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Start Position
Mayor Fullmer called the meeting to order at 5:35 PM. Councilmember Sifuentes gave the invocation and led the Pledge of Allegiance.   Councilmember Cameron arrived at the meeting at 5:38 PM.   2.     Work Session 2.1  Training City Attorney, Jayme Blakesley will train on the Open and Public Meetings Act, Ethics Act, Roberts Rules of Order, and GRAMA.
Mayor Fullmer called the meeting to order at35 PM. Councilmember Sifuentes gave the invocation and led the Pledge of Allegiance.   Councilmember Cameron arrived at the meeting at38 PM.        Work Session1  Training City Attorney, Jayme Blakesley will train on the Open and Public Meetings Act, Ethics Act, Roberts Rules of Order, and GRAMA.
Mr. Blakesley started the training with the Open and Public Meeting Act.
Mr. Blakesley started the training with the Open and Public Meeting Act.
Councilmember Sifuentes asked if the minutes from a meeting had to be posted by a certain time. Mr. Blakesley responded that there are two requirements, the audio of the meeting must be posted within 3 days. He said that the draft minutes must be posted within one month.
Councilmember Sifuentes asked if the minutes from a meeting had to be posted by a certain time. Mr. Blakesley responded that there are two requirements, the audio of the meeting must be posted withindays. He said that the draft minutes must be posted within one month.
Mr. Blakesley continued with his training.
Mr. Blakesley continued with his training.
Mayor Fullmer commented on special meetings that are not on the calendar would not be considered an emergency meeting. She stated an example being if a meeting is not scheduled on a specific date but decided to call one, that is a special meeting, not an emergency meeting.
Mayor Fullmer commented on special meetings that are not on the calendar would not be considered an emergency meeting. She stated an example being if a meeting is not scheduled on a specific date but decided to call one, that is a special meeting, not an emergency meeting.
Mr. Blakesley continued with his training.
Mr. Blakesley continued with his training.
Mayor Fullmer asked about posting on social media threads when other members of the council are on the same thread. Mr. Blakesley responded to be careful and gave an example.
Mayor Fullmer asked about posting on social media threads when other members of the council are on the same thread. Mr. Blakesley responded to be careful and gave an example.
Mr. Blakesley continued with the Roberts Rules of Order and Ethics portion of his training.   2.2  Municipal Code Amendment Public Works Director, Naseem Ghandour will present a code amendment for the Prohibition of Exclusive Public Utilities Services within a Public Utilities Easement.
Mr. Blakesley continued with the Roberts Rules of Order and Ethics portion of his training.  2  Municipal Code Amendment Public Works Director, Naseem Ghandour will present a code amendment for the Prohibition of Exclusive Public Utilities Services within a Public Utilities Easement.
Public Works Director, Naseem Ghandour shared a presentation.
Public Works Director, Naseem Ghandour shared a presentation.
Councilmember Sifuentes asked if residents are protected in the law on the size of the utility box placed on property and if council members can create any restrictions. Mr. Ghandour responded, and a discussion ensued.   2.3  Subdivision Ordinance Amendments Planner, Anthony Fletcher, will present code amendments for the Subdivision Code.
Councilmember Sifuentes asked if residents are protected in the law on the size of the utility box placed on property and if council members can create any restrictions. Mr. Ghandour responded, and a discussion ensued.  3  Subdivision Ordinance Amendments Planner, Anthony Fletcher, will present code amendments for the Subdivision Code.
Planner, Anthony Fletcher shared a presentation showing the amendments to the Subdivision Code.
Planner, Anthony Fletcher shared a presentation showing the amendments to the Subdivision Code.
Mayor Fullmer asked if all the changes made would bring them up to code. Mr. Fletcher responded that that was correct.
Mayor Fullmer asked if all the changes made would bring them up to code. Mr. Fletcher responded that that was correct.
Councilmember Sifuentes asked for clarification on making changes to both residential and commercial even though it was not required for commercial. Mr. Fletcher responded that they were doing so to be consistent. A discussion ensued.
Councilmember Sifuentes asked for clarification on making changes to both residential and commercial even though it was not required for commercial. Mr. Fletcher responded that they were doing so to be consistent. A discussion ensued.
Mr. Fletcher continued with the presentation.
Mr. Fletcher continued with the presentation.
Councilmember Holdaway asked if a Planning Commission Chair would be on the board for the Development Review Committee (DRC). Community Development Director, Morgan Brim responded that was correct, along with the department heads that delt with land use and a discussion ensued.
Councilmember Holdaway asked if a Planning Commission Chair would be on the board for the Development Review Committee (DRC). Community Development Director, Morgan Brim responded that was correct, along with the department heads that delt with land use and a discussion ensued.
Mr. Fletcher continued with the presentation.
Mr. Fletcher continued with the presentation.
Mayor Fullmer commented on an item passed at a previous legislative session concerning parking. She stated the public wanted a reduction in parking on their streets and explained how the city met the new requirements and the concerns regarding that. A discussion ensued.
Mayor Fullmer commented on an item passed at a previous legislative session concerning parking. She stated the public wanted a reduction in parking on their streets and explained how the city met the new requirements and the concerns regarding that. A discussion ensued.
Mr. Fletcher continued with his presentation. He gave a recap and explained that since it was a working session, a public hearing would be held during the Planning Commission and then again during the next City Council meeting.
Mr. Fletcher continued with his presentation. He gave a recap and explained that since it was a working session, a public hearing would be held during the Planning Commission and then again during the next City Council meeting.
Councilmember Holdaway expressed his concerns about the timing of being noticed for the work session. Mr. Blakesley explained the process of work sessions and a discussion ensued.
Councilmember Holdaway expressed his concerns about the timing of being noticed for the work session. Mr. Blakesley explained the process of work sessions and a discussion ensued.
Resident Karen Cornelius expressed her concerns regarding notice timing. Mayor Fullmer responded and explained the process of noticing for work session items and public hearings for agenda items. A discussion ensued.
Resident Karen Cornelius expressed her concerns regarding notice timing. Mayor Fullmer responded and explained the process of noticing for work session items and public hearings for agenda items. A discussion ensued.
Mayor Fullmer recapped the meeting to that point and explained what would happen in public comments and during the rest of the meeting.   3.     Public Comments Mayor Fullmer opened public comments at 7:28 PM.
Mayor Fullmer recapped the meeting to that point and explained what would happen in public comments and during the rest of the meeting.        Public Comments Mayor Fullmer opened public comments at28 PM.
Resident Elizabeth Holdaway commented that she would like to petition that the hands raised, during the meeting, in agreement with others should be counted and recorded. Ms. Holdaway stated she would like more notice on agenda information.
Resident Elizabeth Holdaway commented that she would like to petition that the hands raised, during the meeting, in agreement with others should be counted and recorded. Ms. Holdaway stated she would like more notice on agenda information.
Resident Jordan Christensen brought a book for each council member about parking. He expressed his concern about parking regulations and management.
Resident Jordan Christensen brought a book for each council member about parking. He expressed his concern about parking regulations and management.
Resident Tyler Haroldsen, living in Edge Water expressed concern about pedestrians crossing the road by the Megaplex and would like to see it changed to be a safer area for people to cross the road.
Resident Tyler Haroldsen, living in Edge Water expressed concern about pedestrians crossing the road by the Megaplex and would like to see it changed to be a safer area for people to cross the road.
Resident David Lauret thanked Mayor Fullmer and Mr. Blakesley for the work session that they held. Mr. Lauret said he appreciated the intent behind bringing the discussion to the people.
Resident David Lauret thanked Mayor Fullmer and Mr. Blakesley for the work session that they held. Mr. Lauret said he appreciated the intent behind bringing the discussion to the people.
Resident Keith Holdaway expressed appreciation for responses received to a questionnaire he sent out. Mr. Holdaway commented that he would still like an answer regarding tax money being returned to Megaplex and TopGolf.
Resident Keith Holdaway expressed appreciation for responses received to a questionnaire he sent out. Mr. Holdaway commented that he would still like an answer regarding tax money being returned to Megaplex and TopGolf.
Ms. Cornelius stated she would like an answer regarding the taxes being returned to Megaplex and Topgolf to be on public record. Ms. Cornelius was thankful for the work session and wants to work together for the common good. She expressed concern about an item on the agenda from the December 27, 2023, City Council Meeting, East District Public Infrastructure District, opening the door to the Inland Port Authority coming to Vineyard.
Ms. Cornelius stated she would like an answer regarding the taxes being returned to Megaplex and Topgolf to be on public record. Ms. Cornelius was thankful for the work session and wants to work together for the common good. She expressed concern about an item on the agenda from the December,23, City Council Meeting, East District Public Infrastructure District, opening the door to the Inland Port Authority coming to Vineyard.
Resident Mike Cox expressed appreciation to former council member Tyce Flake for being on top of the legislative process and would like to continue to be informed.   Mayor Fullmer closed public comment at 7:42 PM.
Resident Mike Cox expressed appreciation to former council member Tyce Flake for being on top of the legislative process and would like to continue to be informed.   Mayor Fullmer closed public comment at42 PM.
Mayor Fullmer responded to the comments and questions asked during public comment. A discussion ensued between the council, Mayor Fullmer and Mr. Blakesley.   4.     Mayor and COUNCILMEMBERS’ REPORTS/DISCLOSURES/RECUSALS No reports given.   5.     STAFF, COMMISSION, and committee REPORTS                                                                                                          (3 minutes each) No reports given.   6.     CONSENT ITEMS 6.1  Approval of the December 13, 2023, City Council Meeting Minutes 6.2  Approval of an Amendment to the ILA with Utah County for CTC (Resolution 2024-02)
Mayor Fullmer responded to the comments and questions asked during public comment. A discussion ensued between the council, Mayor Fullmer and Mr. Blakesley.        Mayor and COUNCILMEMBERS’ REPORTS/DISCLOSURES/RECUSALS No reports given.        STAFF, COMMISSION, and committee REPORTS                                                               (3 minutes each) No reports given.        CONSENT ITEMS1  Approval of the December,23, City Council Meeting Minutes2  Approval of an Amendment to the ILA with Utah County for CTC (Resolution24-02)
Mayor Fullmer asked if the council would like to continue the consent items to the next meeting on January 24, 2024. Mr. Holdaway stated he would like to take the items off to discuss.
Mayor Fullmer asked if the council would like to continue the consent items to the next meeting on January,24. Mr. Holdaway stated he would like to take the items off to discuss.
Councilmember Holdaway expressed concern regarding onboarding and the process so far. Mayor Fullmer responded that each city has a different process and if the council was not comfortable with approving the consent items, they could be continued to the next meeting. A discussion ensued.
Councilmember Holdaway expressed concern regarding onboarding and the process so far. Mayor Fullmer responded that each city has a different process and if the council was not comfortable with approving the consent items, they could be continued to the next meeting. A discussion ensued.
Motion: COUNCILMEMBER SIFUENTES MOVED TO CONTINUE THE CONSENT ITEMS 6.1 AND 6.2 TO THE MEETING ON JANUARY 24, 2024. COUNCILMEMBER RASMUSSEN SECONDED THE MOTION. MAYOR FULLMER, COUNCILMEMBERS CAMERON, HOLDAWAY, RASMUSSEN, AND SIFUENTES VOTED YES. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.   7.     BUSINESS ITEMS 7.1  PUBLIC HEARING Budget Amendment Resolution 2024-01 City Manager, Eric Ellis, will present proposed amendments to the Fiscal Year 2023-2024 Budget. The mayor and city council will act to adopt (or deny) this request by resolution.   Mayor Fullmer called for a motion to open the public hearing.
Motion: COUNCILMEMBER SIFUENTES MOVED TO CONTINUE THE CONSENT ITEMS1 AND2 TO THE MEETING ON JANUARY,24. COUNCILMEMBER RASMUSSEN SECONDED THE MOTION. MAYOR FULLMER, COUNCILMEMBERS CAMERON, HOLDAWAY, RASMUSSEN, AND SIFUENTES VOTED YES. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.        BUSINESS ITEMS1  PUBLIC HEARING Budget Amendment Resolution24-01 City Manager, Eric Ellis, will present proposed amendments to the Fiscal Year23-2024 Budget. The mayor and city council will act to adopt (or deny) this request by resolution.   Mayor Fullmer called for a motion to open the public hearing.
Motion:COUNCILMEMBER SIFUENTES MOVED TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING AT 7:57 PM. COUNCILMEMBER RASMUSSEN SECONDED THE MOTION. MAYOR FULLMER, COUNCILMEMBERS CAMERON, HOLDAWAY, RASMUSSEN, AND SIFUENTES VOTED YES. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
Motion:COUNCILMEMBER SIFUENTES MOVED TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING AT57 PM. COUNCILMEMBER RASMUSSEN SECONDED THE MOTION. MAYOR FULLMER, COUNCILMEMBERS CAMERON, HOLDAWAY, RASMUSSEN, AND SIFUENTES VOTED YES. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
City Manager, Eric Ellis presented budget amendments.
City Manager, Eric Ellis presented budget amendments.
Resident Kim Cornelius asked for clarification about funds to hire a senior planner. Mr. Ellis responded that when the quarterly report was completed it was found that they had the funds to hire a senior planner or promote from within.
Resident Kim Cornelius asked for clarification about funds to hire a senior planner. Mr. Ellis responded that when the quarterly report was completed it was found that they had the funds to hire a senior planner or promote from within.
Mr. Christensen commented that he felt it was more cost effective to promote from within.
Mr. Christensen commented that he felt it was more cost effective to promote from within.
Motion:COUNCILMEMBER SIFUENTES MOVED TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AT 8:01 PM. COUNCILMEMBER RASMUSSEN SECONDED THE MOTION. MAYOR FULLMER, COUNCILMEMBERS CAMERON, HOLDAWAY, RASMUSSEN, AND SIFUENTES VOTED YES. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
Motion:COUNCILMEMBER SIFUENTES MOVED TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AT01 PM. COUNCILMEMBER RASMUSSEN SECONDED THE MOTION. MAYOR FULLMER, COUNCILMEMBERS CAMERON, HOLDAWAY, RASMUSSEN, AND SIFUENTES VOTED YES. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
Councilmember Cameron asked if more than one person was going to be hired or promoted from within. Mr. Ellis responded that it would be one staff member receiving additional certification and training for the new position promoted from within. A discussion ensued.
Councilmember Cameron asked if more than one person was going to be hired or promoted from within. Mr. Ellis responded that it would be one staff member receiving additional certification and training for the new position promoted from within. A discussion ensued.
Councilmember Holdaway commented he would like to understand the departments before voting on an item he does not understand. Mayor Fullmer asked Mr. Ellis if the item could wait until after orientation. Mr. Brim responded that it could wait.
Councilmember Holdaway commented he would like to understand the departments before voting on an item he does not understand. Mayor Fullmer asked Mr. Ellis if the item could wait until after orientation. Mr. Brim responded that it could wait.
Mr. Blakesley called for a point of order. He stated that since the public hearing was closed, only action on the item would be continued, not a public hearing. He said if the council wanted to continue the public hearing, it would need to be part of the motion. A discussion ensued.
Mr. Blakesley called for a point of order. He stated that since the public hearing was closed, only action on the item would be continued, not a public hearing. He said if the council wanted to continue the public hearing, it would need to be part of the motion. A discussion ensued.
Motion: COUNCILMEMBER SIFUENTES MOVED TO CONTINUE 7.1 PUBLIC HEARING BUSINESS ITEM BUDGET AMENDMENT RESOLUTION 2024-01 TO THE MEETING ON JANUARY 24, 2024. COUNCILMEMBER HOLDAWAY SECONDED THE MOTION. MAYOR FULLMER, COUNCILMEMBERS CAMERON, HOLDAWAY, RASMUSSEN, AND SIFUENTES VOTED YES. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.   8.     CLOSED SESSION No closed session was held.   9.     ADJOURNMENT Mayor Fullmer called for a motion to adjourn the meeting.
Motion: COUNCILMEMBER SIFUENTES MOVED TO CONTINUE1 PUBLIC HEARING BUSINESS ITEM BUDGET AMENDMENT RESOLUTION24-01 TO THE MEETING ON JANUARY,24. COUNCILMEMBER HOLDAWAY SECONDED THE MOTION. MAYOR FULLMER, COUNCILMEMBERS CAMERON, HOLDAWAY, RASMUSSEN, AND SIFUENTES VOTED YES. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.        CLOSED SESSION No closed session was held.        ADJOURNMENT Mayor Fullmer called for a motion to adjourn the meeting.
Motion: COUNCILMEMBER SIFUENTES MOVED TO ADJOURN THE MEETING AT 8:07 PM. COUNCILMEMBER RASMUSSEN SECONDED THE MOTION. MAYOR FULLMER, COUNCILMEMBERS HOLDAWAY, RASMUSSEN, SIFUENTES, AND CAMERON VOTED YES. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.     MINUTES APPROVED ON:      January 24, 2024   CERTIFIED CORRECT BY:  /s/ Heidi Jackman heidi jackman, dePUty recorder
Motion: COUNCILMEMBER SIFUENTES MOVED TO ADJOURN THE MEETING AT07 PM. COUNCILMEMBER RASMUSSEN SECONDED THE MOTION. MAYOR FULLMER, COUNCILMEMBERS HOLDAWAY, RASMUSSEN, SIFUENTES, AND CAMERON VOTED YES. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.     MINUTES APPROVED ON:      January,24   CERTIFIED CORRECT BY:  heidi jackman, dePUty recorder
Some of our new elected officials. It's an exciting time. We've got a light agenda tonight so we can have an opportunity to do 00:00:00
some training and to get to know each other. But we're very glad to have you with us tonight. I am going to just randomly call 00:00:07
them. Would you mind doing the invocation? Inspirational Father, Pledge. Pledge of Allegiance. 00:00:14
Hi there. Can you hear my father? We are so very grateful for this wonderful snowy day we have. We're grateful for this moisture. 00:00:23
And please bless and watch over all those travelers. Please keep them safe. Please. 00:00:28
Please help those emergency workers that are helping those in need that they can also be protected and watched over and we are 00:00:35
still very grateful for those that serve our city and please bless and watch over them and. 00:00:41
Please bless that we can be. 00:00:48
Consider an understanding and be able to listen to one another's thoughts and be able to work together to find good compromises 00:00:52
and good solutions to things that come before us. Please bless us that we can. 00:00:58
Filled my spirit and have a wonderful evening, and Mercedes sings the name of Jesus Christ. Amen. Amen. All the rise. 00:01:05
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, 00:01:13
indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. 00:01:20
All right, this brings us right into our work session. We're going to start out with a training by our city attorney, Jamie 00:01:28
Blakely, and he's going to talk to us about the Open Public Meetings Act, Ethics Roberts Rules and Grandma. 00:01:34
Thank you, Jamie. 00:01:42
I just have a question. 00:01:50
Is it worth waiting for Sarah specifically on this item since she's new? 00:01:52
Thanks, Jake. 00:01:58
Wait for a minute. OK, that'll be fine. We'll give it a minute just to find out the estimated time. If she can't be here, there's 00:02:03
additional trainings that we can have her do the same. 00:02:08
And plus we can send her the recording. They have an orientation on Wednesday that we could assign this to her at that time. 00:02:13
OK. 00:02:25
Perfect timing. That's OK. Come on up. 00:02:26
I'm glad you made it safely. It's very stormy and messy out there right now. 00:02:32
We are just starting on our training with our attorney, and we're going to be talking about open and public meetings Act, the 00:02:37
Ethics Act. Robert's Rules and Grandma. All right. Thank you, Mayor. Members of the council, Greetings. I'm Jamie Blakely. I'm the 00:02:43
city attorney. 00:02:48
You, as a public body, are required to conduct your deliberations openly. What this means is that you cannot consider an ordinance 00:03:25
or a resolution unless meeting is held pursuant to the Open and Public Meetings Act and it's properly noticed. 00:03:33
All meetings have to be open unless they're lawfully closed. A meeting includes a work meeting. It includes an executive session. 00:03:41
And I mean, it is a meeting anytime a quorum of the City Council is together for the purposes of discussing or deliberating or 00:03:52
working on items that fall within your responsibility. That includes members present in person and members that are joined 00:03:59
electronically. 00:04:06
Every public meeting requires public notice. That notice has to be made at least 24 hours ahead of time. There is an exception for 00:04:17
emergencies. We'll talk about that in a few minutes. 00:04:22
There has to be an agenda for every meeting. The agenda must have labeled the items that will be acted upon during the meeting 00:04:27
with quote reasonable specificity. A topic can be raised by the public and discussed during the meeting at the discretion of the 00:04:34
chair. The Mayor is the chair for the City Council. Other public bodies within the city will elect their own chairs. The notice 00:04:42
has to be posted on the Utah Public Notice website and at the Principal office where. 00:04:50
The meeting is to be held. The newspaper requirement went away a little bit ago. I need to update my presentation to reflect that 00:04:57
electronic electronic posting is encouraged. We're meeting today at 5:35 because there was an outage on the public notice website 00:05:05
yesterday afternoon and we couldn't get the notice posted at 5:00 when we attempted. And so you bump the meeting time so that you 00:05:12
can be sure that 24 hour notice occurs. 00:05:19
The city has to publish an annual notice of scheduled meeting, so that's been done. 00:05:28
And then orderly conduct during meetings. If there's a disruption, a person may be removed if, quote, orderly conduct is seriously 00:05:34
compromised. 00:05:38
Electronic meetings are allowed. City code allows for this. It's similar to any meeting. It has to be noticed. There has to be an 00:05:43
anchor location and the anchor location has to be set up for an electronic meeting in such a way that anybody who can't access 00:05:51
electronically has the ability to attend, monitor and participate in the meeting. Most of our meetings are not electronic meetings 00:05:58
because of the council's meeting altogether in in person, but. 00:06:05
There is the possibility to do that with COVID. We had to do it quite a bit and everybody got really good at doing electronic 00:06:13
meetings, but most of your meetings will be held in person. 00:06:18
Written minutes have to be kept in every meeting. These are the requirements of what has to be in the minutes. I'm not going to go 00:06:25
through this line by line, but it will be in your materials. We have phenomenal city recorders and assistant city recorders that 00:06:31
take care of this in a really nice way. I do have a question about yes, please, can you go back to that? I had the question asked. 00:06:38
Is there a time that those minutes have to be done by, Like how, how long before we have to make sure we voted on them and have 00:06:44
them published to the public? 00:06:50
They. 00:06:58
There, there's a, there are two requirements. One is the recording of the meeting and that has to be up within three days and then 00:07:00
retain permanently the minutes. You have a little bit more time to put them up. And the way it works is you post draft minutes and 00:07:06
then once the actual minutes are approved by the public body, they would replace the draft minutes. But I think the draft minutes, 00:07:13
it's within a month, within a month, OK. 00:07:19
It's usually sooner than that and Pam's really great about getting them up, but. 00:07:29
A little bit longer to put the minutes together than the record I've watched her work on minutes before and it's a very labor 00:07:33
intensive. It's remarkable how they do it. 00:07:37
The recording we just talked about, but there has to be a complete unedited recording of all open portions of the meeting 00:07:42
beginning to end. Like I mentioned, that has to be available within three business days and it's retained permanently. 00:07:49
You make closed meetings for certain purposes. It can only be done by 2/3 vote. That vote has to be done by roll call. There are 00:07:57
certain it's announced publicly the reason for closing the meetings. These bullets are the purposes that most often occur with the 00:08:03
City Council. 00:08:10
There are a few others in the statute, but when you most often do, it is to what I call personnel type discussions, which is an 00:08:17
individual's character, professional competence, or physical or mental health? A strategy session related to litigation? A 00:08:23
strategy session related to real property. 00:08:29
And then you have a few others that relate to investigations, security and certain procurement decisions. Those aren't as used as 00:08:35
often as the first three bullets. 00:08:40
There's a prohibition on closed meetings. You can close a meeting, for example, to interview a prospective member of staff. So if 00:08:48
you had a vacancy and you were going to interview somebody, you could go into a closed session to do that. 00:08:54
You are not allowed to do that if you're filling a vacancy in an elected position. So if, for example, there was a vacancy on the 00:09:01
council, you had to fill it, and you wanted to interview people to see who could fill that vacancy. You're not allowed to do that 00:09:05
in a closed session. 00:09:10
Most closed meetings are recorded. There are not recordings for discussions of character, competence, or health of an individual 00:09:19
for security measures, and when that occurs, the presiding officer signs an affidavit of the reasons why and what was discussed. 00:09:28
You are permitted to conduct emergency meetings. They can be held with less than 24 hours. Notice they. These are very very rare. 00:09:37
I don't recall one happening in Vineyard at the time that I since I've been the. 00:09:43
City Attorney. 00:09:50
I have had them occur with other entities and it typically is a true emergency situation. So with COVID I had a few entities that 00:09:52
provide life and safety issues and so they had to hold emergency meetings to be able to appropriate funds and. 00:10:00
And budget and do things to adjust to that. I have had organizations that have had storm damage to facilities and they had to 00:10:09
contract for repairs and needed to make those decisions immediately. They would hold a meeting. An emergency meeting is different 00:10:16
from a special meeting. When we say a special meeting, what we mean is you publish your annual schedule of when you'll hold your 00:10:24
City Council meetings. A special meeting would be any meeting that isn't on that regular list. 00:10:31
But it's not an emergency meeting. You would still provide 24 hours notice. All the other rules would apply. It's just not on that 00:10:39
calendar that you published at the beginning of the year. And those do occur from time to time in all cities. 00:10:46
An example might be like we don't have a meeting on the 14th of February, but if we decided we needed to call one on the 14th, 00:10:54
that would be a special meeting, OK? 00:10:58
OK, chance meetings and social gatherings. So if you happen to see each other at the grocery store, at the Christmas party, at a 00:11:06
church event, at a social event, that's fine. You just cannot conduct city business when you're doing that. If you ever are 00:11:13
together in a topic of city business comes up and you have a quorum, that would be improper and would be a violation at the end. 00:11:20
There's a criminal penalty for a violation of the act, a quick note on electronic messaging. 00:11:29
This one's tricky. Public meetings can occur electronically and if you have a quorum of the Council present during any 00:11:36
communication. 00:11:41
And you're talking about topic, talking about decisions that should be made in an open meeting that can be a violation of the Open 00:11:47
and Public Meetings Act. This can occur by text message, it can occur by e-mail. It can occur on a Facebook thread if people are 00:11:55
commenting back and forth on a topic. So you will want to be mindful when you're communicating through those tools that you don't 00:12:03
have a quorum of the council present in that communication. Otherwise you could be found to have violated the app. 00:12:11
Any questions on open and public meetings before I move on? 00:12:21
I think I will mention something. This had been something that we had discussed prior when a new council came on because they have 00:12:27
commented on social threats but not known. Other people were on a social threat and we talked about how they weren't commenting or 00:12:33
interacting, but then we were all much more careful about making sure who was on it. Is that still kind of how you would interpret 00:12:40
it? Yeah, I do think you want to be careful about that it. 00:12:47
There are some There were news articles a few years ago about the Salt Lake City school board at the time they were making 00:12:55
decisions about whether to remain open or closed during COVID. 00:12:59
Where they were having discussions and deliberations over text and it was happening there unfortunately while the meeting was 00:13:05
occurring which would be a big no no right to talk to each other about how are you going to vote on things and what do you think 00:13:09
about this and. 00:13:14
There's even went a step further of name calling and some unfortunate language, and a parent saw that. An interested parent that 00:13:19
was at the meeting saw it happened, made a records request, got those text messages, and it was. 00:13:25
You know, released and published in the paper. And so I do think you want to be careful. Social media can be really tough, right? 00:13:32
Because. 00:13:36
You could be on a Reddit thread and hit the up arrow right on something and you technically are part of that conversation. You're 00:13:40
giving your support or your favor for it. It could be a thumbs up on Facebook and you're not using the words in that 00:13:45
communication. But it is communication and if it's about a topic that is city business and you have a quorum present, then you 00:13:51
would have an issue. 00:13:56
It doesn't preclude you from using social media, but. 00:14:04
You just need to be mindful. 00:14:08
OK, Rules of order. So the the default rules of order are Roberts Rules of Order. They're rules of order that have existed since. 00:14:11
Kind of old English times and have continued on through most. 00:14:21
Public bodies and public entities. And so a lot of what we'll talk about here from Robert's Rules, they're not from a statute. 00:14:25
They're not from an ordinance. 00:14:29
But they are the parliamentary rules that cities throughout the state follow in public entities throughout the state follow. 00:14:33
The basic rules are these You have an agenda. The agenda constitutes the road map for the meeting, and that's what will be 00:14:40
followed through the meeting. If you overlay that with the Open and Public Public Meetings Act, you can only take action during 00:14:48
the meeting on items that have been properly noticed and are on the agenda. If something new comes up and you would like to act on 00:14:55
it or consider it, you would have to add it to a future agenda and then take it up during the future meeting. 00:15:02
This can come off as. 00:15:10
Awkward or old-fashioned. When you get public comments saying please do something about it, now you realize that it's an important 00:15:14
thing, You want to do something about it, but you have to tell the person who made the comment. 00:15:20
We'll come back to it on a future meeting and can put it on an agenda. 00:15:27
The chair of the City Council controls the agenda, and so the mayor may, at her discretion, put things on the agenda that she 00:15:31
would like the council to discuss. 00:15:37
If any member of the City Council wishes to have something on the agenda, they can make a motion during a meeting asking that 00:15:44
something be put on the agenda. It can be voted on. If you have a majority of the council that would like something to be agenda, 00:15:51
then it would be on a future agenda. You can of course contact the mayor offline and request that something be put on the agenda. 00:15:57
It would be a her discretion in that circumstance whether it's on the agenda or not. 00:16:04
But you can also during a meeting. 00:16:11
Ask that things be there. 00:16:13
You have under Robert Rules, one question at a time and one speaker at a time, basic rules of courtesy that are respected. 00:16:16
The chairperson can use what we more often called unanimous consent, not general consent, with all motions except for motions that 00:16:26
require a roll call vote of the Council. So if you had a procedural motion or an amendment, or a motion to adjourn or a motion. 00:16:36
That is, not to approve a resolution, or to open or close a public hearing, or to go into closed session. You can do it by 00:16:48
unanimous consent. 00:16:52
Typically, items on your consent agenda can be handled this way, but if you do have a resolution on the consent agenda, you'd have 00:16:59
to do a roll call vote for those items. 00:17:03
There are three basic forms of motions. We'll get to these in a minute. You make initial motions, motions to amend and substitute 00:17:09
motions. That's what you see most often. 00:17:13
In meetings, there should be no more than three motions on the floor at the time. That's really just a rule for convenience. It's 00:17:19
tough to keep track of if you have more than that. 00:17:23
Typically, debate and discussion can continue as long as members wish to discuss an item. But the chairperson does have the 00:17:28
ability to kind of bring discussion in when it's time to make a decision. So if things if discussion tends to either lag or be 00:17:35
repetitive or or touch on things that have already been addressed, the chair has the prerogative and can always move things toward 00:17:42
either a motion or a vote at that time. 00:17:49
I'll talk about the sequence in a minute. 00:17:57
Three yes votes are required to pass any item. There are certain items that require a little bit more than three votes there. One 00:17:59
example is a two third vote for a closed session and with a 5 member council, 2/3 is 4. 00:18:05
A motion to reconsider any item requires A majority vote to pass under Robert's Rules. There are kind of specific rules for a 00:18:13
motion to reconsider has to be made during the same meeting. You can, at a later meeting make a motion that would be a motion to 00:18:20
amend, or that could be a text amendment, the replacing ordinance, things of that type, But during but a motion to just reconsider 00:18:26
an item to kind of. 00:18:33
Obvious about that you already took would have to occur during the same meeting. 00:18:40
And then the chairperson and members of the board showed here to bylaws in the code of conduct. 00:18:45
To the extent they exist, your default code of conduct is what's in state law and then what's in the Ethics Act, and we'll talk a 00:18:51
little bit about that. 00:18:55
Types of Motions So you A main motion introduces a new item. A subsidiary motion would be a motion to amend or substitute motion. 00:19:02
So if for example, you wanted to. 00:19:12
Amend the text or amend the policy or make a little bit of a change to the motion that was made. You could request to amend. If 00:19:15
it's a friendly amendment, the person who made the motion can just say I accept that friendly amendment. If it's not a friendly 00:19:20
amendment, then you would vote on the amendment 1st and then you would vote. If it fails, you would then vote on the original 00:19:25
motion. 00:19:30
There can be an incidental motion, which is just a question of procedure. There's a motion to table. A motion to table is an 00:19:36
old-fashioned word for. 00:19:41
And the item not vote on it. 00:19:47
And it would just be done. 00:19:50
They got into item one and quickly realized they needed to handle item three first, and so they just moved to continue item one 00:20:24
until after they could hear item 3. 00:20:29
There is one footnote I would put on motion to continue and it's that if you're moving to continue a public hearing. 00:20:35
To another date, you have to name that date in that motion. 00:20:43
So that those attending the meeting know when to come back for the hearing. Because public hearings have specific notice 00:20:47
requirements under state law under respect that you have to name a date and time. 00:20:53
If you're just moving to continue any old resolution or ordinance, you don't have to name a date. You could just continue to a 00:20:58
future meeting and then when it's ready to come forward, it can come forward again. 00:21:04
Every motion has at least 6 steps. You make the motion, there's a call for a second on the motion. Once the 2nd occurs, the motion 00:21:11
is restated so everyone understands what was. 00:21:17
What was moved for? 00:21:24
There then is debated discussion on the motion. After that's concluded, there's a vote on the motion, and then the chair will 00:21:25
announce the results of the vote and any instructions after that. 00:21:31
Ordinances, resolutions, and any action that would create a liability against the city require a roll call vote liability would 00:21:39
be. 00:21:43
Hiring and firing individuals. 00:21:48
Any kind of contract or procurement decisions? 00:21:51
All other matters can be a simple yes or no. 00:21:54
Points of things You all during the meetings have the opportunity to request more information, Request clarity, request. 00:22:00
Privilege. And so these are the this is the language that's used under Robert's orders, Robert's Rules of Order. You don't have to 00:22:12
use precisely this language, but you do always have the ability. 00:22:17
If there's a breach of rules, if there's improper procedure, you can ask for a point of order at any time during the meeting and 00:22:24
get clarification on that. Heidi and I are here as a resource to you if you have a question on a point of order and we can try to 00:22:29
answer that and give you instruction. 00:22:35
A point of information. If you want to be more informed before you make a decision, you can always request a point of information 00:22:41
and then try to receive that information. That could be a staff report, it could be a document, it could be whatever you feel you 00:22:47
need during that meeting to understand the item. A point of inquiry is the clarification on making voting decisions. So it would 00:22:54
be you know what specifically are we voting on or what would be the effect of. 00:23:01
This kind of vote or. And then finally, as a point of personal privilege, and this is really just comfort. If if it's too cold, if 00:23:08
it's too hot, if you need to use the restroom, if we've been going for a long time and you need a break just to stand up, you can 00:23:14
always ask for a point of personal privilege. 00:23:19
OK. I have just two or three slides that relate to legislative and administrative powers. When for the new council members, when 00:23:28
we meet next week, I'll spend a little bit more time going into the powers and duties and roles. 00:23:36
Of a City Council. But there's a really simple it's, I should I say, simple? 00:23:44
There's a bright line distinction between some of the actions you take. That has to be understood because the information you can 00:23:51
use to make your decision is different in those circumstances, and the effect of the decision is different. And the rights that 00:23:59
the public has relative to your decisions is different For these things. You have, as a City Council in Utah, the ability to make 00:24:06
some decisions that are legislative and some decisions that are administrative. 00:24:13
Legislative decisions are things like rules, regulations, codes. 00:24:22
At what level you want to set your fines? 00:24:26
Punishments, forfeitures, those types of decisions. When you're making a legislative decision, you can bring to bear any point of 00:24:31
policy that is important to you or resonates with you when you make that choice. So when you are creating and approving a land use 00:24:38
ordinance, for example, if you have a preference about density parking. 00:24:46
Anything that relates to that development choice? 00:24:56
You can bring that preference forward and that can be part of the discussion. You can make a decision on that basis. When you're 00:24:59
making an administrative approval, you're approving something that is governed by the code that's in place before that approval 00:25:04
comes to you. 00:25:09
These are things like projects, plans, policies that flow from an ordinance, contracts, services. When you're making those kinds 00:25:15
of decisions, you're a little bit more limited in what you can bring to bear. You cannot reject a project just because I don't 00:25:21
like it, or I think it looks bad, or I don't like the color, or this is next to my neighbor's house and I don't think they're 00:25:27
going to favor it. 00:25:32
When you're making those kinds of decisions, your obligation is to look at what the ordinance says. Look at what is in the 00:25:39
application. You can request evidence to inform and support your decision, but if that evidence is not in the record, you can't 00:25:47
consider it as part of your decision, or else you would open the city up to a legal challenge of that decision. 00:25:54
Staff and I will try to guide you as to whether the decisions that are before you are legislative or administrative. You can 00:26:03
always ask me for clarification if you have questions about it. The topics where the line is harvested, differentiate is when 00:26:09
you're taking up any land use decisions to know are we doing an ordinance, is this a legislative decision or are we considering an 00:26:16
application and is it administrative decision? 00:26:23
Your legislative power has to be exercised by ordinance. 00:26:31
And then this is just a brief little CHEAT SHEET that if it's legislative, it's an ordinance, if it's administrative and it 00:26:36
creates A liability, then it has to be done by resolution. 00:26:43
If it's a procedural or a ministerial action, If you're approving minutes, If you're giving direction to staff. If you're. 00:26:51
Making appointments or making a point of order, those things can all be done by motion and just by roll call. Or not by roll call 00:27:00
vote, but just a yes or no vote altogether. 00:27:05
And then why does it matter? Ordinances have the force of law. They can be enforced criminally or civilly. Legislative decisions 00:27:12
are subject to referenda and mandamus. Mandamus is when somebody brings a lawsuit to compel the government to do something that's 00:27:18
within its authority, and your legislative decisions are subject to that. Administrative decisions are not subject to referendum 00:27:24
or mandamus. 00:27:30
And then the standard of review legally, if it goes to court, is different for a legislative and administrative decision. 00:27:37
You're given quite a bit of deference on legislative choices, on administrative decisions. The courts really will look at due 00:27:44
process and whether you follow the right process. They won't get into the the more detailed aspects of the decision. Most 00:27:51
ordinances do not require a public hearing. The things that do that come to you more often. 00:27:58
Our salary schedules for elected officers and officials, taxes, budgets, tax impact fees and other fees. 00:28:07
Land use regulations and then anytime you dispose of real property owned by the City of public hearing is required. 00:28:15
There are a few other things but. 00:28:23
That's the list of of kind of the greatest hits. 00:28:27
On public hearings, residents of the city have a right to be heard when there is a hearing. You are not required during a public 00:28:32
hearing to engage in dialogue with the public. You're required to hear the public. 00:28:37
You can choose to ask for follow up information, things like that of items that are addressed during the public hearing, but it 00:28:44
does not give the public the right to. 00:28:49
Depose or interrogate you on. 00:28:55
Why you're making the decision and what your background is, whether you're fit for office things of that sort. 00:28:57
On land use decisions, the applicant has to be given the opportunity to respond to public comment. After a public hearing, the 00:29:04
public often will. 00:29:09
They'll bluster a little bit at this, not just in veneer but but throughout the state, because they'll feel like, why did I get 3 00:29:19
minutes? And then the applicant gets to come and address you for 10 or 15 minutes on all the things that were talked about during 00:29:25
public comment. And the reason for that is under state law, they have that right and you have to allow them the opportunity to 00:29:31
respond to the things that are addressed. 00:29:38
During the public comment, you may limit public comment to a reasonable time. This is to allow you to work through things that are 00:29:45
on your agenda. It's to allow you to hear from as many people as possible. 00:29:51
During the hearings you do, however, as a public body, open and close the public hearings by motion and vote. 00:29:58
Chairperson controls the meeting and on the right hand side are just some of the general guidelines about public hearings. 00:30:07
I'll just note the final thing, that if there are personal attacks or things of that nature that are, those are grounds for under 00:30:14
the Open and Public Meetings Act. 00:30:20
Any questions about Robert's rules before I pivot to ethics? Any questions? 00:30:27
OK. Seeing none, I'll keep going. 00:30:33
So I, a few years ago went to Portugal there. 00:30:38
Congratulations on being elected to office. You now qualify to commit 12 felony offenses that weren't available to you before. 00:31:21
It's a little tongue in cheek, but it's true. There are, there's there are perils and there are risks to being an elected 00:31:29
official. And I view my job as being kind of the leash that tethers you to your surfboard, so you can always find the service and 00:31:35
you can always stay safe. 00:31:41
In your office. So the six are You can't use your office for personal benefit. You cannot receive money for assistance with a 00:31:47
transaction with the city. There's a little asterisk next to that that we'll get into. 00:31:53
If you own or have a significant interest in a business regulated by the city, you'll want to be aware of that and just make the 00:32:00
right disclosures and behave in the right way. 00:32:05
If you have an investment, creating a conflict of interest. 00:32:11
You'll need to be aware of that if you have a business that is doing business with the city and so how are three and four 00:32:16
different? Three is the city regulates the business and four is the the business is seeking work from the city. They're they're 00:32:22
participating in a public procurement or the city contracts with that business for service. And then number six is if you invite 00:32:29
somebody to do. 00:32:35
Bad things with you, then you're responsible for the things you invite them to do. 00:32:42
So I'll go through quickly what they are and. 00:32:49
You all know that it's a criminal offense, so you will have access through your position to private controller protected 00:32:51
information. If you use that information to further your economic interests, or to secure special privileges or exemptions for 00:32:58
yourself, or you improperly disclose information that is protected or private or controlled, you can be responsible either under 00:33:04
the Ethics Act or under the provisions of grammar. So you will want to be mindful as you come across information that you use it 00:33:11
properly. 00:33:17
If you have questions about if you get something and you don't know, is this public or is it a private or protected record. 00:33:24
And those are the categories you'll most often see. Speak to the person who provided it to you, Speak to Pam or speak to myself, 00:33:33
and we can give you advice on what it is and how you ought to behave with that information. 00:33:40
You cannot use your official position to further your economic interests or to secure special privileges for yourself or a 00:33:48
relative. And relative is defined fairly broadly to include you, your spouse, your parents, your children. It is not just people 00:33:54
who live in your home. 00:34:00
You cannot knowingly receive, take, or solicit a gift of substantial value if that gift would tend to influence your decision. 00:34:09
And if you know or should know that that gift is primarily a reward for your official action, there are some exceptions. You can 00:34:19
receive an occasional non pecuniary gift of less than $50. That's an annual $50. You can receive an award for your public service. 00:34:28
You can get a bona fide loan from somebody who does business or is located within the city, but that loan has to be on commercial 00:34:36
terms that are available to the public generally. So if you're approving them, making a land use approval for a bank in the city. 00:34:45
And you also happen to be getting a mortgage from that bank for your home or a business loan or something like that. As long as 00:34:55
that loans on regular commercial terms, you're fine. If it departs from normal commercial terms, then you would. 00:35:02
Violate the act and have an issue there, and there's an exception for political campaign contributions. 00:35:11
The I want to talk briefly on gifts. Gifts can come at you from weird angles, and things that you might not consider, that you 00:35:18
might not have considered to be gifts before taking public office would be gifts. 00:35:24
If, for example, you had a neighbor or somebody in the city that you vacation with often, and you share housing for a vacation, or 00:35:31
you go to their cabin, or you go to their condo. 00:35:37
Now that you're in elected office, if they have business with the city. 00:35:43
That go into their condo or going to their cabin or sharing a boat. 00:35:47
Would be something that has monetary value. 00:35:53
And would be a gift that you may not consider it to be, that if you are used to having neighbors call and say I have sports 00:35:57
tickets I'm not going to be able to use, would you like them? 00:36:03
That may have been a normal thing that would happen all the time before you came into an elected position. It would now be a gift, 00:36:09
and if it was over $50, you would have to pay them for the base value of. 00:36:16
That item. 00:36:24
Compensation for assistance in a transaction involving the city. This applies to employees and officers. You have to make a public 00:36:28
disclosure, and the disclosure has. 00:36:33
Really specific timing. You have to disclose it in an open or public meeting. If you're an employee, you have to disclose it to a 00:36:39
supervisor or anyone involved in your evaluation or approval. 00:36:46
It has to have your name and address, the name and address of the person being helped or the entity being helped. It has to have a 00:36:54
description of the transaction and the and the type of service that you'll be performing. And then the timing is very, very 00:37:01
important. If it doesn't occur 10 days before the agreement, 10 days before you receive compensation, then you would be in 00:37:08
violation of the act. So if ever anybody approaches you and says we'd like your help with. 00:37:15
X item that's before the city for approval. Either turn them down right away and if you turn them down I recommend you do it in 00:37:24
writing or tell them I can do this, but only after I consult with the city attorney and then notice it properly and make the 00:37:31
required disclosure. And then I can walk you through that process and what it would mean. 00:37:38
Utah's Ethics Act, and this is my own editorial comment, it's weak. It doesn't require somebody to recuse themselves from actions. 00:37:47
It it has disclosure requirements above all else. And so you can still make decisions even if you have a conflict of interest 00:37:54
under the Ethics Act or doing some of these things that are are discussed in the Ethics Act. I will give you my best advice as 00:38:02
City Attorney whenever you consult with me on that. 00:38:10
And that often will be that you recuse yourself, even if it's not required by statute. I think there, I just think there are 00:38:18
risks, both optics, politics and legally, that it's the safer course for you to do that. And so I'll give you that kind of. I'll 00:38:26
give you advice, here's what I would recommend, here's what the Ethics Act requires, and then you can give some direction as to 00:38:33
what you do, and I'll help you document and make those. 00:38:41
Disclosures in the right way. 00:38:49
When they come about. 00:38:51
Can I pick on you a little bit, Marty, in a good way. I we had a Marty made a disclosure during the last City Council meeting that 00:38:53
was a disclosure that if you look at the dollar amounts and you look at what her position was within her place of employment, she 00:39:00
didn't need any of the categories under the ethics Act. So disclosure wasn't required, but it really was the best course and as we 00:39:07
visited about that she decided to make the disclosure during. 00:39:14
The meeting and I I applaud her for that and I think that's a really good way of handling those kinds of situations. 00:39:22
Interest in a business regulated by the city. So if you're an officer, director, agent, or you own a substantial interest, then 00:39:31
you have to make that disclosure you have with your agenda at your chair Disclosure form. This is a form that we will use 00:39:37
annually. 00:39:44
From here on out for you to make the disclosures that are required. 00:39:51
And then we'll have that in place. 00:40:29
Disclosure has to be a sworn statement to the mayor. You'll see on the form I gave you that it's directed to the mayor. 00:40:31
The mayor reports or delivers a copy to the council. There are exceptions if you're interested in the business is under $2000 or 00:40:38
it's just life insurance. You don't have to disclose that type of thing. Similar disclosure if you have a business that is doing 00:40:44
business with the city, we talked about that earlier and you'll make that disclosure as well in this form and then by 00:40:50
supplementing it throughout the year. 00:40:56
If you have a conflict of interest involving your duties, and this was really where the situation with Marty came up, if you feel 00:41:03
like things you have to do in your personal or your private life may conflict with the decisions you have to make publicly and it 00:41:10
creates a conflict and we recommend disclosure during a meeting. 00:41:17
And then inducing is all of the things we talked about previously, but if you ask somebody else to do it along with you or 00:41:26
separate from you. 00:41:29
Their criminal penalties are based on the dollar value of the compensation, the conflict or the assistance. 00:41:34
The standard of proof is that you know, knowingly or intentionally violate if something comes up. If you learn of something after 00:41:41
the fact and you weren't aware during the vote or during the decision, it is better to make that late disclosure than to not make 00:41:48
it at all and to document it appropriately. That protects you because the standard is knowingly or intentionally, and if you 00:41:55
didn't know about it, even if it was a conflict, it only becomes a conflict once you're aware. 00:42:02
Or know of that situation, There's a penalty for employees that if these kind of violations occur, they are required to be 00:42:10
dismissed from employment. 00:42:14
Or removed from office. 00:42:20
And I should note that on the final bullet. 00:42:22
A third party can't come to the city and seek to rescind the transaction if it was approved by somebody that hadn't followed that 00:42:25
exactly when they made that approval. 00:42:29
Did you see if they can't or they can? Oh, they can. 00:42:35
Any questions from the Council? 00:42:39
No, don't take me here. OK, thank you. Well, if you have further questions and you want to start compiling them for your 00:42:43
orientation on Wednesday, maybe that would be another time to approach it. So that's great. If I can just reinforce one thing at 00:42:49
the end is that I am a resource studio. If you have questions on any of these topics of you know, does my situation apply, we can 00:42:56
talk confidentially, we can go through the details of what that is and then I'll give you my best advice on how to proceed and try 00:43:02
to be a protection to you as you. 00:43:09
Thank you. Awesome. Thank you so much. All right, we won't go ahead and move on to our next agenda, item 2.2. This is the 00:43:17
municipal code amendment and our public works director and senior will present. 00:43:25
This change and explain it for the Council. 00:43:34
All right, so I think I'm going to open the worst director, city engineer. So I put together some slides for this, specifically 00:44:36
about public utility easements, Municipal code, Proposed municipal code change for public detail easements. I include public right 00:44:45
of ways specifically because it's important to distinguish between the two. 00:44:55
Right away is in public utility easement. So the first few slides are going to be kind of just giving a overview of what a public 00:45:05
right of way is, what public utility easement is, and then we'll go into kind of what the proposed change would be and the reason 00:45:10
as to why. 00:45:14
So again, the same endorphin works director and this was done in conjunction with Patrick James, Senior Engineer as well. 00:45:19
So the first slide talks about right away a definition of a right away and it's very to the point it's, it's the right to build 00:45:27
and operate a railroad line, Rd. utility land belonging to another in essence. So it's a diagram, a diagram shown up there kind of 00:45:35
represents it, it's the, it's the growth, it's the pavements asphalt portion of it, it's curb and gutter and the sidewalks and 00:45:42
sometimes I'm between the sidewalks and the road asphalt you typically see park strip on there. 00:45:50
I said I would that would kinda designated designated to the hedges on the side kind of hopes act as a distinguishing that 00:45:58
typically the right away ends at the backside of the sidewalk. We call the backside which is the sidewalk typically closest to a 00:46:05
building a home or so forth. An important thing about the right of way we also called the public runaway is that it provides it's 00:46:12
an area that allows non property owners to. 00:46:20
Access to common areas. 00:46:28
Like for example parks, park schools, grocery stores, et cetera. And on there, no individual property owner has exclusive rights 00:46:30
to go right away. It's typically owned by the city, the county, the state. There are private roads and so forth. Those are owned 00:46:38
by communities like HO As and so forth. It kind of falls within the same constructs which it provides to the community members as 00:46:45
a whole the the ability to maneuver through. 00:46:53
The the this geographical space on that. 00:47:02
So in moving on to what public utility easement is, public utility easement is a right to cross or otherwise use someone else's 00:47:08
land for a specified purpose. So the biggest distinguishing between the two is that public utility easement is. 00:47:16
On someone's property, and it's important to note that all the Public Utilities may fall on a on a particular person's piece of 00:47:26
land for a specified purpose. 00:47:31
That they'll D the little or the title. The land remains with a property owner, but is established to provide another person, 00:47:37
organization or such the right to use that portion in order to. 00:47:44
In order for that specified purpose on there for example and it can be for between. 00:47:53
A private private property owner and a municipality. 00:48:03
Or it could be between 2:00 private parties for example. 00:48:09
Sometimes when you get to areas where you do flag loss and so forth, some communities you have multiple locks back amongst each 00:48:13
other and then the access to the road might be in one area. The lots, like the residential lots are further away from the road. 00:48:21
They have a access easement that is that is an agreement between all the property owners. 00:48:29
Allows those people further away from Rd. access onto the public Rd. on there. So that's again, it's providing a right to cross 00:48:38
someone's property for a specified purpose. A specified purpose being I need to go from my house to the gym or to the school and 00:48:44
so forth. 00:48:50
And that is, you know, that is maybe not so common around here, but it is a common thing, especially when you get to the more 00:48:56
rural parts of, you know, the United States. Here's a diagram showing kind of distinguishing where public right of way is 00:49:04
utilities and of course the private property. As you can see the public, the public right of way, the public property on the top 00:49:12
portion of it kind of highlighted in red is an essence sidewalk to sidewalk and includes the road includes the park strips. 00:49:19
The public utility easement denoted in the yellow area. 00:49:28
Falls within the private property side says typically right we call it the backside of the sidewalk. There is different width of 00:49:31
that public utility easement. There are typical width that you get is 10 feet is your kind of a typical. It can be 8 feet it could 00:49:39
be 15 feet to really depends on. It really depends on the areas of municipalities and like the expectations on that. For example 00:49:47
are there some utilities. 00:49:54
Especially that are owned by. 00:50:02
Power companies that in Utah, they call them private utilities, easements and other areas they call them. 00:50:05
The special purpose utilities went to those. Those may be larger like for example transmission lines have a larger easement on 00:50:15
there versus like a telephone line which would have a much smaller one. 00:50:21
And of course, it doesn't have to fall on the front of some front of somebody's property. This shows that, you know, utilities may 00:50:27
be on the side or on the backside. My personal house, I have a utility easement on all four sides of my of where I live. So it 00:50:34
doesn't nice. It doesn't typically have to be in one particular area, but there's typically standards on that. 00:50:41
So again, talking about what I'm talking more about, what is the public utility. A public utility is defined as and believe 00:50:49
Renault railroad falls into public utility as well and railroad, gas, electrical, telephone, water in essence heat corporations 00:50:57
and energy producers there. There are some exemptions of what the energy producers are like. For example if somebody's producing 00:51:05
batteries they don't technically fall into it energy producer the. 00:51:12
This is off from the Utah code that kind of talks about what they are and then probably has like 5 pages of exemptions on there. I 00:51:21
won't go into it, but that's kind of more generalized. Here is a little diagram kind of showing what a public utility is. Water 00:51:26
wastewater does fall into public utility as well. 00:51:32
And then of course, if you'd like to know more about this Utah code, title 54. 00:51:41
Talks more about that goes into very specifics in the details and covers things such as rights for the public utility easement. 00:51:47
Also talks about installation, maintenance and the rights of property owners and of course the responsibilities of property 00:51:53
owners. And then. 00:51:59
At the end of the day, it really talks about the compliance within state laws. 00:52:05
So kind of why we were talking about this specifically, we were talking about municipal code change, specifically approving our 00:52:11
city in regards to public utility easements. Public utility easements are outlined on Platts. You'll be seeing many, many plots 00:52:17
coming. 00:52:22
Forth reviewing authors that have some site, for example a neighborhood need development, so we'll have would have a plastic car 00:52:29
showing how the roadways the public the public right of ways, which includes the asphalt. 00:52:35
The park strips and also the sidewalks are laid out talks about the lots of the sizes of lost, and not only are they for 00:52:41
residential purposes, but they're also for commercial purposes. An example would be Mountain America. I'll use them as an example. 00:52:48
Just today we signed a document creating a sidewalk easement on their private property. Because they weren't able to get the 00:52:56
sidewalk in the public right of way, they had to veer onto their private property in order for us to allow that to happen. 00:53:04
We had to create a sidewalk easements easement specifically for the purpose of a sidewalk, which is allowing the public the 00:53:11
ability to access. 00:53:17
To have the ability to transverse on Mountain America's private property so that was specifically created for Mountain America and 00:53:25
on and then they'll they're going to have a placerated placing typically see an area that has a generalization of where public 00:53:32
utility easements are specific. You'll see that a lot with the residential and this is just a blow up example where the public the 00:53:39
easements are outlined for at corner lot. 00:53:46
It was like a year and a half process, mainly because I got busy and I didn't do the paperwork on time. But once I did get there, 00:54:30
once I did get the paperwork, happened to coordinate with five different agencies. It was removed on the backside of my house. On 00:54:37
the side of my house, however, so you'll see those on plots showing where the easements are. Again, typical. Typical. In Vineyard 00:54:45
City, we'll do a 10th of Peewee, which is short for Public utility easement. 00:54:53
Again another example about retaining the private use of a Public Utilities and the municipal code chains that we're looking at 00:55:02
doing is to prevent a public utility easement to be retained for private use. We've had an example where we've had some plots 00:55:12
provide to us or excuse me that was given to Veneer City this is some time ago where the public, the Public Utilities meant was. 00:55:23
Dedicated the city which is tip which is is typically done or allows the city to provide to be in essence like the other almost a 00:55:34
caregiver of having oversight at the public utility. Easement to say where a utility company will say for example the power 00:55:42
company, The gas company is required to do some additional work, but they go through a encroachment permit process with the city 00:55:50
that I approach my permit with. The process with the city allows us to do is. 00:55:58
And we're trying to minimize the inconveniences to the general public overall and SSO and so the city where we tend to do is 00:56:40
we're, I wanna say the gatekeeper of it, but we're just there just to ensure that the public centers is being met for those we're 00:56:48
not. Again, all we're doing is abiding to what state laws allow. Go ahead then. 00:56:57
Does the state law? I guess there was a question brought up where? 00:57:07
Do we have any control or protected in a lot where we can actually say that your utility box can't be the size of a coffin on your 00:57:13
front yard? It happens. It's in Spanish. You're just talking about the size of the boxes, like the size and the style. I mean, do 00:57:20
we have any control over that as a City Council, could we actually put restrictions on what Public Utilities like, specifically 00:57:27
Comcast coming in? 00:57:34
You could. We could put something in our municipal ordinance. 00:58:19
If it's a franchise type activity like what you would have with the telecom company that comes in, there are some limitations 00:58:25
state law places on the city. We cannot for example. 00:58:30
Grant an exclusive franchise to anyone company. So if we allow one Internet company to come into the city via franchise agreement, 00:58:35
we would have to make the same terms available to any other franchise that comes. That can occasionally tie the city's hands. If 00:58:43
the first franchise agreement out of the gates doesn't have those kind of restrictions, then you won't be able to enforce those 00:58:50
restrictions on other franchise agreements. 00:58:58
Unless you renegotiate the terms with the original. So we'd have to do a little bit of work before we put it into a franchise 00:59:05
agreement to make sure that we're able to do it. 00:59:10
I kind of I I'm kind of thinking more in general terms. 00:59:15
Like. 00:59:21
Honestly, it was hard to follow just because it's some terms that I'll try to state it a different way. 00:59:24
We already have developments in the city and if the city granted franchise agreements for Google, for example, to come in and lay 00:59:32
cable. 00:59:38
You the Google agreement would be the template for any future Internet provider that wanted to come to the city. You can't put 00:59:46
anything in the agreement that would be more difficult for the next entity than it is. So if you didn't block big boxes, so if you 00:59:54
allowed Google to put big boxes, you can't keep the second provider from doing big boxes. OK, that makes sense and I understand 01:00:02
that. I guess what I'm asking is more of, could we just change city code altogether and say. 01:00:10
We want. 01:00:19
Public utility boxes to be smaller than this size. Would it be up to the standard of the first franchise agreement but like even 01:00:20
if we wanted to make a new code that like. 01:00:26
Like those are grandfathered in. I think. I think we should look at it. We just have to do a little bit of homework as we prepare 01:00:33
the ordinance to see what franchise agreements exist today 'cause they wouldn't expect us to go back and make them replace 01:00:39
everything that's already there. I would just say from here on out you can do that and you would do it. So the city engineer 01:00:46
developed standards for any public infrastructure and I think where we would put it is in the standards document that would say 01:00:52
these are the types of boxes. 01:00:58
That are acceptable to the city. 01:01:05
And then anyone in the future that does that would have to follow those standards. 01:01:07
Can I like Roberts rules? Can I, is there a point of something where I can make that a future? You're in a work session, so 01:01:14
totally discussion. Yeah, I mean just talk to me about it and we'll get something put together and you can work on it. So there 01:01:21
will be. So Marty, this may be something we can pair with what Naseem proposing. 01:01:28
The We've come across an issue recently with some of the very early developments in the city where the public utility easement. 01:01:36
It didn't call out all of the types of utilities that could be included. It separated out telecom and it said this PUE is for 01:01:47
items ABC and D, it is not for telecom, period. 01:01:54
And then what the developer did is they took the right to lay telecom cable and they sold it to the highest bidder. And so the PUE 01:02:02
in those residential neighborhoods can only be used for telecommunications by one company. 01:02:10
We have to close roads while they. 01:02:52
While they put it in. 01:02:55
What we'd like, what we're proposing and I guess what your feedback on is we would like to bring forward an ordinance that would 01:02:56
prohibit that in the future, so when we have future developments come to the city for approval. 01:03:03
There's probably very minimal standards. So because we're pulling it into our easement, I mean, I guess we would just pull those 01:03:46
old contracts, I think. I think what you're getting at there is. 01:03:53
Can the city go in and expand the things that can be put within that pu E? We can, but we would have to do it either by agreement 01:04:00
with all the land owners or by eminent domain, which means you have to pay for it and that's expensive for the city. Now when you 01:04:08
make an initial approval on a land use application, it's inexpensive for the city because they we already require them to create 01:04:16
apua and put things in it. We just want to be clear in our ordinance. 01:04:24
That they can't do the kind of thing that happened early on and limit. 01:04:32
Pull telecom out or limit telecom to the provider they like and it seems like an other municipalities those crossings just happen 01:04:38
without approvals and then they just kind of. 01:04:44
The absorbent to the universe, which crossings are you like? Telecom was told. Maybe in our city, Fast tells the universal person. 01:04:50
All of a sudden and another person comes in and crosses without those approvals, we're saying hey, this is the approval process. 01:04:59
If it if it were a typical pu E that just said it's available for telecom, then any telecom company that wanted to provide service 01:05:08
in the city would come to the city and say we'd like a franchise agreement to be able to lay our cable through all of your PUVS. 01:05:16
We would review that, approve it, and then they can just pull a building permit to do the work to to lay that cable. We don't have 01:05:25
that available to us in all the neighborhoods in the city because of this car map. 01:05:31
So what about location of the box? I know that's been a hot topic and you can include that in your lens. 01:05:40
For the homeowner or the property owner to have to give your or, I don't know. 01:05:50
Their consent as to where they can, where they put up, it's probably something you'll have to review with all of the standards. 01:05:57
Yeah, like like setbacks or places of entrances and exits and things like that. You can regulate it. 01:06:02
Yeah, typically, again typically when it comes to locations of boxes, telecom can be companies tend to, but there's boxes at the 01:06:09
edges of property lines as much as possible. Again, obviously there's everything's situation based on that. However, as we update 01:06:17
our standards and specifications and codes, we can have a rest dictated that they would have to do that and if they there's an 01:06:24
exception to that then they would have to just coordinate with the city. 01:06:32
In terms of. 01:06:39
Like the exemption on that, but typically I haven't talked to the telecom, telecom companies quite, but. 01:06:42
Their first go to is at the edges of property lines as much as possible. Again, if when they're coming in after the fact that 01:06:49
there's already something else there, like for example landscaping or maybe another utility. They tend to just try to cluster as 01:06:57
close as possible. But there are standards and requirements in order for like setbacks like spacing for telecoms and power. They 01:07:04
want they need to be spaced out far enough because otherwise they create their interference. 01:07:12
But yeah, I told you that's something at that point we can take a harder look into to spell it out. 01:07:21
So this is just a blow up of the note that the developer. 01:08:02
Shall, except for any public utility easement shown reserved to itself and it doesn't need a right to design, engineer, construct, 01:08:07
such and such communication facilities and the Public Utilities, which is an essence. An example of how everything the Public 01:08:15
Utilities was dedicated to the municipality of the venue city for everything except for telecommunications which which prevented 01:08:22
the city from being able to allow another company to come in and. 01:08:29
Provide services and that and that public utility easement. 01:08:38
On that so this is just a summary of what the proposed Veneer City code update would be. We don't have I mean we didn't write the 01:08:43
code then of course we're going to take your feedback as part of as part of that where the proposed city ordinance will want 01:08:49
prevent privacy preservation within a public utility easement and to. 01:08:55
Reflective require all plats submitted to the city to have language decaying full Public Utilities months to to thinner city. 01:09:04
And all that. So any other questions? It seems like something that could be beneficial is I feel like. 01:09:14
The council can ask questions if they don't understand this. But it might be beneficial for us to start sending feedback of what 01:09:23
we would like to see as you build the code. And maybe setting up meetings to review the code more in depth so that the council can 01:09:29
talk about some of the concerns they might have. Especially as we add the standards that Marty mentioned. And then having each of 01:09:36
the council talk about what they'd like to see those standards to look like. And then of course, when we do that. 01:09:43
The my department specifically will engage with some of the telecommunication companies because for example an example is having 01:09:52
the utility boxes underground for everyone would incur extra cost to other companies and we don't regulate what the utility 01:10:00
companies charge to the homeowners. I'm not saying that they would but that could be those are the only effects that were those 01:10:08
costs would be passed off down and we just want to be cognizant of the ramifications to our actions as well. 01:10:17
And it would be really interesting to see what surrounding cities have done. And newer cities especially there are being able to 01:10:25
build from the ground up, as well as how older cities were able to kind of fix past issues. Okay. Any other questions from any of 01:10:31
the council right now? No, Okay. 01:10:37
Thank you on this theme. 01:10:44
We will go ahead and move on to 2.3 subdivision ordinance amendments and our economic development team will be presenting and 01:10:45
Anthony, come on up. 01:10:50
Good evening, Mayor and council members. 01:10:57
I I I. 01:11:08
Taking a minute. 01:11:24
I have this feeling that I'm going to ask you to pull that microphone closer to you how you speak. 01:11:26
Getting a vibe. 01:11:32
Can you hear me? Great. 01:11:42
All right. So my name is Anthony Fletcher. I'm a planner here at the city. 01:11:45
And I will be presenting on the subdivision. 01:11:51
Code amendments So. 01:11:55
Through this and through this entire presentation, I will be taking us through the updates that have been. 01:11:59
Necessitated by the state, the state law, I mean state bill. The Senate bill, SB174 requires that we make certain changes to our 01:12:09
code. 01:12:15
And get them adopted by February 1st 2024 and these changes. 01:12:23
Pretty much affect the preliminary subdivision, final subdivision and Adu parking requirements, as well as landscaping bonds. And 01:12:31
we took the opportunity as staff to also do a general code cleanup as well to make sure we're all in conformance with the state 01:12:38
law. 01:12:45
So as you may already know. 01:12:55
In this presentation, I will be using subdivisions and plats interchangeably, just so we're all on the same page. On this slide, I 01:12:59
have an example of a preliminary plat on the left side of the screen and a final plot on the right side. The preliminary plat 01:13:07
pretty much shows an outline or layout of a land that is going to be subdivided, showing the lots. 01:13:16
The roadways and pretty much the parcels of the of that land that's being subdivided. And the final subdivision does a bit more 01:13:26
than that. What it does is it has a lot, it shows a lot more information. So you can tell this one on the right has, you know, 01:13:33
setbacks shown on it. It has. 01:13:40
Addresses. It has notes on the PUE like you just lent, and a lot more information about what is going to happen on the ground. 01:13:49
So this is part of the process before you see a building rise up in the city, so after you have had approval for both of those. 01:13:57
Preliminary and final plat you move on to applying for site plan which goes into. 01:14:05
More detail on one lot or parcel that has been approved from the final plat. 01:14:12
So having said that, this these are going to be the code amendments that are being proposed based on the state requirements now. 01:14:21
Umm, we have divided this into two. We have the state, umm the state code ones and we have administrative recommendations that 01:14:32
would help make the process smoother for us as staff of the city. So to begin with the pre application meeting is now optional. We 01:14:39
use to require that before any applicant to apply for a preliminary subdivisions. 01:14:47
The approval body has also changed from the City Council to the Planning Commission. We have also updated the public utility 01:14:57
reference that we had in the code to the data version. We also do not require. We also just require 50% of utility plans and 01:15:07
landscape plans and we also require that you have both on. 01:15:16
One seat. We also have taken out the engineering and review cost. Before we had Nasim and other city engineers, we used to 01:15:26
contract our engineering review to consultants outside. So we had to have a cost review section of the code. Now we don't need to 01:15:35
do that and we have a the fee schedule to replace all of that kind of information. 01:15:44
All applications are online. Hard copies are no more required by the code. 01:15:54
That's a recommendation that we're we are having a staff and we have. 01:16:02
The various parcels that are going to be. 01:16:08
Going to be presented have to be have to be given addresses by the city engineer. 01:16:13
We have also recommended that we add HOA maintenance responsibilities as well in the code to have a clear cut of what public works 01:16:20
should be doing and what the HOA should be responsible for. 01:16:28
And that would be very helpful for all residents as well. We have also included that we need to add the components of a title 01:16:37
report for the application purposes because a lot of times people get mixed. 01:16:43
Up with what a title report is and a title insurance is, so they look similar. 01:16:51
For the final subdivision, we have an approval body being. 01:16:57
The Development Review committee used to be the City Council and concurrent applications are no more allowed. 01:17:02
Concept plans are now optional, but we strongly recommend that applicants. 01:17:12
Share that with us as well in a city. 01:17:19
Application review according to the state, has to be within 20 business days and of the city we have a staff. We have recommended 01:17:22
that the plat after approval has to be recorded within two years. It used to be required to be recorded within a year. So all of 01:17:30
these finals, final subdivision changes are bringing us into code with the state's code, except for the final plat recording which 01:17:37
we're recommending. 01:17:45
Two years, yes. Any questions on that from the Council? 01:17:53
Umm, to clarify the the changes that we're making because that the way I understood it was the state code only requires us to have 01:17:57
these changes made for residential, but we are doing both residential and commercial just to be consistent, right? 01:18:04
OK. Any questions from the council on the differentiate differentiation between commercial and residential? 01:18:13
Why are we doing it for both? 01:18:23
So this would allow the process to move smoother and faster and would take away the block roadblocks. If we have to review 01:18:28
applications that come in, those are kind of it formalizes as one process across the board as opposed to having two separate 01:18:35
processes between commercial residential. Do you want to talk about any pros or cons that there might be out there? How many 01:18:42
citizens have you engaged on this to get to know? 01:18:49
Like businesses? 01:18:56
Have you like citizen engagement on like, feedback? Yeah. And Morgan, maybe you can address that. It seems like they're saying, 01:18:58
you know, is this going to be a detriment to any of those commercial businesses that causes them any agitation as they're going 01:19:04
through this process or will it be a benefit? Can you talk about the pros and cons? 01:19:10
It would align it with what the state is required for the residential. You could keep it that the commercial of the same process 01:19:18
now if that was the decision of the the council. 01:19:24
We like having it all of our subdivision plat as under the same process that makes it easy to administrate on the staff end as far 01:19:30
as public process. This will be out for a public hearing with the the Planning Commission and then this the City Council for this 01:19:37
is kind of the beginning of the process of like a work session with the we'll go through a week before we OK that's good. We're 01:19:44
not voting on it tonight. OK this is this educational purposes OK go to the next one. 01:19:51
So as I mentioned earlier, the final subdivision will be having the DRC as the approval body and the DRC. 01:20:01
Would be. 01:20:12
The Land Use authority for this, and it is pretty much going to be a technical review. That is why we have the members of the 01:20:15
voting members of the DRC being the chair of the Planning Commission, the City Manager, RDA Director, the heads of department at 01:20:23
the Building Engineering and Community Development and Parks and Recs. 01:20:31
So any questions about this? 01:20:40
Was the Planning Commission chair always on there when we reviewed on Tuesday? I think that's the new one. The ones that were 01:20:45
added were the RDA entity manager. And so as we met with each of the council members, the thought was if we're going to have 01:20:51
department heads, why not have all the department heads? 01:20:56
That do land use type type decisions. You're already a director and your city manager are typically a part of the VRC so that puts 01:21:02
it at 7:00. So those will be the seven voting members. You still have the fire Marshall and others that you know that that wanted 01:21:10
to come in these would be like the the the voting members of the TRC you're this is one of the the more significant changes pushed 01:21:17
forward by the state statute. You the city used to have plot approval occur final plat approval occur at the City Council level. 01:21:25
The state law changed it so city councils can no longer be the final plat approval authority. You have three different options 01:21:34
that the city really is where you would like this this to land. It can be a staff level approval, it can be a Planning Commission 01:21:40
level approval or you can create. 01:21:47
Land use approval Authority and what the city what the staff is proposing is that it be the 3rd that it be this authority and that 01:21:54
that authority be the development review committee and they would be the land use approval for they would be the land use 01:22:00
authority under state law for. 01:22:07
Subdivision ordinance, final plans. This would also change the composition of that body a little bit. 01:22:15
But that's that's the change. And then the political connection to the council is just our ordinances that they have to adhere to. 01:22:22
Yes, there would not be a role. There would not be a role for the City Council in final approval. So it's a non. You actually 01:22:29
can't have a role in that any longer under state law. 01:22:35
Residential subdivision applications for one or two family residential units and townhomes. You do have latitude to decide whether 01:22:42
this should apply to other types of subdivision applications, but that's a requirement. 01:22:50
And maybe I can clarify more and maybe you're saying this is just they're following the codes that are already a part of our city 01:23:00
to review these and the state's code and that's how they are going about it in a non political. 01:23:06
Format. OK. Could you repeat what you just said, so this, so were you saying the state code only applies to certain types of 01:23:13
housing for residential or all residential? Let me try to Orient you by going through how things were done previously, what the 01:23:21
news, what the news state code requires. And then I mean I think I understand that. I guess you just want to know what the new 01:23:28
state law applies to if if it does differentiate between types of housing. 01:23:36
For us to make these changes, yes. So the only thing the state law requires is that the final plat approval for one and two family 01:23:44
residential subdivisions that are only. 01:23:52
One or two family residential units or townhomes. 01:24:02
The final plat approval cannot happen at the City Council level, so other types of developments, if it's mixed-use or if it's a 01:24:06
commercial development, you can still have the final plot approvals happen at the City Council level. 01:24:13
Period then. OK, I have no questions further on that. 01:24:50
My only concern when I met with staff was that the DRC, you know, the licensing and the education level on the DRC level, and I'm 01:24:57
a little bit concerned on the chair of the Planning Commission because it's just they're not paid right. This is a pretty 01:25:03
substantial role. It's like twice a month. 01:25:09
Isn't it And the reviewing of staff. Yeah so the DRC would be meets twice a month but we would we would do the Platts. We would do 01:25:17
like the voting as it needed based a lot of times it wouldn't be a voting meeting but when we had a plat it would be. But also 01:25:24
just the background like you know Parks and Rec. I don't know if they have a background in this maybe maybe ours does. I don't 01:25:32
know our director when we get on boarded also like the RDA or city manager so it seems like. 01:25:39
You know the certificates or the training. It's like, why not just keep it to those that have the certification and training on 01:25:48
it? Is it just because? 01:25:53
That that we don't want to go below, but it is nice to have because you you would still need a quorum just like any other board. 01:26:31
So if you have the seven then you would need at least four to to make a vote. If you have five, you need at least. 01:26:38
And so it's nice to have a consistent voice. I think the city manager is over all these departments and is able has a overall 01:26:45
perspective that individuals don't always have and the RDA does an entirely different job and expertise. 01:26:54
And Land Management at a totally different way. So I I think that they bring something maybe not like everything, but each of them 01:27:02
have a different perspective that I think gives the city a more robust understanding. 01:27:10
That I would feel more comfortable with, with a few more voices than a few less. 01:27:19
So I might push back just a small bit because that's that's two out of the 1234, that's 5 with the set with the two being a 01:27:59
business background. So I feel like land use finance business and then the overall. 01:28:09
The only restriction is that your land use authority on those limited types of flat approvals can't be the City Council. I think 01:28:52
the effort is by the state legislature to depoliticize the approval process for housing to encourage more housing development, and 01:29:00
so they give the city some choice in how you depoliticize that and who makes the approval. 01:29:09
Every city is really different in staffing levels and those types of things, and so the decisions have been. 01:29:19
Pretty different from city to city, as I've seen a few ordinances come through cities that have a really robust staff. 01:29:28
Will often have those approvals at a staff level I what I've. 01:29:37
Thought of in my mind as I advise clients on this is that. 01:29:42
My concern on plats is that we're going to introduce errors by having fewer eyeballs on the plat and so having. 01:29:48
A review committee with more people is actually preferable to fewer, as long as they can meet frequently enough to meet the 01:29:58
statutory review deadlines, because we only get a limited number of views now at the documents once an application is complete. So 01:30:06
we just need to be sure it's not so big that you can't meet infrequently. But more eyeballs from my advantage is better because 01:30:15
we're more likely to catch errors and mistakes and have a really thorough review. 01:30:23
That's the public meeting. 01:31:07
And I should note, a policy thrust of the legislation was to not have public hearings on this. And I'll try to explain why I think 01:31:10
it did that. What often happened on final plat approvals is neighbors would come and say, I don't like this development, you 01:31:17
should not approve it. 01:31:24
But you're making an administrative approval, and if that land use right exists and they make application within those rules, your 01:31:32
hands were tied. So the cities would often confront a room full of people that didn't like a project, but the law would require 01:31:39
them to make the approval. And so the people who came to offer comment left frustrated, feeling like they weren't heard. And the 01:31:47
people on the City Council voting on the plat approval felt frustrated because. 01:31:55
They couldn't do what their constituents were asking because the law required something different. 01:32:03
And so where it was a technical review and not a public, you know, do we like it or not like it, kind of review the the statute 01:32:10
requires you to take it out of the context where you're going to create that dynamic. The rub with it is if your ordinances aren't 01:32:18
really tight, then you may end up having development that you don't like. And so the City Council has, from my view, an enhanced 01:32:26
responsibility to make sure that the city code is how you like it and what you want it to be. 01:32:35
Because if it's not, when an application comes, if it complies with city code, it'll move forward. 01:32:43
Skype now. 01:32:51
So in addition to the. 01:32:55
Subdivision processes that need to be amended. We also have state code changes that recommends that we. 01:32:58
Reduce the minimum parking spaces or requirements for accessory dwelling units and also landscaping bonds for certificate of 01:33:08
occupancy is no more required. So one of the things that we said pay attention to the council even though this is just a work 01:33:16
session, this is SB174 that brought in this code, this was pushed forward last legislative session. One of the things that the 01:33:23
city did one of the requests from the public. 01:33:30
Was that they wanted a reduction of parking on their streets. In most of the neighborhoods there was overwhelming parking on their 01:33:38
St. surfaces and so they required in the city an additional space other than the four that is required for housing. So that if you 01:33:46
had an accessory dwelling unit which was also brought in that everybody should is allowed to have them that they would have to put 01:33:55
a parking space to kind of allow the city wise management of this. Now they are reducing this so you may. 01:34:03
Receive pushback from a large group of your constituents that would be really good to bring together to the table for discussion 01:34:13
as we get ready and prepared for the legislative session to decide how we want to discuss this moving forward at the state. You 01:34:20
already have pushed back from me as a constituent that this really frustrated me when it was brought to my attention, and I had no 01:34:27
idea that it even went through on the state level. There's so much going on there. 01:34:33
I would love. 01:34:42
To talk to the right people to fix this back because I think having that additional requirement has been very useful and helpful 01:34:44
for for Vineyard specifically. And I understand there's other cities that have wider, longer roads and bigger lots that it's not 01:34:51
as big of a deal. But for us, I think it greatly effects. Yeah. And I think the bigger issue that you're pushing on is that there 01:34:59
was a reduction of Adus that went into other cities by like 65% plus if you had a main campus in your area. 01:35:07
That doesn't fall into us. We are on the jurisdictional line of a main campus and then we have additional main or campus in our 01:35:15
area. But because we didn't fall in the jurisdiction of the main campus, we didn't get a reduction of the 65%. And so because of 01:35:21
that, it's it's not the wide roads necessarily. There's just when you have a 65% reduction of Adus and Armaprovo parking minimum 01:35:28
or addition like an extra space, it doesn't affect your citywide management the same way that it does if you don't get that 01:35:34
reduction in the city, so. 01:35:40
Let's get together. I'll send out the names for these bills and the people that are working on them this session. And we're 01:35:48
probably going to want to bring up those multiple facets of where we stand as a City Council will have to come together as we 01:35:53
start reviewing those. So, OK. 01:35:58
Do you have a question? What could you do? 01:36:04
And just talking with other City Council members in the last month and a half and engaging with them, I can't tell you the 01:36:07
frustration of the power grab from the state. It's embarrassing. It's something that we need to fight for our sovereignty of. 01:36:13
I haven't ran into a City Council member that. 01:36:21
Enjoys it. Even Debbie Larae of Orem or some of the others is just like we need to be speaking with our House and and Senate 01:36:25
Connect, you know connections of. 01:36:30
You know, it's America. These, these things were sent down to the city. And I know that the big old legislature will come in and 01:36:36
pound their chest and say, I have the power or whatnot, and we just need to be advocating for that. Yeah. And we'll definitely get 01:36:42
you guys up to date on what we've been doing and what we've been able to bring into the city so far and what we've been able to 01:36:47
hold back. We have some really strong relationships. So this will be a good start to this legislative discussion. Go ahead, 01:36:53
Anthony. 01:36:59
So this is going to be more of a recap of what has been proposed to what is currently happening. So these are the approval, 01:37:06
designated approval boards that we have. 01:37:11
So City Council. 01:37:18
On the final Plat has changed to DRC and City Council for the approval body has also changed to Planning Commission. 01:37:20
So the next steps, as you already know, this is the working session we would have. 01:37:32
A public hearing on January 17th, Planning Commission and City Council in January 24th. 01:37:38
And just a reminder, this has to be adopted the the state code has to be adopted. 01:37:47
First, additionally with these approvals, we'll have to create the TAC in our Commission ordinance and our committee's ordinance. 01:37:55
So we'll see that on the agenda coming forward as well. 01:38:00
The DRC as attack, I thought you said TA salmon, I did. Technical advisory committee is our DRC, You know, right. I mean, it's not 01:38:06
a complaint and I know I'm new, but this is a working session and we didn't only got it 24 hours before. And it would have been 01:38:14
amazing for me to be able to go out to constituencies so that they could be here during the working session and to have them hear 01:38:21
about it, you know, 'cause this is one of their opportunities for them to engage us on the process. 01:38:28
And moving forward, I would totally need to have this before like the topic so that I can tell all of our constituents so that 01:38:36
they can be here. A 24 hour notice isn't sufficient. Like it's just not. I know maybe it's been that way for. 01:38:44
In terms of like engaging the citizenry, in my mind it's like you would allow us to know. 01:38:54
A week before, hey, there's going to be a working session on this X issue and it allows me to go for those that are 4 or against. 01:39:02
I actually like to hear the people that are against, you know, before I get to the working session so that I'm educated enough to 01:39:09
ask questions. And I have a background in government procurement, but I do not have a background in planning, you know and so like 01:39:16
for me to make an educated decision and and all of us have a different backgrounds, right and so. 01:39:23
I'm going to come into a working session like today and I didn't get to talk to anybody for or against it. So I'm not even able to 01:39:31
even develop some questions or have them here. I love the date, you know on on both sides of the issue and so like and I'll talk 01:39:37
to both all the department heads when I meet with them but and I've kind of said that like. 01:39:44
Just making sure that citizens are are for, against And then the last thing is, is so there's two things that are going on here, 01:39:52
what is state required and then also what is staff suggested and I'd really like to get that delineated in color extremely well so 01:39:59
that I can have a packet to send out in this two week period so that they so that the citizens can know, hey these are some 01:40:07
changes I can do a YouTube special on both of those. 01:40:14
Or against so that when I come back on January 24th, we can have that council meeting or whatnot. But like the the working session 01:40:22
is a great opportunity for citizens to be here and it's like we skip this and this is a big there's a massive change. 01:40:31
You know, especially like it's residential, but then also it's like combined with let's do commercial the same way, even though 01:40:40
that's not statement, it's like we need to make sure that citizens know that we have that option to vote on to include both of 01:40:45
them on, right? 01:40:50
So you have something to share about work sessions? Well, I can, I can try to describe the change in the process. The the City 01:40:56
Council hasn't in the past held work sessions like the one we're holding today. And the intent behind it was to try to get out 01:41:04
what we've heard over the last few months of please don't bring things for action when we haven't heard about them. So today's 01:41:12
discussion was intended to be an orienting and kind of educational discussion. 01:41:19
In advance of when you would hold the public hearing. 01:41:28
OK, so that you could. 01:41:31
Hear from staff have the opportunity to ask questions, look at documents, you know that kind of thing. Lots of cities when they do 01:41:34
work sessions like this could do it around a conference room table. We have enough people come to our meetings, so that's tough to 01:41:40
do. But if you imagine that you are sort of around a conference room table, this is intended to be that kind of tabletop 01:41:45
discussion where we would say. 01:41:51
Here are the ordinances we're forecasting that are coming down the Pike. We want to give you a general understanding of what they 01:41:58
are so that you can begin asking for information that you would need and and other things. So I I think what you just explained 01:42:05
will be helpful to staff. They could try to, you know separate the document in a way that you could. 01:42:12
Public and then they'll be able to watch the video. Have two weeks, but you got the note on a color coordination and things that 01:42:58
you needed. Was there anything other than anything else the council wanted? 01:43:03
To give us suggestions before we move off this item. 01:43:10
Um, yeah, sure. Come up to my microphone. 01:43:19
It's not a lot. 01:43:21
Thank you. 01:43:28
Karen Cornelius, resident. 01:43:30
I just think that we're missing a point that Council member Holdaway made and that is that we need more than 24 hours. I just 01:43:32
think that's, I think that's the crux of what he's saying. He would like to be able to notify people so that, I mean even for me, 01:43:39
I would have liked more than 24 hours. That's a lot to read, to digest, to try to understand for the right person. And tonight has 01:43:47
helped a lot and I appreciate it, but I do think. 01:43:54
That we deserve a little more time. I don't know how long you knew it was on the agenda and that's not my problem. That's. But 01:44:02
just let us know. Give us time. 01:44:07
Oh, wait one second. I'm going to go ahead and take this and then I'll allow for discussion, parents. So we go ahead and sit down 01:44:14
here and I'll address your comments. We're not going to take any more comments on this. 01:44:18
But I will say this his points of 24 hours notice and I think what Jamie is saying, so maybe I can try to make it clear for the 01:44:22
public so that you can understand it is. 01:44:27
In the opportunity for the residents to come is during the public hearing and the notice. The minimum notice requirement is the 24 01:44:33
hours. So what we did was we took two weeks in advance notice, 24 hours in advance of this meeting to give a conversation that's 01:44:41
sitting here. So now you don't have 24 hours notice for your public hearing. 01:44:49
You have over 2 weeks for that time. This work session is a discussion for the council that we are now doing publicly to say, hey, 01:44:58
here's all the things, Jake, Sarah, Amber, Marty, they all met with staff all week and talked about this presentation and gave 01:45:05
their feedback, asked questions about it. Now we're here in the public and we're doing it again for the public. But also actually 01:45:13
it's for us and it's to do in the public eye so that we can notice it two weeks in advance. 01:45:20
Now you don't have 24 hours. You have two weeks in advance notice. But to keep the business going, I'm Jake, if you have a final 01:45:28
comment on that, I can understand and concur with that. But this law passed in the session last year, right? So we knew as a 01:45:35
planning department in April of last year that we would have to be facing this moving forward in April, May of last year. We 01:45:42
should have been saying, hey citizens, there's going to be this big structural change that happens. I'm not doing a public notice, 01:45:49
just doing a. 01:45:56
Planning department is going to be facing this. 01:46:04
So that it's so far out because we knew this right when the state legislature changed. Well and maybe maybe we did but and I don't 01:46:07
know if we want to do clarity right now, but we should learn about this before we say it because sometimes what actually happens 01:46:13
is a lot of bills go through and it goes to the state entity. They get all of the information and then they send us notices and 01:46:19
sometimes we get notices towards the end of the year or mid year or at some point. 01:46:25
OK, state right. So we knew July 1st but it but it passed in it goes official July 1st for the for the legislature. I'm just 01:46:34
saying that. 01:46:38
If we can change the culture so that especially with the legislative session that we look at the end of legislative session for 01:46:43
all departments that this is coming down from the state. So that in April, May we're as department saying this is going to be on 01:46:49
the agenda. Democrats, Republicans on both sides. Because what I want is the citizens to fight it out themselves and come to a 01:46:55
debate so that we're not the decision body but that there's some sort of debate that's happening in the public square. So it's 01:47:01
like hey, we waited. 01:47:07
Sure. As far as like putting that the public haven't. Yeah we I mean yeah we can always do better. We started working on this from 01:47:46
a staff side doing an auditor for code and that took a few months. I mean it was a pretty big deep dive and we went through the 01:47:53
entire code and quite frankly we're extremely busy and so like we we kind of take things as we can and but yeah I'm duly noted 01:48:00
we'll we'll always try to do better to to get things out. 01:48:08
And I'm going to stop comments on this particular item just because I feel like we've, we understand, we know how we're gonna move 01:48:16
forward. It was good commentary. I think you've really spoken good points and I think there's one more that's different though, 01:48:22
which is not only the timing, but it's also a minimal citizen requirement of how many are involved in the development of that 01:48:28
process. Totally love the staff that they're involved and that they went through and got together and their professionals and 01:48:34
going through and doing that. 01:48:40
But in every city you want to and every department's a little bit different. But like as you're going through, how many people 01:48:46
would like to be involved? How many people would like to be behind the scenes? How many could we deputize and say, hey, I just 01:48:52
want to listen and be involved because cities can do that. We don't have to be, hey, nobody gets to know until like staff works 01:48:57
over here and then and then they know. 01:49:02
You know working at the National League of Cities, I've learned and just going to the national organization, that's like, yeah, if 01:49:09
if somebody comes and approaches the planning department and says. 01:49:13
I'll work for free. I'm a volunteer. I'd love to just sit in the meeting. And as we're developing this policy or code, it's just 01:49:18
so helpful if you build relationships or whatnot. So I know this isn't for this specific code, but as an organization, as an 01:49:25
ordinance for departments, or as a good best practice, it's like I would like to. 01:49:31
Involve that and not only just for the constituents that believe in the way I think, but the constituents that don't believe the 01:49:39
way I think, so that both sides are kind of represented in that. 01:49:44
Getting really down to the finite description of plots and then building upon those decisions going forward. 01:50:51
We talked about a little bit of some legislative topics and how we're going to start at the base of those and talk and move 01:50:57
forward. I'll review some of the things we're going to be doing next during public comment. There's a period of time that we get 01:51:04
to talk. This is a time that's not generally on the for items that are on the agenda. These are not things that we can take 01:51:10
immediate actions on unless it fits that emergency opportunity like Jamie was saying or if we want to have a discussion. 01:51:17
There's a lot of rules that go with it that I usually set at the beginning of a public comments period that we adhere to to keep. 01:51:25
To step into me and we will start helping you accomplish your goals throughout the year and then we'll start doing some of those 01:52:05
reports. Anybody that's had meetings, if you could hold your reports until next time, that would be really helpful. 01:52:12
Coming next, then, what we'll do is we will go through our staff reports, we'll have a consent agenda, a consent agenda and we'll 01:52:20
talk a little bit about the obligations here as you get these agendas. What you'll want to do is go and schedule time with first 01:52:26
the city manager who will take you through the departments that you will be discussing. 01:52:33
Umm, any item that is on the agenda. You want to do this as soon as you get the draft so that you can start going through them. 01:52:41
It'll go through a period where you can discuss those drafts and then they will be noticed and made public. 01:52:46
If you have something that public comments, I mean public sorry, public comment, thank you for that correction. This is a time to 01:53:26
talk about things that are not on the agenda. You'll come up to this microphone, you'll state your name, you'll share your 01:53:31
comments with us and then we'll close in 15 minutes today. So is there anybody that has a comment that they would like to make to 01:53:37
the council? Come on up, state your name where you're from and what your comments is. Elizabeth Holdaway. I'm from Washington, but 01:53:43
I live in Vineyard now. 01:53:49
I just have two quick comments. There's not a ton of people here today, but I I know you've had to start raising your hands. I 01:53:56
would like to petition somehow that those hands are counted so that when you write down your whatever comments you're writing down 01:54:04
that you can have a check mark or somebody can say, wow, you know, 15 people raise their hands. They almost really agree with that 01:54:11
statement or that concern or that issue. So somehow because there's lots of times where. 01:54:18
I'm raising my hand because I don't always want to stand up, right? But I would love for my voice to be heard and counted. So I'd 01:54:26
love if there was some way to do that just to have for future meetings. And then kind of going back to Jake's comments, last 01:54:33
meeting. And I'm sorry there were so many things thrown at us in the last three meetings, but Jamie made a comment to this, either 01:54:41
the RDA loan for the $41 million one. 01:54:48
Or it was the PID where you asked. You said we do ask for at least seven days notice. 01:54:56
Who wanted to be here, where we're scared to drive in this Blizzard, So I think more people would come if the weather had not been 01:55:32
crazy tonight. But for the rest of the times where there's been lots of people coming, it'd be nice to have that notice. Thank 01:55:37
you. 01:55:41
Hello, my name is Jordan Christensen. I'm a resident Vineyard. A couple of us have brought to you a let me get the words right 01:55:50
here. A small, occasional non pecuniary gift worth less than $50. Hopefully you haven't gotten too many of these in the last 9 01:55:56
days. 01:56:01
But what we've brought to you is a book that is called Paved Paradise, How Parking Explains the World. And as the name suggests, 01:56:09
this book is about how parking, because of our many regulations, ends up dominating many parts of our lives in our cities. 01:56:18
In it, you'll find stories about how parking is central to not only cars, but also transit, public space, architecture, affordable 01:56:28
housing. 01:56:32
And stormwater flooding and the treatment of our environment. 01:56:37
And to be clear, I'm not anti parking and this book is not an anti parking book. I think it's easy to assume because. 01:56:42
I obviously ride my bike a lot of places that maybe I am somehow anti parking. In reality, having mostly ridden my bike for most 01:56:53
trips that I make in the past year, I've actually had more. 01:57:00
Difficulty finding as far to park my bike and lock it up securely than I have ever had parking a car somewhere so I'm not anti 01:57:08
parking. What I am pro for is better parking and better parking regulations and better parking management. And I think in this 01:57:16
book you will find really great ideas to to achieve whatever goal you have in terms of mobility and enabling better access for 01:57:24
people regardless of their transportation mode. 01:57:32
So I hope you do spend some time reading this and I hope you are approaching from a point of curiosity of this authors and many 01:57:41
other people's critiques of the status quo when it comes to parking codes. And finally, I hope you, after reading this, will take 01:57:48
some time to consider if the status quo and what we have right now is really the best path forward to being good stewards of the 01:57:55
earth that we've inherited. Thank you. 01:58:03
Thanks. 01:58:10
My name is Tyler Harrelson. I live in Edgewater. 01:58:15
Just want to make a couple of comments. First one, I noticed I walked in. Jacob's placard says hold away. I know, right in your 01:58:19
name, so we'll fix it. I saw that. I noticed, so I figured I should have mentioned so it could be fixed. I've been in South 01:58:25
America and they say it that way anyway, so it's funny. Yeah. 01:58:31
But no one ever is pronounced the D. 01:58:39
Should still be there. 01:58:43
My other comment was so north of Edgewater, you've got 400 N that borders the, I think it's the yard development, the Forks 01:58:46
development, the one with Megaplex Theater and all those different areas. Because I live there and I'm checking my dog out and 01:58:54
things, I see people all the time walking across that road and because I drive to work everyday using that road, I noticed that 01:59:01
there's there's a turning lane there that is really not necessary. I don't think I've ever seen. 01:59:08
Even nearly enough traffic. I think I've waited behind one person before, but I don't think anyone's ever needed to use that that 01:59:16
turning lane. So I'd love to see that entire Rd. change to the. Currently it's classified as a collector. I think you should 01:59:22
probably be a local St. 01:59:28
Just because it's not really necessary to have so much, and if there's another connection to Orem, I would be nervous if so many 01:59:36
people walking across that, if it's built to be a large, faster Rd. that people get hit because I walk over there all the time. 01:59:43
Part of where we bought in that area specifically was so I could walk to the theater or or to get pizza or whatever it is with my 01:59:50
wife anyways, so. 01:59:57
My sort of longer term suggestion is to to make it more of a slower Rd. so that in the future if there is connection or if there 02:00:05
isn't a connection it's safe for people walking and can encourage multiple forms of transit while still keeping driving an option. 02:00:11
The other thing was in the shorter term, taking out that turning lane could add space for on street parking which would be great 02:00:17
our development has. 02:00:24
Thanks. 02:01:01
Thank you. 02:01:04
Hi, David Larae from Holly Rd. 02:01:07
I just want to say thank you very much to the to the mayor and to Jamie attorney for for this work session that we've held 02:01:11
tonight. I recognize as a departure from the usual and an attempt to put to be more open and to bring the discussion to the 02:01:17
Citizens Center. And I appreciate the intent behind that. And I said thank you very much for that. It said I find it refreshing 02:01:24
and helpful. So thank you. 02:01:30
I'm Keith Holdaway, resident vineyard. 02:01:41
I wanted to express appreciation to Marty for responding to any to a text message. I I sent out a message, a questionnaire, and to 02:01:44
many, many people and I heard from Marty and and our city manager, so I appreciate that. 02:01:53
But I didn't hear back. A couple weeks ago I asked the question about the theater and the golf, and I asked for about about how 02:02:03
much we, we were returning to those facilities, tax money and I was promised. 02:02:12
By the mayor. I'm sure she has a lot on her plate, but she was promised me a correspondence and I haven't received that. I'm. I'm 02:02:23
really wanting to know that as a citizen. Thank you for the follow up. OK. Thank you. 02:02:29
Karen Cornelius, resident. 02:02:42
I appreciate it, Keith, coming up because that was one of my questions and since that question was asked in a public setting. 02:02:44
So that was. 02:03:29
Whether that happens or not, I know you can't respond to that. I just want to say that I too appreciate tonight because I think 02:03:30
that in any relationship, no matter how large the relationship is or how intimate it is, it's about communication and trust. And 02:03:38
that's something that has been severely lacking in the past. And I feel like we've taken a step tonight and I feel bad at how I 02:03:46
feel. 02:03:53
About the things that go on here, and I don't want to feel that way, I want us to be able to work together for the common good. 02:04:01
And so I hope that this year we can work on building that trust and increasing our communication. 02:04:08
Now I have a question about the meeting on the 27th. That was it was the decision on the public hearing that night. Everything was 02:04:17
moved so that we could meet. 02:04:22
Not on the 13th, but it was at 12. Oh. 02:04:29
Like 12:10 in the morning when it was decided that we would move that meeting till the 27th. 02:04:33
To talk about the east side PID, which we did however. 02:04:39
That was a public hearing that was postponed and there was number public comment allowed in the meeting on the 27th. 02:04:46
And I have a question about the East side PID that I need to have answered because we have seen, we have seen plans and we have 02:04:53
heard plans and we understand the concept that the developers have for the West side. 02:05:01
Maybe I'm in the dark, maybe I'm lost, but I don't know what the east side is going to contain and yet we have approved a PID for 02:05:10
that east side. Is this opening the door? And this is my question that keeps me awake at night. Is this opening the door? 02:05:19
To our inland Port Authority because we don't know what the plan is for the east side, but yet the PID was approved with no 02:05:29
further comment on the 27th and that was really disconcerting because a lot of us gave up continued family Christmas time to be 02:05:37
27. Thank you. This is the last comment. 02:05:45
Good evening, Mike Cox, resident. I just wanted to say really quickly that. 02:05:58
One of the things I really appreciated about Tyson like was that he really did stay on top of a lot of what was going on in the 02:06:05
legislature. And I learned a lot from him in these meetings about what was going on. And so I just wanted to say that. 02:06:12
I appreciated that. And I kind of feel like now maybe it kind of falls to all of you to kind of pick up what he was doing so that 02:06:21
we as vintage residents stay on top of it. I mean, it's a it's a power grab from the state. I mean, I I think it's horrible that 02:06:31
you guys should have to give up part of your duties and powers. I mean, that's ridiculous. So that's all. 02:06:40
Thank you. All right. Just to touch on a few things, I'm going to work backwards. We will definitely stay on top of it. Everybody 02:06:49
plays a different role in dealing with it and enticed in a marvelous job reporting it. So don't worry about that. We will. We'll 02:06:55
be on that and appreciate your support and your comment. 02:07:01
The public comment was completed. The public hearing was completed on the 13th, the decision was continued to the 27th. So the 02:07:08
public comment was finalized on the 13th and then the council's decision was continued for the 27th. That's the difference. I 02:07:14
don't know if you want to clarify that any further, Jamie. 02:07:20
Or if I did a good enough job. No, it's that's how I understood it too. So on public hearings, you notice it for a specific date 02:07:27
and we allowed the public hearing to occur and it wasn't, It was closed prior to that meeting, which myself. 02:07:34
Yeah. I wanted to add to that. I don't think we realized it was going to be moved either. Otherwise, we could have had the 02:07:42
opportunity to leave it as an open public hearing, right, Like we can continue a public hearing. Yeah, we can always continue a 02:07:48
public hearing. I think we completed the public hearings on the 13th to keep business moving forward. 02:07:54
And is there just for future, just like a general question, do we ever want to like, read public hearing something if we feel like 02:08:00
it's important to the public or is that? 02:08:05
To come back and be voted in by the body, be discussed, it would come several times, it would go through probably a long process 02:08:43
like the PID did. So that's something that you can stay involved in and the PID isn't something that opens doors for those things 02:08:52
if they're, they're separate in and of themselves. Let's see, I would like to make a comment on that like, sorry, go ahead. 02:09:00
I firmly believe Atlanta, Fulton County does this where they put in an ordinance that it requires like a 30 day process on big 02:09:10
projects, something like that. 02:09:15
That is such a massive thing. I can't tell you how many constituents felt violated by either the pit or the in the poor or or Utah 02:09:21
city where it's like. 02:09:25
It's something and I don't know how to define size or scope, but it's like. 02:09:32
For or against need to have, you can't petition your government if you don't know what your government is doing is always kind of 02:09:37
a default. And so it's like, I would like this body to look at the ordinance and put something in so that it doesn't matter if 02:09:45
it's Utah City or whoever, there's some sort of requirement so that it's not slammed on any of this like that. And there's ways to 02:09:52
do it. I will look at Fulton County's ordinance. I know it's a county, but it really stops. 02:10:00
Some anger and it allows the citizens like a 30 day period to kind of know hey this is coming up because the port was like, hey, 02:10:08
we're dropping three different things and we're learning it in 48 hours and I won't be a part of a body that does that. Like it's 02:10:14
just it feels wrong and it and it just. 02:10:20
And so sometimes when you see something like an inland port come to the public, you're like why is the inland port coming here? 02:11:00
But it is the first opportunity that we had to not only say it for the council who's learning, but allow the residents to know 02:11:06
that we're learning about it. And that's the beginning of a very transparent open process. This allow you to have the very first 02:11:12
presentation with the City Council and that was the the meaningful way that we went about it. I want to talk about something that 02:11:18
came up that I think needs clarity. 02:11:24
And a process that the City Council needs to look at when we're talking about public notices. 02:11:31
The PID notice that was mentioned actually had a ten was a 10 or 14 days. Do you know the land use I think is is it 10/12/14, it's 02:11:36
I believe it was 10 days, 10 days, so it wasn't a 24 hour. But what I'm noticing is that I think it's the packet that the 02:11:45
residents are talking about as far as when you get information and the packet is a courtesy that is given that is a policy that 02:11:53
internally we should talk about during the retreat. 02:12:01
On how to provide additional information as a council. So looking forward keep that in mind on we can get some recommendations we 02:12:10
can look at other opportunities but I think what the residents are actually asking for is not noticed because notice is given at 02:12:18
all different times and at different lengths but it's the the packet of information I would add I would I'm going to I'm going to 02:12:26
close on comments here just to wrap things up. If if you want to discuss kind of further on what that looks like let's do it. 02:12:34
Like that's who we work for. 02:13:15
Like I've got to be able to. I didn't even answer any of their comments I wrote down, and we've got to go through it with them. 02:13:17
Like this moment is for all of us, right? Isn't that the rules? It's just not. The chair of the meeting has discretion over this 02:13:24
portion of the meeting. OK, I'll take it up on my time. 02:13:29
Alright, let's go ahead and move forward to the next agenda item. It was a consent agenda and it seems like some of our council 02:13:37
needed additional time to review it. Would you guys like to continue this to the next meeting or would you like to take it off at 02:13:43
this meeting and discuss it right now? 02:13:49
I would take it off, but discuss it. 02:13:56
Yeah, OK. So we're going to actually discuss 16.1 and 6.2 in order. Were you guys able to read the minutes of the City Council 02:14:00
meeting? If not, let's go ahead and continue it to the next meeting. 02:14:06
So I I just have a comment on that and I don't want to be mad at any staff or accounts or anything like that. But you know I 02:14:14
called all the various cities throughout this throughout the county and they've all done really good onboarding things from the 02:14:20
last week of November or the first week in December. And where they brought all the city staff in and department heads and they 02:14:25
had this amazing. And I I've spoken with previous council members as well where they give the opportunity to just be educated and 02:14:31
know everything, right. 02:14:37
Not being given that opportunity, me and Sarah really put us behind, you know, and I know now we're going to do it next week. And 02:14:44
I made a big deal on social media about, hey, we're not, we're not prepared, but. 02:14:49
We're in a different world now with divided government. You know, me and Sarah obviously have a different viewpoint, and that's OK 02:14:57
that's OK. It's going to require all of staff and us to have kind of a more rigorous debate than what's happening. But in order to 02:15:04
have that, we have to be educated. And really, I asked Mayor Frost of American Ford, the new staff had 25 hours that they've met 02:15:11
with, with all their divisions. Like I was blown away. 02:15:18
Spanish Fork, they were like 18 hours where they were just sit down and talk and throw up ideas and go through and and do that 02:15:26
type of stuff. 02:15:30
You know and so I look forward to the meeting with the various departments and stuff but like even just going through point of 02:15:34
order and and and the minutia cuz you know all the different ordinances the city of county are different So just I just want to 02:15:39
say that me and Sarah have an open. 02:15:44
Door we want to learn and we want to just take that time to get to know you guys. And we're not cold, even though we like might be 02:15:51
very serious and really passionate. It's actually just because we're passionate about some of the values. It's not an anger thing 02:15:56
or you know, we we're just come from a different opinion. 02:16:02
Yeah, and I can say every City Council person on here has varying opinions and there's different obligations that all of us have 02:16:09
to take on, and there's always going to be robust conversation. 02:16:16
We each city has a different process that they go through with onboarding. We do a government 101. We put everybody through a 02:16:26
legislative training with the Utah League of Cities and Towns. We slow down our first agenda and we go through it with all of the 02:16:32
departments. I learned that you didn't go through the consent agenda. 02:16:39
So. 02:17:59
To be fair, I didn't even know we were supposed to read the Councilman. Like we have had no instruction. Yeah. And I think that's 02:18:01
what we're doing here if if you, if you don't know it or understand it because you went through most of the things on the business 02:18:07
items. Am I right? Did you meet with the departments this week? No. No. 02:18:12
I thought you did meet with Honey. We went through the subdivision ordinance. That's all we did. 02:18:19
I think the staff is doing the best that they can. They're also in a flux position where you've got a new city manager coming in 02:19:45
and they're if if they didn't go over the consent agenda with you. I understand that's frustrating, but it's not for lack of 02:19:51
training or a lack of process that's coming forward for you additionally, like I told you, anything that's on the agenda. 02:19:58
And I I think we can look forward to that. I'm going to close this discussion and ask that we make a motion on either continuing 02:21:16
these items or discussing them now. 02:21:20
All in favor, aye. Any opposed? 02:22:07
Are you opposed? Did you say I'm OK to talk about it? Aye. OK, Everybody is on board. We're now in a public hearing. Eric, will 02:22:11
you go ahead and present? 02:22:16
Yeah, thank you, Mayor. We, we have a budget amendment before us. This is the first one of the year. 02:22:23
The goal of this is to add 117,000 total to the Planning Department. The intent behind it is to allow for us to train, certify and 02:22:32
promote from within the the Planning Department. 02:22:41
So that we have some staff that are ready to take on not only regular review of projects, but also to manage some of the master 02:22:52
planning efforts that we have underway right now and that could take some of the workload from our planning director and divide 02:22:59
that up so that we're balancing that that workload effectively. 02:23:06
And then the source of that fund for for us is an increase in our property tax. 02:23:17
It's an increase in our property tax, correct. So every quarter we get a, we get a report back on our property tax revenues and 02:23:26
OK, it's because our property tax amount increased, correct. Not that you're asking us to increase the property tax. 02:23:35
OK. It is because we have increased revenue. OK. That is good. That is clarifying. 02:23:48
Sorry, you really had us going there. Yeah, I was like what, what is happening? 22% increase? No, thank you. OK, well, anybody 02:23:57
from the residence or constituents have any commentary on this? 02:24:04
Mayor this evening to share the documentary document. Yes, please. Yeah, could you share the document? Do we have a document? 02:24:13
Go ahead, Kim Cornelius, resident I just want to make sure I understood what just took place. This is and I'm coming from the 02:24:27
previous meeting on the 13th of December where at the conclusion of the finance directors comments, she asked about the 02:24:33
possibility of funds to hire A. 02:24:40
Senior planner, yes, thank you. And so that's not for, for that specifically, it's for possibility of generating expertise within 02:24:48
the ranks and maybe promoting somebody to that position. Yeah, yeah, what's the title change? And he indicated that the funds or 02:24:55
that the accessibility of the funds through increased taxes probably was somewhere mid January or February. And Oh my gosh, the 02:25:01
government got it to us early, can't believe that. So that's that's what I'm understanding. We already got the. 02:25:08
It's there. 02:25:16
Each quarter we get a report from the tax Commission on our on our property tax revenues and when that quarterly report came in 02:25:19
that provided enough of a bandwidth to allow for that increase. So that's what he was referencing in the previous meeting then 02:25:25
Okay. Great. Thank you. Thanks again. 02:25:31
Other comments. 02:25:39
Sort of Christensen again. Yeah, generally, I think it's much more cost effective to promote from within. 02:25:49
Yes, sorry, Jordan Christensen. I think it's much more cost effective to try to promote from within rather than potentially 02:25:56
starting new with somebody else. So yeah, like in favor of. 02:26:03
Moving forward with trying to promote. Thank you. 02:26:11
Another comments OK, it doesn't look like there are any other comments from the public. I would like to go out of a public 02:26:17
hearing. 02:26:19
So thank you, Marty. Second by Amber, all in favor. Aye. Any opposed? All right. Council, do you have further questions on this? 02:26:24
Is this something that you'd like to look into a little bit further? Tell me your feelings. 02:26:32
I just have a question. I thought it was one position that you were opening up. You said train, promote and certify staff. Is this 02:26:43
more than one person or one in particular? 02:26:49
This would be to take one staff member, get them additional certifications and build them up to this new position that we would be 02:26:56
promoting from within on. 02:27:02
So no, not all. 02:27:08
Just one correct. 02:27:10
And is this just to help you be more efficient or effective or? 02:27:14
Yeah you're absolutely right Sir. So but right now we we manage a lot of master plans and so that's that's where we we need the 02:27:19
the the most help And then with the current planning that would be applications that are coming in we're we're going to see a 02:27:26
really large uptick in those applications. And so we'll we'll we'll we'll need kind of senior planner typically is the person who 02:27:34
helps to to manage a lot of that workload as applications come in and then overseeing master plans. 02:27:41
Things like the waterfront master plan, that's something that we've been working with the county on for a while. There's as an 02:27:50
example that those tend to take, you know, 100 plus hours, you know, just within a given year each each master plan, so. 02:27:57
So is this largely because of Utah City coming and what you're anticipating? 02:28:05
Yeah, that that that would be a big piece that we also have you know the whole all the way fields that the project that's that 02:28:10
that's underway several plats, lots of building permit reviews. Yeah, we're working on the parking master plan, on the economic 02:28:15
development strategic plan. 02:28:21
Stationary plan, the fire station, and yeah, the A tag grant. That's a grant through MAG to help us provide more pedestrian safety 02:28:28
planning services. 02:28:34
So there's there's lots of grants and things like that that this position would help us kind of organize those and then you know 02:28:41
work with each, each of those master plans have committees and meet several times and so that's that's the person that would help 02:28:47
to facilitate and manage that process for us. OK. Thank you. 02:28:53
Jake, did you have a question? 02:29:00
It's not. You guys press that to the microphone at the same time. 02:29:02
Yeah, I feel like I need to get on board with the whole department and understand the whole budget of all departments first. Like 02:29:06
financially, where things are, where they're not, where their priorities are. It's nothing against this position or this person or 02:29:12
everything, but hopefully meeting with them next week. But I couldn't vote on anything. I don't even understand or no, I know 02:29:17
there's a few planners in that, but OK, I feel really comfortable with this, but I'm more than happy to wait for orientation for 02:29:23
them to go and review the budget. 02:29:29
And I don't feel like you guys need it right now. You could wait until after the orientation. Is that right? OK. I would feel 02:29:35
really comfortable with that. Yeah, I'm happy to make a motion to postpone or to continue the vote if everyone OK. But I do feel 02:29:43
comfortable with what's happening as well. But we can wait to make sure everyone's on the same page. Hey, that's great. 02:29:51
Can I put a point of order? I just want to make sure you're clear about what you're continuing. You close the public hearing and 02:30:01
so you would be continuing action on the item, not public hearing on the item. 02:30:07
If you wish to continue the public hearing, you would have to make that part of the motion. 02:30:14
Would it be appropriate to move it to our next council meeting on the 24th? 02:30:52
And then if they still don't, if you still don't feel prepared, we can talk about it then. 02:31:00
OK, so I make. 02:31:06
I make a motion to move the public hearing and as if I don't do I need to specify the two? I make a motion to move 7.1 Public 02:31:08
Hearing Budget Amendment Resolution 2024-01 to next councils meeting on January 24 first by Marty. 02:31:18
Let me be second by Jake. All in favor? Aye. Any opposed? All right, I need a motion to adjourn. So moved secondary. Second prior. 02:31:29
Amber all in favor. Thank you for coming. 02:31:35
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Some of our new elected officials. It's an exciting time. We've got a light agenda tonight so we can have an opportunity to do 00:00:00
some training and to get to know each other. But we're very glad to have you with us tonight. I am going to just randomly call 00:00:07
them. Would you mind doing the invocation? Inspirational Father, Pledge. Pledge of Allegiance. 00:00:14
Hi there. Can you hear my father? We are so very grateful for this wonderful snowy day we have. We're grateful for this moisture. 00:00:23
And please bless and watch over all those travelers. Please keep them safe. Please. 00:00:28
Please help those emergency workers that are helping those in need that they can also be protected and watched over and we are 00:00:35
still very grateful for those that serve our city and please bless and watch over them and. 00:00:41
Please bless that we can be. 00:00:48
Consider an understanding and be able to listen to one another's thoughts and be able to work together to find good compromises 00:00:52
and good solutions to things that come before us. Please bless us that we can. 00:00:58
Filled my spirit and have a wonderful evening, and Mercedes sings the name of Jesus Christ. Amen. Amen. All the rise. 00:01:05
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, 00:01:13
indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. 00:01:20
All right, this brings us right into our work session. We're going to start out with a training by our city attorney, Jamie 00:01:28
Blakely, and he's going to talk to us about the Open Public Meetings Act, Ethics Roberts Rules and Grandma. 00:01:34
Thank you, Jamie. 00:01:42
I just have a question. 00:01:50
Is it worth waiting for Sarah specifically on this item since she's new? 00:01:52
Thanks, Jake. 00:01:58
Wait for a minute. OK, that'll be fine. We'll give it a minute just to find out the estimated time. If she can't be here, there's 00:02:03
additional trainings that we can have her do the same. 00:02:08
And plus we can send her the recording. They have an orientation on Wednesday that we could assign this to her at that time. 00:02:13
OK. 00:02:25
Perfect timing. That's OK. Come on up. 00:02:26
I'm glad you made it safely. It's very stormy and messy out there right now. 00:02:32
We are just starting on our training with our attorney, and we're going to be talking about open and public meetings Act, the 00:02:37
Ethics Act. Robert's Rules and Grandma. All right. Thank you, Mayor. Members of the council, Greetings. I'm Jamie Blakely. I'm the 00:02:43
city attorney. 00:02:48
You, as a public body, are required to conduct your deliberations openly. What this means is that you cannot consider an ordinance 00:03:25
or a resolution unless meeting is held pursuant to the Open and Public Meetings Act and it's properly noticed. 00:03:33
All meetings have to be open unless they're lawfully closed. A meeting includes a work meeting. It includes an executive session. 00:03:41
And I mean, it is a meeting anytime a quorum of the City Council is together for the purposes of discussing or deliberating or 00:03:52
working on items that fall within your responsibility. That includes members present in person and members that are joined 00:03:59
electronically. 00:04:06
Every public meeting requires public notice. That notice has to be made at least 24 hours ahead of time. There is an exception for 00:04:17
emergencies. We'll talk about that in a few minutes. 00:04:22
There has to be an agenda for every meeting. The agenda must have labeled the items that will be acted upon during the meeting 00:04:27
with quote reasonable specificity. A topic can be raised by the public and discussed during the meeting at the discretion of the 00:04:34
chair. The Mayor is the chair for the City Council. Other public bodies within the city will elect their own chairs. The notice 00:04:42
has to be posted on the Utah Public Notice website and at the Principal office where. 00:04:50
The meeting is to be held. The newspaper requirement went away a little bit ago. I need to update my presentation to reflect that 00:04:57
electronic electronic posting is encouraged. We're meeting today at 5:35 because there was an outage on the public notice website 00:05:05
yesterday afternoon and we couldn't get the notice posted at 5:00 when we attempted. And so you bump the meeting time so that you 00:05:12
can be sure that 24 hour notice occurs. 00:05:19
The city has to publish an annual notice of scheduled meeting, so that's been done. 00:05:28
And then orderly conduct during meetings. If there's a disruption, a person may be removed if, quote, orderly conduct is seriously 00:05:34
compromised. 00:05:38
Electronic meetings are allowed. City code allows for this. It's similar to any meeting. It has to be noticed. There has to be an 00:05:43
anchor location and the anchor location has to be set up for an electronic meeting in such a way that anybody who can't access 00:05:51
electronically has the ability to attend, monitor and participate in the meeting. Most of our meetings are not electronic meetings 00:05:58
because of the council's meeting altogether in in person, but. 00:06:05
There is the possibility to do that with COVID. We had to do it quite a bit and everybody got really good at doing electronic 00:06:13
meetings, but most of your meetings will be held in person. 00:06:18
Written minutes have to be kept in every meeting. These are the requirements of what has to be in the minutes. I'm not going to go 00:06:25
through this line by line, but it will be in your materials. We have phenomenal city recorders and assistant city recorders that 00:06:31
take care of this in a really nice way. I do have a question about yes, please, can you go back to that? I had the question asked. 00:06:38
Is there a time that those minutes have to be done by, Like how, how long before we have to make sure we voted on them and have 00:06:44
them published to the public? 00:06:50
They. 00:06:58
There, there's a, there are two requirements. One is the recording of the meeting and that has to be up within three days and then 00:07:00
retain permanently the minutes. You have a little bit more time to put them up. And the way it works is you post draft minutes and 00:07:06
then once the actual minutes are approved by the public body, they would replace the draft minutes. But I think the draft minutes, 00:07:13
it's within a month, within a month, OK. 00:07:19
It's usually sooner than that and Pam's really great about getting them up, but. 00:07:29
A little bit longer to put the minutes together than the record I've watched her work on minutes before and it's a very labor 00:07:33
intensive. It's remarkable how they do it. 00:07:37
The recording we just talked about, but there has to be a complete unedited recording of all open portions of the meeting 00:07:42
beginning to end. Like I mentioned, that has to be available within three business days and it's retained permanently. 00:07:49
You make closed meetings for certain purposes. It can only be done by 2/3 vote. That vote has to be done by roll call. There are 00:07:57
certain it's announced publicly the reason for closing the meetings. These bullets are the purposes that most often occur with the 00:08:03
City Council. 00:08:10
There are a few others in the statute, but when you most often do, it is to what I call personnel type discussions, which is an 00:08:17
individual's character, professional competence, or physical or mental health? A strategy session related to litigation? A 00:08:23
strategy session related to real property. 00:08:29
And then you have a few others that relate to investigations, security and certain procurement decisions. Those aren't as used as 00:08:35
often as the first three bullets. 00:08:40
There's a prohibition on closed meetings. You can close a meeting, for example, to interview a prospective member of staff. So if 00:08:48
you had a vacancy and you were going to interview somebody, you could go into a closed session to do that. 00:08:54
You are not allowed to do that if you're filling a vacancy in an elected position. So if, for example, there was a vacancy on the 00:09:01
council, you had to fill it, and you wanted to interview people to see who could fill that vacancy. You're not allowed to do that 00:09:05
in a closed session. 00:09:10
Most closed meetings are recorded. There are not recordings for discussions of character, competence, or health of an individual 00:09:19
for security measures, and when that occurs, the presiding officer signs an affidavit of the reasons why and what was discussed. 00:09:28
You are permitted to conduct emergency meetings. They can be held with less than 24 hours. Notice they. These are very very rare. 00:09:37
I don't recall one happening in Vineyard at the time that I since I've been the. 00:09:43
City Attorney. 00:09:50
I have had them occur with other entities and it typically is a true emergency situation. So with COVID I had a few entities that 00:09:52
provide life and safety issues and so they had to hold emergency meetings to be able to appropriate funds and. 00:10:00
And budget and do things to adjust to that. I have had organizations that have had storm damage to facilities and they had to 00:10:09
contract for repairs and needed to make those decisions immediately. They would hold a meeting. An emergency meeting is different 00:10:16
from a special meeting. When we say a special meeting, what we mean is you publish your annual schedule of when you'll hold your 00:10:24
City Council meetings. A special meeting would be any meeting that isn't on that regular list. 00:10:31
But it's not an emergency meeting. You would still provide 24 hours notice. All the other rules would apply. It's just not on that 00:10:39
calendar that you published at the beginning of the year. And those do occur from time to time in all cities. 00:10:46
An example might be like we don't have a meeting on the 14th of February, but if we decided we needed to call one on the 14th, 00:10:54
that would be a special meeting, OK? 00:10:58
OK, chance meetings and social gatherings. So if you happen to see each other at the grocery store, at the Christmas party, at a 00:11:06
church event, at a social event, that's fine. You just cannot conduct city business when you're doing that. If you ever are 00:11:13
together in a topic of city business comes up and you have a quorum, that would be improper and would be a violation at the end. 00:11:20
There's a criminal penalty for a violation of the act, a quick note on electronic messaging. 00:11:29
This one's tricky. Public meetings can occur electronically and if you have a quorum of the Council present during any 00:11:36
communication. 00:11:41
And you're talking about topic, talking about decisions that should be made in an open meeting that can be a violation of the Open 00:11:47
and Public Meetings Act. This can occur by text message, it can occur by e-mail. It can occur on a Facebook thread if people are 00:11:55
commenting back and forth on a topic. So you will want to be mindful when you're communicating through those tools that you don't 00:12:03
have a quorum of the council present in that communication. Otherwise you could be found to have violated the app. 00:12:11
Any questions on open and public meetings before I move on? 00:12:21
I think I will mention something. This had been something that we had discussed prior when a new council came on because they have 00:12:27
commented on social threats but not known. Other people were on a social threat and we talked about how they weren't commenting or 00:12:33
interacting, but then we were all much more careful about making sure who was on it. Is that still kind of how you would interpret 00:12:40
it? Yeah, I do think you want to be careful about that it. 00:12:47
There are some There were news articles a few years ago about the Salt Lake City school board at the time they were making 00:12:55
decisions about whether to remain open or closed during COVID. 00:12:59
Where they were having discussions and deliberations over text and it was happening there unfortunately while the meeting was 00:13:05
occurring which would be a big no no right to talk to each other about how are you going to vote on things and what do you think 00:13:09
about this and. 00:13:14
There's even went a step further of name calling and some unfortunate language, and a parent saw that. An interested parent that 00:13:19
was at the meeting saw it happened, made a records request, got those text messages, and it was. 00:13:25
You know, released and published in the paper. And so I do think you want to be careful. Social media can be really tough, right? 00:13:32
Because. 00:13:36
You could be on a Reddit thread and hit the up arrow right on something and you technically are part of that conversation. You're 00:13:40
giving your support or your favor for it. It could be a thumbs up on Facebook and you're not using the words in that 00:13:45
communication. But it is communication and if it's about a topic that is city business and you have a quorum present, then you 00:13:51
would have an issue. 00:13:56
It doesn't preclude you from using social media, but. 00:14:04
You just need to be mindful. 00:14:08
OK, Rules of order. So the the default rules of order are Roberts Rules of Order. They're rules of order that have existed since. 00:14:11
Kind of old English times and have continued on through most. 00:14:21
Public bodies and public entities. And so a lot of what we'll talk about here from Robert's Rules, they're not from a statute. 00:14:25
They're not from an ordinance. 00:14:29
But they are the parliamentary rules that cities throughout the state follow in public entities throughout the state follow. 00:14:33
The basic rules are these You have an agenda. The agenda constitutes the road map for the meeting, and that's what will be 00:14:40
followed through the meeting. If you overlay that with the Open and Public Public Meetings Act, you can only take action during 00:14:48
the meeting on items that have been properly noticed and are on the agenda. If something new comes up and you would like to act on 00:14:55
it or consider it, you would have to add it to a future agenda and then take it up during the future meeting. 00:15:02
This can come off as. 00:15:10
Awkward or old-fashioned. When you get public comments saying please do something about it, now you realize that it's an important 00:15:14
thing, You want to do something about it, but you have to tell the person who made the comment. 00:15:20
We'll come back to it on a future meeting and can put it on an agenda. 00:15:27
The chair of the City Council controls the agenda, and so the mayor may, at her discretion, put things on the agenda that she 00:15:31
would like the council to discuss. 00:15:37
If any member of the City Council wishes to have something on the agenda, they can make a motion during a meeting asking that 00:15:44
something be put on the agenda. It can be voted on. If you have a majority of the council that would like something to be agenda, 00:15:51
then it would be on a future agenda. You can of course contact the mayor offline and request that something be put on the agenda. 00:15:57
It would be a her discretion in that circumstance whether it's on the agenda or not. 00:16:04
But you can also during a meeting. 00:16:11
Ask that things be there. 00:16:13
You have under Robert Rules, one question at a time and one speaker at a time, basic rules of courtesy that are respected. 00:16:16
The chairperson can use what we more often called unanimous consent, not general consent, with all motions except for motions that 00:16:26
require a roll call vote of the Council. So if you had a procedural motion or an amendment, or a motion to adjourn or a motion. 00:16:36
That is, not to approve a resolution, or to open or close a public hearing, or to go into closed session. You can do it by 00:16:48
unanimous consent. 00:16:52
Typically, items on your consent agenda can be handled this way, but if you do have a resolution on the consent agenda, you'd have 00:16:59
to do a roll call vote for those items. 00:17:03
There are three basic forms of motions. We'll get to these in a minute. You make initial motions, motions to amend and substitute 00:17:09
motions. That's what you see most often. 00:17:13
In meetings, there should be no more than three motions on the floor at the time. That's really just a rule for convenience. It's 00:17:19
tough to keep track of if you have more than that. 00:17:23
Typically, debate and discussion can continue as long as members wish to discuss an item. But the chairperson does have the 00:17:28
ability to kind of bring discussion in when it's time to make a decision. So if things if discussion tends to either lag or be 00:17:35
repetitive or or touch on things that have already been addressed, the chair has the prerogative and can always move things toward 00:17:42
either a motion or a vote at that time. 00:17:49
I'll talk about the sequence in a minute. 00:17:57
Three yes votes are required to pass any item. There are certain items that require a little bit more than three votes there. One 00:17:59
example is a two third vote for a closed session and with a 5 member council, 2/3 is 4. 00:18:05
A motion to reconsider any item requires A majority vote to pass under Robert's Rules. There are kind of specific rules for a 00:18:13
motion to reconsider has to be made during the same meeting. You can, at a later meeting make a motion that would be a motion to 00:18:20
amend, or that could be a text amendment, the replacing ordinance, things of that type, But during but a motion to just reconsider 00:18:26
an item to kind of. 00:18:33
Obvious about that you already took would have to occur during the same meeting. 00:18:40
And then the chairperson and members of the board showed here to bylaws in the code of conduct. 00:18:45
To the extent they exist, your default code of conduct is what's in state law and then what's in the Ethics Act, and we'll talk a 00:18:51
little bit about that. 00:18:55
Types of Motions So you A main motion introduces a new item. A subsidiary motion would be a motion to amend or substitute motion. 00:19:02
So if for example, you wanted to. 00:19:12
Amend the text or amend the policy or make a little bit of a change to the motion that was made. You could request to amend. If 00:19:15
it's a friendly amendment, the person who made the motion can just say I accept that friendly amendment. If it's not a friendly 00:19:20
amendment, then you would vote on the amendment 1st and then you would vote. If it fails, you would then vote on the original 00:19:25
motion. 00:19:30
There can be an incidental motion, which is just a question of procedure. There's a motion to table. A motion to table is an 00:19:36
old-fashioned word for. 00:19:41
And the item not vote on it. 00:19:47
And it would just be done. 00:19:50
They got into item one and quickly realized they needed to handle item three first, and so they just moved to continue item one 00:20:24
until after they could hear item 3. 00:20:29
There is one footnote I would put on motion to continue and it's that if you're moving to continue a public hearing. 00:20:35
To another date, you have to name that date in that motion. 00:20:43
So that those attending the meeting know when to come back for the hearing. Because public hearings have specific notice 00:20:47
requirements under state law under respect that you have to name a date and time. 00:20:53
If you're just moving to continue any old resolution or ordinance, you don't have to name a date. You could just continue to a 00:20:58
future meeting and then when it's ready to come forward, it can come forward again. 00:21:04
Every motion has at least 6 steps. You make the motion, there's a call for a second on the motion. Once the 2nd occurs, the motion 00:21:11
is restated so everyone understands what was. 00:21:17
What was moved for? 00:21:24
There then is debated discussion on the motion. After that's concluded, there's a vote on the motion, and then the chair will 00:21:25
announce the results of the vote and any instructions after that. 00:21:31
Ordinances, resolutions, and any action that would create a liability against the city require a roll call vote liability would 00:21:39
be. 00:21:43
Hiring and firing individuals. 00:21:48
Any kind of contract or procurement decisions? 00:21:51
All other matters can be a simple yes or no. 00:21:54
Points of things You all during the meetings have the opportunity to request more information, Request clarity, request. 00:22:00
Privilege. And so these are the this is the language that's used under Robert's orders, Robert's Rules of Order. You don't have to 00:22:12
use precisely this language, but you do always have the ability. 00:22:17
If there's a breach of rules, if there's improper procedure, you can ask for a point of order at any time during the meeting and 00:22:24
get clarification on that. Heidi and I are here as a resource to you if you have a question on a point of order and we can try to 00:22:29
answer that and give you instruction. 00:22:35
A point of information. If you want to be more informed before you make a decision, you can always request a point of information 00:22:41
and then try to receive that information. That could be a staff report, it could be a document, it could be whatever you feel you 00:22:47
need during that meeting to understand the item. A point of inquiry is the clarification on making voting decisions. So it would 00:22:54
be you know what specifically are we voting on or what would be the effect of. 00:23:01
This kind of vote or. And then finally, as a point of personal privilege, and this is really just comfort. If if it's too cold, if 00:23:08
it's too hot, if you need to use the restroom, if we've been going for a long time and you need a break just to stand up, you can 00:23:14
always ask for a point of personal privilege. 00:23:19
OK. I have just two or three slides that relate to legislative and administrative powers. When for the new council members, when 00:23:28
we meet next week, I'll spend a little bit more time going into the powers and duties and roles. 00:23:36
Of a City Council. But there's a really simple it's, I should I say, simple? 00:23:44
There's a bright line distinction between some of the actions you take. That has to be understood because the information you can 00:23:51
use to make your decision is different in those circumstances, and the effect of the decision is different. And the rights that 00:23:59
the public has relative to your decisions is different For these things. You have, as a City Council in Utah, the ability to make 00:24:06
some decisions that are legislative and some decisions that are administrative. 00:24:13
Legislative decisions are things like rules, regulations, codes. 00:24:22
At what level you want to set your fines? 00:24:26
Punishments, forfeitures, those types of decisions. When you're making a legislative decision, you can bring to bear any point of 00:24:31
policy that is important to you or resonates with you when you make that choice. So when you are creating and approving a land use 00:24:38
ordinance, for example, if you have a preference about density parking. 00:24:46
Anything that relates to that development choice? 00:24:56
You can bring that preference forward and that can be part of the discussion. You can make a decision on that basis. When you're 00:24:59
making an administrative approval, you're approving something that is governed by the code that's in place before that approval 00:25:04
comes to you. 00:25:09
These are things like projects, plans, policies that flow from an ordinance, contracts, services. When you're making those kinds 00:25:15
of decisions, you're a little bit more limited in what you can bring to bear. You cannot reject a project just because I don't 00:25:21
like it, or I think it looks bad, or I don't like the color, or this is next to my neighbor's house and I don't think they're 00:25:27
going to favor it. 00:25:32
When you're making those kinds of decisions, your obligation is to look at what the ordinance says. Look at what is in the 00:25:39
application. You can request evidence to inform and support your decision, but if that evidence is not in the record, you can't 00:25:47
consider it as part of your decision, or else you would open the city up to a legal challenge of that decision. 00:25:54
Staff and I will try to guide you as to whether the decisions that are before you are legislative or administrative. You can 00:26:03
always ask me for clarification if you have questions about it. The topics where the line is harvested, differentiate is when 00:26:09
you're taking up any land use decisions to know are we doing an ordinance, is this a legislative decision or are we considering an 00:26:16
application and is it administrative decision? 00:26:23
Your legislative power has to be exercised by ordinance. 00:26:31
And then this is just a brief little CHEAT SHEET that if it's legislative, it's an ordinance, if it's administrative and it 00:26:36
creates A liability, then it has to be done by resolution. 00:26:43
If it's a procedural or a ministerial action, If you're approving minutes, If you're giving direction to staff. If you're. 00:26:51
Making appointments or making a point of order, those things can all be done by motion and just by roll call. Or not by roll call 00:27:00
vote, but just a yes or no vote altogether. 00:27:05
And then why does it matter? Ordinances have the force of law. They can be enforced criminally or civilly. Legislative decisions 00:27:12
are subject to referenda and mandamus. Mandamus is when somebody brings a lawsuit to compel the government to do something that's 00:27:18
within its authority, and your legislative decisions are subject to that. Administrative decisions are not subject to referendum 00:27:24
or mandamus. 00:27:30
And then the standard of review legally, if it goes to court, is different for a legislative and administrative decision. 00:27:37
You're given quite a bit of deference on legislative choices, on administrative decisions. The courts really will look at due 00:27:44
process and whether you follow the right process. They won't get into the the more detailed aspects of the decision. Most 00:27:51
ordinances do not require a public hearing. The things that do that come to you more often. 00:27:58
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