies like like. 02:12:01
You mentioned for for us. You know me too. 02:12:06
I mean, I know that there are. 02:12:09
Extenuating circumstances there that also have maybe delayed some of this. 02:12:11
Now, I think it's still very feasible for us to. 02:12:15
Meet the May 6 deadline. 02:12:18
Even with our current City Council schedules. 02:12:21
I know we can't direct or vote in a meeting, but we can direct to say that. 02:12:27
Since this has a deadline, it's of. 02:12:31
Our highest priority on the Council, right? 02:12:33
Because we've got a deadline. 02:12:38
I think the highest priority is providing the city services that we. 02:12:40
Right. But planning, I mean, sure, this is largely planning, right? 02:12:44
Well. 02:12:49
Again, maybe, maybe we reach over to. 02:12:51
Mr. David Kyle, if he knows. 02:12:54
I don't know what's on plantings plate right now. 02:12:56
We have a lot. 02:12:59
On planning split. 02:13:00
We're currently renegotiating contracts. 02:13:01
Right now. 02:13:04
That's probably one of our and a lot of that is. 02:13:06
Deals with a lot of research. 02:13:08
And how we can claw back some of our. 02:13:10
We basically have lost a lot of money by having. 02:13:17
Previous contracts have signed away our. 02:13:20
Our rights to. 02:13:23
Increase our. 02:13:25
Our impact fees. 02:13:26
And so we're in the process of that negotiation. It is very time consuming. 02:13:27
And that's on top of the regular duties. 02:13:32
So I agree this is important. 02:13:36
I think that we should set the hard deadline and say, look, we want to have a draft of this resolution that's working through us 02:13:39
and Mr. Riddle. 02:13:42
By next week. 02:13:46
I think that is it realistic for us to say. 02:13:48
Can we have? 02:13:51
City staff, the planning department in particular, who's going to be involved in this? 02:13:52
Get what they need to get done in the next two weeks. 02:13:56
After today. 02:14:00
They have a better understanding of. 02:14:01
Where the direction? 02:14:03
This is headed. 02:14:05
This is today. Well, not today, but. 02:14:07
Yesterday and today were the first time I we've had both of our city planners have. 02:14:10
Have been at. 02:14:15
At the office, medical emergencies and. 02:14:17
Spring break and all. Everything you named off. 02:14:21
So we are a little behind and I can send a message to Council and let. 02:14:24
Let you know what. 02:14:29
When we can, what's the earliest we can get it on the calendar? 02:14:32
OK. And I think. 02:14:35
This is just. 02:14:37
Me willingness, I have tried very hard. I think to. 02:14:38
Corral. 02:14:43
That's maybe not the right term, but I'm a cattle guy to get everybody on the same page when it comes to. 02:14:45
The Council. 02:14:51
I'm willing to liaison with the staff. I will take ownership of that and making sure that. 02:14:52
I'm providing what they need or liaisoning with them in the count like. 02:14:56
If they need the. 02:15:00
A person to funnel and work through. I will facilitate however I can. 02:15:02
Is my offer. 02:15:06
OK. That's appreciated. Thanks. 02:15:07
It looks like Jesse's had his hand up. 02:15:10
For a little bit. 02:15:12
Hey and I apologize my video went out for. 02:15:14
A few minutes and so I'm not sure. 02:15:18
Which resolution you're talking about? 02:15:20
But overall, there's no urgency to any of this. 02:15:23
There there is a may. 02:15:26
Six deadline. 02:15:29
But anyone that has a complete application. 02:15:31
Before May the 7th. 02:15:35
Has to go into the current code. 02:15:36
The best we could do. 02:15:39
According to my calculations. 02:15:42
Is have this. 02:15:43
Resolution and the ordinance done by May 5th. 02:15:45
That means we're only protecting the city for one day, assuming. 02:15:48
We even want to change the code. 02:15:52
All the other issues. 02:15:55
Even in I've read 284 numerous times. 02:15:56
Most of these are just minor changes to state law, and there's no urgency about. 02:15:59
Any of this? 02:16:04
That we would have to. 02:16:05
Put this on staff and do 7 resolutions. 02:16:07
As I've read through it, I've already. 02:16:10
Figured out a way to combine two or three of these resolutions. 02:16:13
But remember, this was dropped on my lap in the middle of a lot of. 02:16:16
A personal events. 02:16:19
I just think we back up in. 02:16:22
Just say, is any of this urgent? And if so, let's move forward with the urgent matters. 02:16:24
But I can't see. 02:16:30
Any of this to be urgent at the time? 02:16:31
So I would just. 02:16:34
Council. The Council. 02:16:36
Let's sit down and find out what we think is urgent and why. 02:16:39
And then at that point, then we can give it to staff where they're not overwhelmed as they just got back from spring break and. 02:16:42
I understand one of the persons that had a relative that passed away and. 02:16:49
Things of that sort, so. 02:16:53
That's just my kind of overall advice without giving. 02:16:55
Personal legal advice. 02:16:58
Is that I I think somebody created a sense of urgency for the Council. 02:17:01
And I don't know if that was warranted. 02:17:05
Mr. Riddle. 02:17:09
But sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off, I thought there was a pause when I started. 02:17:10
I was just gonna ask you, go ahead, please. 02:17:16
Did you? 02:17:18
Here when I was. 02:17:19
Asking about if you would be. 02:17:21
Available or willing to. 02:17:23
Do similarly to what you did with the. 02:17:25
Code amendments. 02:17:27
And will you send out? 02:17:30
Maybe a copy of this to each of us. Let us do red lines and send it back to you and then have you reconcile those. 02:17:32
Yes, Sir. 02:17:40
I'll do whatever I'm directed by the council. 02:17:41
But again, I don't think the urgency is if somebody files on this. 02:17:44
On the 6th, we're just eliminating one day. 02:17:49
So I don't really see the urgency in jumping into the code. 02:17:52
And then asking. 02:17:56
Staff to rewrite a code for a one day period. 02:17:57
Agreed. And I think that we've kind of come to consensus here. The only issue, the only issue that had. 02:18:01
Urgency. 02:18:07
I think was the. 02:18:08
The 2026-23. 02:18:09
Which was the vesting 1, and I think that that's the only one that's specified in. 02:18:13
State bill is that May 6th? 02:18:17
Deadline so as long as we have. 02:18:19
Something in place and I think that the resolution meets the intent in SB. 02:18:22
284 as long as we have something in place. 02:18:26
Were good to proceed with the rest of the. 02:18:30
Changes in resolutions almost at leisure, but. 02:18:32
I mean. 02:18:35
Making sure that we're. 02:18:36
Actually doing it the right way, tightening up. 02:18:38
The ordinance, the definitions, all of those things. 02:18:40
Am I understanding that correctly think? 02:18:44
Oh, I'll let you go, Jesse. 02:18:46
Yes, I'm sorry. 02:18:48
Raise your hand, Parker, if I had before, because I'm not really sure if I'm interrupting someone, go ahead. 02:18:52
Jesse, I can't see the screen to know if your hands raised or not. 02:18:58
My apologies. 02:19:01
Oh, he can see me. 02:19:04
Of course I will. I like the procedure we did with the code. 02:19:05
Where I drafted it. 02:19:10
Send it out to the council, they made their changes. 02:19:12
And then it was we went through a public meeting to talk about the the draft. 02:19:15
And I like that procedure and everyone seemed to be on board and everybody's what seemed to be involved. So of course. 02:19:19
Let's stay with the procedure. This work for us. 02:19:26
I agree with that. Is that a consensus? Yeah. 02:19:30
Or at least on my end. 02:19:34
One thing I wanted to point out. 02:19:36
A concern that I. 02:19:39
Have that I hopefully hopefully we can address through. 02:19:40
Kind of everything that went down with this process is. 02:19:43
Like at the end of the day, if any of this stuff was found to be. 02:19:45
Like a need for litigation. 02:19:51
Like Jesse would be on the hook to defend that on behalf of the city. 02:19:53
And so I love what the mayor spelled out in his April first direction of saying. 02:19:57
Work directly with legal to get those resolutions together because I definitely want you, Jesse, to feel comfortable. It's like. 02:20:01
I don't want anything. 02:20:07
I guess. 02:20:09
Unless I would love. 02:20:10
An accompanying. 02:20:12
Legal opinion on things if you're not comfortable. 02:20:13
Defending or. 02:20:17
Supporting something? 02:20:19
That's something that I would love to know kind of going into the meeting. So if you're, if you're ever available to do that. 02:20:21
I think that would. 02:20:26
Be welcome. 02:20:27
If other council members agree. 02:20:28
I. 02:20:35
Process that we put in last time where I. 02:20:36
Take over the process. I didn't really have any control over this process. 02:20:38
They were sent to me. I I assumed when I. 02:20:43
Received them. They were done by the League of City and Towns. 02:20:46
I've talked to their general counsel today. 02:20:49
He was a little bit upset that his name was involved in it. 02:20:51
So there's still revelations coming out on who drafted these and. 02:20:54
To this day I don't know so. 02:21:00
I like the process where we keep it internal. 02:21:02
That if there's a. 02:21:04
Resolution that I get involved in the in the drafting of that. 02:21:06
And then if there's an ordinance, I work with staff to figure out what is what. What about our ordinance needs to be improved? 02:21:09
Now for example 284 has lots of changes. 02:21:15
Especially regarding the Planning Commission. 02:21:19
So we'll have to adopt the state code changes into our. 02:21:21
Local ordinances and and I. 02:21:25
You're always prepared to do that in April and May and June. 02:21:28
Of the year after the. 02:21:31
The legislative session adjourns. 02:21:33
And so I did talk to the general counsel of the league today. There are some seminars that they have on some of the changes to the 02:21:37
cities and I plan to attend those. But. 02:21:41
Yes, Ezra, I like the process we've been through and I would agree with you. 02:21:45
Great. 02:21:50
So, Mayor, can I? 02:21:52
I move that we. 02:21:54
That we adopt the process we've been Speaking of the process that was used previously with the. 02:21:55
City ordinances to review. 02:22:00
This resolution. 02:22:01
202623. 02:22:04
To formally right, it's just issuing a direction. 02:22:06
Yeah, let's. 02:22:11
Mr. Riddle, let's issue that as the council direction. Everyone seems to be in agreeance, everyone's heads nodding. 02:22:13
OK. 02:22:19
OK. 02:22:21
With that, is your head nodding? Yeah. 02:22:23
Yeah, he was nodding. 02:22:25
Could I get a motion to continue this to? 02:22:26
The next weeks work session second. 02:22:29
No. 02:22:31
Say the motion. 02:22:35
Motion to move this to the next work session. 02:22:37
Robin, for clarity, this is item 5.2 adopting a resolution 2026-23. 02:22:40
2nd. 02:22:47
All in favor. 02:22:49
Aye. 02:22:50
Cool with that. 02:22:53
Meeting adjourned. 02:22:55
Is that right? 02:22:56
Do we do we need to go into OK question? 02:22:58
Question, Robin. 02:23:03
Previously the motion. 02:23:04
Was made earlier to. 02:23:07
Continue 6.1 which was after we adjourn as the City Council convened as a redevelopment agency. So because the council voted on 02:23:09
that, we don't get to do RDA stuff. 02:23:14
Yes, no. Maybe so. 02:23:18
OK. You, you mentioned also there would be a time during the RDA meeting just to speak about? 02:23:20
The invoices for the. 02:23:26
OK, we're gaveling in as the RDA board. 02:23:30
Ready. 02:23:32
I have to say that it is currently. 02:23:34
809 on. 02:23:37
What day is today? The 14th? April 14th. 02:23:41
2026 so for. 02:23:43
Future. 02:23:45
Like if. 02:23:46
For future reference. 02:23:49
It helps. 02:23:51
If we have this on the agenda. 02:23:52
And there is some. 02:23:54
Ambiguity to where you can go into and this is on the agenda. 02:23:56
This is on the edge. Yes, Yes it is. 02:24:01
6.16. 02:24:03
To clarify, I think what he was trying to say was that he. 02:24:06
Is that they would like to have. 02:24:09
I dictated it with my executive authority as mayor, protest as a separate meeting and agendas with its own agenda. 02:24:11
Just so that way there's clarity on what's being voted on. 02:24:18
As the RDA board, I agree with this as a best practice. Yeah, so. 02:24:23
As the mayor Pro Tem, I will direct the mayor to fix that stuff. 02:24:28
So it seemed like. 02:24:35
I mean, as an informational item, I think your question is do we owe the money? The answer is yes and. 02:24:37
You know it does under score. 02:24:42
The great partnership that we've had. 02:24:44
With flagship where? 02:24:46
The nature of our agreements is they front the expense for a lot of the things that they do, both the environmental. 02:24:48
And the infrastructure, we reimburse them later. 02:24:55
We've got a lot of our annual payments. They're going to be going out. 02:24:58
Very soon. They usually go out in the spring. We get the money. 02:25:01
From the county. 02:25:04
In February. 02:25:05
And then we. 02:25:07
Begin paying out all of our reimbursement agreements and so just generically the concern of. 02:25:08
Hey, you owe us a lot of money. It's true. We and we've usually pay a lot of that in the spring. So right now is the time that we 02:25:13
we pay them. So OK. 02:25:17
Mr. Daniels. 02:25:22
Could you just because I don't have the form that you've previously provided us in front of me? 02:25:23
When is the next set of payments? 02:25:27
Scheduled. 02:25:30
So. 02:25:32
Our annual reimbursement payments specifically for like tax increment finance. 02:25:33
Agreements. 02:25:37
That all just goes out in first quarter. 02:25:39
OK. So generally not a hard date associated just in first quarter. Each contract has some hard date, some say in the spring, some 02:25:41
say once you get the money, some say by may, some say you know. 02:25:46
Generally, everybody's a. 02:25:51
You know that we've worked with is agreed to receive the money. 02:25:53
Soon after we get it and we prepare the payments and we do the calculations of which. 02:25:56
Parcels are applied and all that kind of thing. 02:26:01
And then there's ongoing environmental. 02:26:03
Remediation that is not. 02:26:05
It just it varies as to what work has been done. 02:26:09
So some months are bigger than other months, Sometimes we pay them every quarter or we've. 02:26:13
You know, it's just. 02:26:18
The environmental piece is the one that's a little more unpredictable. 02:26:20
In terms of when they're expending certain project. 02:26:23
Funds for. 02:26:27
For which element of the environmental work that they're doing? 02:26:28
Other questions? Do you have a comment? 02:26:35
Please just following the audit. 02:26:37
It looks like the we didn't have really good established procedures in place, according to the auditor and the. 02:26:40
Those were hopefully to be in place. 02:26:46
As soon as we could, right? Yeah. So that's absolutely something we've been working on. 02:26:48
Yeah, and I talked. 02:26:53
To Chris because I had some questions about. 02:26:55
This I love for him to. 02:26:59
To comment on. 02:27:01
How he's felt like the. 02:27:02
Relationship. 02:27:04
I don't think he, I don't think he is. I don't think he is. 02:27:06
But I'd love for him to comment on how he feels like this relationship is gone and what he feels like we should do with those 02:27:11
contractual obligations. 02:27:14
Because I don't think you would. 02:27:18
Say to withhold payment on. 02:27:20
No, but. 02:27:22
I agree. 02:27:23
This is council sentiment. Should we invite him back since look, we continued this item already? 02:27:25
Let's bring him back. 02:27:30
Next week, yeah. 02:27:32
Invite him to come to work session, it's fine. 02:27:33
The When does he start the audit? 02:27:36
We don't have a, we don't have a solid date yet. We we need to. 02:27:39
Negotiate with him at the time we can have a work session to. 02:27:42
You like to have a kickoff session. He's mentioned that. 02:27:45
So. 02:27:48
I actually during the meeting. 02:27:48
Emailed Chris. 02:27:51
And and I'm working to arrange a meeting the 1st of next week. 02:27:53
With Josh. 02:27:57
To begin those steps. 02:28:00
I know we agreed that we were going to. 02:28:03
Higher additional staff. 02:28:04
And have that coincide with the audit, is that still the? 02:28:06
Expectation. I know it's the expectation of the Council. 02:28:09
So what we need to do? 02:28:12
And we didn't forget on that, I don't think. 02:28:14
That would be the thing that got continued, I think. 02:28:16
Oh so. 02:28:19
We need to have funds. 02:28:21
Basically put aside. 02:28:23
To we need to have a through to be able to pay. 02:28:25
And then we need to have some parameters, the amount. 02:28:29
How you want to hire them contractor versus? 02:28:33
Actual employees. So some direction from the council, I think we clarified that as we met with with Jesse Riddle last week before. 02:28:37
The thing that you're not? 02:28:46
Remembering though, with this conversation was that before any of this could happen. 02:28:47
The mayor needed to negotiate with. 02:28:52
Taxing entities and make sure that we were going to be permitted to have an additional administrative cost to what we've 02:28:54
previously had. 02:28:58
So that had to be negotiated, to my understanding. 02:29:03
For the coming year or for this current fiscal year? 02:29:05
If, and maybe this is a question, Mr. Daniels, for you. 02:29:09
Is there a surplus of administrative funds in this fiscal year? 02:29:13
Yeah, I think there will be some. 02:29:18
OK. And and I think. 02:29:20
Yeah, we could. We could. 02:29:23
Runs a calculation, but I think there's there's capacity. 02:29:24
And I think depending on the type of staff that you want. 02:29:27
Um, you know, sort of finance is probably the best. 02:29:31
So if that's some sort of like payments? 02:29:35
Analyst or? 02:29:37
You know somebody in accounts payable or something in that order. 02:29:39
I don't know that mean we could talk about the particulars of what? 02:29:43
What you are looking to do and maybe the feedback of the auditor. 02:29:46
Yeah. 02:29:52
Working with HR, we came up with a. 02:29:53
Well, we've worked with. 02:30:00
Councilmember David Larae. 02:30:02
We we have a listing. 02:30:05
Ready to go, We just. 02:30:06
Needed to know. 02:30:08
Some particulars. So if. 02:30:09
If we need to have a vote, could we just? 02:30:12
Direct that the vote happened next meeting so that there is no vote needed. 02:30:14
That's a great question. 02:30:21
We need the budget. I don't think the RDA has budget for additional. 02:30:23
I guess I mean the money is there but like a budget line item, right? 02:30:29
There are many different budget items that allocate for this already I saw that. 02:30:33
There's a lot of money that you're not sure. 02:30:37
Because it is so flexible and high level the RDA budget. So I think you probably so. 02:30:40
Now that's the question is if the RDA board is going to hire them or if the city is going to hire. 02:30:45
The person. The person, both budgets are so high level and flexible that could accommodate it. The mayor could choose. 02:30:49
I think the idea of the council is the RDA, right? Correction. Yeah, the the previous conversation was that. 02:30:55
If we were to proceed down this path. 02:31:02
They would be paid for by the Rda's administrative. 02:31:04
Cost. 02:31:07
Or administrative budget. 02:31:08
And that would be if they're funded by the RDA, they're hired by the RDA board. 02:31:09
It would be, I would assume separate from the. 02:31:13
City, right. So that's a really. 02:31:17
Great question because there is a little bit of an important distinction. 02:31:19
The administrative. 02:31:23
Fee that the RDA. 02:31:25
Deducts, if you will, from our revenue. 02:31:26
Is typically used to reimburse the city. 02:31:29
For the. 02:31:31
Overall overhead administrative cost of running the RDA. 02:31:32
Which is essentially like. 02:31:36
The. 02:31:38
The what do you call it? Like the? 02:31:40
The prorated, if you will, cost of various elements of city administration. So for example, if you're using 10% of the accounts 02:31:43
payable capacity, you're covering 10% of accounts payable cost with that administrative fee. So I think you could go either 02:31:48
direction. 02:31:54
I think. 02:32:00
For if you're going to hire somebody that's like a full time in-house staff member, you probably should hire them as a city. 02:32:00
And have them be a city staffer but be dedicated in their duties to certain RDA. 02:32:07
Related things. So like if you're looking at somebody maybe like a finance analyst. 02:32:12
To provide. 02:32:16
You know, more financial oversight based on, you know. 02:32:17
New processes that the auditors coming up, you know. 02:32:20
Recommending or something like that. 02:32:23
That might be. 02:32:25
A good synergy for the city. 02:32:26
It was decided that. 02:32:27
That meeting that we held. 02:32:29
With Jesse Riddle and you and I, David Kyle that we would high up. 02:32:30
Higher up to three advisors at AS. 02:32:35
Independent contractors and yeah. 02:32:38
And and they would they would build up to up to 20 hours a week, no more than. 02:32:41
At the rate was that was negotiated with him and we had a cap for that. 02:32:45
So, and that's just. 02:32:49
I mean if as everyone. 02:32:51
On board. Yeah, I'm actually, I'm frustrated with the way that that was just phrased, David, because that's a decision that has to 02:32:53
be made by the legislative body and it can't be made outside of. 02:32:58
A public hearing. 02:33:03
Right. But that was already the those funds are allocated on the 20252026 budget. That's very high level that's already been 02:33:04
approved. So we don't have to change it arguing that there's a line item for it, I'm I'm saying. 02:33:10
We never as a. 02:33:18
Governing body or as the RDA board? 02:33:20
Actually had. 02:33:22
A vote to say, are we going to hire? What's that hiring structure going to look like? Is it going to be because we talked about 02:33:23
doing a Commission versus an Advisory Board? 02:33:28
We talked about having representation as. 02:33:33
Each council member would maybe get to. 02:33:35
Bring somebody to the table that they could have an advisor in place now. 02:33:37
This is the first time I've ever heard of three people. 02:33:41
So the mayor was. 02:33:44
Was asked. 02:33:46
If he could have 1/3. 02:33:47
In a meeting and I I had no issue with that. 02:33:49
It was just a meeting with me and I think. 02:33:51
David Larae. 02:33:53
And because the money in the budget and this is not a director level position, it wouldn't come to us. They're just. 02:33:55
Staff employees and we don't. 02:34:00
We don't approve sure staff, this was supposed to be administrative decision. Yeah. So it's because it is just a lower, I'm not 02:34:02
calling lower level, but like because it's not a director, the money is in the budget. 02:34:07
And it's just an employee we did. 02:34:13
Asked the mayor, and I believe he was. We don't need to have a vote. 02:34:15
To have it, but that's why I asked him. I said if we need as long as we have direction from the whole council of. 02:34:20
The way you want to go if you want us just to hire these people. 02:34:26
Like we were open. We thought it would be. 02:34:30
Better to have more than less and have. 02:34:33
Right, less. 02:34:36
Just to have more of a committee versus. 02:34:38
It was basically to get maximum input, so that was just our suggestion we. 02:34:42
We were happy to facilitate whatever decision the City Council wants to make. 02:34:48
Do you want to put a vote on for the next City Council meeting to? 02:34:53
If we want to vote or we can do it informally, I don't care. 02:34:57
How do you want? How do you handle a partner? I'd love to see a. 02:34:59
Proposal from Chris. I think he like. 02:35:02
Or the auditor for the RDA, maybe he might have an idea of what a structure this is not part of the audit. Their staff within the 02:35:04
city, they're going to be watching, correct? But I think not. 02:35:10
The point is. 02:35:16
He Chris previously had mentioned that he felt like there was room in the RDA to have. 02:35:18
Correct. He wanted additional people involved. 02:35:23
Correct. What What I think Councilmember Nair is advocating for is can we get his? 02:35:26
Actual recommendation on what that staffing or structure looks like. 02:35:32
Is that an accurate representation? We've already talked to him about it. 02:35:35
We addressed it right. 02:35:39
I would love to see it. 02:35:41
Well written recommendation that we can write, but we addressed it and we had, we had a decision. Apparently nothing, no action 02:35:42
was taken after that. 02:35:45
But is that fair? 02:35:49
David Larae and I both sit on the RDA committee that was created, so that's why. 02:35:50
In meeting with the mayor. 02:35:55
That's why we didn't hold a vote. Now we could as a committee, we could bring it back towards a vote. I think that's the purpose 02:35:57
of the committee is to bring it back to the council. All right, so let's next week we can do that, Put the formal thing and we'll 02:36:00
vote. 02:36:04
Next week's artwork session, but. 02:36:08
Yeah. Or give direction after we put the guidance of. 02:36:11
So do you want to give direction tonight? 02:36:16
If we hiring let's I mean, I don't understand why we couldn't give the direction. We we asked for two-part time and then the mayor 02:36:18
said a third. He didn't distinguish who he. 02:36:23
Threw it up and said somebody in the school district with a background, he threw someone from the state in a different background. 02:36:27
We in working with the auditor who distinguished some backgrounds and. 02:36:33
I don't remember the titles of what they did on the contractor side. 02:36:38
We had conversations with Chris about it and he's the biggest thing is, is when the audit is is performed. 02:36:42
Going and Chris being all by himself. 02:36:47
Having additional staff to go through and get. 02:36:50
Knowledge would be very important. And so that's where it aligned and I don't think anybody. 02:36:54
Is. 02:36:59
Detracting from that argument. 02:37:00
My position on this is it's. 02:37:02
And look, maybe unpopular opinion with some. 02:37:05
It is falling in line with the same. 02:37:08
We're doing something. 02:37:11
In such a manner that I don't think it is the most transparent practice. 02:37:13
It should come back to the Council and I think. 02:37:17
Look over the last. 02:37:19
2 council meetings and I know that this was a big a big. 02:37:21
Point of frustration for the mayor and for his staff and for the employees in the city. 02:37:24
Where? 02:37:29
We are. 02:37:31
We're doing things in such a manner. 02:37:33
That it's not. 02:37:36
It but the handcuffing. 02:37:38
Right. But the mayor obliged to do this administratively. So we said, OK, great, let's just let's just. 02:37:41
And that's that's fine. But if he doesn't want to do it, then here's I agree with you like. 02:37:47
Then we have to make it and I can't speak for him to say if he wants to or doesn't want to do it. What I'm saying is. 02:37:51
Over the last couple council meetings we've essentially prevented him from doing things unilaterally. 02:37:56
We have tried very hard to maintain. 02:38:02
Authority in the Council so that things are brought into a public session and brought into a public meeting. We can present them 02:38:05
in front of everybody, we can get public feedback. 02:38:09
And this is something that isn't being done in that way. 02:38:13
So my advocacy is. 02:38:16
Let's bring it into the work session next week. Let's invite Chris to come and present on what he thinks the best practices are. 02:38:18
And let's actually make it a voting item. 02:38:24
So that there can be public feedback on those things. 02:38:27
I just don't want. 02:38:30
And and maybe it's my fault for for. 02:38:31
I shouldn't be projecting for the mayor. 02:38:34
Like the with the fee schedule I don't want them to be in a position. 02:38:36
Where they can be accused of favoritism. 02:38:40
Or that they're hiring their friends. Or that they're so. 02:38:43
That's where I think having a committee, having the panel, having that involved in public. 02:38:46
Is the best practice when it comes to hiring because this is a huge ordeal when it comes to. 02:38:51
The money, the budget. 02:38:55
The implications long term. 02:38:56
I just want to move it forward, so I'm happy to do it. And if that's the most transparent way, let's do it that way. 02:39:00
Yeah, I think the patients from. 02:39:06
I think it's been 7 weeks where he's tried to either go. 02:39:08
Is the administrative or legislative? 02:39:11
And so it's like the mayor said he would. 02:39:13
If he says no, then let's do it legislatively. But if he says I'm good and wants to do it? 02:39:16
I just don't want to handcuff him either. 02:39:21
Right. So whichever 1. 02:39:22
So let's make sure the mayor's involved at the work session. 02:39:26
And we get what he actually thinks is the best practice that he wants to do. 02:39:28
OK. And then we'll vote and it'll be a legislative decision. Can we, I can do that and and look, is there any opposition? 02:39:32
Because we're essentially talking about it now. 02:39:39
This is public. It's in the minutes. 02:39:42
Somebody watching us on the recording right now. What's up? Recording home viewer? 02:39:43
All of us are going to go. 02:39:51
You know I share my notes. 02:39:52
Every Wednesday morning on what happened in City Council. I know a lot of you guys do the same. 02:39:53
So. 02:39:58
This will get out now. 02:39:59
It will be discussed, we will collect feedback. That's just how it happens. 02:40:01
If we are in a good spot with the work session next week. 02:40:05
And the mayor says, hey, no, I'm really comfortable doing this as an administrative thing. I think that's the best practice, 02:40:08
Chris. 02:40:11
If he's agreeing with that. 02:40:14
Can we? 02:40:16
Also notice it as the business item. 02:40:18
To adjourn. 02:40:20
Reconvene as an RDA board and vote. Would that be comfortable with you all? 02:40:22
I'm just saying, how do we not handcuff them? 02:40:26
Is that possible? 02:40:28
Sure, possible that was. That was like the going standard of the previous. 02:40:30
Council, I think. 02:40:34
We might just have to notice it as a regular meeting. 02:40:38
But I know we can make that change. Like I know our schedule says it's a work session, but we can. 02:40:41
Well, but even all work sessions are is City Council meetings that you're only doing a work session in. So it would just still be 02:40:46
a notice City Council meeting. 02:40:51
Correct. 02:40:55
Is there any actual change on your end? 02:40:56
And it needs to be addressed. 02:40:58
Correct, but is there any any? 02:41:02
Difficulty or issue if we were to say. 02:41:04
Hey, look. 02:41:06
We want to just put that on as a. 02:41:07
Safety net, Maybe we can do it if there's a consensus. 02:41:09
You know, we just have to. 02:41:13
And let's just let them know a couple days in advance or whatever. Three days in advance, yeah, to make sure. 02:41:14
How he's feeling on that too, Yeah. 02:41:19
Because if he says, hey, I'm not into that. 02:41:21
Then it's a non issue anyways, yeah. 02:41:24
Yeah, I'm fine. I'm fine with that. 02:41:28
I think uh, uh. 02:41:30
I think we've covered the cover, the bases there. It's after 8. 02:41:32
Yeah, it's way after eight. I was looking at my watch. I said at 8:00 I should just continue this and then we have this RDA stuff, 02:41:35
but. 02:41:38
We have Mr. Daniels here. 02:41:41
What other questions do you guys have? 02:41:43
And this is not. 02:41:48
As much for you as it is for Evan, I just want to in the work session. I would love to see like. 02:41:50
Where we're at with the budget, with our spending. So I got a snapshot of like what the budget numbers were. 02:41:55
I just want to know, like, where we're at? 02:42:00
Spending each of those. 02:42:02
Buckets and staffing plan as well. I know we've. 02:42:04
Hired staff, gotten rid of staff so. 02:42:07
We can have that ready square there the work session. 02:42:10
Perfect. 02:42:12
Jake. Good, good. 02:42:15
Good, good. Do I need to do anything special to adjourn? 02:42:16
Somebody sure, please. 02:42:19
I move, we adjourn. 02:42:23
Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. You're going to. Yeah. Let him make his comment. 02:42:24
I'll be very fast. Nate Hutchinson again, I just wanted to state. 02:42:30
From an RDA budget perspective, we're happy to sit down. 02:42:33
With the RDA. 02:42:37
Group as well to start saying what should. 02:42:38
How would you like to? 02:42:41
Prioritize the future budget. 02:42:43
Whether that's cleanup, whether that's some infrastructure. 02:42:45
You know, there's, there's all these different needs and there's currently some funding that will be available over the next 02:42:47
couple of years. 02:42:50
You know, we have this big lump sum that's due this year. 02:42:54
And then it's going to be much more steady state moving forward. 02:42:57
Other than environmental cleanup, but we would love to sit down with you guys so that we're not just kind of in the dark. 02:43:00
Coming up with those plans. 02:43:06
We'd like to, I mean, we have our own ideas so that we're not just spending endless time doing this, but we'd love to sit down 02:43:07
with whoever would want to do that on your side. 02:43:11
To prioritize what the things you'd like to see. 02:43:15
Could I ask has that? 02:43:18
Been something that's occurred with. 02:43:19
Previous city councils where they've given you direction for what they're doing for budget. Yeah. So, so we have an annual RDA 02:43:21
requirement. We actually were meeting weekly. So I mean, it was kind of like. 02:43:26
Constantly like what projects need to be done? 02:43:31
There was a weekly meeting that occurred and then we would come and. 02:43:34
And and talk to the board periodically as as things were larger and public updates, et cetera. But happy this isn't necessarily a 02:43:38
requirement of the agreement, but this is something that we just. 02:43:43
Want to do in good faith of saying like. 02:43:49
Let's prioritize this together if we want to, you know, expedite some of the cleanup on the east side. 02:43:51
See how much budgets available and. 02:43:56
You know how much more additional dollars we're willing to put into some of these projects. 02:43:58
Help prioritize these. So just wanted to put that on the record and for you guys in your minds that we're happy to go through that 02:44:02
process with you. 02:44:05
Thank you. One more thing for the record too, I just want to. 02:44:08
Thank you guys, I work with a lot of developers at the county. 02:44:11
And. 02:44:14
I don't know of a single one who would be OK. 02:44:14
Like waiting this long for. 02:44:17
A giant payment of that magnitude. 02:44:20
So I think we all want to. 02:44:22
Keep that good relationship and make sure we're. 02:44:23
Working in the best interests of the city so. 02:44:26
So thank you for affording us that. 02:44:28
Mr. Pierce, do you have a comment? 02:44:29
David Pierce, President. 02:44:35
I I want to make the assumption and I think I'm correct. 02:44:38
That whomever. 02:44:41
Is. 02:44:43
Hire or contract that. 02:44:44
To assist with. 02:44:46
With work with the RDA. 02:44:48
Is qualified. 02:44:51
And I've been watching the Pit. 02:44:52
TV series about. 02:44:56
You know, medical thing. 02:44:58
And. 02:44:59
Now I can spend. 02:45:00
Three weeks. 02:45:02
In an operating room. 02:45:03
That doesn't mean that I should do operations. 02:45:06
In the future. 02:45:10
Or I can be of. 02:45:11
That doesn't mean I should be a heart surgeon. 02:45:13
If if someone is a. 02:45:18
Family or Consumer Financial? 02:45:21
Instructor. 02:45:24
I would prefer. 02:45:28
Personally. 02:45:29
As a citizen. 02:45:30
To have someone. 02:45:32
Who is skilled? 02:45:34
And trained. 02:45:35
In government financing. 02:45:38
Or land use development. 02:45:41
Financing. 02:45:43
Or even just land use. 02:45:44
Rather than someone else who may have experience on the periphery. 02:45:47
Or whose chief qualification is just. 02:45:52
That he is hung in there. 02:45:55
For a period of time. 02:45:57
That would be. 02:45:59
My assumption? 02:46:00
So thank you. 02:46:01
Yeah. Thank you. The best. 02:46:03
Anything else? 02:46:06
Going once, going twice. 02:46:07
Oh, David, you got to make a motion, she says. 02:46:10
I move, we adjourn. 02:46:12
I second it. 02:46:14
All in favor. 02:46:16
Go home. 02:46:18
Which time? 02:46:29
The purple. 02:46:37
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Transcript

Event transcript
Green lines there so we know we're getting audio. 00:00:00
All righty, let's go ahead. Let's go ahead and get started. 00:18:57
Good evening everybody. It is 6. 00:19:00
April 14th I am Mayor Zach Stratton and I'd like to open up the Vineyard City Council meeting. I've asked Harry. 00:19:02
To come and get our opening prayer and Pledge of Allegiance and. 00:19:08
Grab a pin. 00:19:12
So come on up, Perry. 00:19:14
Come up to the microphone, play or a prayer, then we'll do the pledge. 00:19:18
Our gracious Father in heaven. 00:19:30
We come before you this evening and thank thee. 00:19:33
For the many gifts. 00:19:36
That we have in the freedoms that we still enjoy in this country. 00:19:37
We ask that that would bless us this evening. 00:19:42
That we may share our thoughts and ideas. 00:19:45
In a manner that is pleasing to thee. 00:19:48
We pray for resolutions and we pray for peace. 00:19:51
He sings, We pray for Father, In the name of thy Son Jesus Christ, Amen. 00:19:55
OK. 00:20:01
I pledge allegiance to the flag. 00:20:08
Of the United States of America. 00:20:11
One nation under. 00:20:15
Earl. 00:20:21
All righty. Thank you so much. 00:20:25
I'm going to share a quick. 00:20:28
I think it's important. 00:20:33
I think it's important for the public to. 00:20:38
Understand a couple things. 00:20:41
As the mayor, I chaired the City Council meetings. 00:20:44
But there's an ordinance in our code. 00:20:48
That says if two members of the City Council or more requests for an item be put on the City Council agenda will put it on. I 00:20:50
think that's I think that's a really good check and balance. 00:20:54
I think that's really important. 00:20:58
My inspirational thought though. 00:21:01
Is. 00:21:03
And I think this applies to all of us is. 00:21:04
If everything becomes an emergency, nothing's an emergency. 00:21:06
And I would just. 00:21:10
We need to be judicious with our time. 00:21:16
And transparent. 00:21:19
There's a bunch of business items here in 5.1 and I've spoken to council about this one-on-one. I've communicated with everybody 00:21:22
today. 00:21:25
I really think we need to work session these. 00:21:29
But due to our city code. 00:21:32
Where two members of council can ask for anything on. 00:21:34
Which I again, I think that's important. 00:21:37
It's a good check and balance. 00:21:39
We kind of saw what. 00:21:41
Has happened in the past. 00:21:43
And I don't ever want that to happen in the future regarding. 00:21:44
Items that needed to be discussed being paid. 00:21:47
Put on there but my invitation. 00:21:49
And my thought for the day is. 00:21:51
As counsel. 00:21:54
Legislates. 00:21:56
I would recommend. 00:21:58
That, uh. 00:22:00
Just be judicious with that. 00:22:03
And make sure that we are. 00:22:05
We are following our the transparency that as laid out in my April 4th e-mail. 00:22:08
Where resolutions need to get. 00:22:14
We need to have. We just need to work session on before. 00:22:17
It's not. 00:22:20
Can understand that maybe there was an intent or an understanding at the time that. 00:22:22
Some of these were time sensitive that. 00:22:27
Upon further. 00:22:30
Reviewing is not the case. 00:22:31
And I don't necessarily have again. 00:22:34
I'm gonna do my best as the mayor to stay out of your way. 00:22:37
And let you guys legislate, but I just. 00:22:41
I think that. 00:22:43
It would just be prudent we had. 00:22:45
Our staff is putting in. 00:22:47
Crazy amount of hours. 00:22:48
In preparation for this meeting and. 00:22:50
As you know, we are really trying to shrink the size and making sure that we're being very. 00:22:53
Judicious with our taxpayer dollars so. 00:22:58
Thank you for all you guys do and. 00:23:01
That'll be my thought. 00:23:04
All right, we're going to move down to the work session. 00:23:05
To discuss public safety and compromise on Florida South and Geneva Road and Main Street, I'm going to turn the time over to Jake 00:23:08
Holdaway to lead out this discussion. Go ahead, Jake. 00:23:12
All right. Can you guys hear me? 00:23:16
Hello. 00:23:19
Can you hear me? 00:23:20
If you guys can. 00:23:21
Sorry. 00:23:26
So. 00:23:30
This is a lot of. 00:23:35
Gathering of information from hundreds of. 00:23:37
Citizens that live across. 00:23:40
400 S. 00:23:43
We've had a few deaths in key areas. 00:23:46
And we've had children that have been. 00:23:49
Putting very dangerous situations and been hit and luckily I think we've had three. 00:23:52
Life flighted and. 00:23:57
Not die. 00:23:58
Gratefully but. 00:24:00
They were very, it was very dangerous so. 00:24:01
As we start. 00:24:04
We're going to be opening up 400 S from Geneva Road to Main Street. 00:24:05
It's a very large section section that's usually more quiet. 00:24:09
And there are key safety concerns. Over the past eight years, citizens have emailed in. 00:24:13
Certain concerns. 00:24:19
And they've fallen on deaf ears and so. 00:24:21
The hope for tonight is before we have council and staff go and work and make those changes, is that the council can find some 00:24:23
sort of agreement. 00:24:27
Consensus to then. 00:24:32
Act upon staff without a vote of just saying hey. 00:24:34
We all agree on this because there's there's. 00:24:37
Competing interests and different moving parts so. 00:24:39
I'm going to start on Geneva Rd. 00:24:42
Where the first problem occurs. 00:24:45
On the Grant Old Grant Holdaway property. 00:24:47
I'm going to have Google Maps open here so we can go through it together. 00:24:51
Grant has sold his house and he's no longer there. 00:24:56
But there is an exit. 00:24:59
Onto from Geneva Road to 400 S that sits there and legally there is still an exit and an entrance and it hasn't been adjusted. 00:25:00
Where that young individual? 00:25:09
Died that evening because of the over parking. 00:25:12
400 S She was parked right there by that exit. 00:25:17
It still resides open today. 00:25:20
If you can see and zoom in on that section. 00:25:22
There's no way they could turn left or right. 00:25:25
In that section, and so I'm asking Council on the first point and change. 00:25:28
Is to by statute or resolution? 00:25:33
Tell the. 00:25:36
The Planning Commission to adjust that zone and work with the landowner to move the entrance to the Geneva roadside on the far 00:25:37
South side. 00:25:43
Similar to what? 00:25:48
Grants or Vineyard Gardens does they only have an exit here and they only have an entrance here, so doing the same way keeping it 00:25:49
there will make the road safer. 00:25:55
The second thing in gathering information. 00:26:01
Is moving and I don't know if you guys can see my screen. 00:26:04
But. 00:26:08
The ask would be on the next thing is. 00:26:11
Alpine in meeting with Alpine School District 2 1/2 years ago. 00:26:16
It was apparent that the intersection of Vineyard Rd. and. 00:26:20
And hold away run 400 Sal. 00:26:24
Is not aligned on the east. 00:26:27
Parking lot. 00:26:29
Because that is not aligned. If you zoom in here, you can see that the left hand turn lane. See how dangerous this is? The left 00:26:30
hand turn lane is saying to park here. 00:26:35
But it doesn't even go until here, so the cars wait right here in the middle of the intersection because of the off alignment. 00:26:41
And that off. 00:26:48
Makes it so there is no pedestrian. 00:26:50
Crossing in either of these intersections. So in the resolution I would be asking Council. 00:26:53
Because ASD has been. 00:26:58
Open to the change on that is moving this parking lot 25 feet. 00:27:01
To the east. 00:27:06
There is no power lines and they've obliged. They've said we could do this and they could get funding to align with that. 00:27:07
And that's a very. 00:27:15
Dangerous part in the intersection. 00:27:16
The next. 00:27:19
On that in aligning that is. 00:27:20
Oh, the next part. 00:27:24
Problem with this. 00:27:26
Is that there is an immediate exit here? 00:27:27
On there and it's only. 00:27:31
Like I think 42 feet. 00:27:32
From the other. 00:27:34
And ASD has been open to closing this. 00:27:36
Double exit because they have a left hand turn and a right hand and a left hand and right. They're too close to each other. 00:27:39
So the idea is that they would close this. 00:27:46
And that they would move this dirt. 00:27:48
So that there would be a roadway here. 00:27:50
And that it would align with this intersection, so we would have a very clean intersection. 00:27:52
Again, I know Timpanogos school district. 00:27:56
Oh, do you guys want to go take a front row? See, I don't know if you want to. 00:28:00
It's yeah. 00:28:05
Someone want to go point it out I can. 00:28:08
Yeah. 00:28:11
So closing the road of that parking lot. 00:28:13
Right there. 00:28:16
Closing that and moving it all the way down through a skinny Rd. 00:28:18
Makes the whole process safer. 00:28:22
We don't need 2. 00:28:24
It's only driving 30-40 more feet, it's aligning everybody and it aligns everyone in the same. 00:28:25
Intersection. 00:28:32
Hundreds of parents have emailed Alpine Vineyard or Orem because there's three different government entities that are involved. 00:28:33
And this feedback has fallen on deaf ears, so we're just asking. 00:28:40
Can the Council in resolution? 00:28:44
We're saying please go meet with them and this is our directive to close this and negotiate that. 00:28:46
The next point on the 400 S safe plan. 00:28:53
Is talking about Vineyard Rd. 00:28:56
In. 00:29:00
The width of hold of Vineyard Rd. 00:29:03
Is five lanes of traffic. 00:29:06
It is one of the most wide roads. 00:29:09
We have in the city. 00:29:11
It has two lanes over here on the east side it has a middle. 00:29:13
Medium. 00:29:17
Section and it has two lanes on this side. 00:29:18
And it sits vacant. 00:29:21
But because we don't. Because of the. 00:29:22
Painting on this, what it does is is that. 00:29:24
All we have is parallel parking. 00:29:27
So the request here is to have the left hand turn lane, but immediately after the left hand turn lane is no longer needed. 00:29:30
To get rid of it. 00:29:36
And also repaint it to move it 12 feet to the east. 00:29:37
What that does is it allows for parallel parking. 00:29:42
Safe parallel parking because not only will they be able to back up. 00:29:45
With five lanes of traffic. 00:29:49
They could have two and three lanes and it would only take a lane and a half to be able to back up, so they would be backing up 00:29:52
into nothing if the road is that wide. 00:29:56
And it would create an additional. 00:30:00
Depending on how it's painted. 00:30:03
30 to 50 additional stalls. 00:30:04
And it would take. 00:30:07
Because Vineyard Rd. is not. 00:30:09
A busy Rd. as a thoroughfare of 400 S, it's a safer road to be able to to back up there. 00:30:10
So that's point #3. 00:30:17
Point #4 and I have a little. 00:30:20
Wrote a video to talk about here. This is what. 00:30:23
Vineyard. 00:30:26
How Orms park? 00:30:27
Is used. Let me go back. 00:30:29
Or the experience of 400 uh. 00:30:32
Sorry about that. 00:30:35
See if I can get there. 00:30:36
OK, this is kind of a little video every single Saturday. 00:30:37
Orem City uses Orem Park to Max capacity. 00:30:43
And this is the stake center. They fill up the stake center. 00:30:47
On certain days. 00:30:51
Because they have no parking whatsoever. 00:30:53
For the capacity of what it is and so. 00:30:56
It it makes it so 400 S is extremely dangerous. 00:30:59
And it makes it so people cross at different at different sections, so. 00:31:04
Why do we have a? You know, we love our neighbors. 00:31:08
To the east, Orem city. 00:31:11
However, Orem City does not comply with their own ordinance. 00:31:14
To give you an example of Sleepy Ridge Golf Course when that was built. 00:31:18
All businesses in Orem have to do this. 00:31:23
They have to provide enough parking. 00:31:25
For their events that they are scheduled and so when sleep Ridge Golf course was built. 00:31:28
They told the owners no, you have to buy four additional house lots. 00:31:34
To provide the adequate parking. 00:31:38
Orem City does not comply with that with their own park. 00:31:41
And we have. 00:31:44
Vineyard City over many, many years. 00:31:46
With many different councils have said please, please, please. 00:31:48
And I and I believe as we open up 400 S. 00:31:52
We have leverage. 00:31:55
When the park was sold to Orem City. 00:31:57
We at Vineyard City retained ownership of a very large portion. 00:32:01
Of property night. 00:32:06
10 acres almost. 00:32:08
To be exact, that we still own. 00:32:09
And they use it for small. 00:32:13
Soccer games and. 00:32:15
The capacity they can either do baseball. 00:32:17
Or they can do soccer. 00:32:20
With their parking capacity. 00:32:22
But what they do is they schedule both. 00:32:24
But they only have one parking lot in order to do it. 00:32:26
And so. 00:32:29
The resolution, if we have the solution of Council, would be to take the property that we own. 00:32:30
Not all of it allowing for still some parking. 00:32:36
Some small soccer games and big soccer games. 00:32:40
And say you've got to get these cars off of the road. 00:32:43
You have to. You have to fulfill. 00:32:46
With your ordinance. 00:32:48
Just like if you were a business, you would have to go through and comply that and since we have leverage there. 00:32:51
I think we need to have a very serious conversation now. I know they're already aligning, so I'm not bringing up the discussion of 00:32:57
the alignment of the. 00:33:00
Of the light. 00:33:04
But that needs but that. 00:33:06
That's going to make it safer as well. 00:33:08
The next component is. 00:33:12
At the end of the park. 00:33:15
The dedicated bike path. 00:33:17
Just ends. 00:33:19
I wish you guys could see this. It has the. 00:33:21
Let me go through in here. 00:33:26
It has just the monument to Vineyard. 00:33:28
And because of the. 00:33:31
The differences in councils. 00:33:32
Plans were shifted and changed. 00:33:36
And the. 00:33:38
Properties on the north side of the road from Orem Park. 00:33:39
To the Holdaway Rd. 00:33:44
North-south. 00:33:46
Only have a right of way of 66 feet. 00:33:47
So we do not own, the city does not own that right of way. 00:33:50
However. 00:33:54
At my house. 00:33:55
West. 00:33:56
A different council came in and said we are going to require. 00:33:57
A right of way. I believe it's. 00:34:01
75 feet, so there's a 12 feet. 00:34:03
There's a discrepancy. 00:34:06
So. 00:34:08
As we widen it out. 00:34:10
We are asking. 00:34:12
A landowner and full discrepancy my father. 00:34:14
To say you need to go and we should have the standard of a 75 foot right of way. 00:34:16
And the argument is. 00:34:23
OK, we're going to force this through court. 00:34:25
Or should we have a 65 foot right of way which everyone else has? 00:34:27
On the West side. 00:34:32
And so the Council, we are fighting two different. 00:34:34
Councils of different age groups of what that right of way is. 00:34:37
And so it. 00:34:42
We need to give directive to staff, of which one aren't we And so? 00:34:44
Now before I. 00:34:49
Before I go after that. 00:34:51
The current. 00:34:53
And this is These pictures are incredible. 00:34:55
Because we these were sent by citizens and I appreciate it. 00:34:56
Oh. 00:35:00
I don't know why. 00:35:03
Can you see him now? 00:35:08
Lame. 00:35:10
Is it shut off? 00:35:17
OK, share, share screen. 00:35:20
Can you see it now? 00:35:27
Are you able to see it now? 00:35:34
Kind of on a delay. 00:35:37
So this is the segment from. 00:35:39
Holdaway Rd. to the park. Was there a red line over it? You guys see that? 00:35:41
So. 00:35:46
Let me go back. I think there's a massive delay, OK? 00:35:50
So we do not own that segment. 00:35:53
So if we are going to go with the more expensive, if we're going to be fair, and that's what I'm asking, the council is. 00:35:55
Are we going to have a very wide Rd. on the West? 00:36:00
Side of Holdaway Rd. 00:36:03
That is the 75 feet or 7475. 00:36:05
Or are we going to have the shorter one which is the 66? 00:36:08
But the shorter one from Orem. 00:36:12
Park to. 00:36:14
Holdaway Rd. does not own that. 00:36:16
12 extra feet for a bike lane so. 00:36:18
The goal of having a continuous bike lane that is separated. 00:36:20
From Geneva Rd. 00:36:25
To the lake. 00:36:27
Will have an entire city block where it's not where it doesn't have that right. 00:36:29
And so there are many people that are this is a very expensive. 00:36:34
Buy to buy that specific section. 00:36:38
And it would be very. 00:36:41
Expensive to get to that same standard, right? 00:36:42
Also in this section, the way it's painted. 00:36:46
It's painted so that people just park in it because they have a bike lane, it's red or whatever, and so every Saturday and every 00:36:49
weeknight. 00:36:52
Cars just park up and down in it and the mayor gives tickets over and over and over. 00:36:57
Or not Mayor. The sheriff does. The sheriff's do. 00:37:01
And. 00:37:04
Cities, our kids rarely use it. Their golf carts are always they're they're fighting even though they have one of the largest 00:37:05
roads in the city. 00:37:09
Because it has no protected bike path, everybody. 00:37:13
Fights over the. 00:37:17
Sidewalk. 00:37:19
And so it moves everyone into doing that and so. 00:37:21
There isn't litigation yet, but. 00:37:26
My father, he's here today and I'm. 00:37:29
I mean, he's more than April willing to talk about it. 00:37:31
Is. 00:37:34
A city must act in a fair and consistent and legal defensible matter in an application of its policies if a city determines that 00:37:36
an acquisition of property or right of way. 00:37:40
Purpose is necessary along a given stretch. 00:37:45
Such requirements should be applied. 00:37:48
Uniformly to. 00:37:50
To all similarly situated property owners. Selective enforcement where one property owner is required to dedicate or relinquish 00:37:52
right of way property. 00:37:56
Including through the use of eminent domain. 00:38:01
While others an entire block. 00:38:03
Along the same corridor are not subject to the same requirement raises concerns regarding equity, consistency and potential legal 00:38:05
exposure. 00:38:09
Because it's like you haven't asked this of everyone. 00:38:13
And accordingly, the city should establish and follow a clear, uniform approach. And that's what I'm asking the council tonight, 00:38:16
is to either apply the right of way. 00:38:20
Acquisition requirements consistently along the entire Rd. 00:38:24
And refrain from imposing such a requirement on individuals for just. 00:38:28
For just one, right? 00:38:31
So there are two solutions. 00:38:34
There's a wider solution. 00:38:35
That would be. 00:38:38
And in meeting with everyone, there's not. 00:38:39
On the road. 00:38:42
Their affordable solution is to treat everyone equally under the law. 00:38:44
And have an uninterrupted. 00:38:48
Separated bike path from Geneva Road to the lake. 00:38:50
This saves taxpayers. 00:38:53
But finds an affordable solution and it fulfills. 00:38:56
Campaign promises of connecting the bike path and so. 00:38:59
In the compromise needed. 00:39:02
To be fair to both the east side of Holloway Road and the West side of Holdaway Rd. 00:39:04
The compromise is in the section where there isn't a bike path. 00:39:09
Is to save money and if the council wants to do it now and wants to spend $1,000,000 in doing it the right way, but the affordable 00:39:13
way is just to in that section of 400 S. 00:39:18
Would be to combine both lanes. 00:39:23
Because right now there are 6 feet on the South. 00:39:25
And six feet on the. 00:39:27
And move both of them to the north side of the road. 00:39:30
The West Side. 00:39:35
Would be would be built the right way? We don't need to do Ballards, we can build it. 00:39:36
With a separated bike path. 00:39:40
And have a separated design to be able to do that. 00:39:43
This treats everyone fair now in one plan. 00:39:46
The plan that. 00:39:50
I think I can get we got consensus on is not to acquire anymore right of way property. So it saves about 1,000,000 bucks. 00:39:51
The plan is affordable with the same 66 foot. 00:39:57
Standard right of what we already own on both sections. 00:40:01
Now both plans have the exact same speed limit. 00:40:04
Both have. 00:40:08
Two lanes of traffic. 00:40:09
The same capacity. 00:40:11
The A2 Lane Rd. 00:40:12
Has the capacity of 20,000 cars a day. 00:40:14
We're only adding 300 houses. 00:40:17
Right. So like we're doing a little bit of overkill here and Clegg Farm is only adding three, but there is a little bit overkill, 00:40:20
let's say the other half. 00:40:24
Of the houses. 00:40:28
From where like the mayor lives. 00:40:30
600 houses. OK, let's say there's. 00:40:31
5000 people. 00:40:33
Even 10. 00:40:35
We're still not even half the capacity of what a road would need. 00:40:36
And both would have a separated bike path and I know that segment. 00:40:40
Wouldn't be ideally designed and we could spend $1,000,000 to design it the right way. 00:40:44
But. 00:40:50
But it would it would save the taxpayer a lot of money. 00:40:51
And the last thing that I would tell Council is. 00:40:55
These are the pictures of center and main. 00:40:57
This is a larger capacity Rd. by statue. 00:41:00
But it's a 14 foot wide Rd. in either direction. 00:41:04
This is the same thing with no standard in Main Street, right next to the City Hall. 00:41:08
On the same corridor, except for this has no standard and no sidewalk. 00:41:13
You can go around the city and say this is 300 W. 00:41:17
It's again 14 feet wide on either direction. This has no bike path. 00:41:21
It just has sidewalks and so like. 00:41:26
On this corridor, each development. 00:41:29
Developer has. 00:41:31
Created a completely different standard. 00:41:32
And so that's why. 00:41:35
Having a larger Rd. on the West side. 00:41:37
Then what is on the east? It's like they should have the same 66 foot standards. 00:41:40
To council is is that. 00:41:46
Before getting any staff involved, we need to. 00:41:48
We need to come together and say. 00:41:51
One, do we believe that we should treat everybody equally? And then two. 00:41:54
Should it be a larger, more expensive 70? 00:41:59
Like 75 foot. 00:42:02
Right of way and acquire the property. 00:42:04
Or. 00:42:06
Can we all agree and direct staff to design something out that fits? 00:42:07
And finds a solution. 00:42:12
I don't know if I spoke with the landowner. 00:42:14
Correctly. 00:42:16
If you want to say something better, you could. 00:42:18
Please come on down. We'd love to try to solve the solution. Love to hear from you. Come on down. 00:42:23
It's OK. 00:42:27
I have never talked litigation with anyone of you. I've I've talked to all of you about this. I actually want a safe Rd. along 00:42:29
there. 00:42:32
And as a resident there forever, ever since they put in those bike lanes. 00:42:36
With respect to where the church is. 00:42:42
You never see anybody out there in the bike lanes. 00:42:45
When the kids go to school. 00:42:49
Where do they ride their bikes? 00:42:51
They ride their bikes on the sidewalk. 00:42:53
I know the residents of Sleepy Ridge. I have conversations with them all the time and I've asked a bunch of them. 00:42:56
Why don't you have your kids use the bike lanes? It's too close to the cars. 00:43:03
And so they don't even like those bike lanes. 00:43:08
My daughter, 2 of my daughters are in that ward so I know. 00:43:11
I know. 00:43:15
A lot of people over there, besides dealing with them about the golf course. 00:43:15
And. 00:43:20
The idea simply for me. 00:43:21
The short of it is to take. 00:43:24
The width of those bike lanes, one one of them 6 foot on one side and 1 seven on the other. 00:43:26
Take those out and move them to one side like Jake says, move the road over. 00:43:32
Let the kids that have always ride their. 00:43:37
There are bikes to school on the sidewalk there and then we have a really nice big trail. 00:43:40
On the other side. 00:43:45
And it can be 10 foot. 00:43:47
I've done my homework and gone up the Provo River Trail and. 00:43:50
And along University Ave. both of those are 1010 foot wide. 00:43:53
The one on University Ave. right there next to the golf course Riverside. 00:43:59
The road is there with cars going 60 miles an hour, there's a curb and then you've got the 10. 00:44:05
10 foot. 00:44:10
Wide lane with a stripe down the center. 00:44:11
And that works really good. 00:44:15
I spent a lot of time. 00:44:17
On my electric bike going up Provo Canyon. 00:44:18
And and even in the news, I don't hear of any accidents. 00:44:21
You get some yahoos coming down on their skateboards and they're going way faster than what they should. 00:44:25
And uh. 00:44:30
And I and I haven't heard any accidents, I really do believe. 00:44:31
That those bike lanes on 400 S by the stake center. 00:44:35
Are really a waste. 00:44:39
Thank you. But what? 00:44:41
Thank you. 00:44:43
So anyway. 00:44:43
I just, I just think. 00:44:45
I'm a trails guy myself. 00:44:47
I love them. 00:44:49
I want to help them out in the future, but but we ought to do things that are common sense that really make. 00:44:50
Things safer. 00:44:56
Awesome. Thanks. 00:44:57
Council for. 00:44:58
To for the purpose of the discussion here, so as I see this. 00:45:00
We really have. There's three different issues here. 00:45:04
We have a Rd. 00:45:07
Or the ORM owns. 00:45:09
We have an area that Alpine School District owns. 00:45:11
Right. And then there's what we can do. 00:45:14
I'm gonna give a quick report. 00:45:17
I'm on where? 00:45:18
David, Kyle and I are on. 00:45:20
In ongoing negotiations to get this forum. 00:45:21
Problem fixed. They are aligned they. 00:45:24
Recognize that it is a problem. 00:45:26
They're getting the phone calls from the state present as well. 00:45:29
Regarding the the parking, so they they're, they're lined. 00:45:33
So I think that if we could just let. 00:45:37
Me can continue down that road of discussion and and come to back with you guys with some options to kind of. 00:45:39
Help with that? 00:45:45
Because at the end of the day. 00:45:46
We don't own the road. 00:45:48
Right, it's there's a couple. 00:45:50
Things that Naseem made me aware of is that road is up for micro surfacing this year. 00:45:52
And so as long as we keep that. 00:45:57
Discussion and Oram has said we'll paint however you want to paint it. Yeah, they will. 00:45:58
They just said you just tell us how you want. 00:46:02
So there's some steps in our local agreement we need to enter into and different things. 00:46:04
So we can work on that. 00:46:08
With the Alpine School district as well. 00:46:09
I haven't met with them. 00:46:12
But I have talked to the board about that saying this is an issue and they they recognize that as well. So. 00:46:14
In just for our own time this evening, if we could narrow the discussion of this work session on. 00:46:19
What we can do? 00:46:24
I think that would that would be helpful. 00:46:26
So I would just say that since we own property at the park. 00:46:28
We can have leverage of. 00:46:32
Please do not. 00:46:34
Schedule events because. 00:46:35
They if they don't. 00:46:36
Double schedule. 00:46:38
There's not a parking problem until it's fixed. 00:46:39
And I think as. 00:46:42
I don't think we have to do a resolution. 00:46:43
I think just this conversation, yeah, they're buying on it. 00:46:45
Hey, we want to give you, I don't know what it is, 12 months, 18 months to figure that out. 00:46:48
But after an 18 month period. 00:46:53
We don't want the facilities used for park like yeah, in that way. 00:46:55
Because. 00:47:00
It's our property that we own, so you're going to need to stop soccer. 00:47:01
Fields. It might take a little while to plan that, sure, but I mean, they've had. 00:47:05
Since Ross Holdaway sold that property, there has been complaints for 18 years and it's fallen on deaf ears to. 00:47:10
Park so it's like. 00:47:16
What do we have as leverage to make them move? 00:47:18
Yeah, on that right or action that. 00:47:21
2:00 on that one. 00:47:23
I know there were some terms on the sale like we don't. 00:47:25
We don't have any programming rights on that piece of property we own, right? That's correct. There's no programming rights. 00:47:27
And so all the programming rights lie with Orum. So do we. There's maybe look at that sale and see. 00:47:33
What? Uh. 00:47:39
We're even allowed to to do as part of the contingency. Yeah, it's a lease, isn't it's not a sale, right? It's not a sale. We own 00:47:40
the property. 00:47:44
Yeah, 99 year, I think. 00:47:47
But I could be wrong, I'll check. 00:47:49
We'll look into that for sure. I think though that. 00:47:51
The fever pitch, I mean, we. 00:47:54
We were with Bran and their whole city. 00:47:56
They're they're interested, their leadership team working together. Yeah, they're, they have a just huge desire to get this fixed, 00:47:58
so. 00:48:01
But they're right now just. 00:48:05
Entering into baseball season so. 00:48:07
I'm sure they've already got that program down. Yeah, already programmed, that's why. 00:48:09
That's why I say there needs to be some time, but it needs to be something of like. 00:48:13
A priority. 00:48:17
18 to 24 months, whatever planning, like I'm saying we own this property we don't want, we've talked in the short term about. 00:48:18
Crossing. 00:48:26
New crosswalk and lights for crosswalks. 00:48:27
And that sort of thing. 00:48:30
Which would be very helpful considering the circumstances of. 00:48:32
The previous incidences that were on 4 S. 00:48:36
OK, so let's jump down to. 00:48:40
What do we want to do? What do we don't want to do with the vineyard? 00:48:43
Property, yeah. 00:48:48
The vineyard portion of the of the road. 00:48:50
All I know is we need to be united, so OK. 00:48:53
Like. 00:48:57
I generally like. 00:48:58
Are we? Is the microphones really on? I can't hear them. 00:49:00
Coming out. 00:49:03
In the room, Jesse, tell me if you can hear me. 00:49:04
You didn't chime in. Yeah. 00:49:09
Normally I tell Tony to turn up the microphone like two or three times. 00:49:12
Yeah. 00:49:16
I can hear, I can hear you. There's a little bit of static. 00:49:18
From time to time, but I can hear you OK. 00:49:21
Generally, I'm in favor of the. 00:49:24
Separate bike path, I think that kind of matches the existing infrastructure that's. 00:49:27
Prevalent in the city and those are well. 00:49:31
Received and used. 00:49:33
I think that also enhances the safety of the location. 00:49:35
My uh. 00:49:38
Big concern. 00:49:39
As I've. 00:49:41
Talked with council members as I've talked to members of the community is I don't want to do something. 00:49:42
You know we've. 00:49:48
Busted our butts to try and get. 00:49:49
Aligned with a reduced budget. 00:49:52
And to make sure that we are. 00:49:54
Being good fiscal stewards for the Community. 00:49:56
We're trying to get. 00:49:59
Accounts and reserves in place. So anything that's a big ask, especially like $1,000,000 ask up front. 00:50:01
Is just going to be a hard no from me. 00:50:06
Generally speaking, I don't think that that. 00:50:09
Aligns with what we've been trying to do. 00:50:12
Yeah, I think the 66 foot cross section. 00:50:14
That is in front of the. 00:50:18
The church there. 00:50:20
I think it's very workable. 00:50:21
Cross section we can adjust the lanes however we want and the paint how we. 00:50:24
We want and that works fine and I don't see why that wouldn't suffice. 00:50:28
All the way down. 00:50:32
To Main Street. 00:50:33
From there. 00:50:34
And I think I generally agree with what what David saying we looked at. 00:50:34
You know, before there was these two plans, there was the three. 00:50:40
Previous plans The big. 00:50:43
Road, the small road. And then there was the medium compromise that Councilmember Larae presented on in a work session. 00:50:45
And I generally felt like that was. 00:50:51
Pretty sufficient infrastructure because it made it uniform. 00:50:55
While simultaneously addressing I think. 00:50:59
The safety concerns now I would want to look at, you know, the cost assessment between. 00:51:01
That variation. 00:51:06
But I'm. 00:51:08
I'm not opposed to that idea. I thought that. 00:51:09
There was. 00:51:12
Maybe some excessiveness where there was. 00:51:12
Sidewalk on both sides and the trail that maybe went through. 00:51:15
But I think if you have the trail on one side, the sidewalk on one side, the road is uniform. 00:51:18
That's probably a good. 00:51:23
Yeah, middle ground. 00:51:24
Agree, I think the only requirement I would have. 00:51:26
Is it the road? 00:51:29
Size appropriately that emergency vehicles could use it. 00:51:32
You know, we have a, we have a fire station down there and, and they, they have an out. 00:51:35
Outlet on 300 W over there and I see in the future that they could come down. 00:51:38
Go South on that road, come down and connect up there to. 00:51:43
To 400 S and go out that way. 00:51:46
And I think the requirement there is that. 00:51:48
You would have to have no. 00:51:50
Street parking. 00:51:52
I think the fire code right now is. 00:51:54
24 feet of uninterrupted. 00:51:57
Road is at the width for the fire code, right? I don't know if that's so this will fit the solution we're presenting. Chris is 00:52:00
looking like he might know. 00:52:04
Development where you have fire access roads, yes, I think. 00:52:08
And, and this is much wider, so the Ballards wouldn't be wouldn't take a. 00:52:14
Full lane in talking with. 00:52:19
Scott Johnson and the whole Ashley. 00:52:21
Acres group, I went. 00:52:24
And knocked every door. 00:52:26
You know you've got. 00:52:27
14 feet and a bike path a ballard's could take half a lane at. 00:52:29
You know, 10 to 8 feet. 00:52:34
And making the road very wide. 00:52:37
And I know the sheriff. 00:52:39
Is on that road because of the speeders. It's so wide that that's where they set up. 00:52:40
They get calls all the time, so shrinking it down. 00:52:45
Would actually. 00:52:48
Help it. 00:52:50
But it's not shrinking down to a skinny Rd. I mean, you're still going to be going. 00:52:51
Someone wanted to go 40, they could still go down 40. I mean we want them to go at a save. The 66 foot cross section is a pretty 00:52:54
decent Rd. Yeah, it's a very decent Rd. but putting the bollards on it to make sure that there is a. 00:53:00
A A dedicated bike lane because. 00:53:05
The thing that we haven't brought up is. 00:53:09
The uh. 00:53:11
Bike Blvd. which is Holdaway Rd. That's already past the council. 00:53:12
Kids are supposed to use. 00:53:16
You have the stretch from the park. 00:53:18
And then it crosses Center St. onto Holdaway Rd. 00:53:20
They're supposed to, that's supposed to be the bike road or whatever and connect, but it just ends. 00:53:23
There's no bike path to get to the park, so that's. 00:53:29
To help me understand just a little bit better, is the proposition for the bollards just for the? 00:53:32
Just that section, that strip between the Lakefront Sports Complex and Holdaway Rd. Correct. And and there is a second if we want 00:53:37
to pay. 00:53:41
To RIP out the city, the. 00:53:45
The sidewalk. 00:53:47
And shrink it to match. You could do something in the middle but then it's another $1,000,000 and then talking with. 00:53:49
You know, Nate Riley and everyone that's on that road, they're like. 00:53:55
We presented the bollard solution and it's great. It's not that bad. They're all totally. They're like, I love that. 00:53:58
They want this. 00:54:05
As a solution, I spoke with every single landowner on that road and they they support this. 00:54:06
And I also spoke, so there's no. 00:54:12
There's no. 00:54:14
Not one person has spoken to us against this proposal. 00:54:15
On the road now. 00:54:19
People might that. 00:54:20
Are driving through. 00:54:21
You know, might not get the I-15 Interstate of the 75 feet wide that they would enjoy, but it's not. 00:54:23
So the thing from council would be. 00:54:30
Could we, if we find a general consensus, could we now then go to Naseem and draft? 00:54:33
That. 00:54:38
And draft the legal to we do have to acquire. 00:54:40
A section. 00:54:43
From Keith. 00:54:45
And we've put this to bed and we can build it. 00:54:46
Could I just get a map of? 00:54:49
The uh. 00:54:51
Two side by sides, because we've got some existing plans right that. 00:54:52
Have been through the process already. 00:54:55
I just want to see that compared to what's being proposed. 00:54:57
So instead, yeah, and we can map that, we can post and say here is. 00:55:00
Like, here's the sketch. Here's what the road is going to look like. Here's what the sidewalk a trail. 00:55:03
Seen like a few different maps and so. 00:55:07
I just don't know what. 00:55:09
It's hard just kind of describing it to see. 00:55:11
Like just. 00:55:14
But here's where the bollards would go. 00:55:15
Here's what the cross section would look like. 00:55:17
Just having a basic sketch of that compared to. 00:55:19
You know what we've got and then? 00:55:21
We could do that kind of timeline of what we need to do to approve that, I think, right. I just didn't want to spend thousands of 00:55:23
dollars because I knew that. 00:55:26
There's so much different variation in just an easy, so it doesn't have to be, We could just something like. 00:55:30
Well now I got a week ago walk it me and you, but also sketch it so I could have. 00:55:36
Naseem, if you guys are OK with that? 00:55:41
Draft up. 00:55:43
Just a basic this basic picture. Yeah, just something that. 00:55:44
You know, you have the, you have that temporary segment, yeah. 00:55:48
You have the temporary. This is block is going to be treated the same right of ways the same. 00:55:51
But it's with. 00:55:56
The same right of way is the same, but this is designed with. 00:55:57
The right way, right? So it has a bike path that's there. 00:56:02
And if the Council wants to pay to do that, I don't think it. 00:56:06
I don't think we need to spend the $1,000,000 the. 00:56:08
Bollards are like $25 apiece. You don't have to buy very many of them. 00:56:11
It's going to be between 6:00 to. 00:56:15
$10,000. 00:56:17
To buy them for that segment. That's how cheap this is. 00:56:18
And. 00:56:22
And so it's a. 00:56:24
And it also there's a massive cost savings. 00:56:25
If we go on the old plan, we have to. 00:56:30
Build a retaining wall on my corner of my house and we haven't even priced that out. The current this corner here, yeah. 00:56:33
So we haven't. 00:56:40
Because my my corner is 5 1/2 or. 00:56:41
5 feet tall. 00:56:45
We have to build quite a substantial. 00:56:48
Retaining wall. 00:56:50
On that. 00:56:51
And then we also the city. The city will have to. 00:56:53
And that wasn't in the plan like the when the contractor came over, it was like, what are we doing? He's like. 00:56:56
You don't have a retaining wall above 3 feet. 00:57:00
You have to pay for a retaining. You have to build a retaining wall. It has to be engineered, has to be engineered. 00:57:03
And so that. 00:57:09
Made the cost even more expensive on the other plan. 00:57:11
And then you've also got a. 00:57:14
Acquire the other property, so it's like. 00:57:16
This is getting really expensive and that's when I said the council doesn't know all of these costs. 00:57:19
And they don't know the different right of ways don't align. 00:57:23
In that so. 00:57:27
But I'm more than happy to say OK. 00:57:29
Yeah, the map, we're consistent with everyone. 00:57:30
I'd like to just. 00:57:35
Personally if we can get the map or get the graphics. 00:57:36
Go and try and share that and collect feedback with that area, yeah. 00:57:39
I think that there are. 00:57:44
Differing perspectives but like I know Ashley Akers and Sleepy Age are very aligned on this. 00:57:45
Generally speaking. 00:57:50
But then you get down towards the Mayors neighborhood. 00:57:51
And those people? 00:57:55
Were more interested in the larger Rd. because they want to use that as an ingress. 00:57:56
Totally. So I just would like to collect as much feedback as we can. 00:58:03
Sure. Well, I think they're informed decisions. 00:58:07
So. 00:58:09
If I. 00:58:10
Get a consensus, draft the plan as is, but we'll come back to council for a vote. 00:58:11
Just a picture of what concept? Like, yeah, just like concept. Just something like this. 00:58:18
This is Yeah. Here's the road. 00:58:24
This I can tell you. 00:58:26
I can tell you more than that. Yeah, I can tell you it's 14 feet in both directions. It's got a 2 1/2 foot draw it for me. Yeah, I 00:58:30
can do that. We can do that. But do you want to do it over Google Maps? We want to wait a week, say here's what we're considering. 00:58:35
Yeah, let's. 00:58:41
Look at it. 00:58:47
And then we can run cost estimates based on that like we can get all that. 00:58:48
Information if we have like. 00:58:51
Defined, but don't draft all official plans yet. 00:58:53
No, no, no, just a. 00:58:56
Something that high level concept of, yeah. 00:58:58
Because even that that draft like. 00:59:02
Both. You were just saying that allows us to start looking at the costs for everything. 00:59:04
And getting those estimates in. 00:59:08
OK, OK. 00:59:09
All right. Is that good direction? Yes. 00:59:12
OK, all right, Council, it is 645. I told you I spoke to Muncie. I have a hard stop. 00:59:14
If you'd like to keep going, we could appoint a mayor Pro Tem, but I gotta get to that pillar in the valley event. 00:59:20
Can I like? 00:59:25
Ask we've. 00:59:26
I know Mr. Riddle had sent an e-mail to all of you earlier today. I don't know if you guys had seen that. 00:59:29
As we have done the research in these. 00:59:34
Business items. 00:59:37
I think largely. 00:59:40
We've identified that these are not. 00:59:42
Immediately urgent. 00:59:45
Yeah. We've we've determined that that really the. 00:59:47
The immediacy is only really. 00:59:49
Applying to one of them? Really. 00:59:52
Correct. And and even that one I think is is. 00:59:53
The deadline for that would be May 6th. 00:59:57
So in theory. 01:00:00
If we continue, we can move it to a work session next week. 01:00:01
We can then move it and vote the following week as a business item and that would be April 28th. 01:00:05
The risk that we as. 01:00:11
Take on when we do that. 01:00:12
Is. 01:00:14
You don't have. 01:00:15
Any bolstered protections between now and then, but it would be essentially the same as. 01:00:16
If the state Bill 284 didn't happen because it's just our current. 01:00:21
Code and ordinances. 01:00:25
So I'm I'm OK with a continuance if. 01:00:27
You all are OK with continuing all of those items. I would like to continue 5. 01:00:30
5.2 so yeah, but 5. 01:00:34
I'm sorry, 5. 01:00:37
20202620. 01:00:38
Dash 23, I'd like to discuss that. 01:00:41
A little bit and and see if see if we have consensus to pass that. 01:00:43
If we don't, we can continue it, but the other side I think do need to be continued. 01:00:47
OK, so then I'm going to. 01:00:51
If I'm doing this right. 01:00:53
Do you want? Do you want full consensus? 01:00:55
On 5/2 because I would love to just continue all of them. 01:00:57
Discussing the work session at length. 01:01:01
I don't see any. 01:01:03
Immediacy to. 01:01:05
Can't we do a work session tonight on that one? So at least we're. 01:01:07
Like, I think we get a lot done just talking tonight. 01:01:10
I'd love for staff to have more time to review. There's some data points that I know that they're probably not prepared to have 01:01:13
and I'd also like. 01:01:17
To request that the planners are here, if we could get our planning department, I think that that's one. This is a note they were 01:01:21
invited to come. 01:01:24
So they were invited though. 01:01:29
We should direct them to come. 01:01:32
That would be the mayor's. 01:01:36
Prerogative. 01:01:38
Yeah, I I would. 01:01:40
I would support I mean. 01:01:42
I would recommend. 01:01:44
And. 01:01:46
Ask. 01:01:47
That we. 01:01:49
**** to the work session. 01:01:50
Then a vote. 01:01:52
Process as outlined. 01:01:55
And I would ask that we. 01:01:57
Do that. 01:01:59
But. 01:02:00
That's what that is. I just don't feel, I don't feel comfortable. 01:02:03
With how this process has come about. 01:02:07
I said my piece at the beginning. 01:02:11
And then that's all I'm I'm. I'll be done. But so I'm. 01:02:12
The mayor wants to. 01:02:15
Get out of here. 01:02:17
So yeah, I'm OK if we work session that item and we move to continue the rest, because I plan on being here for two hours either 01:02:18
way, right? 01:02:22
Sometimes it's 345, but. 01:02:25
So are you? Yeah, that's fine. 01:02:28
So but. 01:02:30
So what's your heart? What time is your heart? Stopped 5 minutes ago. 01:02:33
Yeah, so. 01:02:36
I'll make a motion to. 01:02:37
Continue Uh. 01:02:39
All the items 5. 01:02:41
.1 through. 01:02:43
6.1. 01:02:44
To next week's meeting. 01:02:45
Work session. 01:02:47
OK, I have a motion. Do I have a second? 01:02:49
What? 01:02:54
I'm not looking at you. 01:02:57
I'm trying to gauge the view down the table if we're not voting for it tonight. 01:02:59
And I generally agree, but I also don't want to waste the time. 01:03:03
And. 01:03:06
I believe that. 01:03:08
Council Member Holdaway and Councilmember Loray just proposed that they would like to at least work session that one item. 01:03:09
So I'm. 01:03:15
Looking to see how they feel, trying to gauge down the line because. 01:03:16
I don't want to second something if we can use the time effectively. 01:03:20
To just at least address, I think we can use it effectively. 01:03:24
We can let the mayor go and just. 01:03:27
Like because we don't get to talk amongst ourselves. And I think there's not misinformation, but like. 01:03:29
I would like to ask just general questions so we're prepared for a work session next week. 01:03:34
You know if we if it needs to be. 01:03:38
So motion was given. Do I have a second? 01:03:40
OK, I'll offer revising it. 01:03:43
Well, OK, so I'll motion to continue. 01:03:46
51. 01:03:49
53. 01:03:51
54555657 and 61. 01:03:52
And then we can talk about. 01:03:56
Did you say you said 57, Ezra? 01:03:57
Yes, you did OK. 01:03:59
All right. Do I have a second for that? 01:04:00
That's all of them but the one, right? Except for the one. 01:04:03
Yeah, we all generally agree with that case. 01:04:06
Second by Jacob Wood. All in favor. 01:04:08
Aye. Motion passes. 01:04:10
All right, next is we need to do a mayor Pro Tem. 01:04:12
Who wants the hot seat? 01:04:16
Parker I like hitting the gavel. 01:04:19
To I think. 01:04:22
In honor of. 01:04:24
His newborn baby we should make in honor of his new son shocks. 01:04:25
OK. All right. 01:04:30
So I have a motion to have. 01:04:31
Parker be mayor Pro Tem. 01:04:33
For the rest of the meeting. 01:04:34
Or in perpetuity. 01:04:36
Either way, let's let's no and I clarify the motion, Israel. 01:04:37
Nominate her to appoint Parker as the mayor Pro Tem was the point. OK, awesome job a second. 01:04:46
I'll second that. 01:04:51
OK, all in favor. 01:04:52
Hi, All right, bring that gavel down here when you walk past. 01:04:53
Yeah, There you go, Parker. 01:04:57
I'm excited about this one. Here you go, buddy. 01:04:58
Use it. Thank you. 01:05:01
Thanks guys. 01:05:04
Again, I yeah, just talking. No, this will be good. I. 01:05:06
Again I. 01:05:09
Committed to this pillar of the valley thing, thinking that this was going to be work session. 01:05:10
And we need to get to it so. 01:05:14
Hey, well, we had a public comment and we have a couple people. 01:05:17
I apologize. 01:05:20
That last mayor just totally disregarded the public comment. Allow me please, could we have public comment? Mayor Pro Tem, I have 01:05:22
an introduction, introductory comments for this if you if you have say again. 01:05:28
I have introductory comments for this if you if you have. 01:05:33
OK, after we do the public. 01:05:36
Comment or your introductory comment for public comment. 01:05:38
Well, it may set the tone for all that. 01:05:41
Karen, are you OK if we allow Councilmember Larae to set the tone? 01:05:44
Absolutely. 01:05:48
Thank you. Thank you. 01:05:51
So I wanted to say that start out here. 01:05:53
That we recognize that the Vineyard RDA is already entered into several contracts and agreements with various land developers. 01:05:56
We further recognize that these arrangements are binding. 01:06:04
And that the Vineyard RDA expressly intends to honor these arrangements. 01:06:06
We likewise recognize that land owners have certain vested rights associated with their properties. 01:06:10
Which the Vineyard RDA also intends to abide by. 01:06:15
Any action taken as a result of these proposed resolutions that we're working on? 01:06:19
Will only apply in conditions where there are no existing contracts, agreements or vested property rights. 01:06:23
Or were there changes being requested to property rights? 01:06:29
These only applied, so it's just new or renegotiated agreements only. That's what we're talking about. 01:06:32
So any existing arrangements we have? 01:06:37
Would stand. 01:06:40
There is no intention to change them. 01:06:42
So that's let me start with that. 01:06:44
Also, I want to say that as we value highly of the principles of transparency and deliberation. 01:06:47
Our normal process for any proposed legislation would be to 1st examine the issue and any proposed legislation in a working 01:06:52
session for the City Council. 01:06:56
2nd, to allow the Council time to research the issue and its implications, as well as to allow the public time to weigh in on the. 01:07:00
On it during the week or so. 01:07:09
3rd, we would pick up the proposal legislation in a subsequent meeting as a business item where it would be discussed further. 01:07:11
And when the council is ready, voted on and that's that's the process we would like to follow. 01:07:16
And we intended to follow now I would I would point out that these. 01:07:21
There have been a lot of things happening these last little while we've had spring break. 01:07:25
You know, there's there have been medical issues and. 01:07:29
More than one person involved with that. 01:07:32
And and so forth. There's it's just been, it's been a rough these, these things were first looked at. 01:07:34
Over a month ago. 01:07:40
And so the. 01:07:41
Because there is a time sensitive date attached to at least one of them. 01:07:43
It was it was felt that we had to press forward to make sure that we did. We didn't miss that deadline. 01:07:48
And so as a result of that, we pressed forward to try to have. 01:07:52
To have this as a business item. 01:07:56
Tonight. 01:07:58
We have sensed as we. 01:07:59
And I'd have to say that as I've researched this, I found it. 01:08:01
Found it hard to learn things about it to the last 24 hours and all of a sudden everybody had information about it. 01:08:04
And all their inquiries I had made and started coming in. 01:08:09
And we've learned that. We've learned that there is indeed. 01:08:12
Not they're not as pressing as we had. 01:08:16
Where were we? 01:08:17
Given to believe initially. 01:08:19
And so that we can delay some of them and. 01:08:21
And out without losing. 01:08:24
Much ground. 01:08:26
And so we wanted to acknowledge that and so and that's the reason that we've agreed to go ahead and continue most of them, but 01:08:27
just look at the one that does it is more time sensitive. 01:08:32
So be aware that we understand that the transparency is something we ran on and we believe in. 01:08:38
And we want to abide by. 01:08:43
And so and. 01:08:44
And if. 01:08:46
If everything were. 01:08:47
Not time sensitive. We could do that better. 01:08:49
So just. 01:08:51
You know, actually. 01:08:52
I don't know if you. 01:08:55
When I was running for office, I've sent out these little cards and the first first thing on there is that. 01:08:56
We want to restore. 01:09:01
Transparency of public trust, the government and I got it's a return, it came back today even just to remind me about that so. 01:09:02
But so anyway, so I. 01:09:11
And so it's kind of funny, but at the same time. 01:09:14
You know, I really do believe that. I think we all do. And we want to, we want to abide by those principles and we're trying hard 01:09:17
to do that. 01:09:20
But we're also trying to balance the the the needs that have been thrust on us by. 01:09:24
The legislature in some in some cases. 01:09:28
And this. 01:09:31
We believe is one of them. 01:09:31
So that's why we're here now. 01:09:32
And so. 01:09:34
So that's my introduction. We wanted to deal with the first. 01:09:35
The first. 01:09:40
Basically the first resolution which basically sets them a framework. 01:09:41
In which the rest of them would then. 01:09:44
Reside and worked work together with and so by. 01:09:46
By establishing the framework, we are hoping that. 01:09:50
You know, that would allow us to be able to meet. 01:09:52
You know the first deadline and we'd have time to really work through the issues on the other ones, make sure they're right. 01:09:55
And that there. 01:10:01
And they're not. 01:10:02
They're not objectionable terribly to people, and they're actually actually doing. 01:10:04
Good for the citizens of Vineyard. 01:10:08
So that's. 01:10:10
So that's my opening statement. 01:10:11
OK. Thank you. 01:10:14
Karen. 01:10:15
Thank you, David. 01:10:17
Karen Cornelius Fellows. 01:10:20
I just want to say one thing. 01:10:22
Before I get into. 01:10:23
The the things that David talked about. 01:10:25
You were talking about. 01:10:28
Oh, sorry, you were talking about accessibility for emergency vehicles coming down the road and. 01:10:31
Being able to turn. 01:10:36
Do any of you realize that there is no way a fire truck could? 01:10:38
Turn off of Main Street. 01:10:41
On the Vineyard loop. 01:10:43
Going West. 01:10:49
Yeah, to go, but turning off of Main Street and particularly. 01:10:50
If they have to come. 01:10:54
Off of Main Street heading South. 01:10:56
And turning there is. 01:10:58
That road has just been decimated. 01:10:59
Right, and I know none of you did it, but I it's an important thing to consider. 01:11:02
Because there's such density on that one side of the street. 01:11:07
And they couldn't get in. 01:11:11
So. 01:11:12
My other question and. 01:11:13
You explained a lot of it, David, but. 01:11:15
Mayor was sharing with us that the time constraints are not what we thought they were. 01:11:18
So could you explain what the time constraints are on 5.2? 01:11:23
And with all of the noticing that we would have to do. 01:11:28
In order to. 01:11:31
Make all of this legal with the state. 01:11:32
What? What are our time constraints? 01:11:35
That's my question. 01:11:37
Well, these many of these would involve. 01:11:38
Public notice, public hearing and so we would have to give a 10 day notice for that and that would be the case for the for the 01:11:42
Planning Commission and then after their their action it would also. 01:11:46
Apply to the City Council, so that's another 20 days or so. 01:11:50
The Legislature. 01:11:54
Imposed an implementation date of May 6th, 2026. 01:11:57
And so can I clarify that? 01:12:00
Though the. 01:12:02
May 6 deadline. 01:12:04
Is largely. 01:12:06
Applicable to the 5.2 item. That's the resolution 202623. 01:12:08
So that's the one that we're going to stay to talk about. 01:12:14
That one is. 01:12:17
A resolution. 01:12:18
It would not. 01:12:20
Be the same. 01:12:21
There are other resolutions that we were talking about. There was maybe some question as to whether or not. 01:12:24
We were. 01:12:29
Bypassing Planning Commission, and we wanted to look at that a little bit more thoroughly and make sure that we're going through 01:12:30
this process the correct way. 01:12:33
And that's where those notices may be applied, but that's not. 01:12:36
Affected by the May 6 deadline, to my understanding. 01:12:40
In fact, some of there are other dates in there, they're further out like July and then October for some of the issues, but. 01:12:43
But for the overall framework. 01:12:50
May 6th. 01:12:52
Because it's been a long time, you know, very drawn out that we have not. 01:12:53
Address this issue. 01:12:56
In these meetings. 01:12:58
And that is not a new deadline, that May 6 is not a new deadline. And so my concern is. 01:13:00
That sometimes. 01:13:08
Transparency is not. 01:13:10
Possible. 01:13:12
As one council member is complaining that we have not done, however. 01:13:13
He had. 01:13:17
An item on the agenda a few weeks ago to vote on that had never been heard. 01:13:18
Well, as a business item, but anyway I just want to make sure. 01:13:22
That we are not missing the important deadlines. 01:13:27
Because. 01:13:30
There are many things. 01:13:31
That were run on. There are many things that were. 01:13:32
Many promises that were made to the residents, transparency being only one of them. There are others that we need to address and 01:13:35
face and this deadline happens to deal with one of them. So that's that was my concern is why the mayor. 01:13:43
Made mention. 01:13:50
That we weren't in time constraints and I just wanted to clear that up because I don't want to see us miss any of our deadlines. 01:13:52
So thank you. There are differing opinions about how applicable. 01:13:56
All of them are, and that's part of the reason we want to discuss these things. 01:14:00
So. 01:14:05
No, I just wanted to echo what Karen said. We ran on transparency. We also ran on. 01:14:07
Over sort of the RDA we ran on. 01:14:12
Parking around a lot of things and. 01:14:14
I feel like. 01:14:16
The RDA itself, it's taken. 01:14:17
Little longer than. 01:14:20
I think is appropriate and I think we got to get. 01:14:21
Around to addressing that again. All of us won. 01:14:24
Well, most of us won. 01:14:27
On these issues and. 01:14:29
And I think we have to. 01:14:31
Make necessary changes before we lose power. 01:14:33
In on May 6. 01:14:35
So, so and and. 01:14:37
Frankly, this is a. 01:14:38
You know, the end of the Legislature session was what was it? 01:14:40
And wasn't very far into February, right? Was it 45 days at, 45 days from? 01:14:43
From. 01:14:49
Middle of January. 01:14:50
Middle of January, Is that when I start? Yeah. 01:14:51
The end of February, so the end of February, right? 01:14:53
So we had basically March and now here we are, you know, in April. It's it's, you know, yeah, you've been working this for a 01:14:56
while. 01:14:59
Since we got a hold of it, which is about two weeks after the Legislature closed. 01:15:02
Daria, before Daria goes, I'd like to oh gosh, you council members, rascals. 01:15:07
I would like to commend Councilman. 01:15:14
Luray for. 01:15:16
Working hard on this. 01:15:17
The thing that we're talking about right now is a loss of trust. 01:15:20
That's why I believe we were a little bit. 01:15:24
Putting these resolutions out. 01:15:27
Vineyard is. 01:15:30
Struggling with. 01:15:31
A syndrome, and rightfully so. 01:15:35
The contract for the. 01:15:39
HID that affected $1 billion was put out. 01:15:42
With 24 hours notice. 01:15:45
And it scared the hell out of us. 01:15:48
The vote and that was done. 01:15:51
That the legislature without us even understanding that that could happen to our. 01:15:53
Small. 01:15:57
City. 01:16:00
The vote to create the RDA. 01:16:02
Was a legislation if you go way back. 01:16:04
With Governor Herbert. 01:16:05
How it was forced upon us as a city. 01:16:07
With nobody wanting it to happen. 01:16:10
And saying you will either dissolve as a city. 01:16:12
Or you will take those. 01:16:14
It creates less trust. 01:16:16
The legislation to remove the school district vote in 2021. 01:16:19
That did not come to this body. 01:16:24
We found out about it a year after the fact. 01:16:26
That the largest funding entity in the RDA. 01:16:30
Was not required to even be notified. 01:16:33
So there is a lack of trust at the state legislature. 01:16:35
And in all of those? 01:16:39
I would talk to the League of Cities. The lack of trust at the League of Cities. 01:16:40
Has been broken. 01:16:45
When the legislation to remove. 01:16:46
Power of a newly elected official and going to the League of Cities and saying I'm just elected. 01:16:48
This is going to happen. The league remained silent. 01:16:54
And so when we go and approach. 01:16:57
The League. 01:16:59
Let's make it clear there are now 2 leagues. 01:17:01
There's a second league and a second opinion and I. 01:17:04
Wholly recommend and grateful that. 01:17:07
David Luray is going out and getting a second opinion of a second league now. 01:17:10
It's unfortunate that. 01:17:14
We say league or the association and there's a misunderstanding of which one David is working with and. 01:17:16
People use words and they go, oh, you're talking. 01:17:22
Because there is somebody that. 01:17:25
Actually believes in municipal rights. 01:17:27
And in protecting them because for far too long. 01:17:30
Those cries have gone on deaf ears. 01:17:33
And so but. 01:17:37
They still are a league wheat. They still pay us. 01:17:38
We still pay them to represent us, but I would say they don't represent all of us while they represent everyone and so. 01:17:42
We can have a differing opinion on the league. 01:17:48
Now, respectfully, I like them and there's a lot of bills. 01:17:51
But I think we do need to take some time and we want to hear both sides of both the league. 01:17:54
And of the other association, what are the two leagues? What are the 2. The Utah League of Cities and Towns you see 3. 01:17:59
And then the UC 3, the Utah coalition of cities and counties. 01:18:06
And they're both. 01:18:10
Have diverging opinions on this bill? 01:18:11
And so I'm great. I'm grateful for David Larae to go out and search out for both. 01:18:14
I am in his e-mail today. He's like, hey, this is where it's at. I go. 01:18:18
Great. But where were you in two or three weeks ago when this legislation came passed? Why didn't you come and talk to us? 01:18:22
When it was before us, why didn't we hear both sides right? 01:18:27
And so. 01:18:30
But I'm still willing to go down and sit with them. So I think, I think it's smart, but. 01:18:31
I will say. 01:18:36
That I think that. 01:18:37
We need to use the time and wisely and and find out. 01:18:38
And I'm and I'll echo. 01:18:43
David Larae, we're not going to go after everything that's already been voted on and. 01:18:44
Everything that they have contractually done. 01:18:48
Everything in writing. 01:18:51
And this I'm going to point out. This involves us working with. 01:18:52
Anyone who has a contract with the RDA, correct. And there's, there's several developers, not one developer, all of them and 01:18:56
they're anybody at all. 01:19:00
And the writing wasn't perfect. So I mean, we need to clean up on that. But what I will say, Jake. 01:19:04
And other council members, we have essentially moved into a discussion about an item that we're going to come back to in a minute. 01:19:09
No, no, but I please go back to public comment. 01:19:14
Right. Uh. 01:19:19
I would just end with we want to get it better and we want to improve everyone, so go ahead. 01:19:19
Thank you for your patience, Dora President. Thank you. Hi, Daria opportunity. You too. 01:19:29
Make a public comment. 01:19:34
I would just. 01:19:36
Personally like to thank Monica in billing. 01:19:37
Our city staff for her considerate and efficient resolution to an issue that a resident had today. 01:19:40
Good on her. We do have some. We have great city staff and I just want to. 01:19:47
Make that known. 01:19:52
Tonight we have many resolutions tonight on the agenda. 01:19:54
And I truly hope that each will be a benefit to Vineyard. 01:19:57
As we continue working through those resolutions in the next. 01:20:02
Council meeting. I did have a question on 5.2 so I'm glad we're kind of discussing it. 01:20:06
I was. 01:20:12
Concern that vested rights previously. 01:20:13
Acquired. 01:20:16
Would continue under this. 01:20:17
Whether they would continue or not under this resolution, and Mr. Larae, David Larae answered that question for me, So I 01:20:19
appreciate your. 01:20:23
Tenacity. 01:20:28
And finding out. 01:20:30
Appreciate that very much and if you find wording in there that would say otherwise, please let us know so we can fix it. 01:20:31
Will do. 01:20:37
OK. 01:20:38
You mentioned about. 01:20:39
Planning Commission. 01:20:41
Having a parted. 01:20:43
Did I hear that correctly correct some of these other? 01:20:44
I can pull it up real quick. 01:20:49
The other resolutions that we've continued. 01:20:51
I think. 01:20:54
The best practice is to. 01:20:54
Involve the Planning Commission, have them notice. 01:20:57
Do their public hearing, do our public hearing and actually go through the. 01:21:00
Ordinance and code changing processes. 01:21:03
OK, please let the. 01:21:06
Planning Commission, No. 01:21:07
The planning department, thank you. Thank you. 01:21:09
OK, You want to get started, David? Did you have a? 01:21:15
Comment. 01:21:17
David Pierce, I'm a resident. 01:21:23
I have. 01:21:26
Well let me start off 1st. I have an issue with this I. 01:21:28
I can't find anything. 01:21:31
In the agendas from previous meetings. 01:21:34
Where? 01:21:36
Any of these resolutions, particularly the wonder? 01:21:37
Going to be discussing. 01:21:41
Was brought up. 01:21:43
At a previous City Council. 01:21:44
So there has not been any work session on this the public. 01:21:47
Had enough time? 01:21:52
To look at it and to analyze it. 01:21:53
Right, that's that's what they agreed any. 01:21:56
Comment from the staff on this. 01:21:59
And you can say, well, the staff was invited. 01:22:02
The staff was not directed by the mayor. 01:22:06
To appear here. 01:22:09
And give the opinion. 01:22:10
So you are correct I think. 01:22:12
And I don't believe. 01:22:14
That. 01:22:18
Putting this off for a work session. 01:22:22
Will impact. 01:22:25
Its implementation. 01:22:26
By this presumed deadline. 01:22:29
The 6th of May. 01:22:32
So I. 01:22:34
That's why we pushed it as a citizen. 01:22:36
Would like this. 01:22:39
And all the others to go through a. 01:22:40
A work session so that the people have enough time. 01:22:43
To look at it. 01:22:47
To analyze it. 01:22:48
Decide if they like it. 01:22:49
And if they think that to. 01:22:52
Appropriate. Now we can say, well, there are more important things than transparency. 01:22:53
But I think the card said. 01:22:59
Your your little piece of advertisement. 01:23:01
You're what's the number one item. 01:23:06
Restore true transparency and public trust to both city government and the culture within the city. 01:23:09
Thank you very much. 01:23:15
I think. 01:23:16
Putting this in a work session. 01:23:18
Postponing it for a week is the appropriate thing to do. 01:23:20
Yeah, I'll also have a comment. 01:23:24
Or question. 01:23:28
About 400 S. 01:23:30
Yeah. 01:23:33
If just. 01:23:34
I am confused. 01:23:38
From Holdaway Rd. 01:23:40
West, uh. 01:23:41
Would the southern boundary. 01:23:42
The southern curve of the road. 01:23:46
Be the same. 01:23:48
As it is now. 01:23:49
And it would be the northern side of the curb. 01:23:51
That would change. 01:23:54
Yeah, the North is gonna be my understanding. You're not gonna tear out the South. 01:23:55
It's all built and beautiful. You have big trees. 01:23:59
So it's just taking it, it's like. 01:24:02
When when the it's two different councils and one council said we're going to do 66 and the other said 75. 01:24:04
And then? 01:24:10
When they did 75, they go, we're going to go and tear out and make everyone do 75 and it's like, are you guys going to, I'm sorry, 01:24:11
what do you mean by everyone? 01:24:15
Everyone on that, the people who the people that live on that entire block from. 01:24:20
From 400 S. 01:24:25
From. 01:24:26
From the Lakeside Sports Complex to hold away to hold away. 01:24:27
It's in there if we're going to do 75 and we're going to. 01:24:31
Acquire all of that property. 01:24:34
So that it's consistent, right? So it's not consistent throughout that whole right of way. 01:24:37
So. 01:24:42
If I understand what's being. 01:24:44
Proposed or an alternate? 01:24:47
So the northern border. 01:24:50
On the east side of Holdaway Rd. 01:24:52
Would be different than the northern border. 01:24:57
If we didn't change it. 01:24:59
If your proposal. 01:25:01
Is to change it. 01:25:04
So the northern borders. 01:25:06
On one side of Holdaway Rd. would not line up. 01:25:08
Not all alike the northern border. 01:25:12
On the West side, I think this aligns confusion. 01:25:14
I think the proposal that was discussed today would make both sides aligned, either the West and the East. N says we're going to 01:25:19
stay at the 66. 01:25:23
And it'll all align or we're going to go to the 75 or you know. 01:25:27
And it'll all align. But which one are you doing? And if and if you're going to go and do? 01:25:31
Eminent domain. 01:25:36
To acquire this to go to 75. 01:25:37
How are you not? 01:25:40
Going to go and do eminent domain on the other to get that. Just Jake. 01:25:42
He'll draw a map for you and I can walk you. Sorry, we didn't have the PowerPoint, but it's like, I'm sorry, but it's like you 01:25:46
have two consistency plans for two different councils. 01:25:50
And so I'm glad my dad came and pointed that out just like, hey. 01:25:57
OK, so because I have. 01:26:00
Oh, and if you go to 75, you've got a. 01:26:03
Finish what? That is because. 01:26:08
There's not a. 01:26:10
Well, I apologize because I had this. 01:26:13
The platform for. 01:26:17
The other one I do have it. 01:26:23
I don't know where it is so you can show me. 01:26:25
Now I can meet with you after on the side. 01:26:29
It's just I'm sorry. 01:26:31
I can meet with you and walk you through and show you on the map where the and I can get Nasim. 01:26:33
I appreciate that it's just. 01:26:38
Let's do the same on both sides. 01:26:40
And whichever it is, that's. 01:26:43
That's as a citizen what I would prefer, right? 01:26:45
I do have. 01:26:50
Another point with that. 01:26:52
It deals. 01:26:56
With uh. 01:26:57
Don't know, I won't make that point tonight. 01:26:58
But those are my two cents. Thank you. Thanks, Mr. Pierce. 01:27:02
Any other public comment tonight? 01:27:08
Yeah, Pete. 01:27:11
Pete Evans. 01:27:16
So just a point of clarification and. 01:27:17
Because I honestly don't know. 01:27:19
Under public comment it says these are for items not on the agenda. Sorry recorder, didn't know your name. I was telling her I 01:27:21
wasn't trying to catch off sorry. 01:27:24
You can call me Steve. Most people when they hear Pete say hi, Steve. 01:27:29
Yeah. 01:27:32
So in the public comment, it says that they're set aside for citizens to express their views on items not on the agenda. 01:27:36
These items are all on the agenda. Is now the time to? 01:27:43
Talk about the agenda items or are you going to go through the agenda item? 01:27:47
And then open it up for public comment before the resolution. I'll do both. 01:27:50
OK, I'm pretty lazy. Fair when it comes to getting public comment. 01:27:54
I want all of the feedback we can get. 01:27:57
Let us have it. 01:28:00
Great. If you would like to share now before we. 01:28:01
Discuss any of that. 01:28:04
You're welcome to or we'll discuss it and then open up public comment great. So just. 01:28:05
Briefly and then and then if we open it back up. 01:28:09
I'd be happy to. 01:28:13
Respond to some of the things that is discussed in the. 01:28:16
In the resolution. 01:28:19
Discussion. 01:28:21
But. 01:28:22
You know the the. 01:28:23
A couple of things concern me right off the bat on the six resolutions. 01:28:26
And for City Council, the 1st is on the first page, which is a strategic note. 01:28:31
And this is actually contrary to what it says in the beginning, which says these are countermeasures. 01:28:36
For the state statute, SB-284. So each of those are a countermeasure. 01:28:41
Which is trying to counteract the measure. 01:28:46
Of the state statute. 01:28:49
It says. 01:28:51
That these. 01:28:52
Are to preserve vineyards maximum negotiating authority? 01:28:54
Over all, large scale development, including Utah City. 01:28:58
So. 01:29:04
It feels very targeted. 01:29:04
We removed that and the we're working on one. It's already been removed. 01:29:06
That actually hasn't been renewed. 01:29:11
Well, it has been removed. The copy we're working from here. And you're right, the public, the one that was attached to the 01:29:14
agenda. 01:29:17
Yesterday. 01:29:20
Didn't have that removed. It was intended that those resolutions would be exerted from that file and used because those are the 01:29:22
only things we are. 01:29:25
Paying attention to. 01:29:29
We recognize that the that. 01:29:30
Those comments are inappropriate. 01:29:33
And we apologize for that. We're not trying to target anyone. 01:29:35
In an effort here, we're not. Yeah. 01:29:38
Granted that we receive some help in editing these at one point from someone who who? 01:29:40
Probably was, but we recognize that that's a. 01:29:45
You know, that's a problem and should be there. Appreciate you being honest about that. Well, and also been an effort to be more 01:29:48
transparent. It's better just to throw it out and get hundreds of people to see it and go, hey, this is the current resolution. 01:29:53
By law, we don't even have to. 01:29:59
Post the. 01:30:00
Actual attachment, previous councils, you remember, we were so angry, like we're not getting anything. 01:30:02
And we were like, let's just post what we're currently at. 01:30:07
It might change or adjust, and so Robin's asked us for attachments. 01:30:11
OK, let's just post what we're up. 01:30:15
I think the more succinct way to say that was. 01:30:17
He threw, we put a rough draft or something that was not complete out and it was not. 01:30:21
Properly vetted and done, and that's. 01:30:26
Our collective mistake. 01:30:28
So is it safe to assume? 01:30:30
Just I don't want to put words in. 01:30:33
Restate what I think you're saying is that what's been posted for a public review is a rough draft and not. 01:30:35
Yeah, not ready for. 01:30:42
Correct. And then there's no intent to vote on anything tonight. 01:30:43
As we've vetted this and I've tried to work very extensively with legal now and and. 01:30:48
Try and build some consensus and talk to all of the council members. 01:30:53
We are identifying where these issues were. 01:30:57
Coming from. 01:30:59
We've kind of. 01:31:00
Severed that we're working to make all of these corrections. 01:31:02
I definitely am sympathetic and understand the frustration. 01:31:06
It was inappropriate for. 01:31:10
Something to be posted like that because it does read as a target. 01:31:13
And I don't think that that is the Council's intent. 01:31:16
I think. 01:31:20
Largely. 01:31:20
The goal here with these resolutions and again, we're only going to talk about the one tonight and move the rest to next week. 01:31:21
Is largely to just make sure that. 01:31:28
The council and RDA board. 01:31:31
Maintains any oversight authority that they can or should maintain to represent the public. It's not a. 01:31:34
Attack in my perception, I would. I would also. I absolutely agree with that. Not not. 01:31:43
Yeah, tended to be an attack and. 01:31:48
In fact, I want to say that we very much appreciate the work that's been done out there that you're doing at Utah City well. 01:31:50
I would also say that. 01:31:56
The confusion of your name. 01:31:58
Utah City actually thought that the. 01:31:59
They thought you were a city. 01:32:02
So it includes you thought we were a city because it's included in large scale development. 01:32:03
Yeah, well. 01:32:08
They don't know there's lots of people that touch this document. No, that's my main question too. We're always disingenuous. 01:32:10
That's not true. 01:32:14
That can't be hundreds of people. No, no, no, no, I'm not. I'm not saying that that's not true. I'm saying a lot of people, what 01:32:19
this says on its face, they couldn't have thought, oh. 01:32:23
We're sending this to a city called Utah City as part of our coalition. That's not true. 01:32:28
Correct. I think there's a confusion here. The issue that Jake is saying is that. 01:32:35
A lot of. 01:32:39
The collection of information there. 01:32:40
I think came from residents and people who supported right various members of this. 01:32:43
Council in their campaigns and that was not. 01:32:47
Properly. 01:32:50
Vetted or. 01:32:51
Thoroughly. 01:32:53
Parsed through. 01:32:55
And so. 01:32:56
What you're seeing is. 01:32:57
A collection of. 01:32:59
Citizen feedback. 01:33:00
So the the City Council did not draft, no one on the City Council drafted these resolutions. There was quite a few. I believe 01:33:01
there was involvement. 01:33:05
I certainly did not. 01:33:09
Yeah, yeah. 01:33:10
I mean, I, I had AI did some editing on at one point and it went somewhere else and got more, more editing and so forth. It's 01:33:12
gone. It's made the rounds. Didn't you send it to Jesse? 01:33:16
But this is also and yes, our legal reviewed it and he also identified, you know that. 01:33:21
These changes need to. 01:33:25
To be made. 01:33:26
In my conversations with him over the last two days. 01:33:27
The point being. 01:33:30
I wholly recognize that this. 01:33:32
Document that was attached to the agenda should not have been attached to the agenda and wasn't ready to be attached to the 01:33:34
agenda. I think that there was. 01:33:38
A lot of resident fear. 01:33:42
About this May 6 deadline and what SBB? 01:33:44
284 is and isn't. 01:33:48
And I don't think that there was good understanding of that. And that panicked a lot of people and out of the constituent panic. 01:33:50
I think there was council panic and that. 01:33:55
Pushed this faster than it needed to be pushed. I'm just going to call the spade a spade there. And I don't mean to offend anybody 01:33:58
in the room. Yeah, it was. That sounds logic. I would point a question, though, Pete, you recognize that you want us to have 01:34:04
authority as a governing entity Still, you're not. Your goal is not to remove future authority, is it? 01:34:10
What do you mean by that? 01:34:16
Well, when we read through the legislation, it looks like if it's not written, we don't write it out, that we retain it, that we 01:34:18
would lose it. 01:34:21
So I wanted to know your. 01:34:24
You support us in having, yeah, I mean oversight. Have you read through SP? 01:34:26
284 Yeah. And there were opinions of it that it would. 01:34:31
Minimize or restrict that. So that's my question. Well, the big, the big. 01:34:34
I mean I I read it, I don't think that's what it says at all. If I can opine based on my reading. 01:34:38
Since. 01:34:44
I mean, we're having the discussion anyways. Did anyone else have public comment? 01:34:45
OK, we're just kind of rolling now. 01:34:48
That's good enough, right Robin? Just teasing, yeah. 01:34:51
My understanding of it was largely that. 01:34:55
If you don't have. 01:34:59
Very robust. 01:35:01
Definitions. 01:35:04
Code ordinance. 01:35:05
You're required then by law through SB 284. 01:35:07
To always. 01:35:10
Default. 01:35:12
To an applicant. 01:35:13
If there's an appeal process. 01:35:14
You default to what they've. 01:35:16
In their favor. And that was our understanding, yes. 01:35:19
That is how I understand 284. 01:35:21
Yeah, same here. 01:35:24
And so the. 01:35:26
Purpose of these resolutions largely as we move forward is to make sure that we have a very clear and robust. 01:35:26
Process and definitions. 01:35:33
In place so that. 01:35:36
There isn't ambiguity. 01:35:37
Because if there is ambiguity. 01:35:39
We lose the appeal authority. 01:35:41
Due to SB-284, yeah, I think that's largely. 01:35:43
I mean, again, I'm not. I don't, I'm not. 01:35:47
Qualified to issue a legal opinion on it? That's for your city attorney. 01:35:50
But I think. 01:35:54
You know as you read SB 284. 01:35:55
A lot of what it's saying is that. 01:35:57
It's codifying what's always been in. 01:35:59
Utah case law, which is. 01:36:02
When someone makes an application. 01:36:04
A complete application. 01:36:06
Then they get treated under the rules. 01:36:07
Under which that application was made right and that. 01:36:10
That goes to the purpose of that is so for example in another municipality. 01:36:13
We made an application. 01:36:18
For subdivision. 01:36:21
The City Council literally said. 01:36:22
Oh, we don't like this because we don't like. 01:36:24
Those lot sizes. 01:36:26
We said well. 01:36:28
We're just going off of your code. 01:36:28
And they said, oh, we didn't. 01:36:30
We didn't know those were in our code. 01:36:32
And they denied our application. 01:36:33
And then change their code to eliminate those lot sizes. 01:36:35
And then said, well, you're welcome to resubmit. 01:36:39
Your subdivision. 01:36:41
And so. 01:36:42
That's the kind of thing that SB 284 is trying to avoid is by saying. 01:36:43
Whatever, whatever the. 01:36:48
Statutory construct is the zoning construct at the time. 01:36:50
You submit a complete application. 01:36:54
Those are the rules that you get judged by with your application. 01:36:56
And I think the intent of your. 01:37:00
Your resolution is to say. 01:37:03
If that's the case. 01:37:05
Then let's more clearly define what constitutes a complete application. 01:37:06
Correct. Let's make sure that we're lining all of those out. 01:37:11
Exactly right. 01:37:14
Yes, I don't. 01:37:15
I personally don't. 01:37:17
Have any problem with that? I think that's your right. 01:37:18
To be able to define those things. 01:37:21
What? What I'm? 01:37:23
More worried about IS. 01:37:25
What Councilman Larae said at the beginning of There are. 01:37:26
All of these developments already in the city. 01:37:31
That have these vested entitlements. 01:37:34
That this wouldn't apply to. 01:37:36
And I. 01:37:38
I'm struggling to think of any. 01:37:39
Property over 5 acres that would meet these definitions. 01:37:42
Of this resolution that this would even apply to. 01:37:45
Well, then it doesn't apply. It doesn't. It's no harm, no foul then, right? 01:37:48
So who cares? 01:37:52
When we well, I care because it specifically says. 01:37:53
So that we can retain maximum leverage over Utah City. 01:37:57
That's why that's why I care is because you're saying. 01:38:01
Hey, this doesn't apply to you, so why do you care? No, it applies to everyone equally. I mean, we've already established that 01:38:04
your name shouldn't have been. 01:38:07
Applied. No. No, I agree it shouldn't have been applied. 01:38:11
But I'm just saying it is in there. 01:38:14
Saying, hey, this is specifically so we can have leverage over that project. 01:38:16
Right. But I mean, let's go back to the school district, Bill, what you guys ran or it was run? 01:38:21
To remove the school district and we describe it as a 1200 acre RDA. 01:38:26
It's not named, but the only entity written in the entire legislation that it applies to is you. 01:38:31
Right. 01:38:37
So and you weren't named in the bill? 01:38:38
But it's literally the school, I mean the state. 01:38:41
Auditor even came out and said. 01:38:43
This only applies. 01:38:46
After reading the bill, there's not an RDA. So you're saying all of these resolutions were for us, you just No, no, that's not 01:38:47
what we're saying. No, that's what we're saying you're implying here. I read it. I read it in that implication to make sure it 01:38:52
applies to everyone and them. That's how I read that. 01:38:56
It was a quick draft. 01:39:01
He's already agreed that we should improve upon that. 01:39:03
But my question you didn't answer the question. 01:39:05
We recognize. 01:39:08
We didn't answer. We were not here to remove any rights that you currently have. 01:39:09
Right, we agree that anything that you were given in previous councils. 01:39:15
But you didn't answer. You recognize our future, right to have authority as a governing body, right? That's what we're trying to 01:39:18
establish. 01:39:22
So it will will improve this. 01:39:27
Yeah, we just don't want that. Absolutely, absolutely do. But I also think that you ought to think about. 01:39:30
How you create the flexibility to govern in the future that you want to, instead of pigeonholing yourself so tightly into 01:39:36
something that eliminates the flexibility that you want to have in the future. 01:39:41
To do some of those things. 01:39:46
Yeah, because to answer your question, please say your name for the recorder. She doesn't know you. Good to be with you tonight. 01:39:48
Thanks for having us. 01:39:51
Obviously, you know, we saw this yesterday. 01:39:55
This is the first time we've seen it. We're responding quickly. It was very. 01:39:58
We've gone through all that. We don't need to rehash that in response to your comment on the school district. 01:40:02
There's been a lot of. 01:40:08
Frankly, defamatory comments made about the negotiations that occurred between us and the school district. 01:40:09
And to say that we didn't approach the school district or have discussions with the school district, does that all went along. Can 01:40:16
you disclose who those are? 01:40:19
It was with Rob Smith. 01:40:23
So why hasn't when, when, when the that happened originally? I mean, we didn't form the RDA. We weren't here. So let me finish. 01:40:25
Let me finish, please. 01:40:28
Jake, let me go. Can you ask the question? I'm gonna respond to you. 01:40:33
People continue to say. 01:40:37
That there was number negotiations with the school district. 01:40:39
There is a mechanism built into the RDA. 01:40:42
A school district mitigation payment. 01:40:46
Are you aware of this and how that whole mechanism works? Yeah. Would you explain it for the public? So, Jake, I'll let you, I'll 01:40:47
let you explain it. You probably know it better than I do. It's basically there's a minimum amount of how much we, the school 01:40:53
district gets back. And when they didn't get much, they adjusted it to make sure it covers their bases. 01:40:58
So they were concerned that they'd come down here. 01:41:04
Build a lot of housing. 01:41:07
Not have commercial development occur. 01:41:08
And not be able to pay for the students that are going to school. 01:41:10
Which is literally the message that people continue pointing out saying oh this isn't happening. 01:41:13
What's happened though? 01:41:18
Contrary to. 01:41:20
The belief of everybody is that what the school district negotiated as a part of this with the state Prius, that wasn't us. So 01:41:21
let's be clear that this was all pre us. 01:41:25
We've spent hundreds of millions of dollars buying this property. 01:41:30
Because there was an. 01:41:33
Because. 01:41:35
The $170 million that we have currently right now this second. 01:41:36
In the cleanup, an environmental. 01:41:41
Environmental Cleanup. 01:41:43
Between US and other private parties and all the infrastructure that's gone in. 01:41:45
Only has gone in because of the RDA. 01:41:50
Had it not been for the RDA? 01:41:53
They're beat. I mean, almost everyone that's here tonight wouldn't be here tonight because almost everyone in this room is here 01:41:55
because the RDA existed. 01:41:59
And built a lot of the roads coming in here and pioneered the thirty, $40 million of infrastructure that went in, which was us. 01:42:03
And we did that. We felt like we've. 01:42:08
We might be the big bad developers. 01:42:12
You know. 01:42:14
But when you actually. 01:42:15
Look at our track record in Vineyard. We really do care about this place. 01:42:16
The thing that's been the saddest thing to me, to see what's happened and transpired in the city over the last five years. 01:42:20
Is the contention that started to occur here. 01:42:26
And I'm not trying to take sides. We've stayed comple. 01:42:29
Wheatley out of politics? 01:42:31
We haven't got involved in politics. 01:42:33
But at some point. 01:42:36
When I continue to hear and see the defamatory things talked about specifically with the school district. 01:42:39
No one talked to the school district. That's not true. 01:42:44
There's no meetings. 01:42:47
There's no text message, so why e-mail? So if there was no entire gram, why did they negotiate? 01:42:48
Why did they negotiate the mitigation pay? 01:42:54
Where did that contract come from? Do you think the developers? 01:42:56
And the state came up with that. 01:42:59
Where's the documents that you don't know? Figure it out. There's already been a grandma and there's no. 01:43:02
Because the trail, but they because they they were there involved in all the meetings that created that. 01:43:06
And there's been enough commercial development that has occurred here so that mitigation payment has not reported back to us. The 01:43:12
RDA board, you've never know paperwork showing that it happens 20 years ago. 01:43:18
But anyways, I'm going to move past this point. 01:43:24
I should have brought this point up before and I've let things go with public comments and now. 01:43:27
Please address everything to me as the mayor Pro Tem, Jake. Same goes for the council. Thank you. 01:43:32
So when this stuff comes out. 01:43:38
And the concern in the document, especially the way it's drafted in the attacking nature of Utah City. 01:43:40
Is that it's not just saying that you have the power to negotiate future contracts? 01:43:46
It's saying before any payments are made. 01:43:51
We're currently out. 01:43:53
This second. 01:43:54
Six and a half million dollars of RDA funds over the last few months, in the last couple of years that we've submitted invoices 01:43:55
for. 01:43:58
That we have contracts for. 01:44:01
We've turned invoices in for. 01:44:03
That you've actually. 01:44:05
Received property tax payments from the county for that you're contractually obligated to give back to us. 01:44:06
For those dollars that we've spent. 01:44:11
That go towards that $170 million bucket. 01:44:12
And we don't have those. 01:44:16
And I said a few months ago, we're being patient because we're saying it's a new council. You're getting your arms around this 01:44:17
stuff. We're being what we believe to be patient here. 01:44:21
I don't think there's a lot of developers in this state. 01:44:25
That would just continue floating this and not start filing lawsuits and doing some of these other things. 01:44:27
And so. 01:44:32
That's not to say we're going to do that now, but these are things we've got to sit down. 01:44:33
Look at the agreements that exist. 01:44:38
And I think. 01:44:40
I think. 01:44:42
It's it's unfair of the city right now. 01:44:43
To just not be abiding by the current agreements that they have, and that's currently what's occurring. 01:44:48
And I'm OK if you want to. We've even said if you want to change some of the process in this moving forward. 01:44:53
Let's talk about what those changes might look like. 01:44:59
If it's similar to bidding and. 01:45:01
Processing and you know, if you're saying we have to come in and do a new economic study or a new study every time you owe us for 01:45:03
something that we've already contractually agreed to and we've paid for, that's not going to happen. That's. 01:45:09
And I, and I think what you're all saying is that's not what this is for. I also think. 01:45:15
Let's say somebody in the city comes to you right now. 01:45:20
And says here's some tenant. 01:45:23
It's a huge sales taxpayer. 01:45:25
We want some already. They want some RDA dollars to come here. 01:45:28
You all 5 immediately say well wait a second, we can trade $1,000,000 of RDA dollars for three or $4 million annually of sales tax 01:45:32
revenue. 01:45:36
It's a no brainer. All 5 of you say yeah, let's do that. 01:45:40
That's something we should do right now. 01:45:43
You pass what you're passing tonight. 01:45:45
And you can't do that. 01:45:47
Can I ask did you understand? 01:45:49
The resolutions because I worked. 01:45:51
Very extensively with our legal representation the last two days. 01:45:53
To my understanding. 01:45:57
None of this is retroactive or would influence any of the agreements, but that's what I'm talking about. This would be something 01:45:58
new coming in. 01:46:02
And so the question to you all, I think is so if you're doing this. 01:46:05
And before you're going to lose power and you're nervous about the next group coming in and you want to do and put some process in 01:46:09
place. 01:46:12
I think. 01:46:15
You can ask anyone that comes in with a new RDA application. 01:46:16
It's all discretionary what you guys decide to do anyway. 01:46:20
So we're looking at this. 01:46:24
And it's kind of both sides because Jake, I hear what you're saying is like, why are you guys nervous about this? It doesn't apply 01:46:25
to you. And we're saying, well, why are you doing this if. 01:46:29
You already have the discretion to do this anyway if somebody comes in with an RDA application and. 01:46:33
Jacob finally talks the big. 01:46:38
Concert venue that he's talked about coming to town and he gets them and they need a little bit of money and they'll build you a 01:46:39
$200 million concert venue. 01:46:43
And they're ready to go and. 01:46:47
Now all of a sudden you've layered in a bunch of additional processes that you guys don't want to do. 01:46:48
But you have to do. 01:46:53
You know, I think that's another thing to consider. I'm not saying obviously we're just getting this. We're digesting this. You 01:46:54
guys are all getting this, You're digesting this. And so there's going to be some back and forth. Our attorneys are looking at 01:46:58
this, I'm sure. 01:47:01
Your attorneys are looking at this and. 01:47:05
I think that's all I have to say. I also I just. 01:47:07
My last comment will be. 01:47:11
I just hope we can all work together. I would hope that you guys can come up with. 01:47:14
I've heard from every single one of you except Jake. Jake, we've never talked. We've talked to the rest of you on the East Side. 01:47:19
It's been a big consensus from what we've heard. 01:47:22
We would like the east side to get cleaned up faster. 01:47:26
We went back to our group. We're starting to spend millions of dollars more additional to clean up the east side faster. 01:47:29
But then we're sitting here scratching our heads saying well. 01:47:35
If we're doing this faster and we're and you're getting these dollars, it's not like these dollars aren't. 01:47:38
In your account, like there's going to be some processes moving forward, we're going to have to be expending things like we always 01:47:44
do out ahead of things before tax increments created. 01:47:48
But we just want you to know we're here. We're willing to sit down, we're willing to work through things. 01:47:52
We do think it's important to start bringing some economic, more economic engines. You know, Jake, you had mentioned this is all 01:47:57
big failed experiment because we don't have anchors. 01:48:01
I think there are some anchors. I think there should be some additional anchors and that should be a priority. I think we should 01:48:06
all focus on that. 01:48:09
The real way to lower property taxes in the city. 01:48:12
Is going to be generating. 01:48:16
Millions and 10s of millions of dollars of sales tax. 01:48:18
That is the way for you guys to. 01:48:21
To be able to pay for everything else that you're doing and be able to lower the property taxes for everybody else, you can cut 01:48:23
all the staff which you've done. 01:48:26
There's only so much you can cut out of the cost side of things and sometimes the revenue side. 01:48:30
Has to be another big component of this so. 01:48:34
That's the last thing I'll say. And we're willing and happy to meet with any of you individually. We're happy to do this in a 01:48:36
public setting. We don't ever want to have this be. 01:48:40
You know, in closed doors and. 01:48:45
Like all the discussions we've always had with everyone, we're happy to have them in public and. 01:48:47
Whoever wants to attend is welcome. 01:48:52
Thanks, Nate. 01:48:54
Thanks and. 01:48:55
Sure. 01:48:57
And so. 01:48:57
Can we check with made assistant to the? 01:48:59
Mayor, Mr. 01:49:01
David Kyle, we would. 01:49:03
To find out if we have that, if we really. 01:49:04
Have invoices to. 01:49:07
Six and a half million dollars. 01:49:09
That Nate was speaking about. 01:49:11
Do we really have that here? Do we, do we know about it? Are we? That also might be a better question for our RDA Director and we 01:49:12
can. 01:49:15
Gavel in as the RDA at the end of the meeting. 01:49:18
OK, OK. 01:49:21
Thank you. I mean, I keep on. 01:49:22
Point of order just as an olive branch. Is it a point of order? Yeah. OK. I want to make sure there's an olive branch because I 01:49:24
could, I could understand. And listening to Nate about how he could feel like it was attacked on like. 01:49:29
Old scale. I mean, I felt attacked when I saw the bill. I'm like. 01:49:34
I don't want to lose any more authority in the future. 01:49:38
But I I can agree like. 01:49:41
The rough draft could. 01:49:43
Be viewed as. 01:49:45
Hey, we're going to go and rehash the past on on. 01:49:48
On contracts that were there. So that that's a point we'll take in. And I think as a council, if we just agree that we're going to 01:49:52
include Nate. 01:49:55
In the draft and hey, this is where we're at. 01:49:58
Because he should look at it. I believe both. 01:50:01
Leagues of cities and towns should look at the draft and give. 01:50:05
Of good feedback as well. 01:50:07
I think. 01:50:10
You know both of those. 01:50:11
But the last thing is is. 01:50:12
I think, I think we want all both sides want to establish trust. 01:50:14
Like. 01:50:18
I it's it's hard. 01:50:19
You know, we looked into the school district on. 01:50:22
You know Rob Smith. 01:50:25
And we did a. 01:50:26
We did a grandma and there were no documents as to why they lowered their amount and it was like why didn't the city lower amount? 01:50:27
And not even knowing. 01:50:34
So that just there's not good documentation and I'm not throwing the school district under the bus. 01:50:36
The previous Council of Vineyard or you? 01:50:40
But it's just like the history of it and the way in which it was done. 01:50:43
Is it just leaves? 01:50:46
There's no documentation in place to be able to do that. And that's what we're trying to do is. And the last thing is, is I hope 01:50:48
you guys would also support us. 01:50:51
In retaining our authority and not. 01:50:55
Shrinking it down. 01:50:58
I think one of the other concerns, that's the only thing we're trying to fight, Ezra and I had identified earlier today. 01:51:00
Was that in the agenda packet? There's also two versions of each resolution. 01:51:07
There's whatever that first. 01:51:11
Draft thing was in that package and then there's also. 01:51:13
Additional resolutions that I think have already been. 01:51:19
Edited from. 01:51:22
Our legal representation as well. 01:51:23
And so there's. 01:51:25
Added confusion there, which I think is part of the reason why. 01:51:26
We kind of unanimously agree that these should be moved to work sessions and we have to work through those things so. 01:51:30
I'm gonna end public comment and we'll go into. 01:51:36
Discussion. 01:51:40
On uh. 01:51:41
Resolution 2026-23, which is to establish a complete land use application. 01:51:42
And applicant vesting control policy. 01:51:48
Since I'm only, you know, mayor Pro Tem and I actually still am a council member that gets to do stuff. 01:51:54
I'm just going to share some of my. 01:52:00
Thoughts. 01:52:02
Get it out there for the public to hear. 01:52:03
This resolution, the intent of it to my understanding, is largely to define what makes a land use application complete. 01:52:06
Four large scale projects. 01:52:14
There's a little bit of ambiguity there, maybe with large scale projects, but. 01:52:16
That's defined in the. 01:52:20
At least second draft of the resolution. 01:52:22
So that gets clarified, I think, and then. 01:52:25
This would essentially require utility letters, traffic studies, phasing plans, fiscal impact analysis. 01:52:29
Before vesting occurs. 01:52:34
This is the. 01:52:37
Vesting gateway that's. 01:52:39
I think. 01:52:40
Identified by. 01:52:42
State Bill 284. 01:52:43
Which? 01:52:45
Has to be in place before May 6 or we lose the ability to put something like that in place. 01:52:46
The real issue that I think. 01:52:51
From my perspective is that it identifies. 01:52:54
Where we were very weak as a city when it came to what our. 01:52:56
Code, process and ordinances. 01:53:00
Defined and specified. 01:53:03
So from my perspective, there's a couple pros. 01:53:05
With this I do think that. 01:53:08
We need to fix some language in it, and I'll touch on that in a minute. 01:53:10
But the first Pro is that I don't think it actually expands. 01:53:13
Government or government overreach? I think that it's largely. 01:53:17
Defining information thresholds. 01:53:21
That should be met. 01:53:23
And it prevents. 01:53:25
Gaps in taxpayer. 01:53:26
Supervision is maybe the right term to say it. 01:53:30
I recognize that oversight, yeah, that the council is essentially the the taxpayer oversight. 01:53:32
I also think from a local perspective. 01:53:38
That this. 01:53:41
Essentially prevents vesting under thin standard. 01:53:42
It would just make the standard robust. 01:53:45
I think that that's better. 01:53:48
For everyone in the long run that you have. 01:53:50
Essentially a very defined. 01:53:52
Process of what's required. 01:53:54
We talked at length last week about or. 01:53:57
I guess two weeks ago now. 01:54:00
About. 01:54:01
What powers we wanted to allow? Maybe the mayor. 01:54:02
To have or not have, largely because we didn't want there to be perceptions of favoritism. And so this is also in part to combat 01:54:06
that and make sure. 01:54:10
One, the oversight board has oversight. 01:54:14
And 2nd that we're. 01:54:17
Applying it evenly across the board. 01:54:18
My legal concerns with this? 01:54:21
Resolution as it's. 01:54:24
Written right now. 01:54:25
The second one in the packet. 01:54:27
Is that I think that there needs to be a fix when it comes to language regarding. 01:54:30
Already completed applications. 01:54:36
And I did get a couple emails from our city planner, senior planner Cash Hans. 01:54:39
He identified a concern that. 01:54:47
All of Vineyard could be defined as transit adjacent, and that we as a council would essentially need to define what that actually 01:54:50
means. 01:54:54
Prior to moving forward. 01:54:59
And then I would recommend. 01:55:00
Stating that this is interim policy until we have an actual ordinance adopted. 01:55:03
That's my thoughts. 01:55:09
We'll go down the line. 01:55:10
Jake, you want to go next? 01:55:12
I have nothing more to add. I I concur. I think there's wisdom and. 01:55:14
And passing something. 01:55:18
Think the language and verbiage could get better? 01:55:20
I think that it's wise to gather. 01:55:22
Like I've already said that the 2. 01:55:24
And and we've also consulted with other attorneys in other cities. 01:55:27
Head conflicting. 01:55:31
You know the three cities I contacted they. 01:55:33
Small deal. 01:55:37
It's a nothing burger so it's interesting to see. 01:55:38
The. 01:55:40
Difference of opinion and if there is any not a solid consensus, I would pass a resolution just. 01:55:41
To make sure we're protected and our bases are covered. 01:55:47
No, nothing really more to add. It's just that I think that like you said. 01:55:51
To have real teeth, we have to make it an ordinance rather than resolutions. Correct love to. 01:55:56
Do that is it? Yeah. Thank you. 01:56:01
It's important to point out this is a resolution that doesn't. 01:56:03
Find anyone? 01:56:06
Yeah, we an ordinance is required to do that. This is a simply instructions on. 01:56:07
On how to produce an ordinance that would bind us. 01:56:12
And that's, that's the, that's the important, an important distinction here. 01:56:15
So. 01:56:19
It's also. 01:56:22
I like to point out it's possible to repeal resolutions and ordinances too. I mean, we've. 01:56:23
The previous council was was able to repeal a funding. 01:56:29
Mechanism for the. 01:56:32
Their proposed you know. 01:56:34
Vineyards that are. 01:56:35
It's possible to do that? 01:56:37
If we find that, we're really terribly in error. 01:56:39
We're trying hard not to be. 01:56:41
And try to use due process where we can to make sure we're not. 01:56:44
One of the things I learned. 01:56:49
Discussing this with our senior planner. 01:56:51
Is that? 01:56:53
That many of these things we already have enshrined in our zoning code. 01:56:54
And so they. 01:56:58
It really wouldn't take much, if anything, in addition to you know what's already there. 01:56:59
And then but there but does identify a few places where we we need to perhaps make it more robust. 01:57:04
To be honest with you, I really wish we could maintain the old system. 01:57:10
But the Legislature is. 01:57:14
Deemed that can't be. 01:57:15
That can't be done, so we're going to try to follow the law they've given us and and to. 01:57:17
Transfer over to these controls from. 01:57:22
You know, from simply zon. 01:57:25
Text amendments to requirements for a complete. 01:57:26
Package. 01:57:30
You know it's a developer agreement. 01:57:32
It's not a completed development agreement, but it's a perspective. 01:57:35
Developer agreement needs to be there as part of the application. 01:57:40
For some for new development and that's. 01:57:44
And so with. 01:57:47
With that in mind, I think that a little time we can get. 01:57:49
We can identify those things and put them all together, and I think that it would work well. 01:57:54
Our legal advice says that's possible. 01:57:57
Our planners say it's possible. The issue is simply do we have the? 01:58:02
The bandwidth and the planning department to be able to do it. 01:58:05
And within the. 01:58:09
You know, a lot of time. 01:58:10
And I think just to share a thought on on what you've said one of my. 01:58:11
Concerns here with that, specifically the bandwidth aspect. And Ezra, we talked about this earlier today too. 01:58:16
There's some duplication I think that gets created in this and other resolutions that adds checks to. 01:58:23
The planners. 01:58:30
For example. 01:58:32
One of I think it was this one, but it adds a. 01:58:33
Development agreement review and a zoning. 01:58:37
Review in addition to the code and ordinance review and then you have. 01:58:40
Essentially the same scope of work being performed multiple. 01:58:44
And that's that's further on. But yes, you're right and it probably is a duplication of work there the way it's written. 01:58:47
I would think it could be combined. They wouldn't need to be duplicated. 01:58:52
I agree with that I. 01:58:55
Don't want to run into the issue where we've worked very hard to. 01:58:57
Build a lean and efficient. 01:59:01
Organization. 01:59:04
And then we turn around because we're in a panic or a frenzy or we're doing something out of fear. 01:59:05
That, uh. 01:59:10
Pushed us into a position where now we have to hire a lot more staff again and we didn't actually shrink government. 01:59:11
You know, umm. 01:59:17
Ezra, what thoughts do you have? 01:59:18
I have many. 01:59:21
First and foremost. 01:59:24
This document with. 01:59:26
So I'm sorry and. 01:59:28
Kind of my archaic. 01:59:31
Before, when I was at the city, how we. 01:59:34
Had resolutions and things on. 01:59:36
We used to have staff reports that kind of identified. 01:59:39
Here's who's writing it. 01:59:41
Here's who's making this recommendation. 01:59:43
There's some strategic notes that were included in the packet. 01:59:46
But I don't have any direction on who is providing that guidance so. 01:59:50
As you mentioned that. 01:59:54
A lot of people have had their hands in this. 01:59:55
Is that? 01:59:57
Strategic direction. 01:59:58
From our legal counsel from. 02:00:00
City Council. 02:00:04
Could somebody help answer that question for me? 02:00:05
It has. The city was not involved. 02:00:08
At all. 02:00:11
In these documents. 02:00:11
Except for interpreting them. 02:00:13
Are attempting to interpret them. 02:00:15
Our city attorney was involved. 02:00:17
Not in writing it. 02:00:18
Not in Norway by a reviewing. 02:00:20
Well, yes, where did this? We tried to interpret it. 02:00:22
But we did not write it. 02:00:25
I got and these comments that Ezra is mentioning. 02:00:28
They weren't written by our city attorney. 02:00:32
Right, I'm not saying written, but. 02:00:35
We submitted it. 02:00:37
For approval and he said they look fine. 02:00:38
Did you send this to Jesse? Two weeks, yes. I sent it to him, yes. 02:00:40
What did he say? And he said that he. 02:00:45
He was defaulting to. 02:00:48
Mostly to the. 02:00:50
Utah League of Cities and Towns. We thought that time that they were the original authors of this. 02:00:51
We've since found out that that's not the case. 02:00:56
But we. 02:00:59
But it has been through. 02:01:00
Many other. 02:01:02
Well, other citizens have worked with this and so forth, so it's a. 02:01:03
So you sent it to Jesse? 02:01:07
Yeah, where did you get it from? 02:01:10
I was directed. 02:01:13
By a couple of people. 02:01:14
That have been working with us on the RDA. 02:01:16
Where do we find this? And I went and found it. 02:01:18
Did you use my version? 02:01:21
It may have been your version that I ended up with. 02:01:24
I out of no problem. Let's see Christie Henshaw Republican Party. We talked but I didn't give her the version. 02:01:27
You see, three got it. 02:01:34
I spoke with Saratoga Springs, Linden, Orem, there were quite a few people that. 02:01:36
We gave. 02:01:41
Hey, adjust this or I don't think we have it written. It was. 02:01:42
I did. How did this document come to be? 02:01:45
You can do zoom meetings and write with people and zoom meetings all the time while somebody dictates it. 02:01:49
I mean, David Larae helped most of it, putting it all together. I love it. Yeah, there's a lot of us we've. 02:01:55
Well, let's see, the people have been advising us a great deal with the. 02:02:01
RDA has been. We've had Carson Walker, we've had. 02:02:05
John Barrick we've had. 02:02:10
Kim Cornelius is with us here as advisors on some things as well. 02:02:13
And so forth. 02:02:18
We've had, are you wanting us to keep like a Word document like this suggested change and that suggested change like I'm not 02:02:19
understanding we didn't do that. So there's very clear like with your parking ordinance like. 02:02:24
I wrote that. I put on. I wrote it, I put it on. 02:02:30
So I just there's strategic direction here and then instructions on how to use this packet, a point of order for the Council. 02:02:33
Just like we're not. 02:02:41
Allowed to disclose. 02:02:42
Names for resident emails and things like that When? 02:02:44
They reach out to us. 02:02:48
Our recorder and I just are leaning over and there's a. 02:02:51
We have privacy. 02:02:55
Issue concern. So let's not use names unless they have given you permission to use their name. 02:02:57
Yeah. 02:03:01
Right. Yeah, that's why I'm wondering. Like that's like sad. Well, that's my question is like I'm wondering this the League of 02:03:06
Cities and Towns. 02:03:09
Wrote this and we found out that they didn't write this. 02:03:13
Yeah, that's that's my like. 02:03:16
David Lewis staff report, for example, it says. 02:03:18
I've learned a lot in the last 24 hours that were. 02:03:20
Where its origins were, and I'll be happy to discuss those with you privately earlier. 02:03:23
I think. 02:03:28
If we're I mean, this was on the agenda to vote today. 02:03:28
With clear instructions on how to use the packet like. 02:03:31
When I'm getting this, I'm reading this as these are instructions for me from. 02:03:34
Someone. 02:03:38
When I submit this, when I submit this to go on the packet, my understanding my understanding was that the. 02:03:39
That the resolutions themselves will be exerted from this and the packet would not necessarily would not be part of it, it just it 02:03:44
would just be the individual resolutions because that's all I really worked on. 02:03:49
I rather ignored the other other comments on the side. 02:03:53
OK. 02:03:57
We'll move past that one. I just, it just feels very like. 02:03:59
I know this happens a lot in the federal government. Where? 02:04:02
Legislators just proposed stuff that. 02:04:04
Lobbyists or whoever like I don't. 02:04:06
I just don't like that. 02:04:08
So I would love to in the future. 02:04:09
If we're getting like. 02:04:12
Direction or something like. 02:04:13
Is this a staff report? Is this coming from a council member? Like what? 02:04:15
Like who is providing that that instruction? So that that was my first. 02:04:18
Question but. 02:04:21
To address the comment on. 02:04:23
The the. 02:04:26
That this doesn't affect any existing applications. 02:04:29
So in Section 2 and I think. 02:04:32
We can keep pushing towards that goal, but. 02:04:35
Here are some of the things that I've noticed that would need to be changed for that to be effectuated in writing. 02:04:37
So I'm in the document that's. 02:04:42
I'm in the. 02:04:45
The one that says 2026-23? 02:04:46
Not the one that says 202601. 02:04:50
That's in the sub. 02:04:53
Sub item. 02:04:54
So Section 2, it says effective immediately upon adoption of this resolution. 02:04:56
No land use application for any of the following project categories shall be deemed complete. 02:05:00
For purposes of Utah code 109A509. 02:05:05
Unless all items specified in the city's published application. 02:05:09
Checklist for the applicable project type. 02:05:12
As amended by this resolution. 02:05:15
And the implementing ordinance described here and are submitted and final non placeholder form. 02:05:17
So that's my first. 02:05:22
Question of. 02:05:23
Or my first comment of. 02:05:24
It says that like it's saying this is forward-looking. 02:05:26
But this statement means. 02:05:29
We are. 02:05:31
With this resolution changing. 02:05:31
The standards that we had previously published, we were amending those standards we had previously published. 02:05:34
And now all of those applications will be deemed not complete. 02:05:38
So that's my. 02:05:42
My biggest? 02:05:43
Issue with how this is set up and how should we resolve that so that doesn't mean. 02:05:44
It doesn't look backwards. 02:05:48
You had to submit language to improve it. 02:05:49
My. 02:05:51
Recommendation. 02:05:52
Yeah. Is that we clarify. 02:05:53
Language. 02:05:56
To my like I read it and I can see what you're saying. 02:05:57
I think. 02:06:02
Largely you just clarify that. 02:06:07
Any anything that's been vested. 02:06:09
Is still. 02:06:13
Held to the Rules and the Agreement at the time of vesting. 02:06:15
Yeah. So if we've approved, approved. 02:06:20
Applications to go forward if there's development happening like. 02:06:23
And this is what I want staff to input on is. 02:06:26
Of these. 02:06:29
Revised standards How many How many applications don't meet these revised standards currently? 02:06:30
What are those deficiencies? And that way we get a scope of like. 02:06:35
OK, who are we? 02:06:38
Who are we talking about? Does this even affect anyone? 02:06:39
Or is this all? 02:06:42
Not urgent because there's no pending applications that we need to worry about. Well, and I would also. 02:06:44
Want to maybe just add language that specifies? 02:06:48
Just very clearly that this is. 02:06:52
All forward. 02:06:56
Motion. 02:06:58
Yeah, I think we can work on that and. 02:07:00
Subsequent work sessions and. 02:07:02
As we review that which I'd be. 02:07:04
Great to clarify, since that's the direction that's being given here. 02:07:07
You know, since, since. 02:07:10
284 requires us to be upfront about everything. 02:07:12
We're just trying to make sure we are upfront about appearing. 02:07:16
OK then in Section 4. 02:07:21
It says no application shall be. 02:07:24
Deemed complete if any required exhibit. 02:07:26
Is submitted in draft. 02:07:29
Placeholder to be determined or incomplete form. 02:07:31
So it's saying submitted in draft form. 02:07:33
But then one of the required documents is a draft development agreement, so. 02:07:36
There's a clarify that because those are contradictory. 02:07:39
Contradictory right there. 02:07:42
And then also that section still references a planning director. 02:07:45
If we're not going to. 02:07:49
Plan on having one then we can. 02:07:50
Strike that reference to the planning director there. I left that in because we had city planner also mentioned there. I figured. 02:07:52
Yeah, for future, if we ever have one. 02:07:57
That's great. 02:07:59
And then? 02:08:02
As far as the interim application, again I. 02:08:04
I don't think this is. 02:08:06
Ready to pass? 02:08:08
As an interim given. 02:08:09
Those. At least those those. 02:08:11
Issues and. 02:08:14
Again. 02:08:16
All a lot of these are spelled out in ordinance. It'd be great to have staff reviews say. 02:08:18
What's already in ordinance? We don't need to. 02:08:21
Re include that and then try to have this supersede the ordinance, because then there's a. 02:08:24
A question of. 02:08:28
Do we follow the resolution? Do we follow the ordinance? 02:08:29
I believe the ordinance would be. 02:08:31
The prevailing document in any given situation. So I think that just muddies the water to. 02:08:33
One of the other ones do the ordinance. 02:08:38
Right. One of the other resolutions that we're not considering tonight specifies that we do that review you're Speaking of. 02:08:40
Yeah, I think that was actually the next one. 02:08:46
The Dash 24. 02:08:48
So my recommendation? 02:08:51
Open to feedback. 02:08:54
Look, we know we're going to continue this item. 02:08:57
I would like to see this. 02:09:00
Maybe we take this copy the second copy from the. 02:09:03
The agenda packet? Yeah, the body that's numbered. 02:09:07
Let's have 23 correct? Let's have. 02:09:10
I don't know if it's appropriate to have. 02:09:13
Robin do it. Or or. 02:09:16
Mr. Riddle or? 02:09:17
But send it out to each of the council members like we did with. 02:09:19
The code revisions. 02:09:22
Let us redline our bits, send it back to Jesse or Mr. Riddle for a reconciliation and consolidation. 02:09:24
Then we can bring that. 02:09:31
To the work session. 02:09:33
Next week. 02:09:34
Does that sound like an appropriate? 02:09:35
Course of action. 02:09:37
Sounds great. I agree with that, with the understanding that the following week we would have a vote and meet the deadline. 02:09:38
Correct. I think that that's the intent. I don't think anybody here is pushed against. 02:09:44
OK. One of the things we're concerned about in this and this is. 02:09:48
This is a risk we take in doing that. 02:09:52
Is that we not allow ourselves staff time enough to actually? 02:09:55
Create the documents that are contemplated here. It's the instruction to go do it. 02:09:59
You mean maybe specifically like the ordinance? 02:10:03
Yeah, the ordinance wouldn't be created necessarily. 02:10:05
And we're also looking, you know. 02:10:07
And I guess we don't really have time for a. 02:10:09
There's not 20 days left to do the public hearing and stuff. 02:10:11
That affects different resolutions. I don't think that affects this resolution. 02:10:16
It's just the applicant. This one is just application. 02:10:20
And this one is because it's a resolution right now and not an ordinance is largely us setting legislative policy for the staff. 02:10:23
So it's the like you said earlier, the direction. 02:10:30
To go and make. 02:10:33
What needs to be made? 02:10:35
I also think that in doing this though. 02:10:38
We've probably redlined a little bit of the required completeness submittal stuff I. 02:10:41
I'm just thinking. 02:10:47
If we're redlining and we're actually looking at this, we need to. 02:10:48
Involve the staff in the conversations. 02:10:51
Get very realistic about. 02:10:53
Where the hours are and the allocation and make sure that we're not. 02:10:55
Putting ourselves in a position because this is a concern that I have and I know that the mayor has. 02:10:59
Is that we? 02:11:04
Have moved very quickly as a council for the last 100 days. 02:11:06
And in doing that, we. 02:11:10
While shrinking the size of the city government. 02:11:12
Have tapped. 02:11:14
Are people out to a position now where there's. 02:11:15
We're looking at do we have to hire more people? 02:11:19
So we have to be very clear at. 02:11:22
Making sure that we are not. 02:11:26
Overtaxing. 02:11:27
The employees that we have. 02:11:29
We need to take care of them. 02:11:30
And this is the point. This is a note. 02:11:32
We have the staff had this for the last two weeks and. 02:11:34
I know that they started looking at it yesterday because I met with. 02:11:38
Our planners to. 02:11:41
And that was the first time they opened it, looked at it with me. 02:11:42
So. 02:11:47
So there was an attempt at least to let them. 02:11:49
Comment correct, but we also need to look at. 02:11:51
And I'm just. 02:11:53
Playing devil's advocate here, you got to look at the timing. 02:11:54
The same way that we didn't have a City Council meeting last week because it was spring break. They're probably on spring break 02:11:57
with their families. You've got medical emergencies like like. 02:12:01
You mentioned for for us. You know me too. 02:12:06
I mean, I know that there are. 02:12:09
Extenuating circumstances there that also have maybe delayed some of this. 02:12:11
Now, I think it's still very feasible for us to. 02:12:15
Meet the May 6 deadline. 02:12:18
Even with our current City Council schedules. 02:12:21
I know we can't direct or vote in a meeting, but we can direct to say that. 02:12:27
Since this has a deadline, it's of. 02:12:31
Our highest priority on the Council, right? 02:12:33
Because we've got a deadline. 02:12:38
I think the highest priority is providing the city services that we. 02:12:40
Right. But planning, I mean, sure, this is largely planning, right? 02:12:44
Well. 02:12:49
Again, maybe, maybe we reach over to. 02:12:51
Mr. David Kyle, if he knows. 02:12:54
I don't know what's on plantings plate right now. 02:12:56
We have a lot. 02:12:59
On planning split. 02:13:00
We're currently renegotiating contracts. 02:13:01
Right now. 02:13:04
That's probably one of our and a lot of that is. 02:13:06
Deals with a lot of research. 02:13:08
And how we can claw back some of our. 02:13:10
We basically have lost a lot of money by having. 02:13:17
Previous contracts have signed away our. 02:13:20
Our rights to. 02:13:23
Increase our. 02:13:25
Our impact fees. 02:13:26
And so we're in the process of that negotiation. It is very time consuming. 02:13:27
And that's on top of the regular duties. 02:13:32
So I agree this is important. 02:13:36
I think that we should set the hard deadline and say, look, we want to have a draft of this resolution that's working through us 02:13:39
and Mr. Riddle. 02:13:42
By next week. 02:13:46
I think that is it realistic for us to say. 02:13:48
Can we have? 02:13:51
City staff, the planning department in particular, who's going to be involved in this? 02:13:52
Get what they need to get done in the next two weeks. 02:13:56
After today. 02:14:00
They have a better understanding of. 02:14:01
Where the direction? 02:14:03
This is headed. 02:14:05
This is today. Well, not today, but. 02:14:07
Yesterday and today were the first time I we've had both of our city planners have. 02:14:10
Have been at. 02:14:15
At the office, medical emergencies and. 02:14:17
Spring break and all. Everything you named off. 02:14:21
So we are a little behind and I can send a message to Council and let. 02:14:24
Let you know what. 02:14:29
When we can, what's the earliest we can get it on the calendar? 02:14:32
OK. And I think. 02:14:35
This is just. 02:14:37
Me willingness, I have tried very hard. I think to. 02:14:38
Corral. 02:14:43
That's maybe not the right term, but I'm a cattle guy to get everybody on the same page when it comes to. 02:14:45
The Council. 02:14:51
I'm willing to liaison with the staff. I will take ownership of that and making sure that. 02:14:52
I'm providing what they need or liaisoning with them in the count like. 02:14:56
If they need the. 02:15:00
A person to funnel and work through. I will facilitate however I can. 02:15:02
Is my offer. 02:15:06
OK. That's appreciated. Thanks. 02:15:07
It looks like Jesse's had his hand up. 02:15:10
For a little bit. 02:15:12
Hey and I apologize my video went out for. 02:15:14
A few minutes and so I'm not sure. 02:15:18
Which resolution you're talking about? 02:15:20
But overall, there's no urgency to any of this. 02:15:23
There there is a may. 02:15:26
Six deadline. 02:15:29
But anyone that has a complete application. 02:15:31
Before May the 7th. 02:15:35
Has to go into the current code. 02:15:36
The best we could do. 02:15:39
According to my calculations. 02:15:42
Is have this. 02:15:43
Resolution and the ordinance done by May 5th. 02:15:45
That means we're only protecting the city for one day, assuming. 02:15:48
We even want to change the code. 02:15:52
All the other issues. 02:15:55
Even in I've read 284 numerous times. 02:15:56
Most of these are just minor changes to state law, and there's no urgency about. 02:15:59
Any of this? 02:16:04
That we would have to. 02:16:05
Put this on staff and do 7 resolutions. 02:16:07
As I've read through it, I've already. 02:16:10
Figured out a way to combine two or three of these resolutions. 02:16:13
But remember, this was dropped on my lap in the middle of a lot of. 02:16:16
A personal events. 02:16:19
I just think we back up in. 02:16:22
Just say, is any of this urgent? And if so, let's move forward with the urgent matters. 02:16:24
But I can't see. 02:16:30
Any of this to be urgent at the time? 02:16:31
So I would just. 02:16:34
Council. The Council. 02:16:36
Let's sit down and find out what we think is urgent and why. 02:16:39
And then at that point, then we can give it to staff where they're not overwhelmed as they just got back from spring break and. 02:16:42
I understand one of the persons that had a relative that passed away and. 02:16:49
Things of that sort, so. 02:16:53
That's just my kind of overall advice without giving. 02:16:55
Personal legal advice. 02:16:58
Is that I I think somebody created a sense of urgency for the Council. 02:17:01
And I don't know if that was warranted. 02:17:05
Mr. Riddle. 02:17:09
But sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off, I thought there was a pause when I started. 02:17:10
I was just gonna ask you, go ahead, please. 02:17:16
Did you? 02:17:18
Here when I was. 02:17:19
Asking about if you would be. 02:17:21
Available or willing to. 02:17:23
Do similarly to what you did with the. 02:17:25
Code amendments. 02:17:27
And will you send out? 02:17:30
Maybe a copy of this to each of us. Let us do red lines and send it back to you and then have you reconcile those. 02:17:32
Yes, Sir. 02:17:40
I'll do whatever I'm directed by the council. 02:17:41
But again, I don't think the urgency is if somebody files on this. 02:17:44
On the 6th, we're just eliminating one day. 02:17:49
So I don't really see the urgency in jumping into the code. 02:17:52
And then asking. 02:17:56
Staff to rewrite a code for a one day period. 02:17:57
Agreed. And I think that we've kind of come to consensus here. The only issue, the only issue that had. 02:18:01
Urgency. 02:18:07
I think was the. 02:18:08
The 2026-23. 02:18:09
Which was the vesting 1, and I think that that's the only one that's specified in. 02:18:13
State bill is that May 6th? 02:18:17
Deadline so as long as we have. 02:18:19
Something in place and I think that the resolution meets the intent in SB. 02:18:22
284 as long as we have something in place. 02:18:26
Were good to proceed with the rest of the. 02:18:30
Changes in resolutions almost at leisure, but. 02:18:32
I mean. 02:18:35
Making sure that we're. 02:18:36
Actually doing it the right way, tightening up. 02:18:38
The ordinance, the definitions, all of those things. 02:18:40
Am I understanding that correctly think? 02:18:44
Oh, I'll let you go, Jesse. 02:18:46
Yes, I'm sorry. 02:18:48
Raise your hand, Parker, if I had before, because I'm not really sure if I'm interrupting someone, go ahead. 02:18:52
Jesse, I can't see the screen to know if your hands raised or not. 02:18:58
My apologies. 02:19:01
Oh, he can see me. 02:19:04
Of course I will. I like the procedure we did with the code. 02:19:05
Where I drafted it. 02:19:10
Send it out to the council, they made their changes. 02:19:12
And then it was we went through a public meeting to talk about the the draft. 02:19:15
And I like that procedure and everyone seemed to be on board and everybody's what seemed to be involved. So of course. 02:19:19
Let's stay with the procedure. This work for us. 02:19:26
I agree with that. Is that a consensus? Yeah. 02:19:30
Or at least on my end. 02:19:34
One thing I wanted to point out. 02:19:36
A concern that I. 02:19:39
Have that I hopefully hopefully we can address through. 02:19:40
Kind of everything that went down with this process is. 02:19:43
Like at the end of the day, if any of this stuff was found to be. 02:19:45
Like a need for litigation. 02:19:51
Like Jesse would be on the hook to defend that on behalf of the city. 02:19:53
And so I love what the mayor spelled out in his April first direction of saying. 02:19:57
Work directly with legal to get those resolutions together because I definitely want you, Jesse, to feel comfortable. It's like. 02:20:01
I don't want anything. 02:20:07
I guess. 02:20:09
Unless I would love. 02:20:10
An accompanying. 02:20:12
Legal opinion on things if you're not comfortable. 02:20:13
Defending or. 02:20:17
Supporting something? 02:20:19
That's something that I would love to know kind of going into the meeting. So if you're, if you're ever available to do that. 02:20:21
I think that would. 02:20:26
Be welcome. 02:20:27
If other council members agree. 02:20:28
I. 02:20:35
Process that we put in last time where I. 02:20:36
Take over the process. I didn't really have any control over this process. 02:20:38
They were sent to me. I I assumed when I. 02:20:43
Received them. They were done by the League of City and Towns. 02:20:46
I've talked to their general counsel today. 02:20:49
He was a little bit upset that his name was involved in it. 02:20:51
So there's still revelations coming out on who drafted these and. 02:20:54
To this day I don't know so. 02:21:00
I like the process where we keep it internal. 02:21:02
That if there's a. 02:21:04
Resolution that I get involved in the in the drafting of that. 02:21:06
And then if there's an ordinance, I work with staff to figure out what is what. What about our ordinance needs to be improved? 02:21:09
Now for example 284 has lots of changes. 02:21:15
Especially regarding the Planning Commission. 02:21:19
So we'll have to adopt the state code changes into our. 02:21:21
Local ordinances and and I. 02:21:25
You're always prepared to do that in April and May and June. 02:21:28
Of the year after the. 02:21:31
The legislative session adjourns. 02:21:33
And so I did talk to the general counsel of the league today. There are some seminars that they have on some of the changes to the 02:21:37
cities and I plan to attend those. But. 02:21:41
Yes, Ezra, I like the process we've been through and I would agree with you. 02:21:45
Great. 02:21:50
So, Mayor, can I? 02:21:52
I move that we. 02:21:54
That we adopt the process we've been Speaking of the process that was used previously with the. 02:21:55
City ordinances to review. 02:22:00
This resolution. 02:22:01
202623. 02:22:04
To formally right, it's just issuing a direction. 02:22:06
Yeah, let's. 02:22:11
Mr. Riddle, let's issue that as the council direction. Everyone seems to be in agreeance, everyone's heads nodding. 02:22:13
OK. 02:22:19
OK. 02:22:21
With that, is your head nodding? Yeah. 02:22:23
Yeah, he was nodding. 02:22:25
Could I get a motion to continue this to? 02:22:26
The next weeks work session second. 02:22:29
No. 02:22:31
Say the motion. 02:22:35
Motion to move this to the next work session. 02:22:37
Robin, for clarity, this is item 5.2 adopting a resolution 2026-23. 02:22:40
2nd. 02:22:47
All in favor. 02:22:49
Aye. 02:22:50
Cool with that. 02:22:53
Meeting adjourned. 02:22:55
Is that right? 02:22:56
Do we do we need to go into OK question? 02:22:58
Question, Robin. 02:23:03
Previously the motion. 02:23:04
Was made earlier to. 02:23:07
Continue 6.1 which was after we adjourn as the City Council convened as a redevelopment agency. So because the council voted on 02:23:09
that, we don't get to do RDA stuff. 02:23:14
Yes, no. Maybe so. 02:23:18
OK. You, you mentioned also there would be a time during the RDA meeting just to speak about? 02:23:20
The invoices for the. 02:23:26
OK, we're gaveling in as the RDA board. 02:23:30
Ready. 02:23:32
I have to say that it is currently. 02:23:34
809 on. 02:23:37
What day is today? The 14th? April 14th. 02:23:41
2026 so for. 02:23:43
Future. 02:23:45
Like if. 02:23:46
For future reference. 02:23:49
It helps. 02:23:51
If we have this on the agenda. 02:23:52
And there is some. 02:23:54
Ambiguity to where you can go into and this is on the agenda. 02:23:56
This is on the edge. Yes, Yes it is. 02:24:01
6.16. 02:24:03
To clarify, I think what he was trying to say was that he. 02:24:06
Is that they would like to have. 02:24:09
I dictated it with my executive authority as mayor, protest as a separate meeting and agendas with its own agenda. 02:24:11
Just so that way there's clarity on what's being voted on. 02:24:18
As the RDA board, I agree with this as a best practice. Yeah, so. 02:24:23
As the mayor Pro Tem, I will direct the mayor to fix that stuff. 02:24:28
So it seemed like. 02:24:35
I mean, as an informational item, I think your question is do we owe the money? The answer is yes and. 02:24:37
You know it does under score. 02:24:42
The great partnership that we've had. 02:24:44
With flagship where? 02:24:46
The nature of our agreements is they front the expense for a lot of the things that they do, both the environmental. 02:24:48
And the infrastructure, we reimburse them later. 02:24:55
We've got a lot of our annual payments. They're going to be going out. 02:24:58
Very soon. They usually go out in the spring. We get the money. 02:25:01
From the county. 02:25:04
In February. 02:25:05
And then we. 02:25:07
Begin paying out all of our reimbursement agreements and so just generically the concern of. 02:25:08
Hey, you owe us a lot of money. It's true. We and we've usually pay a lot of that in the spring. So right now is the time that we 02:25:13
we pay them. So OK. 02:25:17
Mr. Daniels. 02:25:22
Could you just because I don't have the form that you've previously provided us in front of me? 02:25:23
When is the next set of payments? 02:25:27
Scheduled. 02:25:30
So. 02:25:32
Our annual reimbursement payments specifically for like tax increment finance. 02:25:33
Agreements. 02:25:37
That all just goes out in first quarter. 02:25:39
OK. So generally not a hard date associated just in first quarter. Each contract has some hard date, some say in the spring, some 02:25:41
say once you get the money, some say by may, some say you know. 02:25:46
Generally, everybody's a. 02:25:51
You know that we've worked with is agreed to receive the money. 02:25:53
Soon after we get it and we prepare the payments and we do the calculations of which. 02:25:56
Parcels are applied and all that kind of thing. 02:26:01
And then there's ongoing environmental. 02:26:03
Remediation that is not. 02:26:05
It just it varies as to what work has been done. 02:26:09
So some months are bigger than other months, Sometimes we pay them every quarter or we've. 02:26:13
You know, it's just. 02:26:18
The environmental piece is the one that's a little more unpredictable. 02:26:20
In terms of when they're expending certain project. 02:26:23
Funds for. 02:26:27
For which element of the environmental work that they're doing? 02:26:28
Other questions? Do you have a comment? 02:26:35
Please just following the audit. 02:26:37
It looks like the we didn't have really good established procedures in place, according to the auditor and the. 02:26:40
Those were hopefully to be in place. 02:26:46
As soon as we could, right? Yeah. So that's absolutely something we've been working on. 02:26:48
Yeah, and I talked. 02:26:53
To Chris because I had some questions about. 02:26:55
This I love for him to. 02:26:59
To comment on. 02:27:01
How he's felt like the. 02:27:02
Relationship. 02:27:04
I don't think he, I don't think he is. I don't think he is. 02:27:06
But I'd love for him to comment on how he feels like this relationship is gone and what he feels like we should do with those 02:27:11
contractual obligations. 02:27:14
Because I don't think you would. 02:27:18
Say to withhold payment on. 02:27:20
No, but. 02:27:22
I agree. 02:27:23
This is council sentiment. Should we invite him back since look, we continued this item already? 02:27:25
Let's bring him back. 02:27:30
Next week, yeah. 02:27:32
Invite him to come to work session, it's fine. 02:27:33
The When does he start the audit? 02:27:36
We don't have a, we don't have a solid date yet. We we need to. 02:27:39
Negotiate with him at the time we can have a work session to. 02:27:42
You like to have a kickoff session. He's mentioned that. 02:27:45
So. 02:27:48
I actually during the meeting. 02:27:48
Emailed Chris. 02:27:51
And and I'm working to arrange a meeting the 1st of next week. 02:27:53
With Josh. 02:27:57
To begin those steps. 02:28:00
I know we agreed that we were going to. 02:28:03
Higher additional staff. 02:28:04
And have that coincide with the audit, is that still the? 02:28:06
Expectation. I know it's the expectation of the Council. 02:28:09
So what we need to do? 02:28:12
And we didn't forget on that, I don't think. 02:28:14
That would be the thing that got continued, I think. 02:28:16
Oh so. 02:28:19
We need to have funds. 02:28:21
Basically put aside. 02:28:23
To we need to have a through to be able to pay. 02:28:25
And then we need to have some parameters, the amount. 02:28:29
How you want to hire them contractor versus? 02:28:33
Actual employees. So some direction from the council, I think we clarified that as we met with with Jesse Riddle last week before. 02:28:37
The thing that you're not? 02:28:46
Remembering though, with this conversation was that before any of this could happen. 02:28:47
The mayor needed to negotiate with. 02:28:52
Taxing entities and make sure that we were going to be permitted to have an additional administrative cost to what we've 02:28:54
previously had. 02:28:58
So that had to be negotiated, to my understanding. 02:29:03
For the coming year or for this current fiscal year? 02:29:05
If, and maybe this is a question, Mr. Daniels, for you. 02:29:09
Is there a surplus of administrative funds in this fiscal year? 02:29:13
Yeah, I think there will be some. 02:29:18
OK. And and I think. 02:29:20
Yeah, we could. We could. 02:29:23
Runs a calculation, but I think there's there's capacity. 02:29:24
And I think depending on the type of staff that you want. 02:29:27
Um, you know, sort of finance is probably the best. 02:29:31
So if that's some sort of like payments? 02:29:35
Analyst or? 02:29:37
You know somebody in accounts payable or something in that order. 02:29:39
I don't know that mean we could talk about the particulars of what? 02:29:43
What you are looking to do and maybe the feedback of the auditor. 02:29:46
Yeah. 02:29:52
Working with HR, we came up with a. 02:29:53
Well, we've worked with. 02:30:00
Councilmember David Larae. 02:30:02
We we have a listing. 02:30:05
Ready to go, We just. 02:30:06
Needed to know. 02:30:08
Some particulars. So if. 02:30:09
If we need to have a vote, could we just? 02:30:12
Direct that the vote happened next meeting so that there is no vote needed. 02:30:14
That's a great question. 02:30:21
We need the budget. I don't think the RDA has budget for additional. 02:30:23
I guess I mean the money is there but like a budget line item, right? 02:30:29
There are many different budget items that allocate for this already I saw that. 02:30:33
There's a lot of money that you're not sure. 02:30:37
Because it is so flexible and high level the RDA budget. So I think you probably so. 02:30:40
Now that's the question is if the RDA board is going to hire them or if the city is going to hire. 02:30:45
The person. The person, both budgets are so high level and flexible that could accommodate it. The mayor could choose. 02:30:49
I think the idea of the council is the RDA, right? Correction. Yeah, the the previous conversation was that. 02:30:55
If we were to proceed down this path. 02:31:02
They would be paid for by the Rda's administrative. 02:31:04
Cost. 02:31:07
Or administrative budget. 02:31:08
And that would be if they're funded by the RDA, they're hired by the RDA board. 02:31:09
It would be, I would assume separate from the. 02:31:13
City, right. So that's a really. 02:31:17
Great question because there is a little bit of an important distinction. 02:31:19
The administrative. 02:31:23
Fee that the RDA. 02:31:25
Deducts, if you will, from our revenue. 02:31:26
Is typically used to reimburse the city. 02:31:29
For the. 02:31:31
Overall overhead administrative cost of running the RDA. 02:31:32
Which is essentially like. 02:31:36
The. 02:31:38
The what do you call it? Like the? 02:31:40
The prorated, if you will, cost of various elements of city administration. So for example, if you're using 10% of the accounts 02:31:43
payable capacity, you're covering 10% of accounts payable cost with that administrative fee. So I think you could go either 02:31:48
direction. 02:31:54
I think. 02:32:00
For if you're going to hire somebody that's like a full time in-house staff member, you probably should hire them as a city. 02:32:00
And have them be a city staffer but be dedicated in their duties to certain RDA. 02:32:07
Related things. So like if you're looking at somebody maybe like a finance analyst. 02:32:12
To provide. 02:32:16
You know, more financial oversight based on, you know. 02:32:17
New processes that the auditors coming up, you know. 02:32:20
Recommending or something like that. 02:32:23
That might be. 02:32:25
A good synergy for the city. 02:32:26
It was decided that. 02:32:27
That meeting that we held. 02:32:29
With Jesse Riddle and you and I, David Kyle that we would high up. 02:32:30
Higher up to three advisors at AS. 02:32:35
Independent contractors and yeah. 02:32:38
And and they would they would build up to up to 20 hours a week, no more than. 02:32:41
At the rate was that was negotiated with him and we had a cap for that. 02:32:45
So, and that's just. 02:32:49
I mean if as everyone. 02:32:51
On board. Yeah, I'm actually, I'm frustrated with the way that that was just phrased, David, because that's a decision that has to 02:32:53
be made by the legislative body and it can't be made outside of. 02:32:58
A public hearing. 02:33:03
Right. But that was already the those funds are allocated on the 20252026 budget. That's very high level that's already been 02:33:04
approved. So we don't have to change it arguing that there's a line item for it, I'm I'm saying. 02:33:10
We never as a. 02:33:18
Governing body or as the RDA board? 02:33:20
Actually had. 02:33:22
A vote to say, are we going to hire? What's that hiring structure going to look like? Is it going to be because we talked about 02:33:23
doing a Commission versus an Advisory Board? 02:33:28
We talked about having representation as. 02:33:33
Each council member would maybe get to. 02:33:35
Bring somebody to the table that they could have an advisor in place now. 02:33:37
This is the first time I've ever heard of three people. 02:33:41
So the mayor was. 02:33:44
Was asked. 02:33:46
If he could have 1/3. 02:33:47
In a meeting and I I had no issue with that. 02:33:49
It was just a meeting with me and I think. 02:33:51
David Larae. 02:33:53
And because the money in the budget and this is not a director level position, it wouldn't come to us. They're just. 02:33:55
Staff employees and we don't. 02:34:00
We don't approve sure staff, this was supposed to be administrative decision. Yeah. So it's because it is just a lower, I'm not 02:34:02
calling lower level, but like because it's not a director, the money is in the budget. 02:34:07
And it's just an employee we did. 02:34:13
Asked the mayor, and I believe he was. We don't need to have a vote. 02:34:15
To have it, but that's why I asked him. I said if we need as long as we have direction from the whole council of. 02:34:20
The way you want to go if you want us just to hire these people. 02:34:26
Like we were open. We thought it would be. 02:34:30
Better to have more than less and have. 02:34:33
Right, less. 02:34:36
Just to have more of a committee versus. 02:34:38
It was basically to get maximum input, so that was just our suggestion we. 02:34:42
We were happy to facilitate whatever decision the City Council wants to make. 02:34:48
Do you want to put a vote on for the next City Council meeting to? 02:34:53
If we want to vote or we can do it informally, I don't care. 02:34:57
How do you want? How do you handle a partner? I'd love to see a. 02:34:59
Proposal from Chris. I think he like. 02:35:02
Or the auditor for the RDA, maybe he might have an idea of what a structure this is not part of the audit. Their staff within the 02:35:04
city, they're going to be watching, correct? But I think not. 02:35:10
The point is. 02:35:16
He Chris previously had mentioned that he felt like there was room in the RDA to have. 02:35:18
Correct. He wanted additional people involved. 02:35:23
Correct. What What I think Councilmember Nair is advocating for is can we get his? 02:35:26
Actual recommendation on what that staffing or structure looks like. 02:35:32
Is that an accurate representation? We've already talked to him about it. 02:35:35
We addressed it right. 02:35:39
I would love to see it. 02:35:41
Well written recommendation that we can write, but we addressed it and we had, we had a decision. Apparently nothing, no action 02:35:42
was taken after that. 02:35:45
But is that fair? 02:35:49
David Larae and I both sit on the RDA committee that was created, so that's why. 02:35:50
In meeting with the mayor. 02:35:55
That's why we didn't hold a vote. Now we could as a committee, we could bring it back towards a vote. I think that's the purpose 02:35:57
of the committee is to bring it back to the council. All right, so let's next week we can do that, Put the formal thing and we'll 02:36:00
vote. 02:36:04
Next week's artwork session, but. 02:36:08
Yeah. Or give direction after we put the guidance of. 02:36:11
So do you want to give direction tonight? 02:36:16
If we hiring let's I mean, I don't understand why we couldn't give the direction. We we asked for two-part time and then the mayor 02:36:18
said a third. He didn't distinguish who he. 02:36:23
Threw it up and said somebody in the school district with a background, he threw someone from the state in a different background. 02:36:27
We in working with the auditor who distinguished some backgrounds and. 02:36:33
I don't remember the titles of what they did on the contractor side. 02:36:38
We had conversations with Chris about it and he's the biggest thing is, is when the audit is is performed. 02:36:42
Going and Chris being all by himself. 02:36:47
Having additional staff to go through and get. 02:36:50
Knowledge would be very important. And so that's where it aligned and I don't think anybody. 02:36:54
Is. 02:36:59
Detracting from that argument. 02:37:00
My position on this is it's. 02:37:02
And look, maybe unpopular opinion with some. 02:37:05
It is falling in line with the same. 02:37:08
We're doing something. 02:37:11
In such a manner that I don't think it is the most transparent practice. 02:37:13
It should come back to the Council and I think. 02:37:17
Look over the last. 02:37:19
2 council meetings and I know that this was a big a big. 02:37:21
Point of frustration for the mayor and for his staff and for the employees in the city. 02:37:24
Where? 02:37:29
We are. 02:37:31
We're doing things in such a manner. 02:37:33
That it's not. 02:37:36
It but the handcuffing. 02:37:38
Right. But the mayor obliged to do this administratively. So we said, OK, great, let's just let's just. 02:37:41
And that's that's fine. But if he doesn't want to do it, then here's I agree with you like. 02:37:47
Then we have to make it and I can't speak for him to say if he wants to or doesn't want to do it. What I'm saying is. 02:37:51
Over the last couple council meetings we've essentially prevented him from doing things unilaterally. 02:37:56
We have tried very hard to maintain. 02:38:02
Authority in the Council so that things are brought into a public session and brought into a public meeting. We can present them 02:38:05
in front of everybody, we can get public feedback. 02:38:09
And this is something that isn't being done in that way. 02:38:13
So my advocacy is. 02:38:16
Let's bring it into the work session next week. Let's invite Chris to come and present on what he thinks the best practices are. 02:38:18
And let's actually make it a voting item. 02:38:24
So that there can be public feedback on those things. 02:38:27
I just don't want. 02:38:30
And and maybe it's my fault for for. 02:38:31
I shouldn't be projecting for the mayor. 02:38:34
Like the with the fee schedule I don't want them to be in a position. 02:38:36
Where they can be accused of favoritism. 02:38:40
Or that they're hiring their friends. Or that they're so. 02:38:43
That's where I think having a committee, having the panel, having that involved in public. 02:38:46
Is the best practice when it comes to hiring because this is a huge ordeal when it comes to. 02:38:51
The money, the budget. 02:38:55
The implications long term. 02:38:56
I just want to move it forward, so I'm happy to do it. And if that's the most transparent way, let's do it that way. 02:39:00
Yeah, I think the patients from. 02:39:06
I think it's been 7 weeks where he's tried to either go. 02:39:08
Is the administrative or legislative? 02:39:11
And so it's like the mayor said he would. 02:39:13
If he says no, then let's do it legislatively. But if he says I'm good and wants to do it? 02:39:16
I just don't want to handcuff him either. 02:39:21
Right. So whichever 1. 02:39:22
So let's make sure the mayor's involved at the work session. 02:39:26
And we get what he actually thinks is the best practice that he wants to do. 02:39:28
OK. And then we'll vote and it'll be a legislative decision. Can we, I can do that and and look, is there any opposition? 02:39:32
Because we're essentially talking about it now. 02:39:39
This is public. It's in the minutes. 02:39:42
Somebody watching us on the recording right now. What's up? Recording home viewer? 02:39:43
All of us are going to go. 02:39:51
You know I share my notes. 02:39:52
Every Wednesday morning on what happened in City Council. I know a lot of you guys do the same. 02:39:53
So. 02:39:58
This will get out now. 02:39:59
It will be discussed, we will collect feedback. That's just how it happens. 02:40:01
If we are in a good spot with the work session next week. 02:40:05
And the mayor says, hey, no, I'm really comfortable doing this as an administrative thing. I think that's the best practice, 02:40:08
Chris. 02:40:11
If he's agreeing with that. 02:40:14
Can we? 02:40:16
Also notice it as the business item. 02:40:18
To adjourn. 02:40:20
Reconvene as an RDA board and vote. Would that be comfortable with you all? 02:40:22
I'm just saying, how do we not handcuff them? 02:40:26
Is that possible? 02:40:28
Sure, possible that was. That was like the going standard of the previous. 02:40:30
Council, I think. 02:40:34
We might just have to notice it as a regular meeting. 02:40:38
But I know we can make that change. Like I know our schedule says it's a work session, but we can. 02:40:41
Well, but even all work sessions are is City Council meetings that you're only doing a work session in. So it would just still be 02:40:46
a notice City Council meeting. 02:40:51
Correct. 02:40:55
Is there any actual change on your end? 02:40:56
And it needs to be addressed. 02:40:58
Correct, but is there any any? 02:41:02
Difficulty or issue if we were to say. 02:41:04
Hey, look. 02:41:06
We want to just put that on as a. 02:41:07
Safety net, Maybe we can do it if there's a consensus. 02:41:09
You know, we just have to. 02:41:13
And let's just let them know a couple days in advance or whatever. Three days in advance, yeah, to make sure. 02:41:14
How he's feeling on that too, Yeah. 02:41:19
Because if he says, hey, I'm not into that. 02:41:21
Then it's a non issue anyways, yeah. 02:41:24
Yeah, I'm fine. I'm fine with that. 02:41:28
I think uh, uh. 02:41:30
I think we've covered the cover, the bases there. It's after 8. 02:41:32
Yeah, it's way after eight. I was looking at my watch. I said at 8:00 I should just continue this and then we have this RDA stuff, 02:41:35
but. 02:41:38
We have Mr. Daniels here. 02:41:41
What other questions do you guys have? 02:41:43
And this is not. 02:41:48
As much for you as it is for Evan, I just want to in the work session. I would love to see like. 02:41:50
Where we're at with the budget, with our spending. So I got a snapshot of like what the budget numbers were. 02:41:55
I just want to know, like, where we're at? 02:42:00
Spending each of those. 02:42:02
Buckets and staffing plan as well. I know we've. 02:42:04
Hired staff, gotten rid of staff so. 02:42:07
We can have that ready square there the work session. 02:42:10
Perfect. 02:42:12
Jake. Good, good. 02:42:15
Good, good. Do I need to do anything special to adjourn? 02:42:16
Somebody sure, please. 02:42:19
I move, we adjourn. 02:42:23
Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. You're going to. Yeah. Let him make his comment. 02:42:24
I'll be very fast. Nate Hutchinson again, I just wanted to state. 02:42:30
From an RDA budget perspective, we're happy to sit down. 02:42:33
With the RDA. 02:42:37
Group as well to start saying what should. 02:42:38
How would you like to? 02:42:41
Prioritize the future budget. 02:42:43
Whether that's cleanup, whether that's some infrastructure. 02:42:45
You know, there's, there's all these different needs and there's currently some funding that will be available over the next 02:42:47
couple of years. 02:42:50
You know, we have this big lump sum that's due this year. 02:42:54
And then it's going to be much more steady state moving forward. 02:42:57
Other than environmental cleanup, but we would love to sit down with you guys so that we're not just kind of in the dark. 02:43:00
Coming up with those plans. 02:43:06
We'd like to, I mean, we have our own ideas so that we're not just spending endless time doing this, but we'd love to sit down 02:43:07
with whoever would want to do that on your side. 02:43:11
To prioritize what the things you'd like to see. 02:43:15
Could I ask has that? 02:43:18
Been something that's occurred with. 02:43:19
Previous city councils where they've given you direction for what they're doing for budget. Yeah. So, so we have an annual RDA 02:43:21
requirement. We actually were meeting weekly. So I mean, it was kind of like. 02:43:26
Constantly like what projects need to be done? 02:43:31
There was a weekly meeting that occurred and then we would come and. 02:43:34
And and talk to the board periodically as as things were larger and public updates, et cetera. But happy this isn't necessarily a 02:43:38
requirement of the agreement, but this is something that we just. 02:43:43
Want to do in good faith of saying like. 02:43:49
Let's prioritize this together if we want to, you know, expedite some of the cleanup on the east side. 02:43:51
See how much budgets available and. 02:43:56
You know how much more additional dollars we're willing to put into some of these projects. 02:43:58
Help prioritize these. So just wanted to put that on the record and for you guys in your minds that we're happy to go through that 02:44:02
process with you. 02:44:05
Thank you. One more thing for the record too, I just want to. 02:44:08
Thank you guys, I work with a lot of developers at the county. 02:44:11
And. 02:44:14
I don't know of a single one who would be OK. 02:44:14
Like waiting this long for. 02:44:17
A giant payment of that magnitude. 02:44:20
So I think we all want to. 02:44:22
Keep that good relationship and make sure we're. 02:44:23
Working in the best interests of the city so. 02:44:26
So thank you for affording us that. 02:44:28
Mr. Pierce, do you have a comment? 02:44:29
David Pierce, President. 02:44:35
I I want to make the assumption and I think I'm correct. 02:44:38
That whomever. 02:44:41
Is. 02:44:43
Hire or contract that. 02:44:44
To assist with. 02:44:46
With work with the RDA. 02:44:48
Is qualified. 02:44:51
And I've been watching the Pit. 02:44:52
TV series about. 02:44:56
You know, medical thing. 02:44:58
And. 02:44:59
Now I can spend. 02:45:00
Three weeks. 02:45:02
In an operating room. 02:45:03
That doesn't mean that I should do operations. 02:45:06
In the future. 02:45:10
Or I can be of. 02:45:11
That doesn't mean I should be a heart surgeon. 02:45:13
If if someone is a. 02:45:18
Family or Consumer Financial? 02:45:21
Instructor. 02:45:24
I would prefer. 02:45:28
Personally. 02:45:29
As a citizen. 02:45:30
To have someone. 02:45:32
Who is skilled? 02:45:34
And trained. 02:45:35
In government financing. 02:45:38
Or land use development. 02:45:41
Financing. 02:45:43
Or even just land use. 02:45:44
Rather than someone else who may have experience on the periphery. 02:45:47
Or whose chief qualification is just. 02:45:52
That he is hung in there. 02:45:55
For a period of time. 02:45:57
That would be. 02:45:59
My assumption? 02:46:00
So thank you. 02:46:01
Yeah. Thank you. The best. 02:46:03
Anything else? 02:46:06
Going once, going twice. 02:46:07
Oh, David, you got to make a motion, she says. 02:46:10
I move, we adjourn. 02:46:12
I second it. 02:46:14
All in favor. 02:46:16
Go home. 02:46:18
Which time? 02:46:29
The purple. 02:46:37