Start Position
CALL TO ORDER Chair Knighton called the meeting to order.
INVOCATION/INSPIRATIONAL THOUGHTS/PLEDGE OFALLEGIANCE Commissioner Jenkins led the meeting in the Pledge of Allegiance.
OPEN SESSION No comments were made by the public.                    MINUTES REVIEW ANDAPPROVALNo minutes were presented for approval.                    BUSINESSITEMS1
Discussion and Action- Lakeside Trail PocketPark Public Works Director Chris Wilson presented the plans for a pocket park located along the Vineyard Lakefront Trail.
Resident David Lauret asked a question regarding the size of the pocket park.
MOTION: COMMISSIONER JENKINS MOTIONED TO APPROVE STAFF TO PROCEED WITH THE DESIGN OF THE LAKESIDE TRAIL POCKET PARK WITH THE CONDITIONS TO INCLUDE DECOMPOSED GRANITE, A DOG WASTE STATION, WAYFINDING SIGNS, HERITAGE ELEMENTS, AND MORE BENCHES IF FUNDING IS POSSIBLE. COMMISSIONER BLACKBURN SECONDED THE MOTION. ROLL WENT AS FOLLOWS: CHAIR KNIGHTON, VICE-CHAIR BRADY, COMMISSIONER JENKINS, COMMISSIONER BLACKBURN, AND COMMISSIONER BRAMWELL VOTED AYE. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. 2
Discussion and Action- PumpStation Mr. Wilson presented a staff report for the construction and design plans for the city water tank, booster station, and public works yard.   MOTION: VICE-CHAIR BRADY MOTIONED TO APPROVE THE PUMP STATION PLANS AS PRESENTED IN THE STAFF REPORT WITH THE CONDITION THAT THE CONCRETE FORM LINERS ARE REMOVED. COMMISSIONER BRAMWELL SECONDED THE MOTION. The Planning Commission had a brief discussion regarding the concrete form liners to better understand their purpose.   MOTION CONTINUED WITH A VOTE: ROLL WENT AS FOLLOWS: CHAIR KNIGHTON, VICE-CHAIR BRADY, COMMISSIONER JENKINS, COMMISSIONER BLACKBURN, AND COMMISSIONER BRAMWELL VOTED AYE. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.                       WORKSESSION1    General Plan Review- Heritage and CulturalResources Planner II Briam Amaya presented the plan to update the Heritage and Cultural Resources section of the General Plan.                     COMMISSION MEMBERS’ REPORTS AND EX PARTE DISCUSSIONDISCLOSURE                    ADJOURNMENT The meeting was adjourned.   CERTIFIED CORRECT ON: June,22 CERTIFED BY:/s/CacheHancey Cache Hancey, PlanningTechnician
We're ready, cash. OK. 00:00:02
All right. Then I will call to order our Vineyard Planning Commission meeting. 00:00:07
Although I did not ask somebody to give us an invocation or inspirational thought or Pledge of Allegiance. 00:00:14
Anthony, would you? 00:00:20
Like to do one of those 3? Sure. 00:00:23
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America. 00:00:28
And to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. 00:00:33
I know I got that. 00:00:45
Thank you. All right. So we'll open up the the open session part of the agenda, this time dedicated for public comments, if 00:00:47
there's anybody in the public that has a public comment that they'd like to share on something that's not already on the agenda. 00:00:56
Feel free to stand and. 00:01:06
Make a comment. 00:01:09
OK. 00:01:12
Minutes, review and approval. 00:01:14
Did we have any minutes to approve? I don't see any on here that's anything. OK, then let's go right on to our business items, 00:01:19
Item 4.1, discussion and action on the Lakefront Trail pocket park. 00:01:24
Chris Wilson, Public Works director, Thank you, Planning Commission. 00:01:34
So. 00:01:40
This Wednesday we had taken this concept to City Council to get some feedback and approval and also wanted to bring it through 00:01:42
through this public meeting for approvals as well. 00:01:48
I don't know if cash are we able to share? 00:01:56
I'll plug in now. I just didn't know if you're going to share the agenda. 00:02:00
You might need to come to this desk. I'm having a hard time switching to HDMI. Is that possible? 00:02:30
There we go. There we go. 00:03:28
Sorry about that delay. 00:03:30
So just some background on this project. You can see an overall map here where this is located. 00:03:33
This. 00:03:40
Sits at the junction between the Shores subdivision and the James Bay subdivision. There was a small remnant of city and state 00:03:43
lands located in this little triangle when the trail was extended along James Bay. 00:03:53
As you can see in this blown up. 00:04:04
View here. 00:04:08
So it was Public Works was asked to put together a plan to improve this area as we've been looking at beautifying the the 00:04:09
lakefront in general concern here was just the weeds and. 00:04:16
Other things from the surrounding communities. 00:04:24
And a desire to potentially make a resting place for those going along the trail. So this this proposal. 00:04:27
This is how it was presented to the City Council. The proposal included adding five trees that are similar to what you see here, 00:04:37
Columbia Pine, more specifically a Bosnian Pine. These specific trees are located currently in the over by legend on this is the 00:04:44
small Little. 00:04:52
Pocket Open Space, that's right by Vineyard Rd. And Center St. 00:05:01
The proposal was then to add some sumac some. This is a ground cover that we would put in between the trees and the original 00:05:07
proposal was to put wood chips. The council asked us to look at some other options, something that wouldn't be as loose that could 00:05:14
get kicked out onto the trail. It seemed as though like a gravel was not as favorable as well. So another option they were 00:05:22
currently looking into is is like a decomposed granite. 00:05:29
That would be a more compacted material that would be less likely to kick up, that wouldn't track out onto the trail as much and 00:05:38
the concept would be that that interior space maybe something similar to this where we could. 00:05:45
Have the bench in the middle of that and then have a border going around where we would still do the wood chip around the ground 00:05:54
cover in the in the trees. 00:05:59
So with with that, we'll turn it over to any questions that you might have for me. 00:06:05
Is there gonna be a fence around it? Where other properties about? 00:06:12
So currently there's there are no fences. 00:06:16
And usually in this situation this the city wouldn't. 00:06:21
Offense this. 00:06:25
The vegetation would act as a barrier. I know the property owner on the north side intends on putting a fence along their property 00:06:28
there. 00:06:33
Would we account for gates if they want egress ingress onto the trail from their properties? Yeah, there. There will be some gaps 00:06:39
here and there that we could provide that ability. Yes. Thank you. 00:06:45
I know the the owner to the north has expressed that that he would like a gate in there. 00:06:54
How big is the space is this Chris I so and you can see the dimensions and maybe you can't see them across the top. It's about 52 00:07:00
feet. 00:07:05
And about 80 feet this way. 00:07:10
Divided by two. 00:07:16
One one reason that the trees were pulled in was supposed to that we we wouldn't hinder any access because we know the the 00:07:21
resident just to the east uses that to access the path that that portion of the yard. 00:07:28
So there are residents back here on the east side. 00:07:38
As well as on the Northside, Yep. Yeah. So it touches kind of three and at the very point in the South and then you have east and 00:07:41
north. 00:07:44
So how did this request? 00:07:48
How was the city even entertained? This idea as a pocket part versus other places around helmet might also be? 00:07:51
Doing that, we're doing Waterfront master plan and part of the Waterfront Master plan is asking us to look at like every quarter 00:08:00
mile trying to provide a place for shade place, Yeah. And so this is honestly a spot that that we've looked at in the past, the 00:08:06
Waterfront Master plan, what one thing they wanted us to do is try to work with the both property owners to get an actual trail 00:08:12
through there and that that's probably not very likely. 00:08:18
But it does show improvements here and so we've we've kind of identified this area as as a great spot for Parka Park anyway and so 00:08:25
that this would be just kind of that first implementation of the waterfront master plan. 00:08:31
It wouldn't be at the request of the property owner that we're doing part of the master plan. 00:08:38
That's the emphasis behind it, because I'm just thinking about what precedents are we studying. 00:08:44
For the rest of the Community, if there are so-called unimproved growth. 00:08:50
For pocket art potentials. 00:08:55
You know, we took that this request went to the City Council and the City Council thought, I thought it was a good one. 00:09:34
And there's some low framing. This is kind of like a low hanging fruit opportunity. We do have funding in our arborist budget to 00:09:39
to plant trees within the city. And so this is kind of an opportunity we thought OK hey we we do have some the current budget that 00:09:47
that could be applied to this and and not be a very costly or impactful. These trees are consistent with our tree plant in the 00:09:54
city. Yeah, we're we may, we may. 00:10:02
We're still. 00:10:10
There was a few members as we reviewed this arborist suggested these trees, but we we are going back and looking and verifying 00:10:12
that these are the best trees for this location. So we will we will be verifying that before we solidify the exact tree. 00:10:21
Is there an estimated cost on what it would cost to do what? Yeah, right. With this plan as as it's shown with where we originally 00:10:31
were thinking of doing the mulch, the wood chip there we were, we were estimating about $2000 for those improvements obviously 00:10:37
plus our staff time. 00:10:44
We've we haven't been able to get pricing together and availability for the the the crushed granite or decomposed granite. But as 00:10:51
soon as we do, we'll be able to update some of those numbers and what that cost may be. We also talked about doing a pad concrete 00:11:01
or extending the asphalt to provide a pad for the bench. So that may still be part of that or we may just do all. 00:11:10
All granite. 00:11:21
Truss rock there. 00:11:22
Would there be a trash can and maybe a dog back station as well? Yeah, that was a that was a request by council as well as to 00:11:25
provide a a dog bag, state station and a receptacle here. 00:11:32
Yeah. 00:11:40
You know just it's up for consideration tonight. Just a quick comment or question. There was some scout troop or something that I 00:12:21
heard of that was making benches for places in the city. Maybe this would be a good location for something like that. I. 00:12:28
You know on the the downside of the slope and he was he he was asking that we considered you know. 00:13:10
If we're removing some of those to cut one of those up and maybe do like a flat cut on top. So I mean that's not the potential and 00:13:16
there's like a free bench or something that we can get through the youth council or some other organization, you know there's 00:13:21
there's probably some unique opportunities out there. 00:13:26
Putting my other hat on and from the heritage perspective. 00:13:32
We're always looking for opportunities to create or present the design of heritage in any benches or trash receptacles or anything 00:13:36
like that to have like a consistent theme maybe along the trail, you know and so that wouldn't work so well probably with the log 00:13:43
bench, but it it would be very easy to do in a metal bench, you know, if if that were pursued at all. So I just like to put that 00:13:51
out there that and if you're going to design A bench. 00:13:58
And it would be metal. We'd like to have some input into that. What maybe some design of that could be? So what is your next 00:14:06
meeting, Heritage meeting not until the first Tuesday of May? 00:14:12
What you guys sound like we have some time on the bench. So I mean if if you wanted to what what I would suggest is I'm just like 00:14:20
a citizen can can bring a proposal the heritage Commission if you have like a design style or something like that that that you 00:14:25
would encourage some elements that you would like incorporated into. 00:14:30
You know future furniture and stuff that we put out, right. I you know that that might be a good work session for for you guys to 00:14:36
have and then just provide a recommendation and then the City Council could consider that. Yeah especially along the trail 00:14:41
systems. You know it's it would be nice to have a consistent theme depth throughout if if we could but it wouldn't work in a log 00:14:47
bench probably. 00:14:52
Well, I'm ready for the log. We could just roll back down the hill if we don't like it. 00:14:58
Are we ready for any wayfinding signage right now for our trail system or is that still a ways off as far as planning that all 00:15:04
'cause it? This would be this and any other stopping points would be a good places to put that. 00:15:10
Mr. Madora, state engineer, also surprisingly, needs a long arm to reach the mic. 00:15:19
You know Einstein's actually with the. 00:15:25
When it comes to the front liner station, it's going up on downtown Vintage. We partner with ETA and also MAG in order for some 00:15:30
designs to be done. And we're actually got some ones that have been using the mag template, UTA provider, some more concepts 00:15:38
specifically for the front organizations. And we intend to put those up, see how they're done and then we're playing them up 00:15:45
expeditiously in order to meet their requirements for the front runner station opening. And then with that kind of feel and. 00:15:53
Implement those type of Wi-Fi signs throughout the city as well so they can. They're consistent. I know Brian has been working 00:16:02
with our friends in Orem as well to ensure that the signs that permanent signs were planning signs we have up. It is consistent 00:16:08
with our friends in our in London. 00:16:13
Thanks for the update. Yeah. So I mean my my thought on this is sounds like we covered like consulting the Heritage Commission for 00:16:20
bench ideas, making sure there's a dog waste station there and then when it's appropriate. I wouldn't want to rush it and have a 00:16:26
sign that didn't fit the others, but when it's appropriate, putting away signing, fine there. 00:16:33
About. 00:17:12
Doing a design for manhole covers for sewer, storm drain and such. And so the foundry that we that most of that products come 00:17:13
through is presented some options if we want to do some customized things like that. So that they've been the heritage 00:17:21
Commission's been working on putting together a design and maybe when they're done with that, that's something that could be 00:17:28
implemented into other things as well and maybe some standards put with the benches and other things so. 00:17:36
Very cool. 00:17:44
So, so I I like the concept of utilizing open space that the city owns and otherwise doesn't have a a purpose to it I guess like 00:17:46
here, but I'm wondering if. 00:17:52
I guess I'm just concerned this isn't precedent setting or it is and will continue following this because what I heard you say, 00:17:59
Morgan, is that if the land, if a private landowner. 00:18:04
Has city. 00:18:10
Land behind their fence, let's say, and it's just open and it's just dirt right now. Anyone could come in and request the city to 00:18:12
put something nice in there on the ground, cover trees, benches, or whatever. 00:18:19
I'm even thinking just out behind the city building here, there's a block of dirt out there. That's. 00:18:27
Just there. And I'm just wondering is there anything the city could do to improve that? 00:18:34
I don't just can I comment on that a little bit. All right. So with a lot of the places in the city that do have land behind homes 00:18:39
are are part of a bigger plan like that. That for instance would be part of the plan that we're trying to do for that that whole 00:18:47
wetland area or for the areas behind the shores and such those those are all part of a bigger plan too. So, so this would fit into 00:18:54
that. So yeah, I would I would think that this would fit into that and then I guess. 00:19:02
A question that I would have for staff is. 00:19:11
Do we have a lot of spaces like this where the city owns, like, I don't know, 1/10 of an acre behind people's homes? What's it 00:19:12
called orphan, orphan space or? 00:19:17
I mean this is part of the trail corridor and then the trail we found the alignment would be better you know moving it further to 00:19:25
the to the West. I mean you know trust receives a lot more these requests, but we don't receive a ton of like pocket park type 00:19:31
requests. I mean that we have had the resident there bring up the piece that you brought to him. So that that would be a great. 00:19:38
You know, a little spot for us to look at as a city and see if we can improve it. It obviously does help if it's part of a plan as 00:19:45
this is part of kind of like the waterfront master plan of of adding pocket parks along the trail and shade. It seemed to fit in 00:19:51
and so and yeah, and it wasn't a huge budget item. 00:19:58
So I think you know like something like that that space out there too. I mean those are definitely areas that the that the city 00:20:05
can can look at. I would definitely recommend that we get the the open space corridor master plan in place. Brian as you know he, 00:20:11
he provided the foundational document through his graduate studies and we still have a really good plan that hasn't officially 00:20:17
been approved. So we are moving into the the official planning of that. We're going to hire a consultant and having our first 00:20:23
meeting I believe in two weeks. 00:20:29
To choose a consultant we're aiming for next Thursday, well that next Thursday. So yeah so we'll be moving on that process so like 00:20:36
those kind of things it would be nice to have the master plan in place just so whatever we do our improvements fit in with a 00:20:43
comprehensive plan and kind of you know they're they're not like a little one offs but still it's up to the if the City Council 00:20:50
said pull the trigger on it then we would come back to the Planning Commission with the site plan and we we go forward with it so. 00:20:57
I actually think it's great like I I think it would actually I actually like the President of of utilizing these little pockets of 00:21:06
of rather than have it being you know a patch of weed. So if if someone were to find you know a piece that's not being utilized 00:21:12
and it can be to the benefit of the city and it's, it fits within all the you know the budget and you know it makes sense, checks 00:21:19
the boxes and I think it's great you know to have these little pockets. 00:21:26
Fill in these little parts of our city with. 00:21:34
Small amenities, you know, small improvements. 00:21:38
So I think it would be great to do this and and and maybe even set the precedent. And I think that there's a really cool 00:21:42
storytelling opportunity with it. Like I what I've kind of been running through my head is just like, what can we do with that 00:21:47
little? 00:21:51
That's the the edge of the lake or something that I guess what I would the the the next layer I would ask on this is what what 00:22:30
additional meaning can we apply here you know that that adds value to our. 00:22:37
You know that and into its that location being on this on the lakefront but it's up a little bit the bench is kind of cool because 00:22:46
you probably you know depending on the trees you might be able to you know see the lake have prospect up but it's bigger than I 00:22:51
than I realized like that's it's a pretty large amount of space So that's the only other question too is I wonder the scale of 00:22:57
what we've drawn there like. 00:23:03
Like the box of the bench. It might even be big enough to have more than one bench. Like the one bench might feel really small. 00:23:10
And that big of a space is something. Maybe you have to. I don't know. Yeah, So I almost. These are things that like. 00:23:18
Yeah, it could be pretty easy to, yeah. So I almost wonder if like maybe a scale. 00:23:26
Drawing like I love the idea. I think it's great to do. 00:23:31
To fill it in and and I think that the crush granite it's a good idea. 00:23:36
The only thing on like the the vegetation is is is to think about like just make keeping visibility on the ground for safety 00:23:42
purposes and everything like that too. I would I would say it's a good recommendation as well and we've had if I'm not mistaken 00:23:48
we've had history there of. 00:23:54
Drug traffic, you know, more seedy side of the population along the lakefront. 00:24:01
And I'm just wondering if by building something nice if that would attract more activity of that nature, homelessness or anything 00:24:07
like that that that we wouldn't want to create. So that's that's part of the history you don't want representative. 00:24:16
So I mean I I can think of like locations in the Northwest like both in Portland and Seattle where I spent time that they would 00:24:27
they would do a lot of these little pocket parks and some would have like. 00:24:32
It would have like an exercise theme like it would have these like outdoor like equipment for people. Maybe that's an idea along 00:24:38
the trail and it's got like this like structure for people to use for for exercise or yeah, I don't know. You know or it's or 00:24:44
again just kind of storytelling aspect or there's. 00:24:50
And stop and activate it. I think that will help hopefully to keep. 00:25:30
I think, I think more people going there's. I think it's better than, you know is this gonna be lighted at night? No. OK. 00:25:36
Well, they need to be irrigated or is there water in the area? No, there's not. So that we will have to do some temporary water 00:25:43
provisions. So we will come up with some bladders that will be able to establish the trees. It may take. It will take some extra 00:25:49
staff time to do that, but we'll have other places in the city that will routinely be visiting as well with this kind of a similar 00:25:55
situation, establishing trees. 00:26:02
Arborist thinks about two years for establishment period on these and then they should be able to be self sustained without a 00:26:09
constant water supply. 00:26:13
Another idea I was thinking about too. I know we, I think we talked about this when we were looking at the public works building 00:26:18
and in relationship to our plant and our tree manual and that our water wise plants and local scapes. Kind of a lot of things 00:26:25
we've talked about in the city and it'd be cool to have somewhere like a little demonstration. 00:26:32
Type of the local skates scheme so that that could give the residents an idea of what to do at their house. That's been talked 00:27:23
about. Well, hopefully it will come through. 00:27:28
So it sounds like there's a lot to consider and I guess maybe as a way for us to to move forward at least with with the trees you 00:27:35
could, you could approve this with like the you know, with the planting, the the trees and the shrubs is shown with the idea that 00:27:42
that we that we come back maybe with with a few different proposals. 00:27:48
You know, we could, we could workshop it a little bit more if you'd like. 00:27:57
It's up. It's up to you. Yeah. I like the idea too, of the crushed granite. Is that what it's called, rather than the? 00:28:03
The wood chips, they seem to blow and move around, but so something a little more permanent. 00:28:10
Seems good too and and then this would be a good one. It's not not a public hearing, but to open it up and David probably has some 00:28:17
comments and then Tay too to see if you know any comments. Got the motion to open a public hearing. 00:28:23
Public comments, right? Yeah. You don't need a public area. Yeah, we've been. It's an official notice, public hearing, but you can 00:28:32
just open up for a couple, then we'll open it up for public comments. 00:28:36
Thanks. I just want to get an idea of the relative size of it. So we say it's 50 feet wide, 80 feet long on one side. How wide is 00:28:49
this room? 00:28:54
20. 00:29:02
Is it? It's 40 at least. 00:29:06
468101214, so so just 32 by 30 is more than the width of this room so this is a good size space. So I would I would suggest them 00:29:10
that you're drawing any trees in your bench or not to scale or one and then #2, it really would be a good place to put some large 00:29:18
piece of equipment that we've been trying to find a place for Tim. 00:29:25
It was like vintage farm equipment. Yeah, exactly. We have some things they're being stored right now off site. Well, we need to 00:29:34
find homes for pretty quickly. 00:29:39
A good place? 00:29:45
Take your data. 00:29:48
I would, I would say. I've seen. 00:29:52
How the tractors are treated that are in high traffic areas with rocks through windows, I imagine this something like that could. 00:29:55
I mean it is a little more secluded area so hopefully if if we put something there I'd want it to be something that was not 00:30:00
fragile. 00:30:05
Yeah. 00:30:13
So I mean obviously it's on, it's on the agenda for us to take an action tonight. 00:30:18
I mean, maybe a month. 00:30:57
So it's it's not a rush if we need time to talk about it, if we wanna have all the elements together at one time. 00:30:59
However you'd like to see it. 00:31:09
I and maybe it's just I haven't like David a little bit. I'm a little hung up on the scale and and wanting maybe just a little 00:31:12
more specific plan just to take into account the scale and make sure we're not missing an an opportunity or. 00:31:19
Or it's going too small. It's pretty close to scale. The trees are 10 foot OK on center. The the trees themselves, the shapes may 00:31:27
not be quite to scale but location of the center of them is to scale. They're 10 foot off of the property lines and such. But 00:31:35
maybe the shapes of the like, the actual size of what that tree will be, it may be a little bit more than that but it's not that 00:31:42
far off. Early off, yeah, the the bench, definitely I threw in there as a box. 00:31:50
But I think there's an opportunity we could, I mean, I I would be willing to to put forward a motion, but one of the things that I 00:31:58
think we could put in there is that you know, if it's if there's room for more than one bench and it makes sense. 00:32:04
Especially if we've got groups willing to donate or build or something like that, I think that makes a lot of sense. 00:32:10
So that would be like a condition to it. We we approve the, yeah, I think there's a few things in there that I mean if I and I 00:32:20
will make a motion if the time is free, but is there any other discussion? OK. 00:32:27
Well then I'll make a motion to approve staff to proceed with the Lakeside Pocket Park project as proposed, with the additional 00:32:34
guidance of the decomposed granite for the ground cover. 00:32:40
When it when it's open, or soon after getting the dog station, or a wastebasket when wayfinding sign goes in, that would be a good 00:32:48
place for it as well. And then. 00:32:53
If there's if there's room for additional benches and we find ways to obtain it from donors or heritage Commission or whatever it 00:33:01
might be, to program it accordingly. 00:33:07
The end Then we'll bring it back to you. 00:33:14
Oh yeah. 00:33:17
I'm OK trusting staff with it, but. 00:33:20
We'll see if there's a second part. 00:33:24
That was a long motion. It was so if I understood it, I can second it. 00:33:28
Yeah, the 2nd pushes it to a motion. If you don't then it'll die. If you want me to just recap it, it's as is. Plus dog station, 00:33:36
decomposed granite, additional benches if there's room, and there's one other. 00:33:43
Yeah. And I would just say and incorporating any heritage elements possible and that and that's the piece that I think would be 00:33:52
good because that that's more upsetting the the standard. So that's more of like a planning policy thing and so we we would bring 00:33:56
that. 00:34:00
But we would be talking about more holistically in the city, not just the Parka park. 00:34:06
And you don't put that emotion well. Will it be this? No to bring it back? 00:34:11
OK. So Tim, you seconded. Yes. OK, all in favor, aye. 00:34:16
Great. OK. Thank you, Chris. 00:34:22
Item 4.2. Discussion and action on a pump station. 00:34:27
So this is a another site plan approval, so currently we're working on. 00:34:33
Our our water tank and booster station as well as some fencing that will go around the Public Works yard. So what we'll be looking 00:34:41
at here is. 00:34:46
Some aesthetics that will be on the the water tank. 00:34:52
The booster station and and that fencing and getting your input and approvals on that this has gone out to bid. It is something 00:34:56
that council seen and as well and and and we're in that process but with a few items we're just picking out and confirming with 00:35:03
the contractor so. 00:35:10
This is a. 00:35:19
Overview of the site. 00:35:21
The you can see the the bottom of the. 00:35:28
Is the pages 1600 N as it runs into the the Linden Marina, the railroad tracks to the right. The big rectangle is the water tank 00:35:32
with you can see all the Piers that will be inside there for the structure. The box up to the north of it is future expansion as 00:35:40
needed with growth and this. 00:35:49
Structure that's here is the booster station. 00:36:00
And this just kind of demonstrates a lot of the piping that's in there as well. Across the the railroad track side, we've already 00:36:03
installed a black vinyl coated chain link fence that was done as a betterment with the the railroads double, double UTA double 00:36:10
track project. 00:36:17
And what's proposed with the fencing is to match the the West side with that same black vinyl coated chain link and then across 00:36:25
the front the desire is to put. 00:36:32
A A wrought iron look with some intermittent columns. 00:36:42
Rock columns or CMU type columns, so. 00:36:50
To step you through each one of these now. 00:36:54
It's right now in our bid, we have the. 00:36:58
Option to either leave the the face of the the tank structure as just a smooth concrete face. It would just be Gray concrete, just 00:37:01
nothing finished. Look like your driveway but a vertical wall. 00:37:10
The other option that's proposed that we have in the budget is to do this. 00:37:20
Finished look on the side. That would give it like a barn wood or reclaimed wood look, but it would still be just a Gray concrete, 00:37:27
so it would give us some dimension and some better aesthetic feel. 00:37:34
The the one part that may if I go back up to the site plan. So right now we're we're accommodating for all four sides to get that 00:37:42
look in our bid. There is a desire which will probably come back through here. I'm not sure when soon I hope for the project sake 00:37:49
this. 00:37:56
Easter Eastern face Here. We may want to keep it as a smooth wall. 00:38:05
For a future mural or something like that that's that's been desired by council and and and others, what's the difference in cost 00:38:12
there? Because I can think of a few things that are to spend money on than making it water tank pretty. Personally definitely it 00:38:18
is if I remember right like 100 and 5200 thousand. 00:38:25
Dollars, I'd have to look back at the the bid sheet, but I believe it was in that that range. 00:38:33
So I'll move, I'll move forward and get just interrupted if you have other comments, otherwise I'll just keep. I'll keep moving 00:38:44
along. 00:38:46
So here's your elevations of the the booster station. It is proposed to be ACNU building, similar to other Public Works facilities 00:38:53
that we have in the city. 00:38:59
You can see it's a metal metal roof and some metal gabling and then the rest of it is. Is CMU the. 00:39:06
Desires to do a skirt that will be maybe a three foot couple courses up to maybe around 3 foot high. The proposed right now is 00:39:17
that would be a split face block and then above that would be. 00:39:25
A smooth and we would differentiate with two different colors. 00:39:34
Yeah, yeah. So this is a really close up for you. 00:39:39
So right now the desire would be a this charcoal. 00:39:45
Or black, Sorry, black split face on the bottom and then having a smooth Gray on top. 00:39:51
And I can pass it around if you guys want to close. 00:39:57
The color scheme was this Gray look was desired so that we could somewhat match the existing building that there that has Gray and 00:40:04
and some Blues to it, where these colors should should match pretty well. The other desire was to make this. 00:40:14
A differentiated from our other facilities like our wastewater facilities, so across the street. 00:40:25
I don't know that I have a picture of it, but. 00:40:32
And and this is not a good example because this is our Pi comp house, but it is secondary water, but most of our wastewater 00:40:36
buildings are are brown color and so the idea was to to differentiate from those. So this would be identifiable as a different 00:40:45
facility than wastewater. So across the street is one of our list stations that is a brown color I showed this to. 00:40:54
Give you an idea, The metal roofing would be something similar to this. 00:41:03
Black like like this is and then that Gray upper with the lower black split face. 00:41:08
Any questions on on that? 00:41:20
This is a kind of give you an idea of what that chain link will look like, and I believe I have a. 00:41:25
Something better for you to see here. 00:41:32
So this is an example of one of our wastewater facilities here where it's a the black vinyl chain chain link fence. 00:41:35
So that's what's proposed there the the rock columns, this is an example of what that could look like proposed would be using 00:41:42
accenting with this additional charcoal color. 00:41:50
Being all all of that with a that concrete cap on the top. 00:42:01
This is the This is for the columns intermittent along the wrought iron fence, correct? 00:42:09
This is an example of a facility Provo City water tank where they have a similar that wrought iron fence in the front with the 00:42:16
rock columns. They did a like a rock. 00:42:23
Relief on the the street side of their tank, but then the other sides, as you can see are just bare concrete and then the. 00:42:33
The other side of the property, they've just done this black vinyl coated fence, so that can kind of give you an idea of what that 00:42:41
may look like. 00:42:45
And I think that's all I got for you. 00:42:55
If you have any questions besides that, the main water tank was 6,000,000, yeah, it's a 6,000,000 gallon tank. 00:42:58
And then just north of there, I noticed there's a proposed addition. 00:43:07
Another two million. I think right now we've reserved space for up to 3 million just depending on on final build out. 00:43:11
I think 2,000,000 is what we felt was when we did our water master plan that additional 2,000,000 would be adequate, but we 00:43:22
reserve enough for 3 million in case that was what was needed. And the construction of these two tanks or at least one maybe 00:43:29
another will give us the capacity for the growth, anticipated growth of vineyard, yes, per the per the master plan that's that's 00:43:35
what's anticipated, yes. 00:43:42
What is the proposed height of the tank? So the tank will, I think it's about 24 to 26 feet tall with there'll be a little bit of 00:43:51
it buried and some. 00:43:57
Backfill up against it, sloped up against it a couple feet, but overall out of the ground it'll be in that 2022 foot range. 00:44:06
What's right across the street from that in the master plan? 00:44:18
I have to do this S to the South. So right in the master plan, yeah, what's planned to be there. So that's the so so you have the 00:44:23
the the the lift station is there but kind of that that that's also kind of the very tip if you go a little further of the of the 00:44:30
Vineyard downtown area and that specific area would be the what we're calling Geneva Park. And so it'd be about like an 18 to 25 00:44:37
acre park that would be. 00:44:44
That would provide the hills that cap, the material that that needed to be contained. Yeah. Now that that's not the canoe, the 00:44:52
Camus on the other side. So this is less contaminated soil, but still are still required to be capped. So yeah, if you look up 00:44:58
there, so the idea was to turn that into a park with with some hills that that are, you know, so open space we thought about that 00:45:04
could potentially be a great spot for a mountain bike park because you have to have some train there. So we definitely want to 00:45:10
utilize it and. 00:45:16
Yeah, there's been concepts of like Mount Mike parking some sort of like an adventure type park, something exciting that that can 00:45:23
pull people in from the region. So the the yellow line here shows the vignette connector alignment and this is where they'll have 00:45:29
a large overpass structure that would go over the railroad tracks. So that would be sitting. 00:45:35
You know, significantly higher, maybe twice the height of the water tank. 00:45:41
This is the lift station here. 00:45:47
That's currently there. And then I think the bigger question Morgan would be is what is the future of this property right here? 00:45:50
Visually though, this will be a when you come over that overpass, this on one side, parked on the other. 00:46:30
Going to be their first introduction to that if they come that way to downtown. Yeah, exactly. And that's what we're thinking like 00:46:37
the doing potentially have like a mural or some some nice signage on on this that E facing side of the of the water tank. It could 00:46:44
be cool you know and we thought of like maybe there's a way that it's it's a sign that you change and. 00:46:50
You could, you know, you could put like dates for big events and things. So those people on the front runner, they see things that 00:46:58
are going to be, you know, happen inventory. So basically 2526 feet high. How, how long are you thinking of the square footage? 00:47:04
Yeah, it's if I recall correctly, it's like 260 ish feet long. 00:47:11
Almost Football Field. 00:47:20
Is there gonna be any trees or anything on this property? So so currently so if I go back to the photos, so we haven't. 00:47:22
We haven't proposed any landscaping. We've grubbed out all the invasive trees. There was a lot of Russian olive along here. We 00:47:34
left the these existing larger trees that we believe cottonwoods that for now we left them. We haven't proposed any landscaping 00:47:40
here yet because. 00:47:47
The in the next little first of all, we don't have a complete Rd. so we don't really have a defined area, not a curb and gutter to 00:47:54
landscape up against and. 00:47:59
Tends to get difficult to contain landscaping up against asphalt and then. 00:48:05
The other desire to hold off is the Linden Heritage Trail will eventually come through here. They may be a couple years out, but 00:48:10
they'll be there's a 20 foot swath between the where the fence is and the edge of the road and that trail will take over half that 00:48:18
or half of that width. And we would just whatever we end up putting there ends up getting torn out when that happens. So not being 00:48:25
an underdeveloped area. 00:48:33
The desire was to wait on that landscaping until we had a better idea of what would come there. 00:48:40
And based off of the angle of the overpass and the train tracks, I assume that it's going to be very similar to what we have on 00:48:47
Geneva Road. And if that's the case, you won't even be able to see this building from the road. I I'd be surprised if you could 00:48:53
see the building from the road so. 00:48:59
It's the same thing as Anthony is I I don't think it needs to be super aesthetically pleasing. And then when you look at the other 00:49:07
side too, it's that that's your industrial area, you're just going to have warehouse boxes. 00:49:14
On the other side, so it'll. 00:49:21
It'll blend in. 00:49:24
With basically that concrete. 00:49:25
Mixing guy, right? That came through on the other side. 00:49:28
Yeah. 00:49:31
Q6. 00:49:36
Yeah, you're right. That's what I'm saying is your elevation on that overpass, you're going to be up. 00:49:37
Higher than the building. 00:49:42
Yeah, you'll see Do create, can we do we do a green roof. So the the roof is. 00:49:45
Will have like a rock scape cover over it. So it won't just be a concrete lid, it'll have a a protective layer over the top of 00:49:53
rock and like gravel and stuff. So we're talking like Conference Center rock park, sure. 00:50:01
That was a joke. That's our demonstration garden to be one of those green boxes. We'll let the bridge grow through the lid and 00:50:12
down into the. 00:50:15
Yeah, of course. I mean the architect in me was like excited about the board from concrete, but. 00:50:24
But yeah, I think that this is going to be buried. I I think what I'm thinking about too is like down the road, if we've got an 00:50:32
overpass coming through here, we've got the front runner station passing along it. 00:50:37
I think it. 00:50:44
The other disadvantage of the board forum is this. This could be a target for for tagging and that kind of stuff too, because it's 00:50:46
kind of a discrete area along the tracks and so I think a mural is kind of cool or something like to be intentional about. 00:50:53
Being intentional to put some artwork there so that if people are riding along the front runner, they're they're looking out there 00:51:00
seeing something, but. 00:51:03
But I could see as everything kind of comes together, that area could be kind of this. 00:51:08
I don't know, maybe the best area to put the porch on concrete. Unfortunately we will have security cameras there, so at least 00:51:14
we'll have video of them as they as a tagging. 00:51:18
We can hire them, yeah, they're good. Then they can do the whole thing. 00:51:23
The track. 00:51:29
Yeah. 00:51:32
Any other thoughts on that? You talk about the fence too. I for me personally, I think everything you propose on the fence is 00:51:34
fine. I think the colors. 00:51:39
That all makes sense. 00:51:44
It doesn't make sense to me that wastewater buildings be brown. 00:51:46
Any other thoughts or comments? 00:52:01
What's the projection? So the we have an issue that we've bid it out and awarded it for the booster station on the tank and the 00:52:07
the fencing. They have yet they haven't received their notice to proceed. They're just finishing up some documents and we'll get 00:52:14
them rolling hopefully before the end of the month. 00:52:21
They'll be the the whole process will go about 400. 00:52:30
26 days. So that'll put them into the end of July of 2023. 00:52:36
Their first the schedule that they propose they want to start working on the the exterior fencing first to secure the site better 00:52:44
so if they are working there and leaving materials and equipment that they'll feel more secure. 00:52:52
And they'll work on ground improvement improvements first. So they have to add in some ground stabilization to help with 00:53:01
liquefaction under the tank because it's so, so heavy. 00:53:07
They and they'll start working on that booster station and the two parallel. We'll just take quite a bit of time to get done. 00:53:15
We're talking a couple of years out in terms of having a function. Yeah, they'll be done in by the end of July of 2023. So just a 00:53:23
little over here, a year and a couple months. 00:53:30
This is something that we're taking action on too, right? 00:53:41
Correct. So if anybody's ready with the motion. 00:53:45
Any conditions of any kind? 00:53:55
The city would need to meet other than what we've talked about. 00:53:58
Yeah, If you have preference for like the material on the exterior, I think I heard a comment from you Jeff, but there was 00:54:01
something specific there that you want to capture in a in a condition if you wanted to you know make sure there was a spot for the 00:54:07
mural. So maybe like there's not we don't do the the board siding on the the east facing side. 00:54:13
Just help me up. However you guys want to approach it, we can. 00:54:19
You can add a condition. 00:54:23
I mean, I think if we can save money in that regard. 00:54:29
I think it would be beneficial. So it would it be the board siding on everything but that. 00:54:32
But they use space inside. I don't think we need any board sighting personally, but that's just personally. 00:54:39
Aesthetic preference and and did I hear correctly there would be a difference around $200,000 roughly if we were to do that on all 00:54:47
four sides, correct. So you know if there's a way to save the 200,000 then? 00:54:53
And then put it in the murals or on the other things that would enhance it. 00:55:00
Right there. So that that I would suggest if we're gonna put money into something that that might be the spot to do it. It's kind 00:55:37
of a trail entrance into the the park that one is building into the Marina. 00:55:42
And and this is off the wall, well maybe it's on the wall but if we were to having this pump the storage tank, is it such that it 00:55:47
could be turned into a climbing wall in the future. I mean if that if there was interest in doing something like that. So I stand 00:55:55
corrected it was 85 that their bid was 85,545 to put the for the form liner that's still, I mean it's still a sizeable amount of 00:56:03
money but so, so. 00:56:11
Again, it would it damage the water tank at all if it were to be used as a climbing wall sometime in the future. So that that I 00:56:19
the idea would be to keep it as secure facility, yeah, so. 00:56:25
Not open to public access? Yeah, OK. 00:56:34
Makes sense. I mean, I'll jokes aside about the green roof, Like even that's like the the roof is worth thinking and maybe maybe 00:56:38
we're thinking too far down the road. So I don't know when we're getting that overpass on the vineyard connector, but like, that's 00:56:45
a more visible piece to me, it seems like then especially the inside concrete walls, even on the. So I think, I think doing just 00:56:51
the regular concrete walls, having a mural or some option opportunity on the the east side of the face of the front runner line, I 00:56:58
think it's a good idea. 00:57:04
Yeah, I think if we could get a mural there where people come into the front like. 00:57:11
This is in your You're in downtown now. Would be kind of cool, personally. 00:57:18
Plus, if it gets defeated, you can paint over it again, right? I guess you could do that with a with a form well too. 00:57:23
Yeah. 00:57:31
I couldn't find them. Do we want to? Are there any public comments on this before we? 00:57:33
OK, OK. 00:57:43
OK, so there wasn't a motion in the agenda or anything, but I think I could make one up. 00:57:48
So I moved to approve the pump station plans as presented with the condition that the concrete formed walls are not. 00:57:54
Text Jared. 00:58:10
Concrete form liners, smooth textured. 00:58:11
Appearance. So that's kind of why we presented that. 00:59:25
With the feedback from the council and stuff like that and cost has come up. I mean how does the and I'm not I I just think that I 00:59:28
I know this there's been discussion about this it it like is is it something that that is already funded for that like if they did 00:59:35
do the siding that we have the funds to to pull the trigger on it. Yeah it's approved in the budget so it's it but it would be 00:59:43
just a like funds we wouldn't use so it would be it would be a savings. 00:59:50
My point is from the Planning Commission standpoint is I would look at it aesthetically if you if if you feel that just a plain 00:59:58
you know, a plain look would would, would would look better than than adding sighting like you know something to kind of cover the 01:00:04
the tank and then I would suggest that you pull it off. But if from an aesthetic standpoint you actually think that the sighting 01:00:10
looks better than I, I, then there's from a budget standpoint it's already covered and so we're trying to move forward. So, so for 01:00:16
me personally. 01:00:22
Aesthetic wise like. 01:00:28
You know, put a slogan up there, you know, so there's, there's things that you could do later on with the top of the tank also to 01:01:49
give a little bit better visual and one one thought too again and just thinking of scale, like we were talking about the size, the 01:01:55
length of that wall, what we're talking about almost the length of a football field. 01:02:02
That's a gigantic mural, so it might even be. 01:02:09
One option to propose is that. 01:02:16
You you leave some smooth sections. 01:02:19
For murals on that wall. 01:02:23
Because maybe a 280 foot long mural. 01:02:26
That's just that's that's pretty big. I can't think of one right now that's that we have in this area. 01:02:31
And I mean, the murals are cool. When you ride Front Runner and you go to these communities, you see the artwork, you know, like 01:02:38
it's it's it's a great way. Again, like we talked about tagging. I think it dissuades the tagging because now you have something, 01:02:43
you know, cool and artistic there, but that is giant. So, you know, maybe. 01:02:48
Maybe, maybe there's some sections of it. I mean what's the when we talk about 85 grand, I mean that's. 01:02:56
Compared to like the overall project budget. 01:03:02
17.5 million, so it's a percentage wise of the project budget. 01:03:06
That is, that is not an overly significant number. 01:03:12
And we may not like. 01:03:16
It doesn't always work. The way of thinking, well, we could take that money and use it somewhere else doesn't necessarily always 01:03:18
translate that way. You know, like we can't go back in the bid and say all right now we're going to. 01:03:23
Easily go throw in, you know, some nicer Maple trees or something in the landscape package, so. 01:03:29
There is a down in Provo, I think it's like 300 W and 200 W the bike shop building, they've got some a large mural there. It's not 01:03:35
anywhere near like you say, it is pretty cool. You know, they kind of have some time frame, historical time, time frame images and 01:03:43
that's what I was thinking. I mean I'm not an artist and this isn't the point where we need to bring it up, but it doesn't need to 01:03:51
be 1 theme on the mural. It can be a successive series of things on on on Amy Roll that shows progress. 01:03:58
Or shows different aspects of the importance of the city or I think there's a way to use the 260 feet that wouldn't just be one 01:04:06
system painting well you might even be able to do something simple or just put Vineyard and just make it really big and and that 01:04:16
might from outer space, you're a vendor and you can do things around it. So I mean if the space is there, I mean that you know. 01:04:25
Yeah. 01:04:37
Runner you either going back in time or forward in time, right? 01:04:40
Hey Morgan, you guys are planning working on some sign ordinance and mural code that will allow this. I know currently that part 01:04:46
of the delay on that is that we're working through the the code to see what we can do there. Putting a sign on there, we're 01:04:54
limited to the size, so say welcome to Vineyard we're we're limited by the the sign ordinance as to how big you can make that but 01:05:01
going with a mural. 01:05:09
Or artwork, then you're open to making it a lot bigger. So I know they are working on that and hopefully we'll have some answers 01:05:16
before too long. That is something that we do. I mean if we we do make a smooth wall or just whatever option we go with, we do 01:05:24
need decisions made quickly so that before too long if if we say pull the form liner off on that one side, it could come with the 01:05:32
cost from the contractor if they've already prepped themselves to do. 01:05:39
All of their forms with that form liner and they have no smooth. Well, it sounds like the most tonight is to pull it all the way 01:05:47
off right on on all four sides. Yeah and that and that's fine. If that's if that's the route you guys want to go, I think we're 01:05:55
good with that. What, what color would it be if if those form liners are are are taken off like what would be the exterior just 01:06:02
great just natural concrete the same it would be with the form liner, same color all the form liners doing is giving it a texture. 01:06:10
OK. 01:06:18
That's fine. I just wanted to have kind of a little bit more in depth conversation on that and that's fine. However you guys want 01:06:22
to go with us, we maybe need to clarify the motion. 01:06:26
If somebody wants to make another motion, I think. 01:06:30
Well, since you got a second, I believe you need to move forward with a with a vote on it, or you could do a substitute motion. 01:06:33
So you have to. 01:06:44
Yeah, there's a second, please. Tim seconded. Tim seconded the motion. 01:06:47
OK. So no substitute motions then based on conversation. OK. Then all those in favor of the motion? 01:06:55
Aye, aye. 01:07:02
Great. Thank you. 01:07:05
I feel like I'd betrayed. 01:07:11
Myself a little bit, yeah. 01:07:14
Yeah. 01:07:28
All right. 01:07:32
Thank you, Chris. 01:07:34
Let's move on to item 5.1. It's a work session, so no votes or action here. 01:07:38
General Plan Review, Heritage and Cultural resources and looks like Brian is. 01:07:47
Getting queued up. 01:07:52
Yeah. 01:07:54
OK, hello everybody. I'm Brian. I worked as a city planner. 01:08:30
So this year? 01:08:36
We continue to work on updating the general plan. We're trying to move forward on updating two elements in depth that's the open 01:08:38
space, parks, trails and lakefront and the moderate income housing. So with the moderate income housing, we have new legislation 01:08:45
that involves House Bill 462. 01:08:52
That basically the state is online has revised some of the strategies that cities can put into their general plan. 01:09:00
For helping promote modern income housing and and then they're asking cities to not only implement those in their general plan, 01:09:07
but to specify implementation strategies and and have those clearly outlined by October the 1st of 2022. So basically we have to. 01:09:17
Some of them quickly on our initiatives for improving our strategies from our income housing. 01:09:28
So apart from those 2IN depth updates to those elements or chapters as they're referred to in the in the General Plan, we might 01:09:33
also do an in depth. 01:09:37
Update to the Public facilities and services element. We've already done substantial work with public works and Engineering 01:09:43
regarding this element. So I think we're ready to move forward on undoing in-depth update of that element as well. 01:09:50
All the all the other remaining elements, 5 elements will be receiving updates to their goals and strategies only and minor in 01:10:00
text revisions. So today we want to have a work session with you because I wanted to explain kind of our approach to how we're 01:10:07
doing these revisions and what we're going to be doing to the goals and strategies. This week we're presenting the heritage and 01:10:15
cultural resources element of the general plan. So we're going to be talking about those strategies and and goals. 01:10:23
Before doing so, I want to talk about. 01:10:32
The edits and revisions in general. So these edits are not like solely my ideas or things I came up with on the cuff. 01:10:37
It's actually a pretty collaborative effort that we're doing with department heads and their auxiliaries. We're including 01:10:45
governing bodies such as yourselves and the public, and we're trying to involve the different committees and commissions that 01:10:50
operate in the city. 01:10:54
So the general plan has to be a living and breathing document. 01:11:02
Conditions to absolutely change on the day-to-day. These have to be updated and reflected in the general plan. Things change such 01:11:08
as population, new and expanding infrastructure, new development, new roads, new parks, trails, et cetera. 01:11:16
We have to make necessary updates to match tables and diagrams within a general plan that includes the land use map, the 01:11:26
transportation plant of the transportation map, some of our demographic data that's shown in tables such as population and family 01:11:33
sizes, home values, employment and jobs data. So all these we got to slowly start catching up on. 01:11:40
There's a lot of Corrections I need to made to writing errors such as spelling, grammar, fragmented sentences. 01:11:48
Worthiness, punctuation, redundancies. 01:11:56
We're also replacing, and I'm I'm pretty heavy on this, on replacing ambivalent, irresolute language with clear and decisive 01:12:00
language. So a lot of the times you'll you'll see things such as into. Consider doing this where appropriate. If possible do that. 01:12:08
And so I'd like to strengthen that language and and write things such as establish, dedicate, preserve, construct, implement and 01:12:17
build. 01:12:22
In terms of formatting, run on. Sentences are made to be shortened, condensed and cleaned up. 01:12:28
When it comes to grouping and relevancy, some goals and strategies have have an unclear or indirect correlation with what is being 01:12:36
talked about in that section. So that's that's all being cleaned up as well. 01:12:44
So let's step into. 01:12:52
We can come back and then you provide your comments to Brian between now and the next meeting and then we can bring back a better 01:13:32
draft. So anyway, we can add that in. Thanks, Morgan. Yeah, that's exactly what we would like to do. 01:13:40
So in this I'm just going to put my, my edit so you can see kind of stuff was done. So I'll always provide you. So every week or 01:13:48
every Planning Commission meeting moving forward until we've completed this, this update, we're going to talk about an element or 01:13:54
or maybe it's not a new element but. 01:14:00
We'll be tidying up those elements until we get done with all the elements eventually. 01:14:06
So I'll provide you the existing. 01:14:11
Draft or how it's written currently my red lines as you can see in my comments to the side and the final draft. So the clean 01:14:15
version. 01:14:20
So for this section, the goals were broadened and made more comprehensive before. Some of those are difficult to differentiate 01:14:26
from strategy. Goals should be goal should present clear overarching ideas or strategies allow us to get more into the particulars 01:14:34
and into the the details. So instead of four goals, now we have 2 go One focuses on fun, exciting and educational ways to 01:14:41
celebrate our history and go to focuses on using heritage. 01:14:49
To increase commerce and tourism. 01:14:57
In some places we had a necessary long list of action items or verbs and we've removed those. An example is in goal one strategy 01:15:01
one from the original draft where we had identify, locate and create an inventory. Now we just have create an inventory that's 01:15:08
just more simple. Another occasion we had a list that said historically related tools, implements, buildings, properties and other 01:15:15
such. 01:15:21
Elements or artifacts, I should say that's been cleaned up to just say a historical influence. 01:15:29
But one point on the other, not other than the nitty gritty things like that, more action items and fortifying language was added. 01:15:36
To strengthen and support these strategies. 01:15:44
For example, um. 01:15:48
In some cases, it made sense. It made sense to make something its own goal because of its impact or significance, such as goal Two 01:15:51
in my In My red lines go to strategy one, which talks about getting historical sites, properties, buildings and structures on the 01:15:58
National Register of of Historic Places. The the National Register assures the preservation and adds that important element to our 01:16:05
to our historical initiatives. 01:16:12
New wording is added to capitalize on sharing historical content online and on social media. So you go to Strategy 3. New 01:16:20
strategies to incorporate new technology and how we share our history using things like augmented reality. See Goal One, Strategy 01:16:26
5. 01:16:32
The strategies and language has been added that focuses on making heritage a way to promote tourism of vineyard. 01:16:38
New goals and strategies that further support the public consumption of written and oral histories has also been added. Those have 01:16:44
been revised in such a way that supports and strongly encourages community engagement and partnership with the community and local 01:16:49
institutions such as UV and BYU. 01:16:53
Move, move, verbiage that employees are very are various master plans to inform our efforts to celebrate our history. So we've 01:16:59
been working on the Waterfront master plan, active transportation plan. Now we're about to start the corridor plan. So we want to 01:17:06
make sure that all of our different planning initiatives are supporting our heritage. 01:17:12
Um, in essence, our intentions aren't aren't too but the existing content or what's already there. What we want to do is improve 01:17:20
and build upon the existing goals and strategies. 01:17:27
We want to further our our our pre-existing efforts. 01:17:35
So in presenting my revisions to you, the Planning Commission? 01:17:40
This is an essential step in verifying that we are moving the right direction. 01:17:44
Every meeting we will present a new a new element. These edits are not final. Like Morgan stated, we need your help as we continue 01:17:48
to make revisions. We're happy to meet with you individually. We're happy to receive your verbal and written comments via e-mail. 01:17:54
We're happy to have more work sessions. 01:18:01
And and we need to capture your ideas. So I guess once you have a an opportunity to read and study all these revisions I I want 01:18:08
you guys to to reach out to us, our department and and help us to make the changes that you want to that you want to see 01:18:14
reflected. 01:18:20
Do you guys have any questions about this chapter specifically or anything moving forward? 01:18:28
That we have. 01:18:35
Notice he can use he can usually. 01:19:23
We may play around with with that, but a lot of focus is going to be on the goals and strategies because that is more of the 01:19:54
implementation part of the general plan. 01:19:58
What, what actually would you say are the, I guess the core components of the vineyard heritage? What is it that we're trying to 01:20:05
highlight? 01:20:09
It's a good question. 01:20:17
I think what we're trying to highlight is ways to put our heritage in front of people. And I think to to my degree, some of these 01:20:19
goals mention like having a museum, either it's indoor or outdoor or having historical implements throughout the city or using 01:20:25
technology to to educate the public on on what Vineyard is, what it, what it used to be and how that's going to help us in the 01:20:32
future. 01:20:38
So I think there's a big educational component to it. 01:20:45
I would say that's what it's mostly trying to and using history as best as we can to increase. 01:20:50
Regional tourism, bringing people to the city and teaching them what we're all about. So I guess to rephrase it, is it like the 01:20:59
core thing for trying to teach them? Is it, is it the history of agriculture and then Geneva, you know, the industry and 01:21:04
agriculture aspect or or what are the the core? 01:21:09
Parts of the heritage that we said this is what we're highlighting. 01:21:15
I was going to invite you to talk about that wanted to well, first of all let me just some context, but. 01:21:19
When we were invited, when we the when we started creating a master plan and deciding on the chapters, it was decided by the city 01:21:28
that there would be a chapter on heritage and culture. 01:21:34
And so the Vineyard Heritage Commission was asked to write the chapter on heritage and culture, basically. And so volunteers like 01:21:40
David Larae and myself and a half a dozen others. 01:21:49
Took blank paper. 01:21:58
And just started writing what we thought was important to try to maintain and vineyard what we felt that we'd lost a lot of 01:22:00
opportunity to preserve history and veneer because of the rapid growth and development. And so we wanted to start at a particular 01:22:08
point saying three years ago and say what is there that we could preserve that still exists within the community. And then beyond 01:22:17
that, what is it we want to educate people about relative to the history of India, we feel very strongly. 01:22:25
That a community is stronger if it understands its historical perspective and Vineyard is a very young community. And So what we 01:22:34
wanted to do is to start with Native Americans, basically some of the first identifiable people. 01:22:42
And then worked through up to modern day whether it was agriculture or fishing or. 01:22:52
Dairy farming or Geneva steel through the 40s and 50s and 60s, we we wanted to try to educate the community on all of that 01:23:00
historical background. And so these were words that we put together, you know and and we certainly don't take ownership, well, we 01:23:09
do take ownership, but we don't own it and we would welcome any improvements at all that could be made on this plan. 01:23:17
Without forsaking or losing our main objectives, to try to preserve as much history as possible, whether it be in museums or in 01:23:26
the on the ground with implements and or educating the public about the historical nature of this community because. 01:23:36
The the historical creation of Vineyard is what makes it such a powerful community today. How it was created it it it wasn't just 01:23:46
an industrial city or a bedroom community. It has real significant history to it that we think will benefit current and future 01:23:53
generations. I don't know if I've answered that or not. That's awesome. So, so anyway, any improvements to what was created would 01:24:01
be welcomed as long as we don't lose. 01:24:09
The essence of what we had hoped to achieve and I guarantee that that that's definitely and Brian has been a wonderful advocate of 01:24:17
heritage and history in the community. When he first came in, part of it was to help the community understand its historical 01:24:25
nature. So he is one of the individuals in the community really I think has it in his DNA as well. Thanks Tim. I really appreciate 01:24:33
you saying that. Yeah, I think you you mentioned some of these things like we really do have a rich history in Vineyard. 01:24:41
Just to reiterate some of the things that you you mentioned agriculture. 01:24:50
Utah Lake and how important Utah Lake has been to everybody that has ever occupied this area are farming. 01:24:54
History to give a steel and also people of faith. 01:25:00
So I think we need to use history to establish connection community inclusivity. 01:25:42
Focus on our hard work and sacrifice and those that came before us and but he has always been a place of like patriotism and 01:25:50
giving to the country. 01:25:54
So I I think it's I know those are the things that we want to try to capture in in this element and and going back and doing an 01:25:59
in-depth review of this chapter there's already a a bunch of wonderful things in the chapter so. 01:26:06
So the comment I have to as we talk about this and something I want to go back in, I've, I've done some of this. I need to 01:26:14
continue to do more as we look at our general plan. 01:26:19
But I think a lot of the heritage too, I really appreciate it your your explanation on it, Tim, because I think there's a lot 01:26:26
there's a perception. 01:26:31
I think for most people in in this region of the the, the identity of this area was Geneva steel and now it's rapid growth and 01:26:37
development, right? 01:26:43
We're very much attached and associated with Utah Lake right. And the the the the perceived perception and heritage of Utah Lake 01:26:50
is this you know disgusting lake that that we that we ruined right. And I think that part of the heritage and our our story here 01:27:00
is the landscape. You know it's the Native Americans it's it's what this what this area was like. 01:27:09
Before all the development and I think that that there's some power in us as a community kind of defining the story of of of our 01:27:19
waterfront, of of the region, of the relationship with the lake, which is obviously a very hot, you know, topic of discussion 01:27:28
these days, right and and what should be done with the lake. 01:27:36
And and and I think that better I think there what what I perceive in in the. 01:27:45
In in the discussions happening in our region and in our state in our community is there, there needs to be more understanding of 01:27:53
of what the natural condition is of the Lakeshore, you know and of this of this area before the development. And there's there's 01:28:01
clearly some misperceptions about that and and and then ultimately what needs to be done. And I think that there's an opportunity 01:28:09
for us to put into our general plan what is our vision as a community and I know we have the open open space parks and trails. 01:28:17
But I don't know if in these categories and again I want to go back in and scroll through it. I've read through this but I need, I 01:28:26
want to from that perspective of of of the the landscape portion. Like what is the what is the heritage of our landscape and how 01:28:33
do we want as a community to celebrate that landscape to preserve the landscape. 01:28:40
A missed opportunity that we have to to review that on a regular basis. 01:29:21
I think it's helpful like for every business item we have, if there's relevant sections in the general plan that we should be 01:29:24
discussing to actually stop and review those in a lot of these situations. You know, so when we're talking about pocket parks, 01:29:30
like what does our general plan say about programming areas? Because it's in there, right. And and that helps guide us and that 01:29:36
also helps us understand when it's out of date and what needs to be taken care of. So it's more of a general comment, but I think 01:29:42
this heritage section will be. 01:29:49
More powerful if anytime there's a business item where there's an option to have a heritage component, we have a couple quick 01:29:55
goals that we can review back to and say remember this is this is what we've agreed to and how how we can align on it. 01:30:01
Whenever I hear like there's the heritage for the city or there's this heritage immediately, I think like, OK heritage, like old 01:30:10
things, but there's more to it than that. There's so much more to that and I think that. 01:30:18
We're missing an opportunity and that we're not theming it at all. Like when I'm I'm sure most of the people that live in Vineyard 01:30:26
because they're new and they hear heritage, they don't know, they can't pinpoint a specific thing. And so I think that we need to 01:30:33
take opportunities to make it so that destinations are like. 01:30:40
Like we had the Geneva Waterfront park or whatever, stuff like that, where we can make stuff like a cool destination to go or 01:30:48
theme things in certain ways. Like if you go to other cities and they're like, oh, our heritage is this specific thing. Like buy a 01:30:55
T-shirt with this thing on it, buy a hat with this thing. And when you think of those cities, like heritage is ingrained into 01:31:03
everything because they're so proud of specific things. 01:31:10
So I think that it would be important for this, for the heritage section to have a few specific things that we want to try to push 01:31:18
forward instead of just heritage. Because if we can do that, then people actually become interested in the history. And if there's 01:31:25
one theme thing then you can build down from that and get into the nitty gritty and the real stories that happened. But I think 01:31:33
that if there are some themes. 01:31:40
And then we'll we'll do some some work in between with you know individually with you guys and then in the next meeting we'll 01:32:20
we'll try to have those reflected in the draft and it may take a couple of times to do that but that and then we we can do the 01:32:26
kind of thing where we adopt one chapter and then we move on to the next or we could wait until everything's done and do it as 11 01:32:32
document. I mean we're we're not as concerned about that, but that's exactly the way we're planning to do that. I'm happy to send 01:32:38
an additional e-mail. 01:32:44
Aside from the agenda, there's this item. We're updating an element in the in the next meeting, so heads up. Cool, I'll do that. 01:32:51
Great. 01:32:55
Just to also piggyback on, he said. Bryce, I think, I think it was a great comment and I think the word I. 01:33:02
There's kind of two good words I guess. But it's it's and I we've talked about four. But storytelling, I think there's a story 01:33:08
that we want to tell through and maybe it's branding or whatever it is. But you know of our heritage and we want to we want to 01:33:14
tell that story or that narrative of what Vineyard is and not let. 01:33:20
Not have that narrative. 01:33:27
Dropped on us of of like. 01:33:30
Like right now I think the narrative is vineyard, that's like they're just building houses like crazy, right. There's this. Yeah. 01:33:32
Yeah. It's just filling in with houses everywhere. Right. And the only other thing people know that and Geneva steel and and 01:33:39
pollution. You know. Yeah. And and there's we know there's more to it, right. Those clearly, yeah, it is. It is fast growing. It's 01:33:47
got all these things. But there's there's a real story to tell here that that's deeper. 01:33:54
It's richer, that's more complex that that we can tell through you know and have that in the general plan and through you know 01:34:02
specific theme, you know strategies or whatever. 01:34:08
Having it implemented in the art sewer covers like that's you know in our, in our signage, all of that kind of stuff. 01:34:15
Is like, so I'm thinking kind of going from that as far as like sewer covers and signage and stuff. If we have themes then it'll 01:34:23
be a lot easier to come up with designs. It's easier to decide what to do. Maybe that's part of what we glean from from each of 01:34:30
your you know comments to my edits is he goes, hey I think this is a Dean you know like give me let's all create like a list or 01:34:36
something just to get our creative Jesus fallen in terms of that. 01:34:43
Just feedback them, yeah. 01:34:51
Daily we have to have you like, please. 01:34:54
Hi, David, Lorraine. 01:35:02
So I don't question when Brian, when you mentioned earlier the the process, you have all sorts of people looking at these things 01:35:04
and you mentioned that you know the administration and this and this Commission, the Commission and you mentioned our residents as 01:35:10
well. 01:35:15
So in in this document, which residents helped you do this? 01:35:22
That's what we're doing right now, So I see, so they can look at what's been done. So they really have to help you do this. Here's 01:35:27
looking for our staff and them saying, yeah, this is good. 01:35:32
A little bit of the plan is just to get a draft consensus from the Planning Commission. Planning Commission is the appointed body 01:36:14
to create that trap. Then we would do a public open house. We would put it out to the public. 01:36:18
They would provide us more feedback and input and then and then that would be infused back in. And so it's it's not something 01:36:24
that's going to get approved quickly, it does but we do want a draft that we can take to the public. 01:36:30
My wife keeps telling me that, asking why? Why do you go to these meetings? You can't make any. You can't make any kind of 01:36:39
changes. Something is going to change. And when they have you speak public sessions like the waterfront session and so forth, you 01:36:45
have you so you pick the one you want, so forth. You have to pick one of their options and it's going to be what they want. It's 01:36:50
not going to be anything we want that. That's what she says to me. I'm trying to find ways to. 01:36:55
To get her to get away from that that perception. So I think she's not the only one who has that perception. 01:37:01
And so I I do come these because I do believe I can make a difference, otherwise I wouldn't be here. 01:37:10
And so I'm just wondering what what can we do to get away from that perception? Because it really is I. 01:37:17
As I've gone around with petitions and so forth that that and getting people to sign it that that that perception is pretty 01:37:25
pervasive. 01:37:29
The perception that there's we don't have a voice that you know the season do what they want with it and they're not. No one cares 01:37:33
about what people think. For example, I I went around the position a few months ago about trying to help create a bikeway on on 01:37:41
Holy Rd. I got a lot of feedback at that time and everyone said there's there's just one more thing we tried to do that they're 01:37:48
not they're going to ignore and a lot of people have said to me in in various ways. 01:37:56
And I feel like the summarizes of the cities forgot who they work for. 01:38:03
The city wants to do what they want to do. They don't. If we go to them or something, they don't really care about that as long as 01:38:09
it meets. If it's their agenda, fine. But they only want what they want to do. And of course the amorphous they understand you 01:38:15
know they as us. But I get I get all that. But still the point is, is that perception is still there and I don't. I'm not trying 01:38:20
to. 01:38:26
The argument is I'm not trying to cast aspersions. I know everyone here is here because they do the right thing and you're trying 01:38:33
to do good things. I get that. 01:38:36
I understand there's a perception abroad in the land that maybe is that isn't true. How can we deal with that? How can we address 01:38:42
that? How can we show them that we really do want their input? 01:38:47
That's I guess that's it. 01:38:54
Great. And we're yeah we're definitely open to suggestions I mean they I mean what the plan is to do is to do a public process 01:38:56
where we would we would go out and and get and get more more feedback. You know as far as like the waterfront master plan and you 01:39:04
know like that we held several meetings we met with a lot of residents we did online forums we had you know Facebook live events. 01:39:12
So we we we really tried to get as much as we could and I I don't think you're ever going to appease everyone and. 01:39:20
You know I I feel like as a city at least with that project we we went to a pretty far extent to to try and and get feedback. But 01:39:28
if you have suggestions of how maybe it's an apparent thing or you know maybe we need to be more transparent. But I I would you 01:39:34
know we would welcome those. 01:39:40
Submitting. 01:39:47
Yeah. And maybe I could just add here from my since the topic of our discussion has been historical and heritage. 01:39:49
I feel many times that I haven't been the, the, the advocate that there needs to be to try to promote heritage and vineyard 01:39:59
because I feel often times that we're getting very, very slow progress, getting very little attention. We have a very young 01:40:07
community. Our average age is what, 2020, like 424 now 24, so getting older a little bit, yeah, as it was in the teens it seems 01:40:15
like. So our average age is 24. 01:40:22
And when I was 24, I didn't carry that care that much about history and heritage, except what I had to study in college. 01:40:30
But as I've gotten older, I've realized the value in it and the value for telling the stories over time. 01:40:38
And I've been very encouraged by what I've heard tonight from the other Planning Commission members, where several of them have 01:40:47
said this is an important thing that we cannot forget. 01:40:52
And but I often feel when we do surveys, let's put out for public comment and we get surveys back from the community and basically 01:40:59
it's quite heritage, Why should we invest any money or effort in that? 01:41:07
And so people like myself are saying, Oh my gosh, we're going to lose this opportunity because the community is very young and 01:41:16
not. They're more interested in just making a living and raising their families, which I was too for a long time of my life. But 01:41:24
but I guess what I'm saying is sometimes I become quite discouraged and and frustrated with. 01:41:32
Lack of public support. 01:41:42
And city support even. I mean, gosh, Chris''s idea, let's put some stuff on manhole covers was a godsend for me. And and so. 01:41:45
I don't know where I'm going with this, but I'm just saying I'm encouraged tonight with what I've heard from members of the 01:41:56
Commission and when we go out for public comment, I don't feel that encouragement because I feel like I haven't done my job to 01:42:04
sell the story of this community in its rich heritage. And so I I'm struggling with that and so I just I'll end my comments Well, 01:42:11
I I I will say to him like the, I mean I've been here six years now and. 01:42:19
You know, we take this as an individual element and we get it out to the public and get more feedback. 01:43:30
So that's just a suggestion we can do those ones that might be way to highlight it stand alone. One little comment I'll add David 01:43:38
to your, your thing is that I think. 01:43:42
You're there's a lot of complexity I think to what you're you're talking about and in a lot of different reasons I think why 01:43:49
there's probably that sentiment in the community and as a Planning Commission I don't know that we've got all those answers but 01:43:56
but I think we've been pretty consistent and and you know this right that's why you're here. Like we we welcome people to come to 01:44:03
meetings and I I feel like generally at least while I've been on a Planning Commission. 01:44:10
We've we've generally tried to listen you know and and and do our best to balance our role as the Planning Commission and and what 01:44:18
citizens are brought forth to us and there's there have been changes in the city things that have been done because of citizen 01:44:24
engagement and I think that I. 01:44:30
I worry sometimes. And the way things are right now is there's a lot of civic engagement on Facebook or social media of of getting 01:44:38
in a Facebook group and complaining or or. 01:44:44
Yeah or yeah, after the fact and and rather than and then if they find something that's frustrating in the city generally people 01:44:51
that get involved and get educated on the reasons why something exists and then engage in how can I make changes to this and 01:44:58
really engage. I think generally that's effective now. I can't say that it's always effective. I I am still hoping David that we 01:45:06
get to review here as a Planning Commission what you were talking about the bike lane on hold the way Rd. 01:45:13
That you know like that would be great. We'd love to review that. And so I can only speak from the Planning Commission's 01:45:21
perspective, but we want more people to come, but we have a pretty empty meeting today and this is pretty consistent, right. So I 01:45:28
I appreciate that and I, as I said before I, I, I know that we're all here trying to our very best and we're all with the right 01:45:35
motives and I do believe that but but I think there's some we do have a communication problem. 01:45:42
We seriously do and and you mentioned that, one of our problems with social media. 01:45:49
It's also probably one of our answers, if we were to look at that right because you're out, people don't have to complain, but how 01:45:56
many people go on, but how how many times have have have the city actually gone and and actually proactively? 01:46:03
Talked about or means or something to talk about what we're trying to do. You know we're you know, no, I'm not sure how many 01:46:11
people know what's going, what's going on north of the Connector. I have a huge plans for that but I don't think you could find 01:46:17
some on the street that really knows. 01:46:23
You ask them and that ought to be out there. People don't know about that. I think also that the lakefront, you know, the 01:46:29
lakefront process was really good, but it just, it was, it happened and it stopped and it needs to. I think it needs to continue. 01:46:35
I think we need to at least at least have a. 01:46:41
I know the city has a page, not a group page on a page where they put out things and then there ought to be a public relations 01:46:47
kind of an article out there that happens that we're putting out some and more than a weekly basis. Well, and if I could just jump 01:46:55
in, this probably isn't a forum to say it, but I have felt for some time that the nitty, the nitty, the city needs an official 01:47:02
spokesperson and that spokesperson needs to be responding in a very positive. 01:47:10
Accurate way. 01:47:18
On things that come up on social media, while Sullivan's here, I just want to say. 01:47:20
One of the several things I really appreciated about Sullivan. Not so much in the recent past, but. 01:47:26
Months ago, year ago and so on. 01:47:33
Nothing that I appreciate that that came out wrong, but nothing that I appreciate about you recently, so but but what I have loved 01:47:37
about Sullivan in the past is when people brought up a question on social media that related to water or floods or why is the 01:47:43
water dirty or whatever, he was immediately there giving correct information and that just kind of stopped a lot of the stuff that 01:47:50
can percolate. 01:47:57
In social media. And so I have felt for a long time, the city needs an official spokesperson that can jump right on these things. 01:48:04
When when through social media, it appears that people know what they're talking about and they don't. To have somebody come right 01:48:11
out and say, look folks, this is the way it is and and and it's accurate. That's idea number one, by the way. 01:48:18
I do apologize by by law we have to stick to the to the agenda and so and so if you want to give me a call I'm happy to but we we 01:48:26
do have to stick to the heritage stuff. Yeah. No I it's an overwhelming law we just we just have to stick to it. So thank you. 01:48:33
If you do want to e-mail me, David, I can set something up. 01:48:42
Yeah, Dave, I just want to thank you sincerely for for your comment. I think community engagement is really important and I I 01:48:45
promise you we're going to focus on that and make sure that we we make improvements in that area. 01:48:52
I guess maybe to end this part of the work session? I mean, I'm pretty sure I'm allowed to show these right mornings. 01:49:00
This was actually part of the heritage General plan was supposed to highlight these these areas. So these are. 01:49:09
Out there now on the train station. These are historical images. 01:49:16
That were gathered from various databases and with the help of people here in the community and the heritage Commission and 01:49:21
everything, we were able to put these these pictures together and they really looked awesome out there on the train station. So I 01:49:26
think we're making good strides. We just got to keep keep up the good work and and like David says keep involving people and keep 01:49:32
keep doing all we can. 01:49:37
So we're excited to at some point be able to showcase those officially to the community but I think, I think I think we're moving 01:49:44
a good direction and and we're committed to to keeping doing doing a good job so. 01:49:51
Just comment on the the bigger picture. So when you first started talking on a general plan updates, there were two thoughts that 01:49:59
I had while you're talking about that. One is I I guess just just one is a lot of a lot of what we you know the talked about this 01:50:07
last year like the whole Clegg farm development there was a lot of discussion about density right and what's what is low density 01:50:15
and and I think we had talked about needing some better definitions. 01:50:22
We all had a different expectation of what low density meant, you know, and as a city we didn't have that definition as as well as 01:51:02
it that would have that would have provided a lot of clarity in that case. So because like the moderate dense in, My question now 01:51:10
I want to look into is like when the state's talking about moderate income housing, right? Yeah, I believe moderate income housing 01:51:18
is. So you have your area median income and then there's a percentage. 01:51:25
That is usually dedicated to to housing out of people's salary. So you take the area median income and then 80%, you take it down 01:51:33
to 80% of that and then that 30% that is leftover from that 80%. This is making sense that that is. 01:51:42
Let me try again. So there's. 01:51:55
So everyone meaning income, right? Yeah. And then there's 80% of what that number is, right? That is the, the moderate income 01:51:59
portion. And then of that 80 percent, 30% of of what is is the remainder is what they should be able to spend on housing at a 01:52:07
maximum, be it renting or paying off your mortgage. 01:52:14
So let's use the real figures. I'd say if our area, what was it called, median income were $60,000, right, Right. So then we take 01:52:22
80% of that $48,000 and then we're saying 30% of that and I don't know what that is. 01:52:31
18,000, yeah, a year. Yeah, 14. It's what's expected to be spent on housing or something. Yeah. Usually, like, no, no more than 01:52:43
that should be spent on housing. 01:52:48
Obviously we're not. We're not meeting. 01:52:55
Data that would actually be a good training too, so we might want to reach out. We'll get there. 01:53:32
OK guys, that's all I got. 01:53:38
Any other questions for Brian? 01:53:41
So what are you expecting from us next comments for you guys to look at this based on this edits, anything that you want to 01:53:43
recommend? I took down some of the comments that you gave me tonight. We'll try to create some new strategies and then we'll we'll 01:53:49
represent them the next time and see if we captured your thoughts adequately. 01:53:55
But yeah, this morning, but and from residents, people who are listening to the meeting. 01:54:03
Thanks, Brian. You're welcome. 01:54:08
Thank you guys. 01:54:11
OK, let's go to our Commission members reports and ex parte discussion or disclosures. 01:54:13
Does anybody have any reports or? 01:54:22
And so the same company that we're going to hire to do the central corridor plan, the one that Brian put together, we'll also do a 01:55:05
breakoff project and do a landscape design for, for the Overpass and that will include the areas immediately around that and that 01:55:10
that's kind of more of an insane project. I don't know if you have anything else on it. 01:55:16
We summarized the parallel and in essence, yeah, so like sit down, we find we have something for design plan doing this stuff 01:55:24
designed this, this is career get started, designed this fiscal year for for use public comments. And then of course currently 01:55:32
it's in our budget for next fiscal year to actually implement the, the design. We have a ballpark of what their cost of shipping. 01:55:39
But of course it's all based on drivens, based on what we would anticipate seeing when the. 01:55:47
Emphasis is will impact in terms of a lot of use and also maintenance use as well especially on something like that great. I think 01:55:54
that's like a good example of an opportunity where like the public may think that they weren't hurt on some things. You know, just 01:56:02
saying like here's the plan, here's estimated timeline things like that and this might and I and this might be another you know 01:56:09
the answer right now but is there like for the I guess before like the actual landscape plan gets gets implemented. 01:56:17
There's a way to go in and like maybe we'll just remove weeds or spray or anything like that or I don't know, you don't have to 01:56:24
answer that now, but. 01:56:28
I mean currently our our goal is just to mitigate that. I mean if we the the original plan with the overpass, did it include a a 01:56:32
seating like a a native seed mix on the on the the? 01:56:40
Slopes, the embankment slopes just to help mitigate any erosion, so we don't want to like necessarily. 01:56:48
Kill off all the vegetation that could be rooted in holding back the soils, but we are definitely trying to mitigate that the best 01:56:57
we can with. 01:57:01
While we wait. 01:57:07
Sounds good. 01:57:09
To also have sponsor. 01:57:41
Clean update here. They have a series of communities along the Wasatch Front and they like to be very visible and community 01:57:44
involvement and so they kind of adopted the Vineyard Clean Up day Saturday. They'll also be providing some T-shirts and some free 01:57:52
tickets to these games on the 30th, these games the following Saturday. So it's just another sponsor, another involved. 01:58:01
Entity out there that's partnering with with me. 01:58:11
And just a quick question. So we're moving forward on doing the corridor plan. Does that mean that the wetlands have been 01:58:17
delineated? 01:58:20
No, OK. 01:58:25
And then coming up in the first weekend of June is. 01:58:30
Vineyard, what is it? What's the efficient name of it? Summer celebration or summer days? Vineyard days and the Friday of the two 01:58:35
day event. And I think maybe it might not be more than two days and I don't know, but at least two days, Friday and Saturday. The 01:58:43
Friday portion of that will be Vineyard Heritage Day when we will have a big celebration at Grove Park as we've done in previous 01:58:51
years. So that's that's going to be posted on just serve as well in the next couple of days. 01:58:59
For volunteers. Didn't need a lot of volunteers on that Friday to help out. 01:59:07
Have we been able to figure out the path forward for? David Told away Rd. request of who that should go to next. Yeah so that's 01:59:15
down to our consultant. So all for planning and design is doing our active transportation plan. 01:59:22
Within that plan, he committed to do breakout projects and I think there's three those are 555 breakout design projects. And so we 01:59:30
asked him to take the Holdaway road bike Blvd. Concept and to provide an actual design. 01:59:37
And so we're setting up a meeting. I sent an e-mail to David and so what's I did right before this meeting. So for for us to get 01:59:46
together and and and to and to talk about it. So when once, once that's once we have a design then we'll we'll bring the design 01:59:52
back back to you and and have David here to both David's David Foster the consultant and David Loray. So that that's for route. 01:59:59
And then ultimately because that is public right away that would go to the City Council for for adoption. So you provide a 02:00:06
recommendation on that one. 02:00:13
Thank you. 02:00:20
Can I tell you more about that too? It also got reviewed by the Bicycle Advisory Commission and they're working on providing 02:00:23
comments that they're going to forward to the City Council on on that concept, so. 02:00:28
Great. Thank you. Any staff reports then? 02:00:35
Just some quick the city waterfront plan was discussed on the Utah Lake Commission podcast and I think the plan was to to have 02:00:40
that go. 02:00:47
Yeah, be posted during their own birthday, so. 02:00:55
Look for that. 02:01:00
I have something as well. It's probably take me about 2 1/2 hours with an org chart to be attached later. 02:01:02
Now just a quick update about the downtown venture town within the front of our station. My name has been asked several times. 02:01:10
This the Planning Commission, but it's moving forward. The train is leaving the shuttle or the station. 02:01:20
When is the train getting to the station? The train is currently, you know, and it's like your last train from. 02:01:27
Kind of ready for customers. UTA hasn't completed all their other items yet. So in essence it's not ready for operations per se. 02:02:10
But there's a way you can see that a lot of things are there. The connection to all the way the connection over from the 02:02:20
translation to Main Street, so shy of about 40 feet is complete, the connection to connection to. 02:02:29
Being your connector is hinged on the traffic signal being put up and that's that's being amazing for progress we've had in the 02:02:40
obstacles. I'll say like that based on our designs and legalities in terms of land ownership and land use for that to be done. But 02:02:48
we've made some gains from there and moving forward on that as well as. 02:02:55
Again, another item that's been brought up during Planning Commission is there a connections, patrol connections from the South 02:03:04
and from the north on that and the intent is to have a retail connection going from the South side underneath the Vineyard 02:03:10
Overpass, Vineyard Connected Overpass as well as a connection on the north side. 02:03:16
When they're back connection on the north side, there'll be in essence so just just north of Vineyard Connector and then it'll be 02:03:23
South of the building, the future buildings to be built and it will connect directly into the ETA temporary parking lot and that 02:03:28
then that trails that that. 02:03:34
Tell access is going to be permanent. No, that's not. That will be a temporary. That will be permanent connection as well. 02:03:40
So one of my questions in on that is once that road is right, you know as you're coming off the bridge and you can turn right and 02:03:49
go towards the train station, what is that intersection going to be and is there going to be? 02:03:55
Like I would assume a traffic signal or something at some point. And then to me the real importance of having that pedestrian and 02:04:03
by path, whatever that goes under the bridge, is anybody that lives in that area that's going to try to walk to the front runner 02:04:10
and cross. I've always been concerned about the pedestrian connection there on 8th N getting from the South, you know, the water's 02:04:17
edge, you know, vineyard to the Town Center. 02:04:24
And I realize that's maybe going to develop overtime, but I'm curious what that's going to look like when that gets open. So then 02:04:32
we kind of having connection like so on. 02:04:38
Traffic signal and of the four way traffic signal through the three lines will be operational because when your connector is going 02:04:44
to extend past that and that is at that particular intersection is going to be professional crossings, signalized pedestrian 02:04:51
crossings for killer pedestrians across there as well as the other profession crossing to get to ETA station will be underneath 02:04:58
the interconnector over the past and that's in essence and that's also why we have the way finding signs. 02:05:05
That's going to direct that collect direct people to the to the right locations and along with that way find sounds UTI providers. 02:05:11
When it provides the designs, they put down like the distance and time, like minutes. So if you so for example someone's at the 02:05:26
intersection of Main Street Vineyard Connector. 02:05:31
They'll see like the way Feinstein says go underneath the bridge is 4 minutes to get to the Vineyard to ETA Station. We're going 02:05:37
over the Going crossing Main Street, crossing Greener Connector to use the northern trail to the construction site. You'll see 02:05:45
that is actually a longer trail, longer. It takes longer to do that. So we're emphasizing to take people underneath the Vineyard 02:05:53
connector on the southern trail as much as possible. And of course there's that switch back to. 02:06:01
When you're growing up. 02:06:10
On the southern trail does that switch likely to see the top of in your connector and we've been cognizant about that to ensure 02:06:12
that we put another sign in there. It says do not use this to get to familiarization because with that we'd be we would anticipate 02:06:17
people will get to the top see train there and say I'm going to be late and decide to cross the street of where you go and put put 02:06:23
themselves in harm's way. 02:06:28
What's the timing for some of those like traffic controls at that intersection? How does that correspond with the timing of the 02:06:36
opening of the train station? So bottom line, the train station will not be that train station location will not be operational 02:06:44
open until the traffic signal administrator in 800 N is installed with all the pedestrians with the pedestrian crossings as well. 02:06:53
I mean, the only thing that we may allow for that formerization to be open for is if we can get access. 02:07:01
Underneath the bridge. 02:07:10
To make that final connection, but I doubt that will occur because ETA controls that access and ETA will also have to make that 02:07:14
connection. So currently we're working on building the trail connections and with the pavings to get to the most furthest point 02:07:20
that we're allowed to before UTA access is required to to take an essence, take down the fence, pay the arrest of their trail, and 02:07:27
put the fence back up. 02:07:34
So the timing, I anticipate timing for all this to happen when we get their access firm and so forth would be we're anticipating 02:07:42
the end of May. 02:07:47
That's where we test paybook again when I actually, when we actually get the access permit from U dot to make their connections 02:07:52
into the Main Street, connect to Main Street and then you're connected with the singleizations and so forth. We'll actually in 02:07:58
essence the timer will start for us to actually get the ball rolling on all of this. 02:08:04
And hopefully we can get that set up for like a May or June timeframe, but we might even just try to dedicate the meeting to that. 02:08:45
So we can, we can keep that. Yeah, yeah, we can invite the public out and just, you know, make sure it goes out on social media 02:08:50
and so everyone else. 02:08:55
That'll be great. I think we're all excited to see that and. 02:09:02
Definitely want to make sure that they are following the vision of the the plan that's been approved. I think that's what we're 02:09:07
all going to be looking for is. 02:09:11
Are they executing what? You know what, We all approved and discussed. So OK. Anything else from anybody before? OK, then we will 02:09:15
adjourn our meeting. Thank you. 02:09:20
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We're ready, cash. OK. 00:00:02
All right. Then I will call to order our Vineyard Planning Commission meeting. 00:00:07
Although I did not ask somebody to give us an invocation or inspirational thought or Pledge of Allegiance. 00:00:14
Anthony, would you? 00:00:20
Like to do one of those 3? Sure. 00:00:23
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America. 00:00:28
And to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. 00:00:33
I know I got that. 00:00:45
Thank you. All right. So we'll open up the the open session part of the agenda, this time dedicated for public comments, if 00:00:47
there's anybody in the public that has a public comment that they'd like to share on something that's not already on the agenda. 00:00:56
Feel free to stand and. 00:01:06
Make a comment. 00:01:09
OK. 00:01:12
Minutes, review and approval. 00:01:14
Did we have any minutes to approve? I don't see any on here that's anything. OK, then let's go right on to our business items, 00:01:19
Item 4.1, discussion and action on the Lakefront Trail pocket park. 00:01:24
Chris Wilson, Public Works director, Thank you, Planning Commission. 00:01:34
So. 00:01:40
This Wednesday we had taken this concept to City Council to get some feedback and approval and also wanted to bring it through 00:01:42
through this public meeting for approvals as well. 00:01:48
I don't know if cash are we able to share? 00:01:56
I'll plug in now. I just didn't know if you're going to share the agenda. 00:02:00
You might need to come to this desk. I'm having a hard time switching to HDMI. Is that possible? 00:02:30
There we go. There we go. 00:03:28
Sorry about that delay. 00:03:30
So just some background on this project. You can see an overall map here where this is located. 00:03:33
This. 00:03:40
Sits at the junction between the Shores subdivision and the James Bay subdivision. There was a small remnant of city and state 00:03:43
lands located in this little triangle when the trail was extended along James Bay. 00:03:53
As you can see in this blown up. 00:04:04
View here. 00:04:08
So it was Public Works was asked to put together a plan to improve this area as we've been looking at beautifying the the 00:04:09
lakefront in general concern here was just the weeds and. 00:04:16
Other things from the surrounding communities. 00:04:24
And a desire to potentially make a resting place for those going along the trail. So this this proposal. 00:04:27
This is how it was presented to the City Council. The proposal included adding five trees that are similar to what you see here, 00:04:37
Columbia Pine, more specifically a Bosnian Pine. These specific trees are located currently in the over by legend on this is the 00:04:44
small Little. 00:04:52
Pocket Open Space, that's right by Vineyard Rd. And Center St. 00:05:01
The proposal was then to add some sumac some. This is a ground cover that we would put in between the trees and the original 00:05:07
proposal was to put wood chips. The council asked us to look at some other options, something that wouldn't be as loose that could 00:05:14
get kicked out onto the trail. It seemed as though like a gravel was not as favorable as well. So another option they were 00:05:22
currently looking into is is like a decomposed granite. 00:05:29
That would be a more compacted material that would be less likely to kick up, that wouldn't track out onto the trail as much and 00:05:38
the concept would be that that interior space maybe something similar to this where we could. 00:05:45
Have the bench in the middle of that and then have a border going around where we would still do the wood chip around the ground 00:05:54
cover in the in the trees. 00:05:59
So with with that, we'll turn it over to any questions that you might have for me. 00:06:05
Is there gonna be a fence around it? Where other properties about? 00:06:12
So currently there's there are no fences. 00:06:16
And usually in this situation this the city wouldn't. 00:06:21
Offense this. 00:06:25
The vegetation would act as a barrier. I know the property owner on the north side intends on putting a fence along their property 00:06:28
there. 00:06:33
Would we account for gates if they want egress ingress onto the trail from their properties? Yeah, there. There will be some gaps 00:06:39
here and there that we could provide that ability. Yes. Thank you. 00:06:45
I know the the owner to the north has expressed that that he would like a gate in there. 00:06:54
How big is the space is this Chris I so and you can see the dimensions and maybe you can't see them across the top. It's about 52 00:07:00
feet. 00:07:05
And about 80 feet this way. 00:07:10
Divided by two. 00:07:16
One one reason that the trees were pulled in was supposed to that we we wouldn't hinder any access because we know the the 00:07:21
resident just to the east uses that to access the path that that portion of the yard. 00:07:28
So there are residents back here on the east side. 00:07:38
As well as on the Northside, Yep. Yeah. So it touches kind of three and at the very point in the South and then you have east and 00:07:41
north. 00:07:44
So how did this request? 00:07:48
How was the city even entertained? This idea as a pocket part versus other places around helmet might also be? 00:07:51
Doing that, we're doing Waterfront master plan and part of the Waterfront Master plan is asking us to look at like every quarter 00:08:00
mile trying to provide a place for shade place, Yeah. And so this is honestly a spot that that we've looked at in the past, the 00:08:06
Waterfront Master plan, what one thing they wanted us to do is try to work with the both property owners to get an actual trail 00:08:12
through there and that that's probably not very likely. 00:08:18
But it does show improvements here and so we've we've kind of identified this area as as a great spot for Parka Park anyway and so 00:08:25
that this would be just kind of that first implementation of the waterfront master plan. 00:08:31
It wouldn't be at the request of the property owner that we're doing part of the master plan. 00:08:38
That's the emphasis behind it, because I'm just thinking about what precedents are we studying. 00:08:44
For the rest of the Community, if there are so-called unimproved growth. 00:08:50
For pocket art potentials. 00:08:55
You know, we took that this request went to the City Council and the City Council thought, I thought it was a good one. 00:09:34
And there's some low framing. This is kind of like a low hanging fruit opportunity. We do have funding in our arborist budget to 00:09:39
to plant trees within the city. And so this is kind of an opportunity we thought OK hey we we do have some the current budget that 00:09:47
that could be applied to this and and not be a very costly or impactful. These trees are consistent with our tree plant in the 00:09:54
city. Yeah, we're we may, we may. 00:10:02
We're still. 00:10:10
There was a few members as we reviewed this arborist suggested these trees, but we we are going back and looking and verifying 00:10:12
that these are the best trees for this location. So we will we will be verifying that before we solidify the exact tree. 00:10:21
Is there an estimated cost on what it would cost to do what? Yeah, right. With this plan as as it's shown with where we originally 00:10:31
were thinking of doing the mulch, the wood chip there we were, we were estimating about $2000 for those improvements obviously 00:10:37
plus our staff time. 00:10:44
We've we haven't been able to get pricing together and availability for the the the crushed granite or decomposed granite. But as 00:10:51
soon as we do, we'll be able to update some of those numbers and what that cost may be. We also talked about doing a pad concrete 00:11:01
or extending the asphalt to provide a pad for the bench. So that may still be part of that or we may just do all. 00:11:10
All granite. 00:11:21
Truss rock there. 00:11:22
Would there be a trash can and maybe a dog back station as well? Yeah, that was a that was a request by council as well as to 00:11:25
provide a a dog bag, state station and a receptacle here. 00:11:32
Yeah. 00:11:40
You know just it's up for consideration tonight. Just a quick comment or question. There was some scout troop or something that I 00:12:21
heard of that was making benches for places in the city. Maybe this would be a good location for something like that. I. 00:12:28
You know on the the downside of the slope and he was he he was asking that we considered you know. 00:13:10
If we're removing some of those to cut one of those up and maybe do like a flat cut on top. So I mean that's not the potential and 00:13:16
there's like a free bench or something that we can get through the youth council or some other organization, you know there's 00:13:21
there's probably some unique opportunities out there. 00:13:26
Putting my other hat on and from the heritage perspective. 00:13:32
We're always looking for opportunities to create or present the design of heritage in any benches or trash receptacles or anything 00:13:36
like that to have like a consistent theme maybe along the trail, you know and so that wouldn't work so well probably with the log 00:13:43
bench, but it it would be very easy to do in a metal bench, you know, if if that were pursued at all. So I just like to put that 00:13:51
out there that and if you're going to design A bench. 00:13:58
And it would be metal. We'd like to have some input into that. What maybe some design of that could be? So what is your next 00:14:06
meeting, Heritage meeting not until the first Tuesday of May? 00:14:12
What you guys sound like we have some time on the bench. So I mean if if you wanted to what what I would suggest is I'm just like 00:14:20
a citizen can can bring a proposal the heritage Commission if you have like a design style or something like that that that you 00:14:25
would encourage some elements that you would like incorporated into. 00:14:30
You know future furniture and stuff that we put out, right. I you know that that might be a good work session for for you guys to 00:14:36
have and then just provide a recommendation and then the City Council could consider that. Yeah especially along the trail 00:14:41
systems. You know it's it would be nice to have a consistent theme depth throughout if if we could but it wouldn't work in a log 00:14:47
bench probably. 00:14:52
Well, I'm ready for the log. We could just roll back down the hill if we don't like it. 00:14:58
Are we ready for any wayfinding signage right now for our trail system or is that still a ways off as far as planning that all 00:15:04
'cause it? This would be this and any other stopping points would be a good places to put that. 00:15:10
Mr. Madora, state engineer, also surprisingly, needs a long arm to reach the mic. 00:15:19
You know Einstein's actually with the. 00:15:25
When it comes to the front liner station, it's going up on downtown Vintage. We partner with ETA and also MAG in order for some 00:15:30
designs to be done. And we're actually got some ones that have been using the mag template, UTA provider, some more concepts 00:15:38
specifically for the front organizations. And we intend to put those up, see how they're done and then we're playing them up 00:15:45
expeditiously in order to meet their requirements for the front runner station opening. And then with that kind of feel and. 00:15:53
Implement those type of Wi-Fi signs throughout the city as well so they can. They're consistent. I know Brian has been working 00:16:02
with our friends in Orem as well to ensure that the signs that permanent signs were planning signs we have up. It is consistent 00:16:08
with our friends in our in London. 00:16:13
Thanks for the update. Yeah. So I mean my my thought on this is sounds like we covered like consulting the Heritage Commission for 00:16:20
bench ideas, making sure there's a dog waste station there and then when it's appropriate. I wouldn't want to rush it and have a 00:16:26
sign that didn't fit the others, but when it's appropriate, putting away signing, fine there. 00:16:33
About. 00:17:12
Doing a design for manhole covers for sewer, storm drain and such. And so the foundry that we that most of that products come 00:17:13
through is presented some options if we want to do some customized things like that. So that they've been the heritage 00:17:21
Commission's been working on putting together a design and maybe when they're done with that, that's something that could be 00:17:28
implemented into other things as well and maybe some standards put with the benches and other things so. 00:17:36
Very cool. 00:17:44
So, so I I like the concept of utilizing open space that the city owns and otherwise doesn't have a a purpose to it I guess like 00:17:46
here, but I'm wondering if. 00:17:52
I guess I'm just concerned this isn't precedent setting or it is and will continue following this because what I heard you say, 00:17:59
Morgan, is that if the land, if a private landowner. 00:18:04
Has city. 00:18:10
Land behind their fence, let's say, and it's just open and it's just dirt right now. Anyone could come in and request the city to 00:18:12
put something nice in there on the ground, cover trees, benches, or whatever. 00:18:19
I'm even thinking just out behind the city building here, there's a block of dirt out there. That's. 00:18:27
Just there. And I'm just wondering is there anything the city could do to improve that? 00:18:34
I don't just can I comment on that a little bit. All right. So with a lot of the places in the city that do have land behind homes 00:18:39
are are part of a bigger plan like that. That for instance would be part of the plan that we're trying to do for that that whole 00:18:47
wetland area or for the areas behind the shores and such those those are all part of a bigger plan too. So, so this would fit into 00:18:54
that. So yeah, I would I would think that this would fit into that and then I guess. 00:19:02
A question that I would have for staff is. 00:19:11
Do we have a lot of spaces like this where the city owns, like, I don't know, 1/10 of an acre behind people's homes? What's it 00:19:12
called orphan, orphan space or? 00:19:17
I mean this is part of the trail corridor and then the trail we found the alignment would be better you know moving it further to 00:19:25
the to the West. I mean you know trust receives a lot more these requests, but we don't receive a ton of like pocket park type 00:19:31
requests. I mean that we have had the resident there bring up the piece that you brought to him. So that that would be a great. 00:19:38
You know, a little spot for us to look at as a city and see if we can improve it. It obviously does help if it's part of a plan as 00:19:45
this is part of kind of like the waterfront master plan of of adding pocket parks along the trail and shade. It seemed to fit in 00:19:51
and so and yeah, and it wasn't a huge budget item. 00:19:58
So I think you know like something like that that space out there too. I mean those are definitely areas that the that the city 00:20:05
can can look at. I would definitely recommend that we get the the open space corridor master plan in place. Brian as you know he, 00:20:11
he provided the foundational document through his graduate studies and we still have a really good plan that hasn't officially 00:20:17
been approved. So we are moving into the the official planning of that. We're going to hire a consultant and having our first 00:20:23
meeting I believe in two weeks. 00:20:29
To choose a consultant we're aiming for next Thursday, well that next Thursday. So yeah so we'll be moving on that process so like 00:20:36
those kind of things it would be nice to have the master plan in place just so whatever we do our improvements fit in with a 00:20:43
comprehensive plan and kind of you know they're they're not like a little one offs but still it's up to the if the City Council 00:20:50
said pull the trigger on it then we would come back to the Planning Commission with the site plan and we we go forward with it so. 00:20:57
I actually think it's great like I I think it would actually I actually like the President of of utilizing these little pockets of 00:21:06
of rather than have it being you know a patch of weed. So if if someone were to find you know a piece that's not being utilized 00:21:12
and it can be to the benefit of the city and it's, it fits within all the you know the budget and you know it makes sense, checks 00:21:19
the boxes and I think it's great you know to have these little pockets. 00:21:26
Fill in these little parts of our city with. 00:21:34
Small amenities, you know, small improvements. 00:21:38
So I think it would be great to do this and and and maybe even set the precedent. And I think that there's a really cool 00:21:42
storytelling opportunity with it. Like I what I've kind of been running through my head is just like, what can we do with that 00:21:47
little? 00:21:51
That's the the edge of the lake or something that I guess what I would the the the next layer I would ask on this is what what 00:22:30
additional meaning can we apply here you know that that adds value to our. 00:22:37
You know that and into its that location being on this on the lakefront but it's up a little bit the bench is kind of cool because 00:22:46
you probably you know depending on the trees you might be able to you know see the lake have prospect up but it's bigger than I 00:22:51
than I realized like that's it's a pretty large amount of space So that's the only other question too is I wonder the scale of 00:22:57
what we've drawn there like. 00:23:03
Like the box of the bench. It might even be big enough to have more than one bench. Like the one bench might feel really small. 00:23:10
And that big of a space is something. Maybe you have to. I don't know. Yeah, So I almost. These are things that like. 00:23:18
Yeah, it could be pretty easy to, yeah. So I almost wonder if like maybe a scale. 00:23:26
Drawing like I love the idea. I think it's great to do. 00:23:31
To fill it in and and I think that the crush granite it's a good idea. 00:23:36
The only thing on like the the vegetation is is is to think about like just make keeping visibility on the ground for safety 00:23:42
purposes and everything like that too. I would I would say it's a good recommendation as well and we've had if I'm not mistaken 00:23:48
we've had history there of. 00:23:54
Drug traffic, you know, more seedy side of the population along the lakefront. 00:24:01
And I'm just wondering if by building something nice if that would attract more activity of that nature, homelessness or anything 00:24:07
like that that that we wouldn't want to create. So that's that's part of the history you don't want representative. 00:24:16
So I mean I I can think of like locations in the Northwest like both in Portland and Seattle where I spent time that they would 00:24:27
they would do a lot of these little pocket parks and some would have like. 00:24:32
It would have like an exercise theme like it would have these like outdoor like equipment for people. Maybe that's an idea along 00:24:38
the trail and it's got like this like structure for people to use for for exercise or yeah, I don't know. You know or it's or 00:24:44
again just kind of storytelling aspect or there's. 00:24:50
And stop and activate it. I think that will help hopefully to keep. 00:25:30
I think, I think more people going there's. I think it's better than, you know is this gonna be lighted at night? No. OK. 00:25:36
Well, they need to be irrigated or is there water in the area? No, there's not. So that we will have to do some temporary water 00:25:43
provisions. So we will come up with some bladders that will be able to establish the trees. It may take. It will take some extra 00:25:49
staff time to do that, but we'll have other places in the city that will routinely be visiting as well with this kind of a similar 00:25:55
situation, establishing trees. 00:26:02
Arborist thinks about two years for establishment period on these and then they should be able to be self sustained without a 00:26:09
constant water supply. 00:26:13
Another idea I was thinking about too. I know we, I think we talked about this when we were looking at the public works building 00:26:18
and in relationship to our plant and our tree manual and that our water wise plants and local scapes. Kind of a lot of things 00:26:25
we've talked about in the city and it'd be cool to have somewhere like a little demonstration. 00:26:32
Type of the local skates scheme so that that could give the residents an idea of what to do at their house. That's been talked 00:27:23
about. Well, hopefully it will come through. 00:27:28
So it sounds like there's a lot to consider and I guess maybe as a way for us to to move forward at least with with the trees you 00:27:35
could, you could approve this with like the you know, with the planting, the the trees and the shrubs is shown with the idea that 00:27:42
that we that we come back maybe with with a few different proposals. 00:27:48
You know, we could, we could workshop it a little bit more if you'd like. 00:27:57
It's up. It's up to you. Yeah. I like the idea too, of the crushed granite. Is that what it's called, rather than the? 00:28:03
The wood chips, they seem to blow and move around, but so something a little more permanent. 00:28:10
Seems good too and and then this would be a good one. It's not not a public hearing, but to open it up and David probably has some 00:28:17
comments and then Tay too to see if you know any comments. Got the motion to open a public hearing. 00:28:23
Public comments, right? Yeah. You don't need a public area. Yeah, we've been. It's an official notice, public hearing, but you can 00:28:32
just open up for a couple, then we'll open it up for public comments. 00:28:36
Thanks. I just want to get an idea of the relative size of it. So we say it's 50 feet wide, 80 feet long on one side. How wide is 00:28:49
this room? 00:28:54
20. 00:29:02
Is it? It's 40 at least. 00:29:06
468101214, so so just 32 by 30 is more than the width of this room so this is a good size space. So I would I would suggest them 00:29:10
that you're drawing any trees in your bench or not to scale or one and then #2, it really would be a good place to put some large 00:29:18
piece of equipment that we've been trying to find a place for Tim. 00:29:25
It was like vintage farm equipment. Yeah, exactly. We have some things they're being stored right now off site. Well, we need to 00:29:34
find homes for pretty quickly. 00:29:39
A good place? 00:29:45
Take your data. 00:29:48
I would, I would say. I've seen. 00:29:52
How the tractors are treated that are in high traffic areas with rocks through windows, I imagine this something like that could. 00:29:55
I mean it is a little more secluded area so hopefully if if we put something there I'd want it to be something that was not 00:30:00
fragile. 00:30:05
Yeah. 00:30:13
So I mean obviously it's on, it's on the agenda for us to take an action tonight. 00:30:18
I mean, maybe a month. 00:30:57
So it's it's not a rush if we need time to talk about it, if we wanna have all the elements together at one time. 00:30:59
However you'd like to see it. 00:31:09
I and maybe it's just I haven't like David a little bit. I'm a little hung up on the scale and and wanting maybe just a little 00:31:12
more specific plan just to take into account the scale and make sure we're not missing an an opportunity or. 00:31:19
Or it's going too small. It's pretty close to scale. The trees are 10 foot OK on center. The the trees themselves, the shapes may 00:31:27
not be quite to scale but location of the center of them is to scale. They're 10 foot off of the property lines and such. But 00:31:35
maybe the shapes of the like, the actual size of what that tree will be, it may be a little bit more than that but it's not that 00:31:42
far off. Early off, yeah, the the bench, definitely I threw in there as a box. 00:31:50
But I think there's an opportunity we could, I mean, I I would be willing to to put forward a motion, but one of the things that I 00:31:58
think we could put in there is that you know, if it's if there's room for more than one bench and it makes sense. 00:32:04
Especially if we've got groups willing to donate or build or something like that, I think that makes a lot of sense. 00:32:10
So that would be like a condition to it. We we approve the, yeah, I think there's a few things in there that I mean if I and I 00:32:20
will make a motion if the time is free, but is there any other discussion? OK. 00:32:27
Well then I'll make a motion to approve staff to proceed with the Lakeside Pocket Park project as proposed, with the additional 00:32:34
guidance of the decomposed granite for the ground cover. 00:32:40
When it when it's open, or soon after getting the dog station, or a wastebasket when wayfinding sign goes in, that would be a good 00:32:48
place for it as well. And then. 00:32:53
If there's if there's room for additional benches and we find ways to obtain it from donors or heritage Commission or whatever it 00:33:01
might be, to program it accordingly. 00:33:07
The end Then we'll bring it back to you. 00:33:14
Oh yeah. 00:33:17
I'm OK trusting staff with it, but. 00:33:20
We'll see if there's a second part. 00:33:24
That was a long motion. It was so if I understood it, I can second it. 00:33:28
Yeah, the 2nd pushes it to a motion. If you don't then it'll die. If you want me to just recap it, it's as is. Plus dog station, 00:33:36
decomposed granite, additional benches if there's room, and there's one other. 00:33:43
Yeah. And I would just say and incorporating any heritage elements possible and that and that's the piece that I think would be 00:33:52
good because that that's more upsetting the the standard. So that's more of like a planning policy thing and so we we would bring 00:33:56
that. 00:34:00
But we would be talking about more holistically in the city, not just the Parka park. 00:34:06
And you don't put that emotion well. Will it be this? No to bring it back? 00:34:11
OK. So Tim, you seconded. Yes. OK, all in favor, aye. 00:34:16
Great. OK. Thank you, Chris. 00:34:22
Item 4.2. Discussion and action on a pump station. 00:34:27
So this is a another site plan approval, so currently we're working on. 00:34:33
Our our water tank and booster station as well as some fencing that will go around the Public Works yard. So what we'll be looking 00:34:41
at here is. 00:34:46
Some aesthetics that will be on the the water tank. 00:34:52
The booster station and and that fencing and getting your input and approvals on that this has gone out to bid. It is something 00:34:56
that council seen and as well and and and we're in that process but with a few items we're just picking out and confirming with 00:35:03
the contractor so. 00:35:10
This is a. 00:35:19
Overview of the site. 00:35:21
The you can see the the bottom of the. 00:35:28
Is the pages 1600 N as it runs into the the Linden Marina, the railroad tracks to the right. The big rectangle is the water tank 00:35:32
with you can see all the Piers that will be inside there for the structure. The box up to the north of it is future expansion as 00:35:40
needed with growth and this. 00:35:49
Structure that's here is the booster station. 00:36:00
And this just kind of demonstrates a lot of the piping that's in there as well. Across the the railroad track side, we've already 00:36:03
installed a black vinyl coated chain link fence that was done as a betterment with the the railroads double, double UTA double 00:36:10
track project. 00:36:17
And what's proposed with the fencing is to match the the West side with that same black vinyl coated chain link and then across 00:36:25
the front the desire is to put. 00:36:32
A A wrought iron look with some intermittent columns. 00:36:42
Rock columns or CMU type columns, so. 00:36:50
To step you through each one of these now. 00:36:54
It's right now in our bid, we have the. 00:36:58
Option to either leave the the face of the the tank structure as just a smooth concrete face. It would just be Gray concrete, just 00:37:01
nothing finished. Look like your driveway but a vertical wall. 00:37:10
The other option that's proposed that we have in the budget is to do this. 00:37:20
Finished look on the side. That would give it like a barn wood or reclaimed wood look, but it would still be just a Gray concrete, 00:37:27
so it would give us some dimension and some better aesthetic feel. 00:37:34
The the one part that may if I go back up to the site plan. So right now we're we're accommodating for all four sides to get that 00:37:42
look in our bid. There is a desire which will probably come back through here. I'm not sure when soon I hope for the project sake 00:37:49
this. 00:37:56
Easter Eastern face Here. We may want to keep it as a smooth wall. 00:38:05
For a future mural or something like that that's that's been desired by council and and and others, what's the difference in cost 00:38:12
there? Because I can think of a few things that are to spend money on than making it water tank pretty. Personally definitely it 00:38:18
is if I remember right like 100 and 5200 thousand. 00:38:25
Dollars, I'd have to look back at the the bid sheet, but I believe it was in that that range. 00:38:33
So I'll move, I'll move forward and get just interrupted if you have other comments, otherwise I'll just keep. I'll keep moving 00:38:44
along. 00:38:46
So here's your elevations of the the booster station. It is proposed to be ACNU building, similar to other Public Works facilities 00:38:53
that we have in the city. 00:38:59
You can see it's a metal metal roof and some metal gabling and then the rest of it is. Is CMU the. 00:39:06
Desires to do a skirt that will be maybe a three foot couple courses up to maybe around 3 foot high. The proposed right now is 00:39:17
that would be a split face block and then above that would be. 00:39:25
A smooth and we would differentiate with two different colors. 00:39:34
Yeah, yeah. So this is a really close up for you. 00:39:39
So right now the desire would be a this charcoal. 00:39:45
Or black, Sorry, black split face on the bottom and then having a smooth Gray on top. 00:39:51
And I can pass it around if you guys want to close. 00:39:57
The color scheme was this Gray look was desired so that we could somewhat match the existing building that there that has Gray and 00:40:04
and some Blues to it, where these colors should should match pretty well. The other desire was to make this. 00:40:14
A differentiated from our other facilities like our wastewater facilities, so across the street. 00:40:25
I don't know that I have a picture of it, but. 00:40:32
And and this is not a good example because this is our Pi comp house, but it is secondary water, but most of our wastewater 00:40:36
buildings are are brown color and so the idea was to to differentiate from those. So this would be identifiable as a different 00:40:45
facility than wastewater. So across the street is one of our list stations that is a brown color I showed this to. 00:40:54
Give you an idea, The metal roofing would be something similar to this. 00:41:03
Black like like this is and then that Gray upper with the lower black split face. 00:41:08
Any questions on on that? 00:41:20
This is a kind of give you an idea of what that chain link will look like, and I believe I have a. 00:41:25
Something better for you to see here. 00:41:32
So this is an example of one of our wastewater facilities here where it's a the black vinyl chain chain link fence. 00:41:35
So that's what's proposed there the the rock columns, this is an example of what that could look like proposed would be using 00:41:42
accenting with this additional charcoal color. 00:41:50
Being all all of that with a that concrete cap on the top. 00:42:01
This is the This is for the columns intermittent along the wrought iron fence, correct? 00:42:09
This is an example of a facility Provo City water tank where they have a similar that wrought iron fence in the front with the 00:42:16
rock columns. They did a like a rock. 00:42:23
Relief on the the street side of their tank, but then the other sides, as you can see are just bare concrete and then the. 00:42:33
The other side of the property, they've just done this black vinyl coated fence, so that can kind of give you an idea of what that 00:42:41
may look like. 00:42:45
And I think that's all I got for you. 00:42:55
If you have any questions besides that, the main water tank was 6,000,000, yeah, it's a 6,000,000 gallon tank. 00:42:58
And then just north of there, I noticed there's a proposed addition. 00:43:07
Another two million. I think right now we've reserved space for up to 3 million just depending on on final build out. 00:43:11
I think 2,000,000 is what we felt was when we did our water master plan that additional 2,000,000 would be adequate, but we 00:43:22
reserve enough for 3 million in case that was what was needed. And the construction of these two tanks or at least one maybe 00:43:29
another will give us the capacity for the growth, anticipated growth of vineyard, yes, per the per the master plan that's that's 00:43:35
what's anticipated, yes. 00:43:42
What is the proposed height of the tank? So the tank will, I think it's about 24 to 26 feet tall with there'll be a little bit of 00:43:51
it buried and some. 00:43:57
Backfill up against it, sloped up against it a couple feet, but overall out of the ground it'll be in that 2022 foot range. 00:44:06
What's right across the street from that in the master plan? 00:44:18
I have to do this S to the South. So right in the master plan, yeah, what's planned to be there. So that's the so so you have the 00:44:23
the the the lift station is there but kind of that that that's also kind of the very tip if you go a little further of the of the 00:44:30
Vineyard downtown area and that specific area would be the what we're calling Geneva Park. And so it'd be about like an 18 to 25 00:44:37
acre park that would be. 00:44:44
That would provide the hills that cap, the material that that needed to be contained. Yeah. Now that that's not the canoe, the 00:44:52
Camus on the other side. So this is less contaminated soil, but still are still required to be capped. So yeah, if you look up 00:44:58
there, so the idea was to turn that into a park with with some hills that that are, you know, so open space we thought about that 00:45:04
could potentially be a great spot for a mountain bike park because you have to have some train there. So we definitely want to 00:45:10
utilize it and. 00:45:16
Yeah, there's been concepts of like Mount Mike parking some sort of like an adventure type park, something exciting that that can 00:45:23
pull people in from the region. So the the yellow line here shows the vignette connector alignment and this is where they'll have 00:45:29
a large overpass structure that would go over the railroad tracks. So that would be sitting. 00:45:35
You know, significantly higher, maybe twice the height of the water tank. 00:45:41
This is the lift station here. 00:45:47
That's currently there. And then I think the bigger question Morgan would be is what is the future of this property right here? 00:45:50
Visually though, this will be a when you come over that overpass, this on one side, parked on the other. 00:46:30
Going to be their first introduction to that if they come that way to downtown. Yeah, exactly. And that's what we're thinking like 00:46:37
the doing potentially have like a mural or some some nice signage on on this that E facing side of the of the water tank. It could 00:46:44
be cool you know and we thought of like maybe there's a way that it's it's a sign that you change and. 00:46:50
You could, you know, you could put like dates for big events and things. So those people on the front runner, they see things that 00:46:58
are going to be, you know, happen inventory. So basically 2526 feet high. How, how long are you thinking of the square footage? 00:47:04
Yeah, it's if I recall correctly, it's like 260 ish feet long. 00:47:11
Almost Football Field. 00:47:20
Is there gonna be any trees or anything on this property? So so currently so if I go back to the photos, so we haven't. 00:47:22
We haven't proposed any landscaping. We've grubbed out all the invasive trees. There was a lot of Russian olive along here. We 00:47:34
left the these existing larger trees that we believe cottonwoods that for now we left them. We haven't proposed any landscaping 00:47:40
here yet because. 00:47:47
The in the next little first of all, we don't have a complete Rd. so we don't really have a defined area, not a curb and gutter to 00:47:54
landscape up against and. 00:47:59
Tends to get difficult to contain landscaping up against asphalt and then. 00:48:05
The other desire to hold off is the Linden Heritage Trail will eventually come through here. They may be a couple years out, but 00:48:10
they'll be there's a 20 foot swath between the where the fence is and the edge of the road and that trail will take over half that 00:48:18
or half of that width. And we would just whatever we end up putting there ends up getting torn out when that happens. So not being 00:48:25
an underdeveloped area. 00:48:33
The desire was to wait on that landscaping until we had a better idea of what would come there. 00:48:40
And based off of the angle of the overpass and the train tracks, I assume that it's going to be very similar to what we have on 00:48:47
Geneva Road. And if that's the case, you won't even be able to see this building from the road. I I'd be surprised if you could 00:48:53
see the building from the road so. 00:48:59
It's the same thing as Anthony is I I don't think it needs to be super aesthetically pleasing. And then when you look at the other 00:49:07
side too, it's that that's your industrial area, you're just going to have warehouse boxes. 00:49:14
On the other side, so it'll. 00:49:21
It'll blend in. 00:49:24
With basically that concrete. 00:49:25
Mixing guy, right? That came through on the other side. 00:49:28
Yeah. 00:49:31
Q6. 00:49:36
Yeah, you're right. That's what I'm saying is your elevation on that overpass, you're going to be up. 00:49:37
Higher than the building. 00:49:42
Yeah, you'll see Do create, can we do we do a green roof. So the the roof is. 00:49:45
Will have like a rock scape cover over it. So it won't just be a concrete lid, it'll have a a protective layer over the top of 00:49:53
rock and like gravel and stuff. So we're talking like Conference Center rock park, sure. 00:50:01
That was a joke. That's our demonstration garden to be one of those green boxes. We'll let the bridge grow through the lid and 00:50:12
down into the. 00:50:15
Yeah, of course. I mean the architect in me was like excited about the board from concrete, but. 00:50:24
But yeah, I think that this is going to be buried. I I think what I'm thinking about too is like down the road, if we've got an 00:50:32
overpass coming through here, we've got the front runner station passing along it. 00:50:37
I think it. 00:50:44
The other disadvantage of the board forum is this. This could be a target for for tagging and that kind of stuff too, because it's 00:50:46
kind of a discrete area along the tracks and so I think a mural is kind of cool or something like to be intentional about. 00:50:53
Being intentional to put some artwork there so that if people are riding along the front runner, they're they're looking out there 00:51:00
seeing something, but. 00:51:03
But I could see as everything kind of comes together, that area could be kind of this. 00:51:08
I don't know, maybe the best area to put the porch on concrete. Unfortunately we will have security cameras there, so at least 00:51:14
we'll have video of them as they as a tagging. 00:51:18
We can hire them, yeah, they're good. Then they can do the whole thing. 00:51:23
The track. 00:51:29
Yeah. 00:51:32
Any other thoughts on that? You talk about the fence too. I for me personally, I think everything you propose on the fence is 00:51:34
fine. I think the colors. 00:51:39
That all makes sense. 00:51:44
It doesn't make sense to me that wastewater buildings be brown. 00:51:46
Any other thoughts or comments? 00:52:01
What's the projection? So the we have an issue that we've bid it out and awarded it for the booster station on the tank and the 00:52:07
the fencing. They have yet they haven't received their notice to proceed. They're just finishing up some documents and we'll get 00:52:14
them rolling hopefully before the end of the month. 00:52:21
They'll be the the whole process will go about 400. 00:52:30
26 days. So that'll put them into the end of July of 2023. 00:52:36
Their first the schedule that they propose they want to start working on the the exterior fencing first to secure the site better 00:52:44
so if they are working there and leaving materials and equipment that they'll feel more secure. 00:52:52
And they'll work on ground improvement improvements first. So they have to add in some ground stabilization to help with 00:53:01
liquefaction under the tank because it's so, so heavy. 00:53:07
They and they'll start working on that booster station and the two parallel. We'll just take quite a bit of time to get done. 00:53:15
We're talking a couple of years out in terms of having a function. Yeah, they'll be done in by the end of July of 2023. So just a 00:53:23
little over here, a year and a couple months. 00:53:30
This is something that we're taking action on too, right? 00:53:41
Correct. So if anybody's ready with the motion. 00:53:45
Any conditions of any kind? 00:53:55
The city would need to meet other than what we've talked about. 00:53:58
Yeah, If you have preference for like the material on the exterior, I think I heard a comment from you Jeff, but there was 00:54:01
something specific there that you want to capture in a in a condition if you wanted to you know make sure there was a spot for the 00:54:07
mural. So maybe like there's not we don't do the the board siding on the the east facing side. 00:54:13
Just help me up. However you guys want to approach it, we can. 00:54:19
You can add a condition. 00:54:23
I mean, I think if we can save money in that regard. 00:54:29
I think it would be beneficial. So it would it be the board siding on everything but that. 00:54:32
But they use space inside. I don't think we need any board sighting personally, but that's just personally. 00:54:39
Aesthetic preference and and did I hear correctly there would be a difference around $200,000 roughly if we were to do that on all 00:54:47
four sides, correct. So you know if there's a way to save the 200,000 then? 00:54:53
And then put it in the murals or on the other things that would enhance it. 00:55:00
Right there. So that that I would suggest if we're gonna put money into something that that might be the spot to do it. It's kind 00:55:37
of a trail entrance into the the park that one is building into the Marina. 00:55:42
And and this is off the wall, well maybe it's on the wall but if we were to having this pump the storage tank, is it such that it 00:55:47
could be turned into a climbing wall in the future. I mean if that if there was interest in doing something like that. So I stand 00:55:55
corrected it was 85 that their bid was 85,545 to put the for the form liner that's still, I mean it's still a sizeable amount of 00:56:03
money but so, so. 00:56:11
Again, it would it damage the water tank at all if it were to be used as a climbing wall sometime in the future. So that that I 00:56:19
the idea would be to keep it as secure facility, yeah, so. 00:56:25
Not open to public access? Yeah, OK. 00:56:34
Makes sense. I mean, I'll jokes aside about the green roof, Like even that's like the the roof is worth thinking and maybe maybe 00:56:38
we're thinking too far down the road. So I don't know when we're getting that overpass on the vineyard connector, but like, that's 00:56:45
a more visible piece to me, it seems like then especially the inside concrete walls, even on the. So I think, I think doing just 00:56:51
the regular concrete walls, having a mural or some option opportunity on the the east side of the face of the front runner line, I 00:56:58
think it's a good idea. 00:57:04
Yeah, I think if we could get a mural there where people come into the front like. 00:57:11
This is in your You're in downtown now. Would be kind of cool, personally. 00:57:18
Plus, if it gets defeated, you can paint over it again, right? I guess you could do that with a with a form well too. 00:57:23
Yeah. 00:57:31
I couldn't find them. Do we want to? Are there any public comments on this before we? 00:57:33
OK, OK. 00:57:43
OK, so there wasn't a motion in the agenda or anything, but I think I could make one up. 00:57:48
So I moved to approve the pump station plans as presented with the condition that the concrete formed walls are not. 00:57:54
Text Jared. 00:58:10
Concrete form liners, smooth textured. 00:58:11
Appearance. So that's kind of why we presented that. 00:59:25
With the feedback from the council and stuff like that and cost has come up. I mean how does the and I'm not I I just think that I 00:59:28
I know this there's been discussion about this it it like is is it something that that is already funded for that like if they did 00:59:35