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INVOCATION/INSPIRATIONAL THOUGHTS/PLEDGE OFALLEGIANCE Vice-Chair Bramwell orated the purpose and importance of the State’s Office of Property Rights Ombudsman.
OPEN SESSION                         No comments were presented before the Planning Commission.3.
MINUTES REVIEW ANDAPPROVAL3.1    June223.2    June,22MOTION: COMMISSIONER JENKINS MOTIONED TO APPROVE THE MINUTES AS RECORDED. COMMISSIONER GUDMUNDSON SECONDED THE MOTION. VICE-CHAIR BRAMWELL, COMMISSIONER GUDMUNDSON, AND COMMISSIONER JENKINS VOTED AYE. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.BUSINESS ITEMS1
Sign Standard Waiver- Southwest Spine and Pain Planner II Briam Amaya Perez introduced the application and purpose of the sign standard waiver.  He provided potential motions for the Planning Commission to consider as staff did not have a recommendation.   Olivia with Creative Signs clarified the purpose and need of the sign standard waiver.
MOTION: VICE-CHAIR BRAMWELL MOTIONED TO APPROVE THE SIGN STANDARD WAIVER. COMMISSIONER JENKINS SECONDED THE MOTION. ROLL WENT AS FOLLOWS: VICE-CHAIR BRAMWELL AND COMMISSIONER JENKINS VOTED AYE. COMMISSIONER GUDMUNDSON VOTED NO. THE MOTION FAILED TO PASS.   Commissioner Gudmundson expressed concern for the precedent that would be set by approving this sign standard waiver. Community Development Director Morgan Brim explained that staff is working on making changes to the sign code that would address her concerns. He also proposed limiting the hours that the signs would be allowed to remain lit as a condition of approval.
MOTION TO AMEND PREVIOUS MOTION: VICE-CHAIR BRAMWELL MOTIONED TO AMEND THE PREVIOUS MOTION WITH CONDITION THAT THE SIGNS FACING RESIDENTIAL USES MAY NOT BE LIT DURING THE HOURS OF00PM AND00AM. COMMISSIONER JENKINS SECONDED THE MOTION. VICE-CHAIR BRAMWELL, COMMISSIONER GUDMUNDSON, AND COMMISSIONER JENKINS VOTED AYE. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. PUBLIC HEARING5.1
Geneva Nitrogen General Plan Land Use Map and Zoning Map Amendment ApplicationsMr. Brim presented the application. Nicholai Lazarev with the Boyer Company addressed concerns from the Planning Commission.
MOTION: COMMISSIONER GUDMUNDSON MOTIONED TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. COMMISSIONER JENKINS SECONDED THE MOTION. VICE-CHAIR BRAMWELL, COMMISSIONER GUDMUNDSON, AND COMMISSIONER JENKINS VOTED AYE. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. No comments were presented before the Planning Commission.
MOTION: COMMISSIONER GUDMUNDSON MOTIONED TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. COMMISSIONER JENKINS SECONDED THE MOTION. VICE-CHAIR BRAMWELL, COMMISSIONER GUDMUNDSON, AND COMMISSIONER JENKINS VOTED AYE. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. The Planning Commission had a brief discussion regarding the application.
MOTION: COMMISSIONER GUDMUNDSON MOTIONED TO FORWARD A POSITIVE RECOMMENDATION TO THE CITY COUNCIL. COMMISSIONER JENKINS SECONDED THE MOTION. VICE-CHAIR BRAMWELL, COMMISSIONER GUDMUNDSON, AND COMMISSIONER JENKINS VOTED AYE. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.      COMMISSION MEMBERS’ REPORTS AND EX PARTE DISCUSSIONDISCLOSURE
Mr. Brim explained that we will be holding a future training regarding affordable housing.ADJOURNMENT
Vice-Chair Bramwell adjourned the meeting. CERTIFIED CORRECT ON: July,22 NOTICED BY:/s/CacheHancey                                                                     Cache Hancey, Planner
But we just called in an order version. 00:00:02
Call to order. 00:00:08
The July 6, 2022 Vineyard City Planning Commission meeting. 00:00:10
We'll start with an invocation or inspirational thought. I'm going to give an inspirational thought on the protection of property 00:00:17
right. So in the state of Utah, the legislature created the role of the state property rights on busman. The role of the property 00:00:24
rights on busman is to ensure the protection of property rights of citizens of Utah and provide an intermediary individual that 00:00:30
can ensure cities and municipalities and other entities that. 00:00:37
Oversee and have ordinance control over properties. 00:00:44
Use that that authority appropriately and don't infringe your property rights. So me personally, and I think everybody in here can 00:00:48
say, I mean, that's an important role. Nobody wants to infringe your property rights. And with that role, the property rights 00:00:54
ombudsman citizens have the ability to use a mediation service and arbitration to to essentially negotiate with us and ensure that 00:01:00
that what we do. 00:01:06
Is in line with maintaining their property rights and I think especially here Utah County and in Vineyard we are all for 00:01:13
protecting property rights and also this should be aware that they have. 00:01:18
That free resource from the state. So if you ever feel like you're not getting out of us what we need, and I don't honestly, I 00:01:24
don't think that'll happen. We have a great community development here, but that's a resource that is open and nobody should be 00:01:30
afraid to to use that to help communicate with the city when it comes to ensuring their rights are maintained. Yeah. And I've got 00:01:36
just like a quick thing to add to that when I wasn't talking with Heights, we had. 00:01:42
It was that's a city that gets a ton of short term rentals because of the basic cotton cannon and we had a an ordinance that put a 00:01:49
cap on the number of short term rentals. 00:01:54
However, still allowed through a conditional use permit. And so we had a developer who you know, was upset because it was allowed 00:02:00
through the code, but then there was a cap. So he's like, why would you allow it in your code if it's a use I can't even apply for 00:02:07
because we wouldn't accept applications. He's like then the senior code, however you put a cap on, but you still you shouldn't be 00:02:13
in your code anyway. It was like it was kind of a confusing thing. And so we went to the property. 00:02:19
Rides and Buzzman and you know he actually helped us from going into a lawsuit and and he and it was funny he found kind of a a a 00:02:27
middle ground between between both of us and. 00:02:31
You know, we weren't, you know, thrilled with it, but we were still happy, you know, had said some loved ones. So it was, it was a 00:02:36
good way to to kind of escape going through the long process of a lawsuit and, you know, and it helped us get a better code put in 00:02:42
place ultimately, so. 00:02:47
All right, we'll move on to open session. It's time dedicated for public comment. Are there any comments from the public? 00:02:55
Alright, we'll go ahead and close the open session and we'll move to minutes review and approval. So we're doing June 1st and June 00:03:06
22nd. 00:03:11
Did everyone have a chance to review those minutes? 00:03:20
Yeah, I reviewed the June 1st minutes. I was not here for the June 22nd, but I did catch up with Morgan afterwards and looks too. 00:03:24
Be accurate there. So unless it has any objections, I make a motion that we approve the minutes. 00:03:33
Britain, yes, we're good a second. We have to do a roll call. I on that. All right, All in favour. Aye, aye. 00:03:39
All right, we'll move on to the number four business item, Science standard waiver, Southwest Spine and Pain. 00:03:49
OK, thanks. My name is Brian. I'm Amaya. I'm a planner here in the Community Development department. 00:04:00
This application was originally approved in AIR. It came through with a sign application. And then we noticed that they were 00:04:08
proposing 3 exterior wall signs on the northern elevation and that would typically trigger a science standard waiver. And so we 00:04:14
have to put it back through the pipeline. 00:04:21
And so, yeah, the applicant provided us some amended plans and basically we're going to show them to you and we'll read you kind 00:04:30
of the criteria for what, how you guys could choose to approve those or what conditions you can attach those or you can deny them. 00:04:37
They're proposing a total of 10 exterior wall signs at the Southwest Spine and Pain Building. The address is 691 E 400 N is at the 00:04:44
Yard B. 00:04:51
And it's basically down to. 00:04:59
The zoning code isn't super, super explicit as to like how many can be approved. It's kind of the judgment call of the Planning 00:05:04
Commission would be the ultimate authority on on that. So just let me show you their their plans. So here's the location. 00:05:12
So we got the megaplex here, Yard A, here's the yard B, the southern portion. So there's a distance north of Edgewater Townhome 00:05:21
complex. 00:05:25
And I'm going to go down to the plant site here and zoom out a little bit. 00:05:30
So this was part of the original approval, but. 00:05:43
This we counted AS2 separate signs. 00:05:47
And they have other signs on different elevations. Why is that 2 separate signs? 00:05:51
Because if, if I'm correct, the applicant is here, Olivia with creative signs, it's for two different businesses that are there. 00:05:59
Yeah, sure. Would you like to come out on that specifically? I have a few other notes that I'd like to get there, but you're more 00:06:12
than welcome to. 00:06:15
OK. All right. Awesome. Perfect. Yeah. Thank you. 00:06:20
So the way that they've done this application is that they are showing us all the potential locations for future signs of of the 00:06:25
expected tenants that they'll have at some future point. And so they've been they've outlined those with red boxes and when those 00:06:32
tenants come in then their their wall signs can be approved individually and separately as as those tenants come in. So in total 00:06:39
they are proposing 10. 00:06:46
And like I said, currently on the north elevation, there's to our understanding, there's, there's three. 00:06:55
I'm going to read the criteria for how you guys can judge whether or not these six extra exterior wall signs would be merited or 00:07:02
or would be approved. 00:07:10
So there there's criteria that touch on. 00:07:21
Quality, height, sign area and design features and materials. The two that are most relevant to this application are placement and 00:07:26
quantity. And let's just go through and read each of these. I'll try to be quick. I'll sign shall be placed where they are visible 00:07:33
and legible. Factors should be considered include its location relative to traffic, movement and access points, site features, 00:07:41
other structures, and orientation relative to viewing distances. 00:07:48
Insight Triangles All signs may be approved on building walls other than the wall space occupied by the tenant in commercial 00:07:55
centers in which some tenants have little or no visibility from the street. 00:08:01
And then in terms of quantity, it says the number of signs that may be approved within any development shall be sufficient to 00:08:08
provide necessary facilitation of internal circulation of vehicular and processing traffic and wayfinding for safety of the 00:08:14
occupants of vehicle and pedestrians. Factors to be considered shall be those that impact safety considerations such as the size 00:08:20
of the development and the number of development sub areas. 00:08:26
So in reading the criteria for placement, I think you can make an argument for. 00:08:33
Location and you can make an argument for quantity and in terms of sorry I. 00:08:39
I meant to say an argument for visibility and an argument for legibility. And in terms of quantity I think you can make an 00:08:47
argument for wayfinding and the size of the development because it is a pretty large building where several businesses will will 00:08:52
be held at some point. 00:08:58
And I guess I should also state the code section so the code reads that you can have. 00:09:06
One exterior wall sign per elevation and a total of 4. 00:09:14
Except approved through a signed standard waiver. 00:09:18
So. 00:09:22
Yeah, basically there's pros and cons to approving that amount of exterior wall signs. You will add that visibility and visibility 00:09:25
to the businesses that are there. You increase the awareness. It helps with economic development for the city. 00:09:33
And we want all of our new businesses to succeed and thrive. But the cons are obviously, I think from an aesthetic standpoint 00:09:43
where you can have too many signs on, on one building and it can be cluttered and then reduce the aesthetic of the overall 00:09:49
building of the development and the community as a whole. 00:09:56
We don't have a recommendation per SE other than you guys should weigh the things that I've just mentioned and we have provided 00:10:04
some potential motions basically approval or denial of of that. 00:10:10
So, Olivia, you're welcome to come in the stand and explain the proposal if you'd like. 00:10:18
Brian, will you just go back up to the display of the signs? Yeah, the plan set. 00:10:26
Yeah, just to to give an image of, of what it'll look like or the areas that they're proposing. Yeah. And how many potential 00:10:32
tenants did you say there were in the building? Maybe Olivia can speak to that. Yeah, so sorry, is this going on? Do I need a? 00:10:38
OK. So as far as potential tenants, so just to I'll explain the dynamic first so you can understand where I come into play and the 00:10:47
situation of the tenants. So we are fabricating, installing, permitting all of these signs. We've worked with Vineyard City before 00:10:55
and installed signs and you guys are great to work with and I'm happy to be here today. 00:11:03
As far as accidentally, she's submitted the the application, she's in our permits department, she's. 00:11:12
Good with all that clerical work, really helps us out in that area. But I work directly with Southwest Spine and, you know, with 00:11:19
my clients. 00:11:23
Because when it comes to sign permitting and everything, they don't always have a full understanding and they're not quite as 00:11:29
experienced. So they asked for our help to come in and, you know, see what we can do to help them to, you know, get the most other 00:11:34
science. So as far as the dynamics with the with the tenants. 00:11:40
So Vineyard Surgery Center. 00:11:48
Southwest and Vista, they're all sister companies. So Vineyard Surgery Center is obviously surgery and you know they're related to 00:11:50
Southwest and Vista's, but they don't want to. 00:11:58
You know, direct. 00:12:07
Their patients over to Southwest clinical because it's not where they need to go for surgery and it's also not who the 00:12:11
correspondence is going to be through. So the definition between Southwest. 00:12:19
Surgery Center and SW Clinical and Vineyard Surgery Center is important because of that reason. And Vista Healthcare in Southwest, 00:12:29
they're more of the sister companies. 00:12:35
So. 00:12:43
I will say, so they, they created Vineyard Surgery Center specifically for this location, right? So obviously they know where 00:12:45
they're going. That's more of a wayfinding sign and that's why it is only located on that front elevation. So when they drive up 00:12:51
to the building, these are the patients. When they drive up to the building, they can be like, oh, it's on the left side of the 00:12:58
building. That's where I'm going Southwest and Vista and they're more of the, the sister companies. 00:13:05
And it's it's two different. 00:13:12
I guess notes they have a Vista location down in Spanish work and then they also have Southwest locations elsewhere. So it's 00:13:18
important that both of those locals are on there as well. 00:13:24
I was considering it one sign, but if we want to consider it as two separate logos put together. So if we want to consider it as 2 00:13:32
signs, that's more than OK as far as the dynamic with the tenant to the building Southwest. 00:13:40
Vista Vineyard, Surgery Center, et cetera, they are the majority like renter at that building. They helped the builder come up 00:13:49
with the finances to fund this project. So they're a partial owner of the building as well. 00:13:58
And then there will be two more tenants possibly that may come in and and fill in later. And the reason for obviously the 00:14:08
locations is it was well stated that wayfinding and viewable from those busy streets where traffic will be passing by. 00:14:16
And they also wanted to give their tenants the same opportunity. That made sense, right? Because wayfinding for the front and 00:14:25
then. 00:14:29
You know traffic and viewable space from the other sides. 00:14:35
And I I would like to also clarify that. 00:14:41
There's not like. 00:14:45
Multiple logos on it. So you're not going to see like this done Southwest on the same elevation that Vista and Southwest are on. 00:14:47
So they're kind of spread out. They are where each location is, where each tenant is going to be. And that's kind of the spiel 00:14:54
that doesn't even have any questions. I think that was it. That last point was a good clarification that on the same side, you're 00:15:01
not going to see the same logo or signage in there twice, OK. 00:15:09
OK, yes. 00:15:17
And I know the plans are kind of hard. So the building so wide that we had a hard time getting a good picture from so far back. So 00:15:20
they're kind of they are kind of paneled together. 00:15:24
But it it kind of shows. 00:15:30
One thing I would like to clarify is the southwest on that second drop down set of plans. So the middle set, the middle picture I 00:15:34
guess that's obviously on the South facing side and then right around the corner is that bottom West facing. So since they are 00:15:42
sister companies, they're closer together, but they're just right around from the corner from each other. And that was our attempt 00:15:49
to try to spread things out because we understand. 00:15:57
It is a second thing and we want to make the building work nice. I mean, the tenants want the building to look nice. And I do 00:16:05
believe they're also requesting for their tenants to keep their signs black and white. So all, all of the signs, no matter the 00:16:11
tenant will be black and white and that will help not make it look as cluttered or you know it, it'll still be aesthetically 00:16:17
pleasing. 00:16:23
Olivia, can I interview quick second? Yeah, I just wanted to also point out to the Commission that. 00:16:29
So our our code allows for a 5%. 00:16:37
Of the total. 00:16:42
Building facade to be allowed for signage and in no case there's any side of the building exceed they're allowed 5% so. 00:16:45
The north facing elevation which has the most number of signs. 00:16:57
Has a 3.62%, the South facing 2.3%, the West facing 4% and the east facing 2.25%. So they stayed within. 00:17:02
The allowed size sign area. 00:17:16
I just wanted, I just want to point that out. Oh, sorry. And that's including the future tenants as well. Yeah, I did a 00:17:19
calculation for all the proposed signs. 00:17:23
Is there? 00:17:30
Like a. 00:17:33
For example, a monument sign. 00:17:36
Outside of the building, indicating who is in the building, Yeah, there's not. 00:17:39
Just they don't have a very good location for it. And as I'm sure you could see from like the the site plan, they have their 00:17:45
building and then directly to the South or the West of their building is. 00:17:53
And it's not their land, you know, So the main entrance where people are coming in, they don't have access to. So is there just 00:18:01
the one entrance? 00:18:05
I mean, there's like emergency exits right there is they're all coming from the front one preferred. They're all coming from the 00:18:11
north side. 00:18:15
Right now. 00:18:23
And just to clarify, on the monument sign, there is one on the, it looks like they just got the South, the Science Center waiver 00:18:28
approved at the last Planning Commission, but that's for like the Top Golf development and that's on 400 N And then I'm not sure 00:18:36
what street that is the East, but entering into the development from there, I'm sure that there is a monument sign there. 00:18:44
OK. All right. 00:18:53
I'm trying to think of how I've seen this done. 00:18:58
Hopefully this helps a little bit so this entrance. 00:19:02
Here on the West through the northwest, is that correct, Olivia? And then another entrance on the east side. Yeah, the majority of 00:19:06
their traffic is coming from that N Northwest side, just because, you know, you get a lot of people coming off of I-15 heading 00:19:12
southbound. 00:19:17
And these are all the sign locations for future tenants too. So it's not anticipated to be yes. And then we have also, so it's not 00:19:28
like you're going to approve future tenants and then like they're going to come in and like build these huge signs. We've 00:19:34
restricted their area to those red squares defined in the plans. 00:19:40
I think there's also going to be a building here on this parcel. 00:19:48
That my my conceal further conceal this building, the West side of this building at some point. 00:19:52
And the only sign that's on that West side is on the West South side. 00:20:03
And it's the worst outside in the South side, around those two corners. And those are the sister companies that we tried to kind 00:20:08
of break up a little bit. 00:20:13
So my my opinion on this is I think it makes a lot of sense in this situation. I do think we need to understand that. 00:20:20
If any other building that goes in around this, we'll look at that as normal and probably expect that which, which may be 00:20:27
appropriate. But I, I think it, we just need to understand it like whatever goes in first becomes the expectation or even like the 00:20:34
the minimum. So as long as we understand that and if there's things in the code that I think that we feel like we need to be 00:20:42
clearer on or as we went through this that wasn't that clear. This wouldn't necessarily apply right now for tonight, but I think. 00:20:49
An area that we look at cleaning up, whether it be, you know, making everything uniform like these ones are electing to do, even 00:20:57
though they don't have to necessarily with the black and white. 00:21:01
It's so that all of them match if there are multiple on the same side. So I'm just thinking ahead a little bit about what we could 00:21:08
do as Planning Commission and staff to reduce the amount of questions that might come up with a Gray area. But it I mean, the 00:21:14
whole point of the Science Center waiver is to kind of live in the Gray area too. So I understand that. 00:21:20
But those are my main comments. How do you think that this makes sense? When I first read it and thought like 10 times, that is a 00:21:26
lot for four sided building, but you know, it makes a little more sense here, especially from a wayfinding standpoint. 00:21:32
I think your strongest ground that you can stand on seasoning for that is for future people that want to come in and get more 00:21:39
signs is that we are within your 5% restriction. And that's, that's usually just a good rule, general rule, working with a lot of 00:21:46
cities. That's the thing that we deal with a lot and really helpful to us as well. So then we know we're not going over the top, 00:21:54
but also being able to get the signs needed. Yeah. Oh, the other thing that I think would be important. 00:22:01
Moving forward, they're not proposing this, but I don't think we want to see the same sign twice on. 00:22:09
The same side. 00:22:17
And, you know, thankfully they're not proposing that, but I think that may be something that we would want to explicitly call out 00:22:20
moving forward. At least I think it would look strange to have. So yeah, I mean, I definitely agree with you. A part of the issue 00:22:25
that we run into is the. 00:22:30
10 of Gilbert Oh yeah, you can't restrict the content and you can do the form timing if it flashes, that kind of stuff. But the 00:22:36
content First Amendment, we're limited. 00:22:42
I don't have any concerns. 00:22:53
OK, thanks. Do you have a proposed motion language? 00:22:57
There's a couple in here. Yeah, I'll pull that up, yeah. 00:23:03
There we go. 00:23:13
Yeah. So these are just standard conditions that I have to do with, you know, obeying our local and regional ordinances and then 00:23:22
pay any outstanding fees and things like that. But you guys haven't mentioned any additional conditions to that. So I think these 00:23:28
those motions just work as they're written so. 00:23:34
I'll make a motion. 00:23:41
I move to approve the sign standard waiver application as requested by Ali Taylor with Creative Science with proposed conditions 00:23:43
and. 00:23:46
I'll second that. 00:23:52
All in favor, aye aye. 00:23:54
I'm opposed, sorry. It's fine that it goes through, but I am opposed to, well, not necessarily actually, if you're, if, if you're, 00:23:59
if you're a quorum of only three, all three have to. I don't love how the cluttered feeling it's going to like it's large 00:24:06
building. I live right by it. Like I understand the depth and breadth and that we want people to get to the right places. 00:24:13
And I love that it's all under 5%. 00:24:22
Per per elevation I. 00:24:27
I'm not thrilled that we're taking it from our Max of four to 10. 00:24:32
Umm and I I don't love the precedent that sets for future. 00:24:39
Development. 00:24:45
I feel like it's going to be a bigger fight later with other people. 00:24:47
Who want something? I'm sure they're all going to want to look the best, right? But. 00:24:52
Perhaps they're going to offer something that feels more cluttered and we won't have a leg to stand on for non approving it. 00:24:59
Because we have approved this. Does that make sense? 00:25:06
Now that there wasn't an explicit maximum of four signs called out, is that correct? 00:25:10
No, here I'll read you the code section it says. 00:25:16
Work here. Well, one for elevation. Maximum of four, except as approved through a signed standard waiver, including projecting 00:25:23
signs. 00:25:28
So. 00:25:37
Yeah. And I said the same concerns as far as you know, the precedent set in this situation uniquely I feel feel like it makes 00:25:38
sense. But yeah, I, I share the same concern about right. And I'm always happy to take it case by case, which is why we have the 00:25:45
waiver. And I appreciate the thought and the detail. It all looks really nice. 00:25:51
So your concern is mainly. 00:26:00
Olivia. 00:26:04
So it sounds like your concerns. 00:26:07
Just with the multiple signs and then yeah, cluttered feeling the the precedent that it sets for. 00:26:11
Literally everything that comes through after that makes sense. Yeah, for sure I would. I would like to also. 00:26:21
Not clarify because we know this already, but there is an emphasis, emphasis on the multi tenant building, right. And it's not 00:26:32
just. 00:26:35
If there is. 00:26:41
One sign for every four sides or unless approved by a standard sign waiver. But that's kind of the, the main push here, right, is 00:26:42
that it's for multiple tenants. And I, I, I think that there's understanding in that, especially among the community. And it is a 00:26:50
surgery center and a clinic doctors, you know. 00:26:59
Do want to make their people feel like they're taken care of and they do get. 00:27:08
A lot of of a lot of senior citizens coming to their building, so it's really important. Wayfinding is is their number one 00:27:14
concern, mainly getting off the street and into their parking lot. 00:27:21
And and. 00:27:29
Apply for them. What we'd rather do is just have a sign code that's very functional and and and works that you don't need to get 00:28:01
waivers for every single time. And so yeah, we should be rolling that out in the next month. We'll we'll be probably coming to you 00:28:08
with a in a, in a work session with a new code. And after that code is approved regardless of what happened in the past, 00:28:14
everything moving forward would have to meet that code. OK and according to that. 00:28:21
This in the works where did would this fit in there with this still require a signed standard waiver so you'd be able to limit the 00:28:28
the the the number of of signs. So it it all depends on what the the council wants to do. 00:28:35
So if you want to just do an overall percentage, like not to exceed 10% of a, of a, of a building or an elevation frontage, you 00:28:43
can limit the number you can limit, you know, like the height, the, the, the square footage and those kind of things. 00:28:53
Decided on that 5% per elevation, when was that last year? Yeah, that was in, I think that was around December that we changed it, 00:29:04
yeah. 00:29:09
December, November. I'm trying to remember our full conversation around it. 00:29:16
How many entrances are there to this building? Just the one at the north? 00:29:21
Exit, I mean there's the exit sign and I think that there might be like 2 sub entrances from the sides, but I'm pretty sure the 00:29:27
main one that most people are going to be going to is just that main one on the north side. They can, the way that it flows, they 00:29:34
can exit from those two sides and then there's emergency exits on the back. 00:29:41
But the main entrance is from that front side. 00:29:49
Yeah. Like I don't need us to be like Jamestown and Provo where we have, yeah, an address and that's it. But. 00:29:54
Well, I've worked in Orem, and I mean, we all know how crazy Orem is with their signs, right? And I mean I. 00:30:05
Your town is very beautiful and there's a very good aesthetics and I can respect how you guys, you know, handle your businesses. 00:30:14
I've I've heard all good things and I think that there is also, you know, something to be said. I really like to hear you're 00:30:22
completely right. Vineyard in Utah County is really, I guess you could say, well known for their property rights and. 00:30:30
I think that, I mean personally it's. 00:30:39
It is kind of about the rights of their property right. That's why we apply for variances and that's why we apply for I mean it's 00:30:44
not called variance in your guys's city code. It's called a a permit or a standard sign waiver. But with it being multi tenant. 00:30:52
That's kind of where this property rights comes into play for, for the applicant or for for Southwest sign and their future 00:31:02
tenants as well. My kind of opinion or my opinion is I mean with that area how it's being built up. 00:31:09
I mean, the wayfindings would be critical. You're going to have so many buildings and so much congestion. We don't have them doing 00:31:18
massive signs on the street to show, you know what's in each building. So we don't have that kind of display. So if we have a A4 00:31:24
sided building like this that has architectural elements and it can assure people can see what's in that building, no matter which 00:31:30
direction they're coming from, whether it's the residential area, top golf, movies, whatever, they can see it's there. 00:31:35
I I have no no problem with it, but I do think in the future code you know we could take into account to ensure. 00:31:43
That design concept of for design, 4 sided design, that sizing, brightness of lights, things like that. And then maybe take into 00:31:50
account too if there's street signs or no street signs. Because I can see if there were street signs here, you know, on entrance 00:31:56
saying what's there, then they'd know. And then you just have one sign on the building. But without some of those other signage 00:32:03
the other complexes would have. That's I think does have a little bit of a need. 00:32:09
And I'm sure that SW would be happy to accept a condition like, you know, after 9:00. 00:32:15
The signs go off or something because yeah, there's like a, there's a photo cell that we can program to have them turn off, but. 00:32:22
Yeah. Just trying to get your thoughts, yeah. 00:32:30
OK, Olivia, can I ask a question? 00:32:34
And this might be something you need to think about maybe with your, with your company. Is every sign that you guys have proposed, 00:32:40
is every sign crucial to the success of your, of your businesses and your tenants? Like, is there possibly a loan number that can 00:32:46
be that we can discuss at this moment? Or is that even a conversation that you don't feel ready to have potentially? Well, you 00:32:52
know, I is, is that something that would appease Commissioner Govinson? 00:32:58
Like would that be something that you would consider? 00:33:06
Like I guess reducing bringing, bringing, bringing 10 signs to 8 signs or or some number that both parties could you know? 00:33:11
Discuss. Yeah, I mean. 00:33:24
It's so, so silly too. 00:33:29
Take her over numbers. It's fine. OK, I. 00:33:31
I think aesthetically it would be nice if. 00:33:39
That were just two pro elevation. 00:33:42
But I like how I did that front 1, so that makes a little difficult. 00:33:48
OK. 00:33:54
I'm feeling comfortable with the. 00:33:55
With them all being under 5%. 00:34:00
Elevation and. 00:34:03
That we have something in the works so I don't have future fights on my hands. 00:34:05
Yeah, OK, Sorry. I did like the idea of just in in the future thought if they're facing residential areas, having the lights go 00:34:10
off at night, just something to keep in mind. I don't have any opinion on this, but yeah. 00:34:18
It'd be nice. That could be a condition of approval that you guys are assigned to us. These are like eight to five things, right? 00:34:25
Yeah, yeah. 00:34:31
Yeah, yeah. That's, that's probably something you guys could tack on to this that patient if you'd like. 00:34:38
Since you have a motion, you if you wanted to amend the motion of whoever made the motion, then this person is second it would be 00:34:43
to accept the amendment and then you would you would re vote on that If you added a condition, so the condition you said is during 00:34:51
a time frame they could turn the lights off. Yeah, generally it's I mean summertime it doesn't really get dark until 9:00. So 00:34:58
cities will allow till 10:00 and then just make it the same year round cities. 00:35:05
Differently, some say a certain amount of time after balance or amount of time after desk. But if you know if it's something, what 00:35:13
do you usually like to make? It's usually easier to do that. 00:35:18
Same time, you know, I think with the car washes we talked about not 9:00 PM. So I mean that that would make it kind of consistent 00:35:28
with the car wash and that that's easier for code enforcement if you 9:00 to 7:00. 00:35:36
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:35:45
Kind of found, I mean, with that work, work for you guys, I mean, would you have the ability to to do that? Yeah, yeah. So they're 00:35:47
all installed as photocells. So whatever. 00:35:53
Which make you guys happy is what they do. And you could limit it to the the side facing residential. I mean, you know. 00:36:00
Hannah they they got the other signs on so that would. 00:36:08
Like the most intense glare impacting residential uses would be taken care of. 00:36:11
So an amendment to the motion to require the condition that the signs lights be turned off between the hours of 9:00 PM and 7:00 00:36:18
AM. 00:36:24
And I just say that amend the previous motion. Yeah. And then, and then do you want to, is that limited to just the elevation 00:36:32
facing residential or would that be all the signs? There's just this area facing the residential? Yeah, that's great. And then 00:36:38
whoever seconded would need to accept the motion. Should we just redo the whole thing? You already have a motion in place that 00:36:43
hasn't been so, so that that's still an act of motion. And so, so your your amendment's good. And then who second it was that you 00:36:49
asked and then would you accept it? 00:36:55
So I'll accept that amended motion and then? And then you just revote. OK, So just revote now. Yeah. So a vote then for the 00:37:01
motion. Aye, aye. 00:37:07
Thank you, Olivia. 00:37:17
All right, we're going to move on to business item number 5, public hearing on the Geneva Nitrogen General Plan Land use Map and 00:37:19
Zoning Map Amendment application. 00:37:24
Turn the time over, everybody. 00:37:29
I know. 00:37:36
Yeah. 00:38:04
All right, Planning Commissioners, thank you. So this is in regards to the Geneva nitrogen rezone. This was a city initiated 00:38:14
rezoned and land use amendment. 00:38:19
The general plan, currently the land use map does not have that area designated with the land use category. And so it's a 2 prong 00:38:26
ordinance. It would establish regional commercial as the land use category and then it would establish on top of that for zoning 00:38:32
purposes regional commercial. 00:38:38
Business Park and also FOI, which is the flex office industry. If you can, if you want to pull up the smaller map just to show 00:38:46
them that, I think that would be really helpful. 00:38:51
That's not. 00:38:59
So the, and this would be for the zoning of the concept plans that the Planning Commission saw. We also vetted that through the 00:39:04
City Council initially. 00:39:09
Like the the. 00:39:15
Preliminary concept that we saw had on essentially the whole site being being used for flex office. Why industrial? We weren't 00:39:18
necessarily against that, but what the City Council had mentioned during the RDA approval process for the, you know, clean up this 00:39:25
couple years ago was that they wanted to see things that could provide services and more of a mix of of jobs. You know, retail is 00:39:32
really important to the city because the sales tax and also being so close to the 1600 N. 00:39:39
Intersection that our freeway entrance. 00:39:47
A really great opportunity to put some uses there that that could attract, you know, the sales tax dollars that they're really 00:39:51
needed. You can see here, this is kind of a more of a close up view of how the site would lay out. If you remember, I believe 00:39:58
there were seven buildings shown in the concept plan on the South side where it says RC regional commercial. And then on the north 00:40:05
side, I believe there's one or two retail buildings on the on the RC part. And then the business park had a one medical. 00:40:12
Office building or office building in general? I don't think it was called out specifically from for medical and then. 00:40:20
The flex office industry piece was the larger Flux office building. 00:40:26
That that was shown it could potentially break up to 20 different separate sites or it could be all utilized for one large user or 00:40:32
a combination of both. So as in a certain point out to the RC is a good zoning category here front in Geneva Rd. It's also 00:40:41
connected to the larger RC parcel that's 130 acres and then on the north side on the. 00:40:50
The Geneva Industrial. 00:40:59
Corridor as you go come in off 600 N, it would align with those those regional commercial uses. I think I remember we talked 00:41:02
before there was like 700,000 square feet of existing flex office space up there plus an additional I think there's 180,000 square 00:41:10
feet that are being built right now 1750 N and so this is a you know we have a lot of jobs that are ending up there so. 00:41:18
We, we like the zoning category. We feel like it provides the services and kind of those, those launch uses that that currently 00:41:28
don't exist as it exists up there and will help to kind of fill that. 00:41:33
Or I guess put a put a stop in the retail leakage that we're seeing from our employment base. Anyway, staff is recommending 00:41:40
approval of it and are happy to answer any questions. 00:41:47
I have a question about. 00:41:54
Why in this case is the city initiating and not an applicant? 00:41:58
For a zoning change, right, We were worried about seeing a substantial development that would just be for an industrial type. And 00:42:02
so that's to get ahead of that. And then the applicant did come before us the the property owner at the time, it wasn't the Boyer 00:42:11
company, it was the Geneva Nitrous Incorporated they they submitted. 00:42:19
A a change to regional commercial and the whole thing and withdrew that application as the sales fell through. 00:42:28
So anyway, yeah, it was just the city line to to kind of take, take take the lead on program in this area. We want to make sure we 00:42:36
got, you know, more diverse land uses up there. 00:42:40
And I think Nikolai from the Boyer company may be on Zoom. 00:42:46
Yes, yeah. So if you, if you want to hear from from them, they're purchasing the property. They may have already purchased 00:42:51
probably but he's he's here to speak as well. 00:42:54
Yeah, we're happy to answer any questions that the Council has just on current efforts. 00:43:01
Tenant in strategies or our thoughts about the current proposed zoning? We're excited about the proposed zoning. We're doing a lot 00:43:06
of work right now in terms of tenant attraction and we're getting some good feedback from both the retail community, which is kind 00:43:12
of surprising to us, but we are getting some good feedback on retail and then also we're getting very good feedback on the flex 00:43:17
office. 00:43:23
From from very high quality tenants that we think the city would be excited about. 00:43:30
That helps because the theme of the night has kind of been property rights too. So since the city was initiating it, I definitely 00:43:35
wanted to get the property owners and representatives take on your thoughts on the programming. 00:43:40
Yeah. So we actually, we have previewed the entire kind of rezoning actually. It was interesting. They will be, we won't have a 00:43:47
representative from the property owner if this motion goes to full City Council approval on the 13th. I'll also be in person 00:43:54
there. But we have met with the property owner. I have an e-mail that I can share with you all. They're in full support of the 00:44:00
motion and full support of the proposed zoning categories. 00:44:07
We would have. We were very clear at the property owner basically told him, hey, you better let us know because you need to tell 00:44:15
him to yank it from the agenda if you have any problems. 00:44:19
And they indicated that they are in full support and hopefully they will voice that support on the 13th as well should this motion 00:44:24
pass. 00:44:28
I don't have it. 00:44:35
No, we have a recommended motion if you like to, but I think did you guys open the public hearing? 00:44:39
OK. And as this is an ordinance, when you make a motion, it ought to be by roll call? 00:44:46
So need to propose open to public. 00:44:54
Meeting, public hearing, Hearing. OK, I propose to move to a public hearing. 00:44:57
I'll second that. 00:45:02
All in favor. 00:45:06
OK. Anybody? No. OK, I move. I propose that we close this public hearing. I'll also second that. 00:45:09
All in favor, aye? 00:45:19
I mean if the. 00:45:23
Watch this and the property owners. 2 thumbs up. So I have no problem and I motion to forward a positive recommendation of 00:45:26
Ordinance 2022-12, Geneva Nitrogen Land Use and Zoning Map Amendments to the City Council. And this one's by a roll call. So 00:45:34
you'll just call each person's name as they as they vote. Give me a second still. 00:45:42
And then roll call myself, Chris Bramwell, Hi. 00:45:51
Take Edmondson aye, and Anthony's aye. 00:45:56
Great. Approved, yeah. 00:46:00
All right, Nicolai, so that next week we'll be on with City Council. 00:46:03
Thank you council members, we appreciate it. 00:46:07
All right, we'll move on to work session now. You guys got promoted. I don't know if you know that, Council members. 00:46:14
Do you have to run? 00:46:22
Do we have a work session tonight? 00:46:28
All right, so. 00:46:32
Any training session tonight? 00:46:35
No, not tonight. We are working and getting a training for moderate income and affordable housing in our next meeting or meeting 00:46:37
after. I know it's a topic that Amber has been heading up from the the legislative standpoint in our city. And it's really 00:46:43
important for us. And we're we're trying to work with the the downtown developers and just find any way that from a city 00:46:49
standpoint, we can provide more options and, you know, see if there's resources out there to help us kind of help that, that what 00:46:55
we call missing middle, but also. 00:47:01
Even the lower end, you know, look at the AMI. 00:47:08
Anything even down to like a 30% AMI. I mean, it's, it's important that we provide lots of options with all the employment and 00:47:14
everything going on in the city and probably knows trying to find housing is not is not easy anyway. So that we'll try to get that 00:47:21
set up in next week or the OR next meeting on the meeting after. 00:47:28
Commission, I just want to also say that on the meeting on the 20th, we're going to discuss that Heritage chapter, hopefully a 00:47:38
final time, what will be a final time, and then we can. So if you have a chance to leave those red lines and stuff from before 00:47:43
that, that'd be great. 00:47:48
I just to know I will not be here on the 20. I'll reach out to our alternates. I know there was also discussion for. 00:47:55
Maybe finding some additional alternates. I don't know if that's moved along at all. Yeah, I've, I, I'd let the, I kind of sent 00:48:03
that message to, to to the mayor and we'll, we'll hear back. I, I think she was it's her appointment. So I, I don't know how she 00:48:08
wants wants to she she married the, you know, kind of just handling that herself, but we're we're happy to help out. She asked us 00:48:14
to. 00:48:19
Any other Commission member reports or ex parte discussion news? 00:48:29
The reports from me. 00:48:34
All right. Well, then we'll go ahead and adjourn. Do you have to vote to it? No, you can just adjourn. Yeah. All right, we'll go 00:48:36
ahead and adjourn. 00:48:40
Oh yeah. 00:48:48
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But we just called in an order version. 00:00:02
Call to order. 00:00:08
The July 6, 2022 Vineyard City Planning Commission meeting. 00:00:10
We'll start with an invocation or inspirational thought. I'm going to give an inspirational thought on the protection of property 00:00:17
right. So in the state of Utah, the legislature created the role of the state property rights on busman. The role of the property 00:00:24
rights on busman is to ensure the protection of property rights of citizens of Utah and provide an intermediary individual that 00:00:30
can ensure cities and municipalities and other entities that. 00:00:37
Oversee and have ordinance control over properties. 00:00:44
Use that that authority appropriately and don't infringe your property rights. So me personally, and I think everybody in here can 00:00:48
say, I mean, that's an important role. Nobody wants to infringe your property rights. And with that role, the property rights 00:00:54
ombudsman citizens have the ability to use a mediation service and arbitration to to essentially negotiate with us and ensure that 00:01:00
that what we do. 00:01:06
Is in line with maintaining their property rights and I think especially here Utah County and in Vineyard we are all for 00:01:13
protecting property rights and also this should be aware that they have. 00:01:18
That free resource from the state. So if you ever feel like you're not getting out of us what we need, and I don't honestly, I 00:01:24
don't think that'll happen. We have a great community development here, but that's a resource that is open and nobody should be 00:01:30
afraid to to use that to help communicate with the city when it comes to ensuring their rights are maintained. Yeah. And I've got 00:01:36
just like a quick thing to add to that when I wasn't talking with Heights, we had. 00:01:42
It was that's a city that gets a ton of short term rentals because of the basic cotton cannon and we had a an ordinance that put a 00:01:49
cap on the number of short term rentals. 00:01:54
However, still allowed through a conditional use permit. And so we had a developer who you know, was upset because it was allowed 00:02:00
through the code, but then there was a cap. So he's like, why would you allow it in your code if it's a use I can't even apply for 00:02:07
because we wouldn't accept applications. He's like then the senior code, however you put a cap on, but you still you shouldn't be 00:02:13
in your code anyway. It was like it was kind of a confusing thing. And so we went to the property. 00:02:19
Rides and Buzzman and you know he actually helped us from going into a lawsuit and and he and it was funny he found kind of a a a 00:02:27
middle ground between between both of us and. 00:02:31
You know, we weren't, you know, thrilled with it, but we were still happy, you know, had said some loved ones. So it was, it was a 00:02:36
good way to to kind of escape going through the long process of a lawsuit and, you know, and it helped us get a better code put in 00:02:42
place ultimately, so. 00:02:47
All right, we'll move on to open session. It's time dedicated for public comment. Are there any comments from the public? 00:02:55
Alright, we'll go ahead and close the open session and we'll move to minutes review and approval. So we're doing June 1st and June 00:03:06
22nd. 00:03:11
Did everyone have a chance to review those minutes? 00:03:20
Yeah, I reviewed the June 1st minutes. I was not here for the June 22nd, but I did catch up with Morgan afterwards and looks too. 00:03:24
Be accurate there. So unless it has any objections, I make a motion that we approve the minutes. 00:03:33
Britain, yes, we're good a second. We have to do a roll call. I on that. All right, All in favour. Aye, aye. 00:03:39
All right, we'll move on to the number four business item, Science standard waiver, Southwest Spine and Pain. 00:03:49
OK, thanks. My name is Brian. I'm Amaya. I'm a planner here in the Community Development department. 00:04:00
This application was originally approved in AIR. It came through with a sign application. And then we noticed that they were 00:04:08
proposing 3 exterior wall signs on the northern elevation and that would typically trigger a science standard waiver. And so we 00:04:14
have to put it back through the pipeline. 00:04:21
And so, yeah, the applicant provided us some amended plans and basically we're going to show them to you and we'll read you kind 00:04:30
of the criteria for what, how you guys could choose to approve those or what conditions you can attach those or you can deny them. 00:04:37
They're proposing a total of 10 exterior wall signs at the Southwest Spine and Pain Building. The address is 691 E 400 N is at the 00:04:44
Yard B. 00:04:51
And it's basically down to. 00:04:59
The zoning code isn't super, super explicit as to like how many can be approved. It's kind of the judgment call of the Planning 00:05:04
Commission would be the ultimate authority on on that. So just let me show you their their plans. So here's the location. 00:05:12
So we got the megaplex here, Yard A, here's the yard B, the southern portion. So there's a distance north of Edgewater Townhome 00:05:21
complex. 00:05:25
And I'm going to go down to the plant site here and zoom out a little bit. 00:05:30
So this was part of the original approval, but. 00:05:43
This we counted AS2 separate signs. 00:05:47
And they have other signs on different elevations. Why is that 2 separate signs? 00:05:51
Because if, if I'm correct, the applicant is here, Olivia with creative signs, it's for two different businesses that are there. 00:05:59
Yeah, sure. Would you like to come out on that specifically? I have a few other notes that I'd like to get there, but you're more 00:06:12
than welcome to. 00:06:15
OK. All right. Awesome. Perfect. Yeah. Thank you. 00:06:20
So the way that they've done this application is that they are showing us all the potential locations for future signs of of the 00:06:25
expected tenants that they'll have at some future point. And so they've been they've outlined those with red boxes and when those 00:06:32
tenants come in then their their wall signs can be approved individually and separately as as those tenants come in. So in total 00:06:39
they are proposing 10. 00:06:46
And like I said, currently on the north elevation, there's to our understanding, there's, there's three. 00:06:55
I'm going to read the criteria for how you guys can judge whether or not these six extra exterior wall signs would be merited or 00:07:02
or would be approved. 00:07:10
So there there's criteria that touch on. 00:07:21
Quality, height, sign area and design features and materials. The two that are most relevant to this application are placement and 00:07:26
quantity. And let's just go through and read each of these. I'll try to be quick. I'll sign shall be placed where they are visible 00:07:33
and legible. Factors should be considered include its location relative to traffic, movement and access points, site features, 00:07:41
other structures, and orientation relative to viewing distances. 00:07:48
Insight Triangles All signs may be approved on building walls other than the wall space occupied by the tenant in commercial 00:07:55
centers in which some tenants have little or no visibility from the street. 00:08:01
And then in terms of quantity, it says the number of signs that may be approved within any development shall be sufficient to 00:08:08
provide necessary facilitation of internal circulation of vehicular and processing traffic and wayfinding for safety of the 00:08:14
occupants of vehicle and pedestrians. Factors to be considered shall be those that impact safety considerations such as the size 00:08:20
of the development and the number of development sub areas. 00:08:26
So in reading the criteria for placement, I think you can make an argument for. 00:08:33
Location and you can make an argument for quantity and in terms of sorry I. 00:08:39
I meant to say an argument for visibility and an argument for legibility. And in terms of quantity I think you can make an 00:08:47
argument for wayfinding and the size of the development because it is a pretty large building where several businesses will will 00:08:52
be held at some point. 00:08:58
And I guess I should also state the code section so the code reads that you can have. 00:09:06
One exterior wall sign per elevation and a total of 4. 00:09:14
Except approved through a signed standard waiver. 00:09:18
So. 00:09:22
Yeah, basically there's pros and cons to approving that amount of exterior wall signs. You will add that visibility and visibility 00:09:25
to the businesses that are there. You increase the awareness. It helps with economic development for the city. 00:09:33
And we want all of our new businesses to succeed and thrive. But the cons are obviously, I think from an aesthetic standpoint 00:09:43
where you can have too many signs on, on one building and it can be cluttered and then reduce the aesthetic of the overall 00:09:49
building of the development and the community as a whole. 00:09:56
We don't have a recommendation per SE other than you guys should weigh the things that I've just mentioned and we have provided 00:10:04
some potential motions basically approval or denial of of that. 00:10:10
So, Olivia, you're welcome to come in the stand and explain the proposal if you'd like. 00:10:18
Brian, will you just go back up to the display of the signs? Yeah, the plan set. 00:10:26
Yeah, just to to give an image of, of what it'll look like or the areas that they're proposing. Yeah. And how many potential 00:10:32
tenants did you say there were in the building? Maybe Olivia can speak to that. Yeah, so sorry, is this going on? Do I need a? 00:10:38
OK. So as far as potential tenants, so just to I'll explain the dynamic first so you can understand where I come into play and the 00:10:47
situation of the tenants. So we are fabricating, installing, permitting all of these signs. We've worked with Vineyard City before 00:10:55
and installed signs and you guys are great to work with and I'm happy to be here today. 00:11:03
As far as accidentally, she's submitted the the application, she's in our permits department, she's. 00:11:12
Good with all that clerical work, really helps us out in that area. But I work directly with Southwest Spine and, you know, with 00:11:19
my clients. 00:11:23
Because when it comes to sign permitting and everything, they don't always have a full understanding and they're not quite as 00:11:29
experienced. So they asked for our help to come in and, you know, see what we can do to help them to, you know, get the most other 00:11:34
science. So as far as the dynamics with the with the tenants. 00:11:40
So Vineyard Surgery Center. 00:11:48
Southwest and Vista, they're all sister companies. So Vineyard Surgery Center is obviously surgery and you know they're related to 00:11:50
Southwest and Vista's, but they don't want to. 00:11:58
You know, direct. 00:12:07
Their patients over to Southwest clinical because it's not where they need to go for surgery and it's also not who the 00:12:11
correspondence is going to be through. So the definition between Southwest. 00:12:19
Surgery Center and SW Clinical and Vineyard Surgery Center is important because of that reason. And Vista Healthcare in Southwest, 00:12:29
they're more of the sister companies. 00:12:35
So. 00:12:43
I will say, so they, they created Vineyard Surgery Center specifically for this location, right? So obviously they know where 00:12:45
they're going. That's more of a wayfinding sign and that's why it is only located on that front elevation. So when they drive up 00:12:51
to the building, these are the patients. When they drive up to the building, they can be like, oh, it's on the left side of the 00:12:58
building. That's where I'm going Southwest and Vista and they're more of the, the sister companies. 00:13:05
And it's it's two different. 00:13:12
I guess notes they have a Vista location down in Spanish work and then they also have Southwest locations elsewhere. So it's 00:13:18
important that both of those locals are on there as well. 00:13:24
I was considering it one sign, but if we want to consider it as two separate logos put together. So if we want to consider it as 2 00:13:32
signs, that's more than OK as far as the dynamic with the tenant to the building Southwest. 00:13:40
Vista Vineyard, Surgery Center, et cetera, they are the majority like renter at that building. They helped the builder come up 00:13:49
with the finances to fund this project. So they're a partial owner of the building as well. 00:13:58
And then there will be two more tenants possibly that may come in and and fill in later. And the reason for obviously the 00:14:08
locations is it was well stated that wayfinding and viewable from those busy streets where traffic will be passing by. 00:14:16
And they also wanted to give their tenants the same opportunity. That made sense, right? Because wayfinding for the front and 00:14:25
then. 00:14:29
You know traffic and viewable space from the other sides. 00:14:35
And I I would like to also clarify that. 00:14:41
There's not like. 00:14:45
Multiple logos on it. So you're not going to see like this done Southwest on the same elevation that Vista and Southwest are on. 00:14:47
So they're kind of spread out. They are where each location is, where each tenant is going to be. And that's kind of the spiel 00:14:54
that doesn't even have any questions. I think that was it. That last point was a good clarification that on the same side, you're 00:15:01
not going to see the same logo or signage in there twice, OK. 00:15:09
OK, yes. 00:15:17
And I know the plans are kind of hard. So the building so wide that we had a hard time getting a good picture from so far back. So 00:15:20
they're kind of they are kind of paneled together. 00:15:24
But it it kind of shows. 00:15:30
One thing I would like to clarify is the southwest on that second drop down set of plans. So the middle set, the middle picture I 00:15:34
guess that's obviously on the South facing side and then right around the corner is that bottom West facing. So since they are 00:15:42
sister companies, they're closer together, but they're just right around from the corner from each other. And that was our attempt 00:15:49
to try to spread things out because we understand. 00:15:57
It is a second thing and we want to make the building work nice. I mean, the tenants want the building to look nice. And I do 00:16:05
believe they're also requesting for their tenants to keep their signs black and white. So all, all of the signs, no matter the 00:16:11
tenant will be black and white and that will help not make it look as cluttered or you know it, it'll still be aesthetically 00:16:17
pleasing. 00:16:23
Olivia, can I interview quick second? Yeah, I just wanted to also point out to the Commission that. 00:16:29
So our our code allows for a 5%. 00:16:37
Of the total. 00:16:42
Building facade to be allowed for signage and in no case there's any side of the building exceed they're allowed 5% so. 00:16:45
The north facing elevation which has the most number of signs. 00:16:57
Has a 3.62%, the South facing 2.3%, the West facing 4% and the east facing 2.25%. So they stayed within. 00:17:02
The allowed size sign area. 00:17:16
I just wanted, I just want to point that out. Oh, sorry. And that's including the future tenants as well. Yeah, I did a 00:17:19
calculation for all the proposed signs. 00:17:23
Is there? 00:17:30
Like a. 00:17:33
For example, a monument sign. 00:17:36
Outside of the building, indicating who is in the building, Yeah, there's not. 00:17:39
Just they don't have a very good location for it. And as I'm sure you could see from like the the site plan, they have their 00:17:45
building and then directly to the South or the West of their building is. 00:17:53
And it's not their land, you know, So the main entrance where people are coming in, they don't have access to. So is there just 00:18:01
the one entrance? 00:18:05
I mean, there's like emergency exits right there is they're all coming from the front one preferred. They're all coming from the 00:18:11
north side. 00:18:15
Right now. 00:18:23
And just to clarify, on the monument sign, there is one on the, it looks like they just got the South, the Science Center waiver 00:18:28
approved at the last Planning Commission, but that's for like the Top Golf development and that's on 400 N And then I'm not sure 00:18:36
what street that is the East, but entering into the development from there, I'm sure that there is a monument sign there. 00:18:44
OK. All right. 00:18:53
I'm trying to think of how I've seen this done. 00:18:58
Hopefully this helps a little bit so this entrance. 00:19:02
Here on the West through the northwest, is that correct, Olivia? And then another entrance on the east side. Yeah, the majority of 00:19:06
their traffic is coming from that N Northwest side, just because, you know, you get a lot of people coming off of I-15 heading 00:19:12
southbound. 00:19:17
And these are all the sign locations for future tenants too. So it's not anticipated to be yes. And then we have also, so it's not 00:19:28
like you're going to approve future tenants and then like they're going to come in and like build these huge signs. We've 00:19:34
restricted their area to those red squares defined in the plans. 00:19:40
I think there's also going to be a building here on this parcel. 00:19:48
That my my conceal further conceal this building, the West side of this building at some point. 00:19:52
And the only sign that's on that West side is on the West South side. 00:20:03
And it's the worst outside in the South side, around those two corners. And those are the sister companies that we tried to kind 00:20:08
of break up a little bit. 00:20:13
So my my opinion on this is I think it makes a lot of sense in this situation. I do think we need to understand that. 00:20:20
If any other building that goes in around this, we'll look at that as normal and probably expect that which, which may be 00:20:27
appropriate. But I, I think it, we just need to understand it like whatever goes in first becomes the expectation or even like the 00:20:34
the minimum. So as long as we understand that and if there's things in the code that I think that we feel like we need to be 00:20:42
clearer on or as we went through this that wasn't that clear. This wouldn't necessarily apply right now for tonight, but I think. 00:20:49
An area that we look at cleaning up, whether it be, you know, making everything uniform like these ones are electing to do, even 00:20:57
though they don't have to necessarily with the black and white. 00:21:01
It's so that all of them match if there are multiple on the same side. So I'm just thinking ahead a little bit about what we could 00:21:08
do as Planning Commission and staff to reduce the amount of questions that might come up with a Gray area. But it I mean, the 00:21:14
whole point of the Science Center waiver is to kind of live in the Gray area too. So I understand that. 00:21:20
But those are my main comments. How do you think that this makes sense? When I first read it and thought like 10 times, that is a 00:21:26
lot for four sided building, but you know, it makes a little more sense here, especially from a wayfinding standpoint. 00:21:32
I think your strongest ground that you can stand on seasoning for that is for future people that want to come in and get more 00:21:39
signs is that we are within your 5% restriction. And that's, that's usually just a good rule, general rule, working with a lot of 00:21:46
cities. That's the thing that we deal with a lot and really helpful to us as well. So then we know we're not going over the top, 00:21:54
but also being able to get the signs needed. Yeah. Oh, the other thing that I think would be important. 00:22:01
Moving forward, they're not proposing this, but I don't think we want to see the same sign twice on. 00:22:09
The same side. 00:22:17
And, you know, thankfully they're not proposing that, but I think that may be something that we would want to explicitly call out 00:22:20
moving forward. At least I think it would look strange to have. So yeah, I mean, I definitely agree with you. A part of the issue 00:22:25
that we run into is the. 00:22:30
10 of Gilbert Oh yeah, you can't restrict the content and you can do the form timing if it flashes, that kind of stuff. But the 00:22:36
content First Amendment, we're limited. 00:22:42
I don't have any concerns. 00:22:53
OK, thanks. Do you have a proposed motion language? 00:22:57
There's a couple in here. Yeah, I'll pull that up, yeah. 00:23:03
There we go. 00:23:13
Yeah. So these are just standard conditions that I have to do with, you know, obeying our local and regional ordinances and then 00:23:22
pay any outstanding fees and things like that. But you guys haven't mentioned any additional conditions to that. So I think these 00:23:28
those motions just work as they're written so. 00:23:34
I'll make a motion. 00:23:41
I move to approve the sign standard waiver application as requested by Ali Taylor with Creative Science with proposed conditions 00:23:43
and. 00:23:46
I'll second that. 00:23:52
All in favor, aye aye. 00:23:54
I'm opposed, sorry. It's fine that it goes through, but I am opposed to, well, not necessarily actually, if you're, if, if you're, 00:23:59
if you're a quorum of only three, all three have to. I don't love how the cluttered feeling it's going to like it's large 00:24:06
building. I live right by it. Like I understand the depth and breadth and that we want people to get to the right places. 00:24:13
And I love that it's all under 5%. 00:24:22
Per per elevation I. 00:24:27
I'm not thrilled that we're taking it from our Max of four to 10. 00:24:32
Umm and I I don't love the precedent that sets for future. 00:24:39
Development. 00:24:45
I feel like it's going to be a bigger fight later with other people. 00:24:47
Who want something? I'm sure they're all going to want to look the best, right? But. 00:24:52
Perhaps they're going to offer something that feels more cluttered and we won't have a leg to stand on for non approving it. 00:24:59
Because we have approved this. Does that make sense? 00:25:06
Now that there wasn't an explicit maximum of four signs called out, is that correct? 00:25:10
No, here I'll read you the code section it says. 00:25:16
Work here. Well, one for elevation. Maximum of four, except as approved through a signed standard waiver, including projecting 00:25:23
signs. 00:25:28
So. 00:25:37
Yeah. And I said the same concerns as far as you know, the precedent set in this situation uniquely I feel feel like it makes 00:25:38
sense. But yeah, I, I share the same concern about right. And I'm always happy to take it case by case, which is why we have the 00:25:45
waiver. And I appreciate the thought and the detail. It all looks really nice. 00:25:51
So your concern is mainly. 00:26:00
Olivia. 00:26:04
So it sounds like your concerns. 00:26:07
Just with the multiple signs and then yeah, cluttered feeling the the precedent that it sets for. 00:26:11
Literally everything that comes through after that makes sense. Yeah, for sure I would. I would like to also. 00:26:21
Not clarify because we know this already, but there is an emphasis, emphasis on the multi tenant building, right. And it's not 00:26:32
just. 00:26:35
If there is. 00:26:41
One sign for every four sides or unless approved by a standard sign waiver. But that's kind of the, the main push here, right, is 00:26:42
that it's for multiple tenants. And I, I, I think that there's understanding in that, especially among the community. And it is a 00:26:50
surgery center and a clinic doctors, you know. 00:26:59
Do want to make their people feel like they're taken care of and they do get. 00:27:08
A lot of of a lot of senior citizens coming to their building, so it's really important. Wayfinding is is their number one 00:27:14
concern, mainly getting off the street and into their parking lot. 00:27:21
And and. 00:27:29
Apply for them. What we'd rather do is just have a sign code that's very functional and and and works that you don't need to get 00:28:01
waivers for every single time. And so yeah, we should be rolling that out in the next month. We'll we'll be probably coming to you 00:28:08
with a in a, in a work session with a new code. And after that code is approved regardless of what happened in the past, 00:28:14
everything moving forward would have to meet that code. OK and according to that. 00:28:21
This in the works where did would this fit in there with this still require a signed standard waiver so you'd be able to limit the 00:28:28
the the the number of of signs. So it it all depends on what the the council wants to do. 00:28:35
So if you want to just do an overall percentage, like not to exceed 10% of a, of a, of a building or an elevation frontage, you 00:28:43
can limit the number you can limit, you know, like the height, the, the, the square footage and those kind of things. 00:28:53
Decided on that 5% per elevation, when was that last year? Yeah, that was in, I think that was around December that we changed it, 00:29:04
yeah. 00:29:09
December, November. I'm trying to remember our full conversation around it. 00:29:16
How many entrances are there to this building? Just the one at the north? 00:29:21
Exit, I mean there's the exit sign and I think that there might be like 2 sub entrances from the sides, but I'm pretty sure the 00:29:27
main one that most people are going to be going to is just that main one on the north side. They can, the way that it flows, they 00:29:34
can exit from those two sides and then there's emergency exits on the back. 00:29:41
But the main entrance is from that front side. 00:29:49
Yeah. Like I don't need us to be like Jamestown and Provo where we have, yeah, an address and that's it. But. 00:29:54
Well, I've worked in Orem, and I mean, we all know how crazy Orem is with their signs, right? And I mean I. 00:30:05
Your town is very beautiful and there's a very good aesthetics and I can respect how you guys, you know, handle your businesses. 00:30:14
I've I've heard all good things and I think that there is also, you know, something to be said. I really like to hear you're 00:30:22
completely right. Vineyard in Utah County is really, I guess you could say, well known for their property rights and. 00:30:30
I think that, I mean personally it's. 00:30:39
It is kind of about the rights of their property right. That's why we apply for variances and that's why we apply for I mean it's 00:30:44
not called variance in your guys's city code. It's called a a permit or a standard sign waiver. But with it being multi tenant. 00:30:52
That's kind of where this property rights comes into play for, for the applicant or for for Southwest sign and their future 00:31:02
tenants as well. My kind of opinion or my opinion is I mean with that area how it's being built up. 00:31:09
I mean, the wayfindings would be critical. You're going to have so many buildings and so much congestion. We don't have them doing 00:31:18
massive signs on the street to show, you know what's in each building. So we don't have that kind of display. So if we have a A4 00:31:24
sided building like this that has architectural elements and it can assure people can see what's in that building, no matter which 00:31:30
direction they're coming from, whether it's the residential area, top golf, movies, whatever, they can see it's there. 00:31:35
I I have no no problem with it, but I do think in the future code you know we could take into account to ensure. 00:31:43
That design concept of for design, 4 sided design, that sizing, brightness of lights, things like that. And then maybe take into 00:31:50
account too if there's street signs or no street signs. Because I can see if there were street signs here, you know, on entrance 00:31:56
saying what's there, then they'd know. And then you just have one sign on the building. But without some of those other signage 00:32:03
the other complexes would have. That's I think does have a little bit of a need. 00:32:09
And I'm sure that SW would be happy to accept a condition like, you know, after 9:00. 00:32:15
The signs go off or something because yeah, there's like a, there's a photo cell that we can program to have them turn off, but. 00:32:22
Yeah. Just trying to get your thoughts, yeah. 00:32:30
OK, Olivia, can I ask a question? 00:32:34
And this might be something you need to think about maybe with your, with your company. Is every sign that you guys have proposed, 00:32:40
is every sign crucial to the success of your, of your businesses and your tenants? Like, is there possibly a loan number that can 00:32:46
be that we can discuss at this moment? Or is that even a conversation that you don't feel ready to have potentially? Well, you 00:32:52
know, I is, is that something that would appease Commissioner Govinson? 00:32:58
Like would that be something that you would consider? 00:33:06
Like I guess reducing bringing, bringing, bringing 10 signs to 8 signs or or some number that both parties could you know? 00:33:11
Discuss. Yeah, I mean. 00:33:24
It's so, so silly too. 00:33:29
Take her over numbers. It's fine. OK, I. 00:33:31
I think aesthetically it would be nice if. 00:33:39
That were just two pro elevation. 00:33:42
But I like how I did that front 1, so that makes a little difficult. 00:33:48
OK. 00:33:54
I'm feeling comfortable with the. 00:33:55
With them all being under 5%. 00:34:00
Elevation and. 00:34:03
That we have something in the works so I don't have future fights on my hands. 00:34:05
Yeah, OK, Sorry. I did like the idea of just in in the future thought if they're facing residential areas, having the lights go 00:34:10
off at night, just something to keep in mind. I don't have any opinion on this, but yeah. 00:34:18
It'd be nice. That could be a condition of approval that you guys are assigned to us. These are like eight to five things, right? 00:34:25
Yeah, yeah. 00:34:31
Yeah, yeah. That's, that's probably something you guys could tack on to this that patient if you'd like. 00:34:38
Since you have a motion, you if you wanted to amend the motion of whoever made the motion, then this person is second it would be 00:34:43
to accept the amendment and then you would you would re vote on that If you added a condition, so the condition you said is during 00:34:51
a time frame they could turn the lights off. Yeah, generally it's I mean summertime it doesn't really get dark until 9:00. So 00:34:58
cities will allow till 10:00 and then just make it the same year round cities. 00:35:05
Differently, some say a certain amount of time after balance or amount of time after desk. But if you know if it's something, what 00:35:13
do you usually like to make? It's usually easier to do that. 00:35:18
Same time, you know, I think with the car washes we talked about not 9:00 PM. So I mean that that would make it kind of consistent 00:35:28
with the car wash and that that's easier for code enforcement if you 9:00 to 7:00. 00:35:36
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:35:45
Kind of found, I mean, with that work, work for you guys, I mean, would you have the ability to to do that? Yeah, yeah. So they're 00:35:47
all installed as photocells. So whatever. 00:35:53
Which make you guys happy is what they do. And you could limit it to the the side facing residential. I mean, you know. 00:36:00
Hannah they they got the other signs on so that would. 00:36:08
Like the most intense glare impacting residential uses would be taken care of. 00:36:11
So an amendment to the motion to require the condition that the signs lights be turned off between the hours of 9:00 PM and 7:00 00:36:18
AM. 00:36:24
And I just say that amend the previous motion. Yeah. And then, and then do you want to, is that limited to just the elevation 00:36:32
facing residential or would that be all the signs? There's just this area facing the residential? Yeah, that's great. And then 00:36:38
whoever seconded would need to accept the motion. Should we just redo the whole thing? You already have a motion in place that 00:36:43
hasn't been so, so that that's still an act of motion. And so, so your your amendment's good. And then who second it was that you 00:36:49
asked and then would you accept it? 00:36:55
So I'll accept that amended motion and then? And then you just revote. OK, So just revote now. Yeah. So a vote then for the 00:37:01
motion. Aye, aye. 00:37:07
Thank you, Olivia. 00:37:17
All right, we're going to move on to business item number 5, public hearing on the Geneva Nitrogen General Plan Land use Map and 00:37:19
Zoning Map Amendment application. 00:37:24
Turn the time over, everybody. 00:37:29
I know. 00:37:36
Yeah. 00:38:04
All right, Planning Commissioners, thank you. So this is in regards to the Geneva nitrogen rezone. This was a city initiated 00:38:14
rezoned and land use amendment. 00:38:19
The general plan, currently the land use map does not have that area designated with the land use category. And so it's a 2 prong 00:38:26
ordinance. It would establish regional commercial as the land use category and then it would establish on top of that for zoning 00:38:32
purposes regional commercial. 00:38:38
Business Park and also FOI, which is the flex office industry. If you can, if you want to pull up the smaller map just to show 00:38:46
them that, I think that would be really helpful. 00:38:51
That's not. 00:38:59
So the, and this would be for the zoning of the concept plans that the Planning Commission saw. We also vetted that through the 00:39:04
City Council initially. 00:39:09
Like the the. 00:39:15
Preliminary concept that we saw had on essentially the whole site being being used for flex office. Why industrial? We weren't 00:39:18
necessarily against that, but what the City Council had mentioned during the RDA approval process for the, you know, clean up this 00:39:25
couple years ago was that they wanted to see things that could provide services and more of a mix of of jobs. You know, retail is 00:39:32
really important to the city because the sales tax and also being so close to the 1600 N. 00:39:39
Intersection that our freeway entrance. 00:39:47
A really great opportunity to put some uses there that that could attract, you know, the sales tax dollars that they're really 00:39:51
needed. You can see here, this is kind of a more of a close up view of how the site would lay out. If you remember, I believe 00:39:58
there were seven buildings shown in the concept plan on the South side where it says RC regional commercial. And then on the north 00:40:05
side, I believe there's one or two retail buildings on the on the RC part. And then the business park had a one medical. 00:40:12
Office building or office building in general? I don't think it was called out specifically from for medical and then. 00:40:20
The flex office industry piece was the larger Flux office building. 00:40:26
That that was shown it could potentially break up to 20 different separate sites or it could be all utilized for one large user or 00:40:32
a combination of both. So as in a certain point out to the RC is a good zoning category here front in Geneva Rd. It's also 00:40:41
connected to the larger RC parcel that's 130 acres and then on the north side on the. 00:40:50
The Geneva Industrial. 00:40:59
Corridor as you go come in off 600 N, it would align with those those regional commercial uses. I think I remember we talked 00:41:02
before there was like 700,000 square feet of existing flex office space up there plus an additional I think there's 180,000 square 00:41:10
feet that are being built right now 1750 N and so this is a you know we have a lot of jobs that are ending up there so. 00:41:18
We, we like the zoning category. We feel like it provides the services and kind of those, those launch uses that that currently 00:41:28
don't exist as it exists up there and will help to kind of fill that. 00:41:33
Or I guess put a put a stop in the retail leakage that we're seeing from our employment base. Anyway, staff is recommending 00:41:40
approval of it and are happy to answer any questions. 00:41:47
I have a question about. 00:41:54
Why in this case is the city initiating and not an applicant? 00:41:58
For a zoning change, right, We were worried about seeing a substantial development that would just be for an industrial type. And 00:42:02
so that's to get ahead of that. And then the applicant did come before us the the property owner at the time, it wasn't the Boyer 00:42:11
company, it was the Geneva Nitrous Incorporated they they submitted. 00:42:19
A a change to regional commercial and the whole thing and withdrew that application as the sales fell through. 00:42:28
So anyway, yeah, it was just the city line to to kind of take, take take the lead on program in this area. We want to make sure we 00:42:36
got, you know, more diverse land uses up there. 00:42:40
And I think Nikolai from the Boyer company may be on Zoom. 00:42:46
Yes, yeah. So if you, if you want to hear from from them, they're purchasing the property. They may have already purchased 00:42:51
probably but he's he's here to speak as well. 00:42:54
Yeah, we're happy to answer any questions that the Council has just on current efforts. 00:43:01
Tenant in strategies or our thoughts about the current proposed zoning? We're excited about the proposed zoning. We're doing a lot 00:43:06
of work right now in terms of tenant attraction and we're getting some good feedback from both the retail community, which is kind 00:43:12
of surprising to us, but we are getting some good feedback on retail and then also we're getting very good feedback on the flex 00:43:17
office. 00:43:23
From from very high quality tenants that we think the city would be excited about. 00:43:30
That helps because the theme of the night has kind of been property rights too. So since the city was initiating it, I definitely 00:43:35
wanted to get the property owners and representatives take on your thoughts on the programming. 00:43:40
Yeah. So we actually, we have previewed the entire kind of rezoning actually. It was interesting. They will be, we won't have a 00:43:47
representative from the property owner if this motion goes to full City Council approval on the 13th. I'll also be in person 00:43:54
there. But we have met with the property owner. I have an e-mail that I can share with you all. They're in full support of the 00:44:00
motion and full support of the proposed zoning categories. 00:44:07
We would have. We were very clear at the property owner basically told him, hey, you better let us know because you need to tell 00:44:15
him to yank it from the agenda if you have any problems. 00:44:19
And they indicated that they are in full support and hopefully they will voice that support on the 13th as well should this motion 00:44:24
pass. 00:44:28
I don't have it. 00:44:35
No, we have a recommended motion if you like to, but I think did you guys open the public hearing? 00:44:39
OK. And as this is an ordinance, when you make a motion, it ought to be by roll call? 00:44:46
So need to propose open to public. 00:44:54
Meeting, public hearing, Hearing. OK, I propose to move to a public hearing. 00:44:57
I'll second that. 00:45:02
All in favor. 00:45:06
OK. Anybody? No. OK, I move. I propose that we close this public hearing. I'll also second that. 00:45:09
All in favor, aye? 00:45:19
I mean if the. 00:45:23
Watch this and the property owners. 2 thumbs up. So I have no problem and I motion to forward a positive recommendation of 00:45:26
Ordinance 2022-12, Geneva Nitrogen Land Use and Zoning Map Amendments to the City Council. And this one's by a roll call. So 00:45:34
you'll just call each person's name as they as they vote. Give me a second still. 00:45:42
And then roll call myself, Chris Bramwell, Hi. 00:45:51
Take Edmondson aye, and Anthony's aye. 00:45:56
Great. Approved, yeah. 00:46:00
All right, Nicolai, so that next week we'll be on with City Council. 00:46:03
Thank you council members, we appreciate it. 00:46:07
All right, we'll move on to work session now. You guys got promoted. I don't know if you know that, Council members. 00:46:14
Do you have to run? 00:46:22
Do we have a work session tonight? 00:46:28
All right, so. 00:46:32
Any training session tonight? 00:46:35
No, not tonight. We are working and getting a training for moderate income and affordable housing in our next meeting or meeting 00:46:37
after. I know it's a topic that Amber has been heading up from the the legislative standpoint in our city. And it's really 00:46:43
important for us. And we're we're trying to work with the the downtown developers and just find any way that from a city 00:46:49
standpoint, we can provide more options and, you know, see if there's resources out there to help us kind of help that, that what 00:46:55
we call missing middle, but also. 00:47:01
Even the lower end, you know, look at the AMI. 00:47:08
Anything even down to like a 30% AMI. I mean, it's, it's important that we provide lots of options with all the employment and 00:47:14
everything going on in the city and probably knows trying to find housing is not is not easy anyway. So that we'll try to get that 00:47:21
set up in next week or the OR next meeting on the meeting after. 00:47:28
Commission, I just want to also say that on the meeting on the 20th, we're going to discuss that Heritage chapter, hopefully a 00:47:38
final time, what will be a final time, and then we can. So if you have a chance to leave those red lines and stuff from before 00:47:43
that, that'd be great. 00:47:48
I just to know I will not be here on the 20. I'll reach out to our alternates. I know there was also discussion for. 00:47:55
Maybe finding some additional alternates. I don't know if that's moved along at all. Yeah, I've, I, I'd let the, I kind of sent 00:48:03
that message to, to to the mayor and we'll, we'll hear back. I, I think she was it's her appointment. So I, I don't know how she 00:48:08
wants wants to she she married the, you know, kind of just handling that herself, but we're we're happy to help out. She asked us 00:48:14
to. 00:48:19
Any other Commission member reports or ex parte discussion news? 00:48:29
The reports from me. 00:48:34
All right. Well, then we'll go ahead and adjourn. Do you have to vote to it? No, you can just adjourn. Yeah. All right, we'll go 00:48:36
ahead and adjourn. 00:48:40
Oh yeah. 00:48:48
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